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Israeli economics minister: Construction in Jerusalem is Zionism

@T-123456

People like you are deliberate liars, this was the same thing being held against the PA in the late 80's and the PA conceded to everything and in return not a single thing changed, it only got worse. You people point fingers at the victim, tell us what good did the PA get from conceding to all of Israel's demands? Why don't you actually condemn the source of the problem? The occupier?


Oh those poor peace loving people, removed a couple Jewish structures due to military presence while announcing another 10,000 in a span of months. :(

Settlement construction rate rises 70% in 2013 | The Times of Israel
 
@T-123456

People like you are deliberate liars, this was the same thing being held against the PA in the late 80's and the PA conceded to everything and in return not a single thing changed, it only got worse. You people point fingers at the victim, tell us what good did the PA get from conceding to all of Israel's demands? Why don't you actually condemn the source of the problem? The occupier?
I'm a deliberate liar,what good would it do if i would condemn the occupier,i would just lie.
You better mention the honest people in the future,they would never lie to you or give you false hope.
 
I'm a deliberate liar,what good would it do if i would condemn the occupier,i would just lie.
You better mention the honest people in the future,they would never lie to you or give you false hope.

Nothing you provide has anything to do with reality or facts on the ground, all you do is indulge in anti Palestinian rants with no basis. Why don't you answer my questions?

Muslim, Christian and Druze have equal rights in Israel since 1948.

US: Israel discriminates against non-Jews | Maan News Agency

US: Israel discriminates against non-Jews

Bethlehem - Ma'an - Israel continues to discriminate against its religious minorities legally, financially and culturally, according to a US State Department review on worldwide religious freedom released on Monday.

In its 2009 International Religious Freedom Report, the foreign service said that despite past documentation of prejudice against minorities, the status of respect for religious freedoms by Israel "was unchanged during the reporting period."

The report comes one day after at least 30 Palestinians were injured and 20 arrested in violent clashes near the Al-Aqsa Mosque compound that followed an early-morning raid by Israel's paramilitary police forces unit. Nine Israeli officers were also hurt in the incident, mostly from rocks thrown by local teenagers in occupied East Jerusalem.

"We would encourage the government of Israel, as we encourage every government, to ensure that multiple religious faiths who live in that place are entitled to freedom to worship," said US Assistant Secretary of State Michael Posner during the report's official release in Washington on Monday.

Although its section on Israel and the occupied territories says both people's governments purport to respect freedom of religion, the annual review compiles a vast list of Israeli policies that amount to discrimination against non-Jews.

Additionally, it accuses the Palestinian Authority in Ramallah and the Hamas-backed de facto government in Gaza of failing to adequately investigate or prosecute a handful of instances over the past 12 months.

'Israel doesn't protect mosques, churches'

The report found that inside Israel, "government and legal discrimination against non-Jews" continued unabated, and cited several cases in which Israel also failed to adequately address previous allegations.

For example, the report notes that while more than 20 percent of its population is Muslim and Christian, Israel "provides significantly greater levels of legal protection and government resources to Jewish holy places than to those of other religious groups."

"Israel implements regulations only for Jewish sites," the State Department report said. "Non-Jewish holy sites do not enjoy legal protection," and of the country's 137 designated holy sites, not one is for Christians or Muslims.

More egregious, according to the report, is that holy sites go unprotected as Israel "has drafted regulations to identify, protect, and fund only Jewish holy sites." Although many sites have "de facto protection" because of their importance to foreign tourists, "many Muslim and Christian sites are neglected, inaccessible, or threatened by property developers and municipalities."

In some cases, Israel actually permits "citizens or municipalities to turn old mosques into galleries, restaurants, and museums," according to the State Department.

Israel's own government admits its state budgets cover only the costs of constructing Jewish sites and that it provides just basic maintenance to non-Jewish shrines at a "disproportionally lower level than for synagogues."

Following an order by the country's High Court to explain such unequal policies, Israel responded that specific regulations were not necessary for the protection of any holy sites. However, the report said, Israel "did not explain why it therefore promulgated regulations for Jewish sites but not for non-Jewish sites."

