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Is a civil war about to commence in South India?

Why would the most educated part of India take up arms and destroy their peaceful society?
and there is no known Radicalization or running arm supplies in the region to fuel any such endeavor

There are no arms here. Practicing Hindu women are at the forefront of the protests against the supreme court's judgement to allow women into the temple.



It is not my opinion and I avoid myself making such claims. But sometimes someone else's hypothesis is required to counter wild allegations and mudslinging by others without studying the issue.

If someone is interested in this issue then they should check these



 
That's race. Blood.

Yeah, tomato, tamato.

At the most basic level, we are treating people who are different to us diffeerntly.
Caste is bad but it pales into comparison when u consider what Mughals or Christians did.
 
Indians have indeed moved far away from the original version of the faith but what I'm talking about is its essence which is still present.

People are still killing each other in the name of caste. The fair skinned Persian Aryans used to consider the dark skinned Dravidians as rakshasas or demons. The notion of dark skinned people from the South being inferior to the fair skinned from the North is still there.

Nonsense.

If you have no clue you should not talk.

Do you know what Rakshasas mean?

Rakshasa is the name given to the cannibal tribes that lived in ancient Indian subcontinent.

You trying to equate Dravidians to Rakshasas is not only laughable but highly objectionable for me and my dravidian community at large.

But that's not faith.

That's race. Blood.

Do you buy the sanghi BS that all Hindus are one race, one people?

If you do not (no non Hindu does, and most Hindus I know don't either) then you understand India.

Cheers, Doc

Incorrect.

There was neither race or nor blood involved.

Devas (Vedic Indians) and Asuras (Vedic Persians) fought many battles.

They were of the same race and blood but fought because of the circumstances.
 
Nonsense.

If you have no clue you should not talk.

Do you know what Rakshasas mean?

Rakshasa is the name given to the cannibal tribes that lived in ancient Indian subcontinent.

You trying to equate Dravidians to Rakshasas is not only laughable but highly objectionable for me and my dravidian community at large.



Incorrect.

There was neither race or nor blood involved.

Devas (Vedic Indians) and Asuras (Vedic Persians) fought many battles.

They were of the same race and blood but fought because of the circumstances.

I am not speaking about Vedic Hindus and Persians.

The only Persians in India are Parsis.

I am talking about the Indic people.

Hindus and Hindus who now follow other faiths like Islam and Christianity.

Cheers, Doc
 
I am not speaking about Vedic Hindus and Persians.

The only Persians in India are Parsis.

I am talking about the Indic people.

Hindus and Hindus who now follow other faiths like Islam and Christianity.

Cheers, Doc

Aren't Parsis (persian/Zoroastrians) decedents of Vedic Persians?

Ahura (Asura) Mazda (Greatone/God) is the god of the Ahuras =Asuras= The Vedic Persians
 
Aren't Parsis (persian/Zoroastrians) decedents of Vedic Persians?

Ahura (Asura) Mazda (Greatone/God) is the god of the Ahuras =Asuras= The Vedic Persians

This "theory" (OOI) finds traction only within some spheres within India.

At best all born Hindus. About a billion humans believe that Parsis originated from Hindus.

The rest of the 6 billion accept that Vedic Hindus originated from Parsis and what is Hinduism today is a hybrid faith of what they carried with them into the subcontinent after the split, and it's later interaction with local faiths, belief streams and deities.

What IS a matter of debate STILL is how large that genetic infusion was into a continental sized Moolnivasi populace.

If you follow my posts (as some do) I always say that we are sister faiths. But I'm actually referring to Vedic Hinduism. There is little to no connection with the Upanishads and the Puranas.

Similarly I speak about us being civilizational cuzins.

Not blood.

Cheers, Doc
 
This "theory" (OOI) finds traction only within some spheres within India.

At best all born Hindus. About a billion humans believe that Parsis originated from Hindus.

The rest of the 6 billion accept that Vedic Hindus originated from Parsis and what is Hinduism today is a hybrid faith of what they carried with them into the subcontinent after the split, and it's later interaction with local faiths, belief streams and deities.

What IS a matter of debate STILL is how large that genetic infusion was into a continental sized Moolnivasi populace.

If you follow my posts (as some do) I always say that we are sister faiths. But I'm actually referring to Vedic Hinduism. There is little to no connection with the Upanishads and the Puranas.

Similarly I speak about us being civilizational cuzins.

Not blood.

Cheers, Doc

Of course the split happened during the vedic times so Vedic persians (Asuras) would not have inherited the Upanishads which came much later.

Puranas did have references to Asuras all over. Here are few of them.

(Ravana)asura
(Mahisha)asura
Taraka(asura)
Tripura(asura)
Andhaka(asura)
Gaja(asura)
Bana(asura)

Vedas clear say that Devas and Asuras are blood brothers. The fight started due to Devas consuming all the amrutham (celestial nectar) without sharing it with the asuras.
 
As if our security forces were not already stretched to the limit in Kashmir and the North East, I fear things could become worse and we may see the break out of a civil war in South India if the recent Sabarimala verdict is sought to be implemented.

sabarimala-690_09281_100618100712.jpg
The controversy around the entry has not abated. Far from it. (Photo: PTI)

A tide is building up against the judgment.

The Kerala Nair Service Society has announced it will file a review petition, angry BJP workers forced closure of the office of the Travancore Devaswom Board, which manages the shrine, at Pandalam, the place where Lord Ayappa is said to have been born, for not filing a review petition, and Congress workers sat on a day-long fast there.

sabarimala_protest_s_100618101050.jpg
There have been heated protests against the SC verdict on Sabarimala. (Photo: PTI)

But far more ominous and foreboding is the announcement made by the Mala Arayans, a tribal community settled on 18 hills around Sabarimala, and holding some traditional rights to the rituals relating to the temple.

