Obama demands halt to South China Sea island building

[TaiShang]

Our Ma Yun of Alibaba may convince Mr. Obama that China is all about peace and mutual inclusive development. SCS for China means national security, global safety and prosperity and scientific advancement.

If Obama stays unconvinced, that's not bad, either. Talking makes him look tough.

 

[dichoi]

Rules are not followed by big powers.

so he is punished like uneducated boy, don't care that he is big boy.

 

[hexagonsnow]

I think what China doing now just like tower rush strategy in Warcraft 3.

 

[Zsari]

No, you do not understand the legal context of this dispute. China is claiming sovereignty over the seas within the 9 dash lines...China is not claiming that it is exercising its right to build artificial islands in “high seas” but is justifying its right to build within its sovereignty claim.
You do not understand the legal aspect of this. If China is claiming to build in “high seas” (which China has never claimed so) then China would face bigger legal implication (example: 9 dash line would dissappear because admitting they are high seas means declaring they are international water, which means VN and the PHL are free to claim EEZ past your 9 dash, etc.). China is claiming sovereignty over the area, not high seas. The problem now is, how is China claiming sovereignty? those artificial islands are not in Chinese EEZ or continental shelf, which means China cannot legally justify themselve based on sovereignty. Thats why China dont dare to go to court.

You failed to understand my statement. I'm not talking about Chinese construction which are on the reefs it claims sovereignty of. I'm just talking about US demand on China to stop building artificial island as China has the right to build any island anywhere on the high sea just as US has the right to exercise its freedom of navigation.

And no China claims all the islands and reefs within that 9 dash line, not the sea as ROC has already issued a statement clarifying that. Since ROC was the original creator of the 9 dash line, I consider their statement to be legally binding. You can claim EEZ into the 9 dash line as VN and PH have already done, but you can't claim EEZ pass the island & reefs that China claims. And you certainly can't lay claim to any territories via EEZ the way PH is doing.

 

[ArsalanKhan21]

In the same spirit US should also vacate the Diego Garcia Island base and return it to its original inhabitants the Chagossians.

 

[xunzi]

Go eat rock, Obama. LOL Demanding us to stop building on our territorial right, what is he thinking? LOL

 

[jkroo]

We did quite right thing for the demand. So let's rock and roll and build more in our own home.

 

[dichoi]

China is aggressor, she invaded into sea territory of other small neighbors. Only US can stop this new imperialist.

 

[bobsm]

Unfortunately for Obama, it seems the island building will continue.

____________________________________________________________

China demands U.S. stop "provocations" in South China Sea
English.news.cn | 2015-11-20 01:01:19 | Editor: huaxia

BEIJING, Nov. 19 (Xinhua) -- China's People's Liberation Army Navy commander Wu Shengli on Thursday called on the United States to stop its "provocations" in the South China Sea.

The Chinese navy, "bearing the bigger picture of bilateral ties in mind," had exercised "maximum restraint" in the face of U.S. provocations, Admiral Wu of the People's Liberation Army's Navy told Admiral Scott Swift, commander of the U.S. Pacific Fleet, in a meeting in Beijing.

He was referring to recent U.S. maneuvers near Chinese islands and reefs in the South China Sea without the permission of the Chinese government. The Chinese navy had been closely monitoring those "provocative acts" and had given warnings on several occasions, Wu said.

The Chinese admiral urged the U.S. to cherish the "good development" of ties between the countries, and "control" its maritime military operations.

Wu commended Admiral Swift's welcome visit to China as a sign that both sides attach great importance to the development and maintaining of the new type of major-country and military relations between the two sides.

The visit will contribute positively to the deepening of practical cooperation between the two navies and to the alleviation of tensions in the South China Sea as well as safeguarding regional peace and stability, he said.

But recent maneuvers by U.S. aircraft and naval vessels near Chinese islands and reefs in the South China Sea in the name of "freedom of navigation and aviation" have been a sheer provocation to China's sovereign rights and posed grave threats to the security of islands and reefs in the South China Sea, Wu said.

"The U.S. conduct does not contribute to peace and stability in the South China Sea whatsoever," he said, "The U.S. cannot impose its own claims on other nations. It cannot sabotage other nations' sovereignty and security."

The Chinese admiral went on to defend China's island building in the South China Sea as "sensible, reasonable and legitimate," adding that Chinese and U.S. navies should view their differences rationally, and avoid "situations of exigency."

Admiral Swift, for his part, said the U.S. navy does not want the South China Sea to become an issue disrupting ties between the two sides, expressing hope that the two navies could maintain high-level exchanges and hold more joint drills.