The High Court also ruled that Beersheva municipality could reopen the city's old mosque as a museum, the report said. Approximately 80,000 Bedouins were unable to build or legally maintain mosques "as a result of longstanding government policy to deny ownership claims, building requests, and municipal services." A rights group responded that while there was one synagogue for every 700 Jews, there was not a single mosque for the city's 5,000 Muslims.

Relatedly, religious figures were horrified that the court recently ruled the Simon Wiesenthal Center could continue building on a plot of land containing a centuries-old Muslim cemetery. In March, the court ruled that implementing regulations to protect Islamic holy sites are unnecessary, according to the State Department.

Israel segregates public schools between Jews and non-Jews, the report said, and while its schools for Palestinians offer studies in both Islam and Christianity, state funding for is proportionately less than the funding for religious education courses in Jewish schools. Meanwhile, the country's Ministry of the Interior has not yet ended its policy of differentiating between Jews and non-Jews on national identification documents, the report noted.

There were, however, improvements in Israel's overall treatment of religious minorities within the past 12 months, according to the State Department.

For instance, two defendants were sentenced to two months imprisonment, suspended for three years, for their part in a 2006 incident where some 100 ultra-Orthodox Jews assaulted around 50 Christian tourists in a Jerusalem neighborhood. In September 2008, Israeli police reissued a 1999 directive to police precincts throughout the country reminding them of their duty to fully investigate crimes against minority religious communities, which was apparently lacking.

Also, numerous NGOs in the country continue to promote Jewish-Palestinian coexistence and interfaith harmony, according to the report. "These groups and their events had varying degrees of success," the report said.

Religious freedom in Palestine

According to the same report, Palestinians in the occupied territories continue to suffer violations of religious freedom related to Israel's ongoing military presence.

Following an unsuccessful appeal by the Vatican, the Interior Ministry stated that multiple-entry visas for clergy and other religious workers constituted a security threat and would not be issued. "The shortage of foreign clergy impeded the functioning of Christian congregations," according to the report, which said Israel applies travel restrictions that significantly impede freedom of access to places of worship in the West Bank.

Israeli authorities severely limit the access of Palestinians to the city of Bethlehem's Rachel's tomb, a shrine holy to Jews, Christians, and Muslims, but allowed relatively unimpeded access to Jewish visitors, the report said. "Israeli closure policy," the report continued, prevents "tens of thousands of Palestinians from reaching places of worship in Jerusalem and the West Bank, including during religious holidays such as Ramadan, Christmas, and Easter."

Israeli settlers continued to incite against and assault Palestinians based on their religion and ethnicity, according to the report. "Israeli settler radio stations often depicted Arabs as subhuman and called for Palestinians to be expelled from the West Bank. Some of this rhetoric contained religious references.

"Jewish settlers, acting either alone or in groups, assaulted Palestinians and destroyed Palestinian property," the report noted, saying Israel almost always failed to intervene. "Most instances of violence or property destruction reportedly committed against Palestinians did not result in arrests or convictions during the reporting period." For instance, last August a group of approximately 50 armed settlers forcibly entered the Ibrahimi Mosque in Hebron before Israeli forces were able to remove them.

Israel bans its Christian and Muslim population from entering Palestinian-controlled cities, the report noted, preventing access to religious sites. For the past 12 months, Israel meanwhile continued its strict closure policies, "severely restricted the ability of Palestinian Muslims and Christians to reach places of worship and to practice their religious rites."

'Israel wants non-Jews out of Jerusalem'

"Many of the national and municipal policies in Jerusalem were designed to limit or diminish the non-Jewish population of Jerusalem," the State Department report said.

Citing documentation of various Israeli policies, the report highlights what it termed a "combination of zoning restrictions on building by Palestinians, confiscation of Palestinian lands, and demolition of Palestinian homes to 'contain' non-Jewish neighborhoods while simultaneously permitting Jewish settlement."

