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New Yorkers Look To Suburbs And Beyond. Other City Dwellers May Be Next

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npr.org/2020/07/08/887585383/new-yorkers-look-to-suburbs-and-beyond-other-city-dwellers-may-be-next

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Until recently, Steven Kanaplue and Miriam Kanter were living in a one-bedroom apartment on Manhattan's Upper West Side with their dog Booey. The pandemic clinched their decision to move to Montclair, N.J.

Trends often start in New York. The latest: quitting the city and moving to the suburbs.

If not quite an exodus, the pandemic has sent enough New Yorkers to the exits to shake up the area's housing market. Longtime real estate agent Susan Horowitz says she has never seen anything like it. She describes the frantic, hypercompetitive bidding in the suburb of Montclair, N.J., as a "blood sport."

"We are seeing 20 offers on houses. We are seeing things going 30% over the asking price. It's kind of insane," Horowitz says.

About 12 miles from New York City, Montclair is the kind of suburb that even appeals to demanding New Yorkers. It has yoga studios, restaurants locals can walk to, art galleries, even a film festival. It's always popular, but now on a completely different scale. "Every last bit of it is COVID-related," Horowitz says.

New Yorkers aren't the only big city dwellers who have been decamping for suburbs, smaller cities and rural areas. It began with the affordability crisis in cities such as San Francisco, New York and Los Angeles and has only picked up momentum during the pandemic, according to Glenn Kelman, CEO of the national online brokerage Redfin.

The effects of COVID-19 have made many people "wary of living in close quarters," he says. On top of that, the freedom to work from home means "a huge percentage of people are now looking further afield."

Ditching the city and buying a quiet place away from the crowds takes money. Only the relatively well-off can do it. But low interest rates could make homeownership affordable to more people for whom it has been out of reach — if they've maintained their income during the recession.

Kelman says the preference for single-family homes has increased nationally: Thirty-six percent of searches on Redfin in May were exclusively for single-family homes, up from 28% a year earlier.

By all accounts, the coronavirus has been a catalyst, prompting people who had been toying with moving to take the plunge finally — like Miriam Kanter and Steven Kanaplue. They're expecting their first child in September. Kanter works in ad sales; Kanaplue is in risk management. And until recently they were living in a one-bedroom apartment on Manhattan's Upper West Side with their dog Booey. As the virus spiked in the spring, stepping outside became a nerve-wracking experience. "Coming in and out of the building at least four to five times a day to walk him [Booey] — it was getting really stressful," Kanter says.

They had been planning to move to the suburbs since January. The pandemic clinched it. "Being in the epicenter, the washing of the hands, the nerves of it all. It was pushing us out the door," Kanter says.

Out the door to Montclair. In late April, their offer on a Colonial-style house with black shutters and a big front porch beat out four other bids. Kanter says they paid almost 20% above the asking price and thinks they would have been forced to pay even more if they had waited to buy a place. And so on June 1, they moved in and officially became suburbanites. "Everything changed the moment we could let the dog out in the yard," Kanter says.

Similar stories are playing out throughout the greater New York area. Since March, around 10,000 New Yorkers applied to change their address with the U.S. Postal Service and moved to Connecticut, according to Hearst Connecticut Media.

Monica Schwerberg is a real estate agent who works with clients who want to live within two to 2 1/2 hours of New York City, mostly rural areas upstate. "Things have definitely picked up and have gotten pretty wild," she says. In a busy April, when home shopping typically picks up, she and her colleagues would typically get about 75 inquiries. This April, it was more than 400.

The option of moving to the countryside has become more viable with remote work taking hold, says Kelman, Redfin's CEO. "All over the country, folks who had really thought 45 minutes or an hour was the limit to my commute are now willing to commute two or three hours because they're only planning to come into the office once a week," Kelman says.

In May, Melisse Gelula and her spouse, Tiffany Wolf, moved from a rental apartment in Brooklyn to the bucolic hamlet of Narrowsburg along the Delaware River in upstate New York. One point of comparison between city and country? "The town of Narrowsburg has a population of about 400, which is less than the building where I lived in Brooklyn, which had about 750 units," Gelula says.

For five years, they had been coming to the Narrowsburg house for weekends and holidays. It's about two hours from the city. Gelula, a wellness expert and media entrepreneur, says the decision to move permanently was partly dictated by finances and the sky-high cost of living in New York. There were other motivations as well. "I needed a place that didn't look on to other buildings, that looked on to trees," Gelula says. "For me and my well-being, being in nature is really, really vital."

