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Ongoing Systematic Massacre of Muslim Rohingas in Myanmar

You hide behind semantics not facts. A sign of a man not even sure what he's talking about. If you trying to convince anyone don't hide behind sophistry just use facts. Ask any layman will tell you that this is ethnic cleansing pure & true. Maybe you have a different definition on what ethnic cleansing is?

The government doesn't support it LOL:
http://www.fortifyrights.org/downloads/Policies_of_Persecution_Feb_25_Fortify_Rights.pdf
This is based on 12 leaked government documents. As such the Government is complicit for the persecution & ethnic cleansing of the Rohingya people. Please continue with your government apologist stance.

Seems simple enough to me. The only one who said that this is complex are usually the one who support the side of the oppressor. Like saying "Apartheid are Complex" because of whatever or other kind of oppression. Rohingya are not called the most persecuted minorities on the planet for nothing. Even if they are like some people said "don't belong there" they still did not deserve these kinds of fate. There is simply no grey area to support your sophistry.

A guy like me doesn't need to use sophistry to tell you that in Rakhine there is an Ethnic cleansing going on. There's mass grave & burnt houses (most of them Rohingya) to support this.

I use the truth to make my point. I use semantics to point out how contemptible you are.

Your comment is what I am talking about exactly: 'ask any layman'. A layman is misinformed.

Never did I say that the situation was rosy nor that there is no discrimination. It is a complex situation. No part of that report alludes to any practice of 'ethnic cleansing', unless you are using some very specious logic. They are the evidence of a government struggling to prevent open civil war in one of the poorest regions of the country. A part of the country where the native population feel disenfranchised from both the central government and feel under attack from Bengali immigrants. Yet, by pointing this out, and diverging from the narrative of the Western media, I am called an apologist.

To further add insult, you subtly link this report to 'mass graves' - where are these mass graves? Certainly not in the report. Certainly not in any credible source. This is sophistry in it's most blatant form, you contemptible little bastard. In 2 years, people have been crying foul of ethnic cleansing, mass graves and all other fictitious crimes yet there is not a crumb of evidence.

Which was my point to begin with.

Now even buddhists are after muslims?

Wonder why its so?

Are they? There are large Muslim populations all over Myanmar who don't seem to be having any problems.
 
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I use the truth to make my point. I use semantics to point out how contemptible you are.

Your comment is what I am talking about exactly: 'ask any layman'. A layman is misinformed.

Never did I say that the situation was rosy nor that there is no discrimination. It is a complex situation. No part of that report alludes to any practice of 'ethnic cleansing', unless you are using some very specious logic. They are the evidence of a government struggling to prevent open civil war in one of the poorest regions of the country. A part of the country where the native population feel disenfranchised from both the central government and feel under attack from Bengali immigrants. Yet, by pointing this out, and diverging from the narrative of the Western media, I am called an apologist.

To further add insult, you subtly link this report to 'mass graves' - where are these mass graves? Certainly not in the report. Certainly not in any credible source. This is sophistry in it's most blatant form, you contemptible little bastard. In 2 years, people have been crying foul of ethnic cleansing, mass graves and all other fictitious crimes yet there is not a crumb of evidence.

Which was my point to begin with.



Are they? There are large Muslim populations all over Myanmar who don't seem to be having any problems.

So disprove the article I posted instead then if you're feeling so sure about your government. Here's the thing I actually believe without a shadow of a doubt on what I'm doing. While you hide semantics & sophistry while hiding your shame.

Do you even bother reading what I just posted?

Atrocities in Myanmar | April 18, 2014 | Religion & Ethics NewsWeekly | PBS
ROBERTSON (Deputy Director, Asia Division, Human Rights Watch): Entire areas were burned down. I mean we had satellite photographs before and after showing the damage—that people were being shot and killed, people being disappeared. We uncovered mass graves from that period of time. You know, it was a slaughter.