As a matter of policy, according to the State Department, Israel opposes non-Muslim worship at the Al-Aqsa Mosque compound area in the Old City. However, the mosque's actual custodians lack effective authority to remove anyone from the site. "Jews seeking to remove the mosques and to rebuild the ancient temple on the site" are occasionally permitted to ascend the compound, according to the State Department report, citing press sources. Twice over the reporting period, Israeli forces again escorted right-wing activists onto the compound. Police have raided the compound twice more in the past month.

Over the past 12 months, Israel has severely restricted the access of most Muslims from the West Bank, Gaza, and Jerusalem to the mosque. Israeli authorities restrict access for Palestinian residents of Jerusalem, as well.

Israel continues to construct a wall around Jerusalem, having the effect of "inhibiting the ability of Palestinians and some Israelis to practice their religion and seriously restricting access by West Bank Muslims and Christians to holy sites." The wall has made it particularly difficult for Bethlehem-area Christians to reach the Church of the Holy Sepulcher in Jerusalem, and made visits to Christian sites in Bethany and Bethlehem difficult for Palestinian Christians who live on the Jerusalem side of the barrier, further fragmenting and dividing the minority community.

According to the report, in implementing construction of the barrier, Israel has confiscated property owned by Palestinians and several religious institutions, displaced Christian and Muslim residents, and tightened restrictions on movement for non-settlers. Israel offered compensation, it said, although not until owners were forced to go through an appeals process. The value of the compensation was not automatic and was subject to appraisal and verification, and most Palestinians and religious institutions refused it "to avoid any perception that accepting compensation would legalize the confiscation of land and building of the barrier," the report pointed out.

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Nothing you provide has anything to do with reality or facts on the ground, all you do is indulge in anti Palestinian rants with no basis. Why don't you answer my questions?
What questions,i answered all of them didnt i?
 
What questions,i answered all of them didnt i?

Let's slow down a little bit, I'm confused by your post you made here in the beginning. You're not being clear and it's as if you picked off where you left off somewhere. My questions about the PA in the late 80's, they conceded to every Israeli demand and recognized Israel. Did that get them to a better place?

As for Gaza, weapons are only used in self defense. There will be really long calm as restrictions would be eased in the future. The tunnels are completely destroyed and no weapons come in Gaza anyways, Hamas has supported the PA moves. Hamas however isn't involved or can get in the way of the talks so there's no point in mentioning Gaza. There are few weapons left in Gaza and there is a major economic crisis, it's a refugee camp for God's sake and people want to play the game of blaming a small strip of besieged land for Israel's occupation.

@T-123456

Here is even the staunch ally of Israel blaming Israel for preventing breakthroughs in peace talks, two years ago remember it was based on 1967 borders until Israel complained and Obama withdrew that plan to pressure from the congress. Palestinians can do nothing in their hands to change anything, they've conceded to over 78% of Palestinian land, the right of return, anything you can think of. The onus is on the occupying power to not make any concessions, but rather abide by international law. Nobody is asking Israel to make concessions, no such thing exists, Israel can't make concessions in Palestinian territory. All that's being asked is it respect international law. The only people who believe that are Israelis who deliberately misinterpret UN resolution 242.

Kerry focuses blame on Israel for collapse of talks | The Times of Israel
 
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Let's slow down a little bit, I'm confused by your post you made here in the beginning. You're not being clear and it's as if you picked off where you left off somewhere. My questions about the PA in the late 80's, they conceded to every Israeli demand and recognized Israel. Did that get them to a better place?

As for Gaza, weapons are only used in self defense. There will be really long calm as restrictions would be eased in the future. The tunnels are completely destroyed and no weapons come in Gaza anyways, Hamas has supported the PA moves. Hamas however isn't involved or can get in the way of the talks so there's no point in mentioning Gaza. There are few weapons left in Gaza and there is a major economic crisis, it's a refugee camp for God's sake and people want to play the game of blaming a small strip of besieged land for Israel's occupation.

@T-123456

Here is even the staunch ally of Israel blaming Israel for preventing breakthroughs in peace talks, two years ago remember it was based on 1967 borders until Israel complained and Obama withdrew that plan to pressure from the congress. Palestinians can do nothing in their hands to change anything, they've conceded to over 78% of Palestinian land! the right of return, anything you can think of. The onus is on the occupying power to not make any concessions, but rather abide by international law. Nobody is asking Israel to make concessions, no such thing exists, Israel can't make concessions in Palestinian territory. All that's being asked is it respect international law. The only people who believe that are Israelis who deliberately misinterpret UN resolution 242.