And the pandemic landed with its full force close to home. She saw funeral homes with refrigerated tents and trucks to accommodate the overflow of the deceased. "It made Brooklyn feel a lot different to me," Gelula says. "I thought maybe this is not the time for us to stick it out, maybe this is the time for us to retreat and come back when New York has had a moment to breathe and heal."
 
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https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/09/sha...e-biggest-exodus-from-cities-in-50-years.html
‘Shark Tank’ investor Herjavec: We’re about to see biggest exodus from cities in 50 years

  • “Shark Tank” investor Robert Herjavec said Thursday he believes the coronavirus pandemic has shifted attitudes about city living, altering the dynamics of the real estate market for years ahead.
  • This is one of the greatest moves to the suburbs from urban areas since the 1950s or the ’60s,” Herjavec said on CNBC’s “Squawk Alley.”
  • “I recently moved out of Los Angeles into a suburban area, and I can tell you on a very personal level, my area is on fire,” he added.

Shark Tank” investor Robert Herjavec said Thursday he believes the coronavirus pandemic has shifted attitudes about city living, altering the dynamics of the real estate market for years ahead.

“This is one of the greatest moves to the suburbs from urban areas since the 1950s or the ’60s,” Herjavec said on CNBC’s “Squawk Alley.” “I recently moved out of Los Angeles into a suburban area, and I can tell you on a very personal level, my area is on fire.”

Herjavec, CEO and founder of cybersecurity firm Herjavec Group, said he feels that the changes in geographic preference will persist beyond just the height of the Covid-19 outbreak, predicting it will “be a trend for a while.”

“Everybody wants to leave large urban communities and move out into the suburbs,” said Herjavec, who also owns stakes in many small and medium-size businesses. “And I think urban real estate is going to hurt for a little bit.”

On Wednesday, new data showed New York City apartment vacancy in June hit a record high of 3.67%. More than 10,000 apartments listed on the market that month, an 85% increase compared with June of last year, according to a report from Miller Samuel and Douglas Elliman. The report largely attributed the spike to brokers being unable to show apartments due to business restrictions, as well as a general decline in demand.

Realogy Holdings CEO Ryan Schneider told CNBC on Thursday that company also is observing the coronavirus’ impact on where people are looking to live. The suburbanization trend has been the strongest in the New York City area, he said, but it’s not limited to it. The real estate company, which owns such brands as Coldwell Banker and Century 21, also is seeing the trend in California and other areas, he said.

“In every urban geography, the web traffic of people and what they’re searching for has changed versus 6 to 12 months ago to be much more suburban,” he said on “The Exchange.” “Even in the urban geographies where that rotation has not happened in the actual housing purchase and sales yet, the consumer searching is going in that direction and we continue to see that through the whole Covid crisis in the last three months.”

The coronavirus pandemic has brought about questions for the real estate industry, both in the commercial and residential sectors. On the commercial side, uncertainty persists about the long-term shift to remote work, which many companies adopted in March in a bid to slow the spread of Covid-19, and how it will impact demand for office space.

Hessam Nadji, CEO of Marcus & Millichap, the U.S.′ largest commercial real estate broker, told CNBC on Tuesday he believes urban areas will lose businesses and residents as a result of the pandemic. But, he said, it won’t be permanent.

“I think the next 18 to 24 months are going to show a lot of exodus out of central business districts, as you can expect,” Nadji said on “The Exchange.” “We’re seeing there’s a lot of office vacancy, for example, in the suburbs that have now been absorbed; there’s a lot of demand for rental homes that we’re seeing because people are fleeing especially hot spots like New York, but ... you just have to keep a long-term view on it.”
 
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https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/17/realestate/coronavirus-suburbs-real-estate.html
5 Ways the Coronavirus Has Changed Suburban Real Estate

Thousands of New Yorkers left the city and headed to the suburbs during the pandemic, and real estate there hasn’t been the same since.
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Credit...Simone Noronha

Shawna Padula and Keith Hymes, both 37, decided very shortly after the pandemic shutdown in New York that they would stop looking for a larger apartment in the city for their growing family and instead shop for a house in the suburbs.

It was late March when they headed out to Long Island’s North Shore to see a four-bedroom colonial with a big backyard in Manhasset. Real estate agents were then prohibited from giving in-person home tours, but the homeowner had agreed to personally show them around, provided they wore masks and gloves.