MATTHEW SMITH (Executive Director, Fortify Rights): Many of the crimes that we have documented rise to the level of crimes against humanity. These are some of the most serious crimes that can be committed under international law.

These statement came from HRW & the director of Fortify Rights. So I will take their word for it. Please stop using bullshitted excuses to justify this. Just because you are feeling "disenfranchised" doesn't gave you a Carte Blanche to commit ethnic cleansing. The Hutu were "disenfranchised" by the Tutsi before the Rwandan Genocide happened so does that gives them right to do it?

The Government of Myanmar is responsible for this. Go ahead read the whole 79 pages then you can come back:
http://www.fortifyrights.org/downloads/Policies_of_Persecution_Feb_25_Fortify_Rights.pdf
 
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to Aung San Suu Kyi, owner of Wallenberg Medal: THERE IS A MASSACRE GOING ON IN YOUR COUNTRY B!TCH.!
 
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So disprove the article I posted instead then if you're feeling so sure about your government. Here's the thing I actually believe without a shadow of a doubt on what I'm doing. While you hide semantics & sophistry while hiding your shame.

Do you even bother reading what I just posted?

Atrocities in Myanmar | April 18, 2014 | Religion & Ethics NewsWeekly | PBS




These statement came from HRW & the director of Fortify Rights. So I will take their word for it. Please stop using bullshitted excuses to justify this. Just because you are feeling "disenfranchised" doesn't gave you a Carte Blanche to commit ethnic cleansing. The Hutu were "disenfranchised" by the Tutsi before the Rwandan Genocide happened so does that gives them right to do it?

The Government of Myanmar is responsible for this. Go ahead read the whole 79 pages then you can come back:
http://www.fortifyrights.org/downloads/Policies_of_Persecution_Feb_25_Fortify_Rights.pdf

You really are something. You accuse me of sophistry and using semantics to talk bullshit and post up your little links yet what you are doing is exactly what you seem to be railing against. Yes, I did read the report in full and not once were there any evidence of ethnic cleansing, mass graves and satellites photos. Like I said, the whole report was crying foul about a country with limited resources trying to cope with a complex immigration problem.

Being a sneaky, little bastard you are, you pulled a couple of quotes from some PBS article trying to pass it off as if they were part of the report. Tell me, if there are satellite photos and mass graves, whey are they not in these reports? Why have we not seen them? Your second quote from the Fortify Rights guy : "rise to the level of crimes against humanity" Very sneaky indeed. Which crimes is he talking about exactly? It's not clear is it? THAT is SOPHISTRY.

You want to talk about civilians being gunned down? How about this: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/jun/11/burma-clashes-muslims-buddhists-arakan

Local Arakanese being shot by police. Are they being ethnically cleansed? I suppose so in your simplistic little world.

Ofcourse, I don't even want to start on the politicisation of academia and how even the most well intentioned research is biased based on funding but let's just say that you believe in the integrity of every think tank and NGO. No one of note has published a report on any actual atrocities carried out by the government. There's a good reason for this.

What I do remember is the poorly conceived webpages, crappy Facebook groups and endless bleeting on TV by islamists rehashing pictures from Rwanda and Thailand trying to pass them off as examples of ethnic cleansing. How risible.

Then you come to confuse the government with the Arakanese. Are the Arakanese carrying out mass killings or the government? Which is it? You say disenfranchisement is no excuse. I agree. What is a good excuse is the other side, the Rohingya side, doing exactly the same thing to them in their own land. They torch and kill Arakanese just as the Arakanese do. This is why it is COMMUNAL VIOLENCE.

Your kind are the useful idiots of the world. You simplify the world into simplistic absolutes and yet you have the gall to accuse me of being brainwashed by my government. This is not a simple Buddhists vs. muslims, Evil Burmese vs. righteous think tanks and NGO's, persecuted masses vs. an oppressive empire. But ofcourse, in your simple little world, this is exactly what it is.

