Israel Air Force to Participate in U.S. Drill Alongside Pakistani, U.A.E. Jets

[WaLeEdK2]

I guess this time they will be prepared, what to do what not to, Plus unlike Anatolian eagle, IDF can ask US to rigged the field a little for them in role assignment, to reduce their interaction with PAF or to safeguard their techniques.

And I don't think they'll do that. The point of an exercise is to see how prepared and ready you are. The Israelis obviously know that rigging the field isn't going to help them at all. There's no shame in losing an engagement in an exercise. Its a chance for you to improve.

 

[DavidSling]

And I don't think they'll do that. The point of an exercise is to see how prepared and ready you are. The Israelis obviously know that rigging the field isn't going to help them at all. There's no shame in losing an engagement in an exercise. Its a chance for you to improve.

Who said anything about losing?

 

[WaLeEdK2]

Who said anything about losing?

I never said they will. But I'm saying that if they lose.

 

[Genghis khan1]

And I don't think they'll do that. The point of an exercise is to see how prepared and ready you are. The Israelis obviously know that rigging the field isn't going to help them at all. There's no shame in losing an engagement in an exercise. Its a chance for you to improve.

USAF send their junior pilots to these exercise. They just collect data and learn. Some of these countries are just there to learn how other countries operate or just be a part of Uncle Sam Air Force carnival. While for US it way of extending political leverage. Countries do their real deal exercises within themselves or with selected Air Forces only.

Who said anything about losing?

You know the psychology fear of losing, specially from the only Air-Force that already known for flying Russian junk on vacation and still scoring against IAF, That's a psychological victory already. Jewish media in US is pretty robust in portraying IDF as invisible, but we all know that's ain't true.

 

[DavidSling]

USAF send their junior pilots to these exercise. They just collect data and learn. Some of these countries are just there to learn how other countries operate or just be a part of Uncle Sam Air Force carnival. While for US it way of extending political leverage. Countries do their real deal exercises within themselves or with selected Air Forces only.


You know the psychology fear of losing, specially from the only Air-Force that already known for flying Russian junk on vacation and still scoring against IAF, That's a psychological victory already. Jewish media in US is pretty robust in portraying IDF as invisible, but we all know that's ain't true.

No one is invincible, neither is PAF altho people in this forum has some urban legends about it.
IDF still scored around 60-0 in those exercise against USAF is I'm not mistaken

 

[New Resolve]

Well in the interest of brotherly relations, UAE shud let us jump in their Block 60's, i hear the air conditioning is nice.

 

[Genghis khan1]

No one is invincible, neither is PAF altho people in this forum has some urban legends about it.
IDF still scored around 60-0 in those exercise against USAF is I'm not mistaken

Like I said, US usually send their junior pilots and by no means I am undermining IAF. I know Isreali Airforce take their job seriously.

 

[Windjammer]

Well in the interest of brotherly relations, UAE shud let us jump in their Block 60's, i hear the air conditioning is nice.

What makes you think we haven't done that already.

Whats the point going against the likes of F-22 and F-35 when you wont even see them on your radar. I remember couple of years back there was a similar exercise somewhere in the middleeast and Americans did brought their F-22 while UAE had their most advanced F-16s and Pakistan was flying the F-7s. Both PAF and UAE were not able to spot F-22 and in all engagements the F-22 won.
So from a novice point of view how does it help gain any experience when you cant pickup on your radar and its always a one sided fight?
Another thing how come we never take JF-17 to such exercises. Shouldnt we pitch against the best the world has to offer and see where the shortcomings lie if any. @Windjammer

It's not quite as basic as that, earlier even our F-7s had exercised with the F-22 and recall the comments of the Rapptor pilot.

 

[niaz]

Are we ‘Holier than thou’ meaning superior in piety & morality to Egypt, Jordan, Tunisia & Turkey that have diplomatic relation with Israel?

We all know that Pakistan is land of the pure but it does not mean that we would become impure if we participate in an exercise where Israeli Airforce is also present. Even the Saudis are now talking with Israel.

 

[gambit]

Each Red Flag exercise normally involves a variety of fighter interdiction, attack/strike, air superiority, enemy air defense suppression, airlift, air refueling and reconnaissance missions

Red Flag is primarily air-air.

Taking control of contested airspace is about clearing the way for other forces to attack enemy ground assets from the 3rd dimension. So in order to make the final days of the exercise as realistic as possible, Red Flag designers incorporate as much aspects of air power as possible.