“It was the first and only house we looked at,” said Ms. Padula, who works in the apparel industry and is expecting the couple’s second child. “We really liked the area, and the house was move-in ready.”

They bought the house right away for $1.575 million, and moved in late last month. Mr. Hymes had been reluctant to leave the city, but now they’re both relieved they bought when they did, as competition in the suburban commuter markets has grown fierce.

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“I have a girlfriend who was looking to buy in Huntington,” Ms. Padula said. “In May she had scheduled to see five houses on a Saturday. She set them up on a Tuesday. By the time she went to look, there was only one left.”

The well-documented exodus from the city over the past few months is upending housing market dynamics in close-in suburbs in Long Island, Fairfield County, Conn., Westchester County and northern New Jersey.

Areas that have seen declining values for years are suddenly attracting flocks of buyers. Multiple competing offers, a phenomenon last commonplace in the run-up to the housing market collapse, are the norm again for listings in turnkey condition, and especially if they’re priced under $1 million. Demand for single-family rentals is also unrelenting — and landlords are cashing in big-time.

Sales agents are fielding calls at all hours of the day and night, trying to keep pace with market conditions that seemingly changed overnight.


“Sellers are realizing the sudden new demand — it’s like catching lightning in a bottle,” said Jaime Sneddon, a broker with William Pitt Sotheby’s International Realty in New Canaan, Conn. “Who knows how long it’s going to last?”

No one has an answer to that question, largely because it begs so many other questions. Will the flow out of the city continue through the summer? What if there’s a second wave of the virus this fall? How many former city dwellers now renting in the suburbs will choose to become permanent residents? And of course, there’s the uncertain economy.

While the markets will settle down at some point, the suburbs might benefit for some time if the preference for urban living is significantly weakened by the virus’s brutal toll, said Jeffrey Otteau, president of the Otteau Group, a real estate valuation and consulting firm based in New Jersey.

“This was a life-altering series of events which likely made an indelible mark on everyone’s psyche, not unlike what happened after the Great Depression,” Mr. Otteau said. “That experience put an imprint on peoples’ minds that shaped their lives for decades to come. Possibly this is one of those events.”

Or not.

“When there is a vaccine, and let’s call it 2021, and this is resolved, does this thinking continue? My thinking is no,” said Jonathan Miller, the president and chief executive of Miller Samuel appraisers. “Only because we saw this after 9/11. We saw this outbound migration for three years and then it reversed.”

For now, here are five ways in which the flight from the city is currently disrupting suburban real estate.


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It’s a Sellers’ Market
Courtney and Rob Silverstein began looking for a house on Long Island even before New York’s shutdown, as they began hearing about the virus’s impact in Asia and Europe. Then living in Long Island City with their infant son, the couple went to Rockville Centre in February for a Saturday open house at a three-bedroom, three-bath colonial. They returned Sunday for a second look.

“It was packed both days even though it was rainy and cold,” said Ms. Silverstein, 33, who oversees corporate social media marketing for Bloomberg. “On that Monday, we made an offer. There were other offers, so we did have to adjust our bid, but fortunately, they accepted ours.”

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The simple laws of supply and demand have sent the pendulum swinging in sellers’ favor. The surge in demand from New Yorkers is heaped on top of pent-up demand from a spring market that was delayed by the pandemic ban on in-person showings. Add to that a reduced supply of listings and you have a market that is in no mood for lowball offers.

In Westchester, the number of signed contracts soared in the month prior to June 21, hitting a total that was 18 percent higher than the same period last year, according to data from William Pitt Sotheby’s.

“The scarcity of inventory has been fueling an already busy market,” said Owen Berkowitz, a co-principal of the Berkowitz Marrone team with Douglas Elliman, in Scarsdale. “Some potential listings fell by the wayside — people stopped readying their houses because everyone was shut down. I have clients waiting for more inventory.”

In Greenwich, Conn., closings of single-family homes were up 8 percent over last year during the second quarter, while inventory was down by nearly 18.5 percent, according to a Douglas Elliman market report. (Connecticut, unlike New York, never banned in-home showings.)

Jennifer Leahy, in Douglas Elliman’s Greenwich office, said she had received multiple bids on nearly all of her listings below $3 million in the past few months, including “houses that had been sitting on the market and weren’t turnkey.”

Above $4 million, buyers are still slow to pull the trigger, but below $3 million, “I don’t have enough inventory for my buyers,” she said.