I am not an apologist but I am indeed proud to stand up in my corner to fight against ignorance.
 
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You really are something. You accuse me of sophistry and using semantics to talk bullshit and post up your little links yet what you are doing is exactly what you seem to be railing against. Yes, I did read the report in full and not once were there any evidence of ethnic cleansing, mass graves and satellites photos. Like I said, the whole report was crying foul about a country with limited resources trying to cope with a complex immigration problem.

Being a sneaky, little bastard you are, you pulled a couple of quotes from some PBS article trying to pass it off as if they were part of the report. Tell me, if there are satellite photos and mass graves, whey are they not in these reports? Why have we not seen them? Your second quote from the Fortify Rights guy : "rise to the level of crimes against humanity" Very sneaky indeed. Which crimes is he talking about exactly? It's not clear is it? THAT is SOPHISTRY.

You want to talk about civilians being gunned down? How about this: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/jun/11/burma-clashes-muslims-buddhists-arakan

Local Arakanese being shot by police. Are they being ethnically cleansed? I suppose so in your simplistic little world.

Ofcourse, I don't even want to start on the politicisation of academia and how even the most well intentioned research is biased based on funding but let's just say that you believe in the integrity of every think tank and NGO. No one of note has published a report on any actual atrocities carried out by the government. There's a good reason for this.

What I do remember is the poorly conceived webpages, crappy Facebook groups and endless bleeting on TV by islamists rehashing pictures from Rwanda and Thailand trying to pass them off as examples of ethnic cleansing. How risible.

Then you come to confuse the government with the Arakanese. Are the Arakanese carrying out mass killings or the government? Which is it? You say disenfranchisement is no excuse. I agree. What is a good excuse is the other side, the Rohingya side, doing exactly the same thing to them in their own land. They torch and kill Arakanese just as the Arakanese do. This is why it is COMMUNAL VIOLENCE.

Your kind are the useful idiots of the world. You simplify the world into simplistic absolutes and yet you have the gall to accuse me of being brainwashed by my government. This is not a simple Buddhists vs. muslims, Evil Burmese vs. righteous think tanks and NGO's, persecuted masses vs. an oppressive empire. But ofcourse, in your simple little world, this is exactly what it is.

I am not an apologist but I am indeed proud to stand up in my corner to fight against ignorance.

You really something 100.000 peoples get displaced/ethnically cleansed or what you might called it, remain persecuted on their own land till this day & you somehow try to reason it inside your head. Wow. Weasel out of this anyway you want, you still haven't refute me on anything other than "there's no evidence," but you yourself haven't shown me your "evidence" to proof me otherwise. Just the usual bullshit.

"rise to the level of crimes against humanity" Very sneaky indeed. Which crimes is he talking about exactly? It's not clear is it? THAT is SOPHISTRY.
He's a Human right activist he's allowed to use "Sophistry" to illustrate to people how bad things really are in order to get people support. What's your fucking excuses other than using sophistry as a tool for misinformation.

Here's my evidence; more than hundreds thousands still remain displaced post-riot & still treated like actual shit inside the country (not sophistry this time the Rohingya are actually treated like shit) . This is not the kind of evidence you can just scoff at.

Then you come to confuse the government with the Arakanese. Are the Arakanese carrying out mass killings or the government
This is why I don't talk to kid. Do you even read?
http://www.fortifyrights.org/downloads/Policies_of_Persecution_Feb_25_Fortify_Rights.pdf
The government crime was the facilitating of this incident, turn a blind eye to everything & then try to cover it up.

Once again you spout bullshit in my mouth. Check my post, when have I ever linked this to that? All I'm saying is that when something like this happens you do not try to rationalize it. The Rohingya are the one who actually got the brunt end of thing & they should at the very least be recognized for their suffering.

For example if the Arakanese were in the Rohingya shoes I would have support them in a heart beat. The Tutsi also murdered some Hutu, but I do not need to tell you which side got the international support. Stop with the sophistry you only embarrass yourself.