The navies should also improve implementation of the Code for Unplanned Encounters at Sea, to preclude misunderstandings and misjudgment and avoid maritime and aerial accidents, Swift said.


China News – Xinhua Headlines, Photos, Video | English.news.cn

 

[Wolfwind]

China is aggressor, she invaded into sea territory of other small neighbors. Only US can stop this new imperialist.

Well no, China believes those territories belongs to them. They see it as building within their own territory.

 

[dichoi]

Well no, China believes those territories belongs to them. They see it as building within their own territory.

No.

China is invaded with force in 1974 and 1988. Islands were never china's territory. China dare not to join with Pynoy in UNCLOS arbitration. This is clear that China claim in 1947 is fake..

 

[Wolfwind]

No.

China is invaded with force in 1974 and 1988. Islands were never china's territory. China dare not to join with Pynoy in UNCLOS arbitration. This is clear that China claim in 1947 is fake..

No, im pretty sure they defended (not invaded) their territory in 1974 and 1988 because they believed it was theirs anyway. They saw that other countries started colonising their territory so they wanted to put a stop to it.

And UNCLOS is pointless because there's just too many bullying tactics to pander to the argumentum ad populum fallacy.

So basically China has been defending territories that it believes are hers. And China sees it as building within their own territory, and not the territory of others. You can't really call that invading or imperialism because she considers those areas as her own territory anyway.

 

[dichoi]

No, im pretty sure they defended (not invaded) their territory in 1974 and 1988 because they believed it was theirs anyway. They saw that other countries started colonising their territory so they wanted to put a stop to it.

And UNCLOS is pointless because there's just too many bullying tactics to pander to the argumentum ad populum fallacy.

So basically China has been defending territories that it believes are hers. And China sees it as building within their own territory, and not the territory of others. You can't really call that invading or imperialism because she considers those areas as her own territory anyway.

China propaganda is lying about Islands in SCS, there was never territory of China. Invasion of China is illegal.

 

[Wolfwind]

China propaganda is lying about Islands in SCS, there was never territory of China. Invasion of China is illegal.

Vietnam propaganda is lying about Islands in SCS, there was never territory of Vietnam. Invasion of Vietnam is illegal.

 

[William Hung]

You failed to understand my statement. I'm not talking about Chinese construction which are on the reefs it claims sovereignty of. I'm just talking about US demand on China to stop building artificial island as China has the right to build any island anywhere on the high sea just as US has the right to exercise its freedom of navigation.

But this thread is talking about the area in the SCS where China is claiming sovereignty over. Obama is talking about this area. China has never officially said they are building in the high seas. So there is no point talking about rights in the high seas when China does not even use this excuse for the SCS.

And no China claims all the islands and reefs within that 9 dash line, not the sea as ROC has already issued a statement clarifying that. Since ROC was the original creator of the 9 dash line, I consider their statement to be legally binding.

This is your own interpretation, not the official PRC declaration. Can you even given reference to official PRC statements that align with your interpretation? China has never dared to officially declare what those dash lines mean in legal terms. China has only said “we have indisputable sovereignty over it” but never dared to clarify the meaning of the dash lines. Even Indonesia is now asking China to clarify it but China keep ignoring that question.

What Taiwan say is not the official line of the PRC unless the PRC also officially endorses it. The PRC dont even recognise the ROC govt as being a legal representative of the PRC.

You can claim EEZ into the 9 dash line as VN and PH have already done, but you can't claim EEZ pass the island & reefs that China claims. And you certainly can't lay claim to any territories via EEZ the way PH is doing.

You do not understand the UNCLOS. Any reefs that are submerged under water during high tide are considered as part of the seabed. You can not claim sovereignty over seabeds, which include those submerged reefs. The seabed/reefs will be considered as the continental shelf of the coastal state. And guess what? Mischief reef is one of those reefs that are submerged during high tide and within the EEZ of the Philippines. That is why your govt dont dare to use the high-sea rights excuse, because that would mean Mischief reefs and the water around it belong to the Philippines’ EEZ. Your govt excuse is just to say “we have indisputable sovereignty” but dont dare to clarify it in legal terms.

So basically China has been defending territories that it believes are hers. And China sees it as building within their own territory, and not the territory of others. You can't really call that invading or imperialism because she considers those areas as her own territory anyway.

@Zsari , what you say seem to contradict with your countryman Wolfwind. One says China is exercising its right to build in the high seas while the other says China sees it as building within its territory.

Can you clarify?