The flurry of activity persuaded Nest Seekers International to add Greenwich to its network of brokerage locations. Eddie Shapiro, the company’s chief executive, said they had long thought about opening in Greenwich, “but the opportunity didn’t feel right until Covid happened. We’re just following our clients’ needs.”

In the inner-ring northern New Jersey suburbs in Bergen, Essex, Union and Middlesex counties, listings under contract were up 70 percent in May over April, as shutdown restrictions began to ease, Mr. Otteau said. The increased demand started in the entry-level tiers, between $400,000 and $600,000, but then spread through all of the other tiers, including the luxury sector above $2.5 million, he said.

“Now the largest increase in home-buying demand is in that luxury sector,” he said. “In Bergen County, we’re seeing a doubling in the sales pace year on year.”

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Back Country Is Making a Comeback
For years, values in the so-called back-country areas — characterized by expansive homes on multiple-acre lots — have dropped off sharply, as buyer preferences shifted to in-town locations and more-manageable yard sizes. Inventory piled up. But with more buyers now looking for large outdoor spaces and swimming pools to help them ride out the pandemic, the back country is feeling the love again.

New Canaan, Conn., where the town’s four-acre zone has long lagged. “We just thawed a market that had been frozen over for a long time.”

In Greenwich, Conn., about 50 houses had sold on lots of two acres or more as of mid-June, compared with 40 at the same time last year, according to Mark Pruner, an agent with Berkshire Hathaway.

“The remarkable thing about that is the sales went up on those lots while we were having a pandemic,” Mr. Pruner said.

In Weston, Conn., long a sleepy market with minimum two-acre zoning and no downtown, more than 80 listings had accepted offers or were under contract as of June 22, at least triple the pace of last year at the same time, according to Cyd Hamer, an agent in William Pitt Sotheby’s Westport office.

In Westchester, where it “became vogue to live in the lower county,” where development is more dense, more buyers are now drifting north to large-lot towns like Bedford, North Salem and Pound Ridge, according to Mr. Berkowitz.

“After a great decline in interest in the big stuff, properties that were somewhat lagging on the market are now gaining interest,” he said.

“Dated” Is No Longer a Deal Killer
While move-in ready homes are still most in demand, buyers are no longer turning up their noses at properties that need work. Limited inventory and shifting priorities have changed that.

“Younger-age buyers have really not wanted to take on renovation projects, so if a house wasn’t move-in ready, it would take longer to sell and would sell at a discount,” Mr. Otteau said. “It still has an effect on the selling price of a home, but the need for work is no longer an impediment to sale.”

For example, with swimming pools at the top of so many buyers’ wish lists, some are willing to put up with dated kitchens and baths to get that outdoor amenity, Ms. Hamer said.

“I joke that people are buying the pool and the house that goes with it,” she said.


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In Manhasset, Ann Hance, an associate broker with Daniel Gale Sotheby’s International Realty, put a dated three-bedroom colonial on the market the weekend of June 12 for $1.599 million.

“It’s a house that needs work. It’s got a great backyard and nicely scaled rooms, but it needs updating,” Ms. Hance said. “I had seven offers that weekend. It’s going to close for substantially more than the list price, and it’s all cash. This wasn’t the case in 2019.”

Mr. Pruner said he was working with three couples looking for a home in Greenwich, and “two out of the three are looking for something that needs work because they think it will be a better price.”

Rents Are Through the Roof
The market for single-family rentals continues to be red hot in coastal Fairfield County (as well as Litchfield County to the north). Many homeowners who have somewhere else to go are putting their primary homes up for rent and collecting unprecedented sums. The inventory of summer rentals rose dramatically as owners decided to test the waters to see how much they could get, said Melodye Colucci, an agent with Coldwell Banker Residential Brokerage in Stamford.

“It has truly become the Wild West in Fairfield County,” Ms. Colucci said. “The Hamptons are pretty much sold out for summer rentals, hence the move here.”

Most renters are looking in the $4,000 to $7,000 a month range, which gets a modest-sized three or four-bedroom home, she said. But high-end rentals are extremely competitive, even as they command tens of thousands a month. Last year, between March 1 and June 26, about 50 single-family homes rented for $10,000 a month or more in Fairfield County — this year the number is almost 260, Ms. Colucci said. (The figures include both summer and yearly rentals.)