Kerry focuses blame on Israel for collapse of talks | The Times of Israel
What is a solution,what do you propose the world must do.
Maybe with a new Israeli government things could change?
The Nethanyahu government is rightwing,maybe a leftwing government would do better?
 
What is a solution,what do you propose the world must do.
Maybe with a new Israeli government things could change?
The Nethanyahu government is rightwing,maybe a leftwing government would do better?

There can't be a solution since one side is not backed by a superpower nor has any influence in the world. Israel is backed by the EU and the US, the Palestinians are powerless. If we seek to balance this then the Muslim world must get heavily involved and project power so the world takes it that we're serious about the rights of the Palestinian people. Me and you know this is highly unlikely, so really nobody can propose a solution that will work. We can come up with our ideas all we want although it's a turn off because we know nothing will be implemented. And who can blame them? Why should they implement peace when they know they'll get away with anything they do and also are supported in everything they do?

This is a hopeless situation for the Palestinians, the only thing that could have changed the results today would have been a successful operation before 1948 that prevented the formation of a Zionist state. We all knew this would happen sooner or later. So I believe we should just focus on the UN moves right now while expressing verbal support to the Palestinians.

The Israeli government will largely stay right wing since their hawkish policy and support of settlements. They live off of violence, so whenever you can give the Israeli people a sense that they're threatened by neighbors they will look to the government to protect hence it's builds this fake feeling of tension and the only way to safety is supporting right wing policies. I don't see the left wingers getting any significant influence in the next ten years for sure. When Netanyahu is gone that won't make a difference, the Knesset and cabinet is largely made up of right wing representatives.
 
There can't be a solution since one side is not backed by a superpower nor has any influence in the world. Israel is backed by the EU and the US, the Palestinians are powerless. If we seek to balance this then the Muslim world must get heavily involved and project power so the world takes it that we're serious about the rights of the Palestinian people. Me and you know this is highly unlikely, so really nobody can propose a solution that will work. We can come up with our ideas all we want although it's a turn off because we know nothing will be implemented. And who can blame them? Why should they implement peace when they know they'll get away with anything they do and also are supported in everything they do?

This is a hopeless situation for the Palestinians, the only thing that could have changed the results today would have been a successful operation before 1948 that prevented the formation of a Zionist state. We all knew this would happen sooner or later. So I believe we should just focus on the UN moves right now while expressing verbal support to the Palestinians.

The Israeli government will largely stay right wing since their hawkish policy and support of settlements. They live off of violence, so whenever you can give the Israeli people a sense that they're threatened by neighbors they will look to the government to protect hence it's builds this fake feeling of tension and the only way to safety is supporting right wing policies. I don't see the left wingers getting any significant influence in the next ten years for sure. When Netanyahu is gone that won't make a difference, the Knesset and cabinet is largely made up of right wing representatives.
What if all Muslim countries would recognise Israel in return for a Palestinian State?
The biggest fear of Israel is that when there is a Palestinian State with clear borders,the Arab States with or without Iran would engage in a war against Israel to whipe them out.
The only way to prevent this would be peace between the Muslim countries and Israel.
 
What if all Muslim countries would recognise Israel in return for a Palestinian State?
The biggest fear of Israel is that when there is a Palestinian State with clear borders,the Arab States with or without Iran would engage in a war against Israel to whipe them out.
The only way to prevent this would be peace between the Muslim countries and Israel.

Which Muslim countries don't recognize Israel? Trust me, they all do so in secret. Israel has no fear from Muslim countries, they also have huge advantages against us if we ever tried engaging in a war against them. So let's answer that question first, btw all Arab states already offered to do this as long as Israel withdraws from the occupied territories. Israel has not responded to any offers.