There is no corner or side to stand on when supporting Genocide. It's all clear cut from there.
 
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These Aren’t Refugee Camps, They’re Concentration Camps, and People Are Dying in Them
June 17, 2014
489723473.jpg

Rosheda Bagoung holds her malnourished child inside the tent at the Dar Paing refugee camp in Sittwe, Burma, on May 10, 2014 Lam Yik Fei—Getty Images
Confined to squalid camps, supposedly for their own "protection," Burma's persecuted Rohingya are slowly succumbing to starvation, despair and disease. Some are calling it a crime against humanity
Several days before he was born, Mohammad Johar’s family escaped the Buddhist mobs that attacked their Muslim neighborhood, leaving bodies and burned homes in their wake. The threat of renewed violence has since kept the family and tens of thousands of fellow ethnic Rohingya confined to a wasteland of camps, ringed by armed guards, outside this coastal town in western Burma. But enforced confinement has spawned more insidious dangers. Last week, 2-year-old Mohammad Johar died of diarrhea and other complications, contracted in a camp that state authorities claim was made to safeguard him. The local medical clinic was empty and the nearest hospital too far — perhaps impossible to reach, given that his family would have to secure permission to go outside the wire. “Only in death will he be free,” sighed his 18-year-old brother, Nabih, moments after wrapping the toddler’s body in a cotton shroud.

Two years after the outbreak of communal violence, a deepening humanitarian crisis is claiming more lives by the day. Malnutrition and waterborne illnesses in the camps, aggravated by the eviction of aid groups and onset of monsoon rains, have led to a surge of deaths that are easily preventable. In a country that’s still being hailed in the West for its tilt toward democracy, the ongoing blockade on critical aid to more than 100,000 displaced Rohingya around Sittwe — and thousands elsewhere in Rakhine state — amounts to a crime against humanity, rights groups say.

For years, the Rohingya have been denied citizenship in Buddhist-majority Burma, and have faced severe restrictions on marriage, employment, health care and education. Now, it seems, the Burmese authorities are determined to starve and sicken the Rohingya out of existence.

“Aid is still being obstructed by the authorities in a variety of ways, and this appears to be symptomatic of the shared feeling among government officials at all levels that the Rohingya don’t belong in Rakhine state,” says Matthew Smith, executive director of Fortify Rights, a Bangkok-based group that released a February report highlighting long-standing government policies targeting the ethnic minority. “The increasingly permanent segregation of the Rohingya is wholly inconsistent with the dominant narrative that democracy is sweeping the nation. The Rohingya are facing something greater than persecution — they’re facing existential threats.”

The vice grip shows no signs of loosening. Construction is now under way for a sprawling, walled-off police base inside the camp’s perimeter. Doctors Without Borders, the international aid agency that was evicted by the government in February, has not been allowed back. Although some foreign aid groups have resumed operations since late March, when radical Buddhists ransacked more than a dozen offices, the U.N. says much more should be done. The World Food Programme continues to provide rations of rice, chickpeas, oil and salt, but aid workers insist they are not enough to stem the gathering problem of acute malnutrition. Indeed, several interned Rohingya tell TIME they were brutally beaten by Burmese security forces in recent weeks for attempting to supplement their diet by fishing beyond the boundaries of the camps.

Burma’s government refuses to recognize its 1.3 million Rohingya as citizens. Though Rohingya have lived in the Buddhist-majority country for generations, they are widely, and affectedly, referred to as Bengalis, to convey the false impression that they are intruders from neighboring Bangladesh. “There is no such thing as ‘Rohingya,’” insists U Pynya Sa Mi, the head of a monastery in Sittwe. “The Rakhine people are simply defending their land against immigrants who are creating problems.”