“Traditionally you would think these very well-to-do people who have these beautiful houses wouldn’t really need the money,” she said. “But if you can go to your vacation house and come back with $100,000 in the bank — well, there were a lot more families this year who decided that was a good idea.”

Ms. Hamer was contacted by a couple who live on Fifth Avenue — they wanted to rent for the summer but “didn’t like anything on the market, and said to me, ‘please find us something special.” She found a homeowner willing to rent them a waterfront property in Westport for $200,000 for 10 weeks — the couple was “thrilled.”

Emotions Rule
The rush to get into a house is causing many deals to be driven more by emotion than the usual business-minded pragmatism at the higher end, agents say.

“We do have the Wall Street crowd here and I have clients that still employ their spreadsheets,” comparing price per square foot and other metrics among listings, said Ms. Hance, in Long Island. “But there are people who clearly want to make the move and they’re going to do it regardless. Especially if the woman is pregnant or they have babies and there’s a strong emotional component to make a life change now. They want to close this summer.”

Many buyers in competitive price ranges aren’t even looking at comps — comparable properties that sold within the last six months — when deciding how much to offer on a home, said Ms. Hamer.

“They’re looking at the other active listings. They have their checkbook in hand and they’re saying, ‘what’s available in my range, and I’m going to pick one of those,’ ” she said. “It’s not something we’re used to at all.”

Fear can be highly motivating, said Ms. Colucci, in Stamford. She listed a $25,000 a month rental in Westport that received six offers in 36 hours; four of those offers were from people who hadn’t set foot in the house.

“One of the couples who lost out called right away and asked if I had anything else — they were in a co-op on Park Avenue and afraid of riding the elevator,” she said. “Fear is a huge driving emotion and people who can afford it will pay a huge premium to make that fear go away.”
 
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https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/09/sha...e-biggest-exodus-from-cities-in-50-years.html
‘Shark Tank’ investor Herjavec: We’re about to see biggest exodus from cities in 50 years

  • “Shark Tank” investor Robert Herjavec said Thursday he believes the coronavirus pandemic has shifted attitudes about city living, altering the dynamics of the real estate market for years ahead.
  • This is one of the greatest moves to the suburbs from urban areas since the 1950s or the ’60s,” Herjavec said on CNBC’s “Squawk Alley.”
  • “I recently moved out of Los Angeles into a suburban area, and I can tell you on a very personal level, my area is on fire,” he added.

Shark Tank” investor Robert Herjavec said Thursday he believes the coronavirus pandemic has shifted attitudes about city living, altering the dynamics of the real estate market for years ahead.

“This is one of the greatest moves to the suburbs from urban areas since the 1950s or the ’60s,” Herjavec said on CNBC’s “Squawk Alley.” “I recently moved out of Los Angeles into a suburban area, and I can tell you on a very personal level, my area is on fire.”

Herjavec, CEO and founder of cybersecurity firm Herjavec Group, said he feels that the changes in geographic preference will persist beyond just the height of the Covid-19 outbreak, predicting it will “be a trend for a while.”

“Everybody wants to leave large urban communities and move out into the suburbs,” said Herjavec, who also owns stakes in many small and medium-size businesses. “And I think urban real estate is going to hurt for a little bit.”

On Wednesday, new data showed New York City apartment vacancy in June hit a record high of 3.67%. More than 10,000 apartments listed on the market that month, an 85% increase compared with June of last year, according to a report from Miller Samuel and Douglas Elliman. The report largely attributed the spike to brokers being unable to show apartments due to business restrictions, as well as a general decline in demand.

Realogy Holdings CEO Ryan Schneider told CNBC on Thursday that company also is observing the coronavirus’ impact on where people are looking to live. The suburbanization trend has been the strongest in the New York City area, he said, but it’s not limited to it. The real estate company, which owns such brands as Coldwell Banker and Century 21, also is seeing the trend in California and other areas, he said.

“In every urban geography, the web traffic of people and what they’re searching for has changed versus 6 to 12 months ago to be much more suburban,” he said on “The Exchange.” “Even in the urban geographies where that rotation has not happened in the actual housing purchase and sales yet, the consumer searching is going in that direction and we continue to see that through the whole Covid crisis in the last three months.”

The coronavirus pandemic has brought about questions for the real estate industry, both in the commercial and residential sectors. On the commercial side, uncertainty persists about the long-term shift to remote work, which many companies adopted in March in a bid to slow the spread of Covid-19, and how it will impact demand for office space.