So where do we go from here? We've done everything in the book so what's left? If this year doesn't see changes, then it's time for a whole new Middle East. Muslim countries need to send forces into the West Bank to protect the remaining Palestinian cities and villages from Israeli colonization. We also should make a no fly zone near Palestinian cities, all is needed is a batch of fighter jets, each Muslim country can send a few. Imagine how that would terrify Israel? It would send a message that the Muslim world is serious, they would look for a diplomatic solution and the US will realize it needs to please it's muslim allies. Why can't we do this?
 
Which Muslim countries don't recognize Israel? Trust me, they all do so in secret. Israel has no fear from Muslim countries, they also have huge advantages against us if we ever tried engaging in a war against them. So let's answer that question first, btw all Arab states already offered to do this as long as Israel withdraws from the occupied territories. Israel has not responded to any offers.

So where do we go from here? We've done everything in the book so what's left? If this year doesn't see changes, then it's time for a whole new Middle East. Muslim countries need to send forces into the West Bank to protect the remaining Palestinian cities and villages from Israeli colonization. We also should make a no fly zone near Palestinian cities, all is needed is a batch of fighter jets, each Muslim country can send a few. Imagine how that would terrify Israel? It would send a message that the Muslim world is serious, they would look for a diplomatic solution and the US will realize it needs to please it's muslim allies. Why can't we do this?
Because,and this is something my uncle told me years ago;A Muslims only enemy is a Muslim.
How can you expect that from a none existing world,there is no Muslim world,they are all(most) enemies of each other.
Btw,the jets part is impossible,that would mean,all out war.
 
Because,and this is something my uncle told me years ago;A Muslims only enemy is a Muslim.
How can you expect that from a none existing world,there is no Muslim world,they are all(most) enemies of each other.
Btw,the jets part is impossible,that would mean,all out war.

I know that, very few people like me and you actually sympathize with each other. Most of the Muslim world is busy fighting each other, which is why I'm against all forms of nationalism, tribalism, etc....it creates more problems that we don't need.

It would be up to Israel to decide if it's all out war, if it's all out war okay we need to have a credible air offensive plan in which we will strike Israeli infrastructure heavily in a short span of time. This is all they understand, we need to show them destruction so they withdraw from Palestinian Territories. If they don't see destruction they will continue on this path forever. We should say, we'll recognize Israel once it ends the occupation, during the war we should be saying this. Wars today won't be fought like they were in the past. And trust me, don't fall for their bogus they call 'Samson option', I lived amongst Israeli settlers and soldiers in Gaza myself, I know them better than anyone. They love life, they would definitely concede to a diplomatic solution rather than all out destruction which would also guarantee their destruction. They say things like that to scare the Muslim world, in reality they're terrified of such a prospect, if we can inflict massive damage and prevent a military reprisal the world would work towards an immediate diplomatic solution unless they want destabilized middle east which could lead to WW3. We could do many things, oil embargos, close our ports and canals. We could freeze the world if we wanted. The thing missing is nuclear weapons, if no nuclear weapons exist in the Middle East we can't be sure this would work. This is why all of us need nuclear weapons ASAP for our future.

If that doesn't happen in the near future of a couple decades then we Palestinians will continue to suffer just as we suffer today and our Muslim world will stay as it is, worthless like the scum of the ocean without any dignity or honor. Trust me tomorrow this scheme in the Middle East is coming to everybody else who is Muslim, turkey and Saudi Arabia will realize this. The difference is turkey is preparing for this and knows this while Saudi Arabia is being not only retarded but working against Muslims in our region.
 
I know that, very few people like me and you actually sympathize with each other. Most of the Muslim world is busy fighting each other, which is why I'm against all forms of nationalism, tribalism, etc....it creates more problems that we don't need.