Burmese officials downplay the health crisis, noting provisions of water and medical services. But the misery in the camps tells another story. Just off the road that leads inside, naked children with extended bellies loiter near a makeshift clinic that serves hundreds of families living in tarp-and-sheet-metal barracks. A line of mothers awaits the attention of Chit San Win, a former nurse who, out of necessity, has become a mobile doctor to the displaced. He sees an average of 40 patients a day and says conditions have become “much worse” since Doctors Without Borders was ousted, citing the dearth of government services and supplies. A 1-year-old boy under his care coughs with symptoms of tuberculosis, a growing scourge due to a lack of vaccinations. HIV and malaria are also a concern. However, without a lab to run tests or international aid agencies to provide hospital referrals, he’s left giving out hopeful assurances and second-rate medicine. “I do what I can,” says Chit San Win.

While the death toll is not clear because of the restrictions against aid groups, desperate conditions have driven scores of Rohingya to risk their lives at sea on boats bound for Thailand and Malaysia. Originally, traffickers packed dozens of refugees onto rickety craft that often sank. These days, the smaller boats ferry travelers to larger vessels that come up from the Burma-Thailand border; once full, with 300 to 500 passengers, they set off on the three-day voyage to Thailand. On arrival, the Rohingya must pay $2,000 to traffickers who brought them. If they fail to pay up, they may be imprisoned in jungle camps for ransom or sold into debt bondage. Those caught by the authorities hardly fare better: the Thais corral them in grim detention centers, where they fester as officials wait for a third country to take them.

Abul Bassier, a 36-year-old schoolteacher whose brother and father were killed when a mob razed their home in Sittwe’s Bu May quarter, says his younger brother took his chances on a boat trip in March. About two weeks later, Abul Bassier received a phone call from a man in Thailand demanding money for his brother’s release. With six children of his own to look after and no freedom to work, he is overcome by his own helplessness. “What can I do here, a prisoner with no rights, no humanity?” he exclaims, breaking into tears. Each time Abul Bassier calls the number stored on his cell phone, he says a Thai man asks whether he has the money, then hangs up when the invariably negative answer is given.

And yet, with scant relief on the horizon, some Rohingya are still mustering everything they can to get out, selling their own food rations, scrap metal, even their own clothing to raise funds. One of them, Muhibullah, 54, says he made the journey overland to Malaysia in 1988, back when the ruling military junta had all but sealed off Burma from the world. He was caught and spent 18 months in prison in Malaysia before being deported home. Over the past year, he says five of his friends have made the boat trip successfully; three have died en route. “But I’m not afraid,” he says, getting nods of support from a group of hard-bitten men seated with him under the shade of a banyan tree, waiting.

An hour later, the funeral procession for Mohammad Johar glides by and the men’s conversation falls silent. Trailed by a gaggle of boys in knitted white caps, a volunteer carries the tiny blanketed corpse on a banana leaf, far past the sun-beaten barracks and empty government-built health clinic. The group finally stops at a grass clearing in earshot of the sea, where lines of bamboo pens mark the freshly dug graves. In short order the little boy is buried and a prayer offered. Another day, another life gone.

This story was reported with a grant from the Pulitzer Center on Crisis Reporting.

Myanmar: Burma’s Rohingya Left to Die in Concentration Camps - TIME
 
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@Reashot Xigwin ,Rohingyas should not have done terrorism. What goes around,comes around.

& do tell me how that justify all this? Even an animal are treated better than these guys.

01kristof2-blog427.jpg

Many Rohingya Muslims are being denied health care. Amir Hussein says his arm was broken by a Buddhist mob two years ago. It is now useless because he never saw a doctor to re-set the bone. Credit Nicholas Kristof/The New York Times


 
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& do tell me how that justify all this? Even an animal are treated better than these guys.

When that is the problem of Rohingya's .They irked the majority by terrorism and islamism.So, they reap the consequences .
 
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When that is the problem of Rohingya's .They irked the majority by terrorism and islamism.So, they reap the consequences .

Denying them citizenship for once, then healthcare, educations, property, & etc. In short they're treated like they don't exist.
 