Hessam Nadji, CEO of Marcus & Millichap, the U.S.′ largest commercial real estate broker, told CNBC on Tuesday he believes urban areas will lose businesses and residents as a result of the pandemic. But, he said, it won’t be permanent.

“I think the next 18 to 24 months are going to show a lot of exodus out of central business districts, as you can expect,” Nadji said on “The Exchange.” “We’re seeing there’s a lot of office vacancy, for example, in the suburbs that have now been absorbed; there’s a lot of demand for rental homes that we’re seeing because people are fleeing especially hot spots like New York, but ... you just have to keep a long-term view on it.”
I assumed most Americans already lived in the suburbs minus the few great big metropolitan areas lol. Maybe its just Texas, but practically everyone here lives in the suburbs
 
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I assumed most Americans already lived in the suburbs minus the few great big metropolitan areas lol. Maybe its just Texas, but practically everyone here lives in the suburbs

That's true in Massachusetts too (Boston is only 50 sq miles).
However Coronavirus cases here are centered in dense city areas (Chelsea had 7,700 cases per 100,000 people! Meanwhile it's < 1000 in the suburbs) or spread out elderly care facilities served by low wage health workers who tend to live in those dense areas.
 
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That's true in Massachusetts too (Boston is only 50 sq miles).
However Coronavirus cases here are centered in dense city areas or spread out elderly care facilities served by low wage health workers who tend to live in those dense areas.
I heard it is an expensive place as well! On the bright side you guys have amazing summers lol ... it typically gets above 100 degrees in Texas these days.
 
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It'll be interesting to see the long term impact of Coronavirus and WFH on office space in cities. The company I work for was aggressively hiring and has continued to hire during this crisis. Our business is unaffected and runs fluidly from home. They were considering getting another floor in our building but are now talking about a "new normal" where people aren't in the office most of the time.

My neighbours company has made his team home based permanently. They've vacated the office. It'll be interesting to see what becomes of cities in the future.
 
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It'll be interesting to see the long term impact of Coronavirus and WFH on office space in cities. The company I work for was aggressively hiring and has continued to hire during this crisis. Our business is unaffected and runs fluidly from home. They were considering getting another floor in our building but are now talking about a "new normal" where people aren't in the office most of the time.

My neighbours company has made his team home based permanently. They've vacated the office. It'll be interesting to see what becomes of cities in the future.

I feel the WFH could be permanent because theirs massive cost savings for business owners. Warehouse and Stocking jobs will be around; but slowly the stocking jobs would switch to warehouse as businesses go online and less foot traffic at stores.

This was bound to happen down the road it’s just corona accelerated the shift. And with all the tech available businesses adapted quickly.

The school systems suck up a lot of property tax money.
https://www.wbur.org/news/2010/09/01/newton-north
At Almost $200M, Newton North Shines

In my suburb in Illinois for a 3,000 Sq. ft house property tax is 13,000 and almost 60-65% is sucked by the school system.
 
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It'll be interesting to see the long term impact of Coronavirus and WFH on office space in cities. The company I work for was aggressively hiring and has continued to hire during this crisis. Our business is unaffected and runs fluidly from home. They were considering getting another floor in our building but are now talking about a "new normal" where people aren't in the office most of the time.

My neighbours company has made his team home based permanently. They've vacated the office. It'll be interesting to see what becomes of cities in the future.

Well working from home was in many of those "predicting the future" short videos from the 1950's and 1960's.

That's Arthur C Clarke predicting the rise of desktop computers which will allow people to work from home and not need to work in cities.
 
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NY is way densely populated . I doubt few thousand will make much difference to the city overcrowding problem.
 
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In my suburb in Illinois for a 3,00 Sq. ft house property tax is 13,000 and almost 60-65% is sucked by the school system.

They don't call us "Taxachusetts" for nothing.
Screen Shot 2020-07-17 at 7.18.17 PM.jpg

Illinois is right behind us (or ahead of us)

I feel your pain with taxes. It's slightly higher than $13K here.
 
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Yeah. I’m planning to shift to Texas in 3-5 years, and they’ve decided this July to increase again.
Also I meant to say 3,000 Sq. Ft. Lol

No basements in Texas. You lose 1/4 to 1/3 of your house (well more like you lose your junk area ...which well is kind of nice to have...I think...well miscellaneous area if anything..hey I like all the utility stuff in the basement...plus the extra refrigerators).
 
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