That is why we have bombers at Red Flag.

http://www.afgsc.af.mil/News/Articl...take-off-to-participate-in-red-flag-16-2.aspx

Ellsworth AFB's B-1 bombers and personnel left for Nellis Air Force Base, Nevada, to participate in Red Flag 16-2, one of the largest training exercises involving more than 100 aircraft, 3,000 deployed servicemembers and all four military services, Feb. 29.

The Bones went to Green Flag as well.

https://theaviationist.com/2014/11/23/b-1-at-green-flag-exercise/

B-1 bombers, assigned to the 34th Bomb Squadron, from Ellsworth Air Force Base, South Dakota, have deployed to Nellis AFB, Nevada, to take part in Green Flag-West exercise.

Red Flag is more comprehensive, but its focus is on how to clear contested airspace.

 

[volatile]

Another thing how come we never take JF-17 to such exercises. Shouldnt we pitch against the best the world has to offer and see where the shortcomings lie if any. @Windjammer

1. Nato compatable equipment Only
2. We recently have some drills against Flankers and F15 in KSA

 

[Zibago]

I fail to see it being an issue

 

[tore]

We should not make an issue out of who participates in this exercise. But rather focus on learning.

Pakistan has no issu with Israel, look at it as another neutral country like Finland, Sweden or Brazil.

 

[IceCold]

1. Nato compatable equipment Only
2. We recently have some drills against Flankers and F15 in KSA

How exactly was India SU-30 a Nato compatable equipment? They did participate with them in red flag.

It's not quite as basic as that, earlier even our F-7s had exercised with the F-22 and recall the comments of the Rapptor pilot.

Isnt this the pic from the same exercise i am referring too? I cant recall his exact comments but it was something related to the agility of these small planes.

 

[volatile]

How exactly was India SU-30 a Nato compatable equipment? They did participate with them in red flag.

Yes you are right and valid observation ,Infact IAF was very much dependent on 3rd party system to do this ,information here is from 2012 and after that they have participated

IAF pilots shared tactical information with RAF pilots in their formations using radio communications since the IAF's data-link system (which shares critical sensor data with friendly aircraft) was not compatible with the Link 16 system in use with NATO aircraft like the Typhoon.
http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/indian-air-forces-top-guns-score-wins-in-the-uk-1204336

Indigenous software makes Su30-MKI more compatible
AGENCIES Aug 23, 2008, 04.21pm IST

NEW DELHI: The Indian Air Force software experts from Bangalore based Software Development Institute (SDI) indigenously developed software patches to make Su30-MKI avionics compatible with NATO operational philosophy.

This wholly indigenous effort has saved valuable foreign. The IAF is participating in the exercise Red Flag, which is an advanced aerial combat training exercise hosted at Nellis Air Force Base, Nevada in USA.

Frontline Indian Sukhoi fighters are pitted against US and NATO air forces' F-16s and F-15s in complex and advanced network centric operations -- the toughest test for flying machines and men.

"The SDI software has made the Su30-MKI platform more versatile and compatible with other Air Forces," said Wing Commander JS Gavankar, Software Engineer from SDI presently with the IAF contingent at Nellis.

The avionics software developed by the SDI has reduced the cockpit workload and has assisted in increasing the pilots situational awareness multifold, said Wing Commander J Singh, Flt Cdr of 20 squardon.

IAF technicians ensured a very high availability of aircraft for all exercise related requirements, during exercise Red Flag despite scorching heat and average tarmac temperatures above 50 degrees Celsius during flying hours. The exercise concludes its operations on August 23.

During extreme heat conditions there is a tendency of the flying machines to develop snags such as leaks in hydraulic systems, engine oil, gear box etc. The performance of avionics system also becomes erratic as integrated circuits develop problems in extreme heat conditions.

However due to proper planning and hard work of IAF technicians, aircraft serviceability was kept high at all times.

Appreciating the IAF technicians Colpnel Corey, Maintenance Commander of USAF base Nellis said: "IAF has maintained amazing serviceability rate in a sustained manner during the entire exercise. This is because of in-depth planning, knowledge and focused approach of the maintainers."

Wing Commander JD Kapoor, Senior Engineering Officer of 20 Squardon said that IAF technical practices and systems are comprehensive and well defined and meticulous adherence to these have ensured high tarmac availability that allowed aircrews to perform their missions.

In some cased there were reports of IAF using AWACS to vectored there positions to enemy which resulted in many simulated losses in one of the excercise . So inorder to real time train Nato compatability plays an important part ,may be the reason JF17 left behind