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Denying them citizenship for once, then healthcare, educations, property, & etc. In short they're treated like they don't exist.

Terrorists are treated like this . They have three choices now:
1) leave myanmar
2) become buddhist
3)reap the consequences.

Rohingya's were ungrateful to myanamar and did terrorism. So,you have the consequences.
 
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Terrorists are treated like this . They have three choices now:
1) leave myanmar
2) become buddhist
3)reap the consequences.

Rohingya's were ungrateful to myanamar and did terrorism. So,you have the consequences.

No, the Jews were treated like this. No one & I mean no one deserves this kind of fate. This is why we have International law in the first place to prevent this kind of thing! You have three choices now:
1) Denounce your humanity.
2) Try to grow a conscience.
3) Go f**k yourself.

Don't talk to me like I'm a buffon (I'm not you). So does Karen & the Kachin people so why don't they get the same kind of treatment the Rohingya have?
Internal conflict in Burma - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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No, the Jews were treated like this. No one & I mean no one deserves this kind of fate. This is why we have International law in the first place to prevent this kind of thing! You have three choices now:
1) Denounce your humanity.
2) Try to grow a conscience.
3) Go f**k yourself.

Don't talk to me like I'm a buffon (I'm not you). So does Karen & the Kachin people so why don't they get the same kind of treatment the Rohingya have?
Internal conflict in Burma - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The real question is.Do muslims respect international law? no. They respect only violence and might is right. Not a wonder Saudi arabia,Pakistan,Arab states is funding terror everywhere. When the population harbors and protects terrorists,they will be dealt as hostiles and terrorists themselves.

This is standard military protocol.
 
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The real question is.Do muslims respect international law? no. They respect only violence and might is right. Not a wonder Saudi arabia,Pakistan,Arab states is funding terror everywhere. When the population harbors and protects terrorists,they will be dealt as hostiles and terrorists themselves.

This is standard military protocol.

Are you an idiot? This is a Rohingya thread don't spam here. Not to mention Rohingya does their little rebellion way before the Saudi started funding terror groups. Non-state combatants are not legally bound by international laws, but a country must comply with it. I mean for F**k sake since when does treating enemy combatants has to with the mistreatment of the non-fighting Civilians population.

In case you don't know this is the ACTUAL standard military protocol. The Geneva convention exist to make war as "civil" as possible.

No need to thank me:
Burma's insurgencies have been supported or used by foreign states: the Karen received support from the United Kingdom (UK); along the shared border, East Pakistan (and then Bangladesh) assisted the Muslim Rohingyas, with additional Middle Eastern backing; the People's Republic of China assisted the Communist Party of Burma (CPB) (later the United Wa State Army), and the Naga and Kachin Independence Army ; the United States (U.S.) supported the Kuomintang; and Thailand assisted a wide variety of rebel groups by essentially creating buffer states or zones.[1] A renown Australian Criminal, Dave Everett also fought alongside and trained the Karen, sympathizing with them to the point of committing armed robbery in order to fund his weapon smuggling operation to Burma.[21]
 
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Are you an idiot? This is a Rohingya thread don't spam here. Not to mention Rohingya does their little rebellion way before the Saudi started funding terror groups. Non-state combatants are not legally bound by international laws, but a country must comply with it. I mean for F**k sake since when does treating enemy combatants has to with the mistreatment of the non-fighting Civilians population.

In case you don't know this is the ACTUAL standard military protocol. The Geneva convention exist to make war as
"civil" as possible.

Military protocol says otherwise and stands in contradiction of international geneva blah. Unlawful combatants and collaborators are to be severely dealt with .

The Geneva convention exist to make war as
"civil" as possible.

USA has military commission's act of 2006 . Russia has its military laws in implicit defiance of Geneva. As per legal mynamar laws,rohingyas are illegals and terrorists. And that strips them of all citizenship rights and allows myanmar more freedom in dealing with them.
 
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