It would be up to Israel to decide if it's all out war, if it's all out war okay we need to have a credible air offensive plan in which we will strike Israeli infrastructure heavily in a short span of time. This is all they understand, we need to show them destruction so they withdraw from Palestinian Territories. If they don't see destruction they will continue on this path forever. We should say, we'll recognize Israel once it ends the occupation, during the war we should be saying this. Wars today won't be fought like they were in the past. And trust me, don't fall for their bogus they call 'Samson option', I lived amongst Israeli settlers and soldiers in Gaza myself, I know them better than anyone. They love life, they would definitely concede to a diplomatic solution rather than all out destruction which would also guarantee their destruction. They say things like that to scare the Muslim world, in reality they're terrified of such a prospect, if we can inflict massive damage and prevent a military reprisal the world would work towards an immediate diplomatic solution unless they want destabilized middle east which could lead to WW3. We could do many things, oil embargos, close our ports and canals. We could freeze the world if we wanted. The thing missing is nuclear weapons, if no nuclear weapons exist in the Middle East we can't be sure this would work. This is why all of us need nuclear weapons ASAP for our future.

If that doesn't happen in the near future of a couple decades then we Palestinians will continue to suffer just as we suffer today and our Muslim world will stay as it is, worthless like the scum of the ocean without any dignity or honor. Trust me tomorrow this scheme in the Middle East is coming to everybody else who is Muslim, turkey and Saudi Arabia will realize this. The difference is turkey is preparing for this and knows this while Saudi Arabia is being not only retarded but working against Muslims in our region.
Dont you think that when the Arab countries,Turkiye,Iran have nukes,they will use it on each other?
Lets say Iran has them and KSA gets them,then what?
Only a spark needed.
Thats not something i'm looking forward to.
 
Dont you think that when the Arab countries,Turkiye,Iran have nukes,they will use it on each other?
Lets say Iran has them and KSA gets them,then what?
Only a spark needed.
Thats not something i'm looking forward to.

No they won't because world attention and Israeli attention would be directed at these countries, they will all face sanctions and military threats which would actually temporarily unite Muslim nations. Israel would probably take military action therefore diverting all this attention to Israel since that would pitch all our nations in direct conflict with Israel if not the whole world. Nobody wants Muslims with nuclear weapons, everybody would stand against us. If after all of that we still work against each other then we're some sick people. We're speaking a decade or two from now, when Syria will be over and much of the region will be different. Iran and Saudi Arabia have to get over their differences. So middle eastern nations with nuclear weapons would mean an end to Israeli occupation. Israelis who run to shelters because of primitive rockets would not be willing to be on the receiving end of destruction if they fire nuclear weapons at Arab/Muslim nations. Even the years leading up to nuclear weapons you'll realize how tense the conflict will become between Middle East and the West. Everything in the region will be forgotten, we would no longer take serious proxy wars against each other. We'd be more worried about western threats, sanctions, etc...
 
No they won't because world attention and Israeli attention would be directed at these countries, they will all face sanctions and military threats which would actually temporarily unite Muslim nations. Israel would probably take military action therefore diverting all this attention to Israel since that would pitch all our nations in direct conflict with Israel if not the whole world. Nobody wants Muslims with nuclear weapons, everybody would stand against us. If after all of that we still work against each other then we're some sick people. We're speaking a decade or two from now, when Syria will be over and much of the region will be different. Iran and Saudi Arabia have to get over their differences. So middle eastern nations with nuclear weapons would mean an end to Israeli occupation. Israelis who run to shelters because of primitive rockets would not be willing to be on the receiving end of destruction if they fire nuclear weapons at Arab/Muslim nations. Even the years leading up to nuclear weapons you'll realize how tense the conflict will become between Middle East and the West. Everything in the region will be forgotten, we would no longer take serious proxy wars against each other. We'd be more worried about western threats, sanctions, etc...
I dont think so but lets wait and see.
A ME filled with nukes is very dangerous.
 
I dont think so but lets wait and see.
A ME filled with nukes is very dangerous.

It's time for something new, what difference does it make? What do we have to lose? You're living in Turkey so you don't feel the hopelessness the Arabs feel. We've been victims of misery for decades, so really it's either we stay living under misery or we seek change.

However, how likely is it anything I say will happen? I'm not sure what the commanders of our armies are thinking, and I doubt it has anything to do with a better Middle East. So we cannot wait and see, if the peace talks and UN efforts fail it's time for our people to get the message across to our rulers and military forces. It will benefit all of us, little of it would benefit Palestinians, it's actually going to make things better for the people of the Middle East.
 
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