Through their leaders, CR Dileepkumar and KN Padmanabhan, they announced that they will keep vigil in the hills around Sabarimala to make sure its customs are not breached. They said "Our ancestors were close aides of Lord Ayappa, and fought many wars for him. Thousands of our community members will join the movement to protect the customs of the shrine".

The Kerala DGP has announced that 500 female police are going to be posted at the temple. This is bound to further exacerbate the situation by infuriating the Ayappans (devotees of Lord Ayappa), many of whom come from Tamilnadu, Andhra, Telangana, Karnataka, and indeed from all over the world. These 500 policewomen will face the wrath of the devotees of Lord Ayappa, and may even be physically attacked, just as J&K policemen are being attacked in Kashmir.

kerala-police_100618101925.jpg
They will be at the forefront. (Photo: Facebook)

In the meantime, many women organisations in Tamilnadu, Kerala, etc., have declared that their members will not go to Sabarimala till they have crossed 50 years of age.

Women, though debarred from the temple when they are of menstruating age, seem to be even more devoted than men to the centuries' old custom.

Religion is a powerful force in India, and the vast majority of our people are deeply religious and conservative. All this seems to have been forgotten by the majority on the Supreme Court bench which decided the Sabarimala case. In their crusading zeal, they rushed in where angels fear to tread, guided by abstract, theoretical "modern" notions of women's dignity, equality, etc., overlooking the wise admonition of Justice Indu Malhotra, the sole voice of restraint and reason.

indu-s_051018093440_100618113445.jpg
Justice Malhotra has exhibited the balance and restraint in her assessment. (Photo: PTI)

If the verdict is sought to be enforced, I fear some kind of guerilla war will break out in South India, because most people are deeply religious, and are not willing to give up their customary religious practises, no matter what the Courts say, and some may even be willing to give up their lives for this purpose.

https://www.dailyo.in/politics/saba...ala-tamil-nadu-religion-sc/story/1/27087.html

North Indian scum is trying to destroy distinct identity of Dravidians. They started it with jallikatu ban. In North Indian lower castes are denied entry to temples. The government has done aboslutely nothing to let lower castes enter temples.
Go see how your radd ul fasad and jerb e azab is doing .I+ is still not finished .
 
Of course the split happened during the vedic times so Vedic persians (Asuras) would not have inherited the Upanishads which came much later.

Puranas did have references to Asuras all over. Here are few of them.

(Ravana)asura
(Mahisha)asura
Taraka(asura)
Tripura(asura)
Andhaka(asura)
Gaja(asura)
Bana(asura)

Vedas clear say that Devas and Asuras are blood brothers. The fight started due to Devas consuming all the amrutham (celestial nectar) without sharing it with the asuras.

I was about to say in my first post that samudra manthan and the nectar (different word, I'm not getting the Avestan reference) is there in our most ancient Gathas as well.

Definitely some big shit did go down. Lol

@Gadkari

Cheers, Doc
 
I was about to say in my first post that samudra manthan and the nectar (different word, I'm not getting the Avestan reference) is there in our most ancient Gathas as well.

Definitely some big shit did go down. Lol

@Gadkari

Cheers, Doc

First of all its a common misconception that Ravana was a Asura. He was not. He was a Daitya.

Second, Asura means "A-Sura". That is one who is NOT a Sura.

The name Suras is derived from Sanskrit - a combination of Su (good, excellent) and Rasa (nectar, Amrit) to form Suras.

So Devas were those who drank the SuRasa and became immortals.

Asuras were those who were denied the SuRasa and remained mortails and angry at the devas.


Its possible Zoroastrianism is the philosophy of the Asuras since you certainly consider one of them as your prophet.

And since Deva's and Asuras were step brothers, the Asura philosophy is also an offshoot from the Vedic philosophy.


For example, your Fire temple is called "Der e Mehr" or "inside Mitra enclosure" or "home of Mitra". (Der - same as "ghar", andar = inside)

So your primary god is Mitra who is worshiped through the Fire (same as vedic Hinduism). Only you seem to have forgotten Mitra and have started thinking that its the Fire you worship. (same as a Kamdev in another thread who said Rajputs actually think their weapon is a god)

So now Mithra for you became Zoroastrian angelic divinity. You called that "yazata".

And now you know who the Yazidi's are. They are the same guys who worship "Yazata" i.e. Angels.

So basically both of you are Mithra worshippers who ended up forgetting Mithra. Same as Hindus who do not worship Mithra anymore though he is one of the primary deity in the Rig Veda.
 
First of all its a common misconception that Ravana was a Asura. He was not. He was a Daitya.

Second, Asura means "A-Sura". That is one who is NOT a Sura.

The name Suras is derived from Sanskrit - a combination of Su (good, excellent) and Rasa (nectar, Amrit) to form Suras.

So Devas were those who drank the SuRasa and became immortals.

Asuras were those who were denied the SuRasa and remained mortails and angry at the devas.


Its possible Zoroastrianism is the philosophy of the Asuras since you certainly consider one of them as your prophet.

And since Deva's and Asuras were step brothers, the Asura philosophy is also an offshoot from the Vedic philosophy.


For example, your Fire temple is called "Der e Mehr" or "inside Mitra enclosure" or "home of Mitra". (Der - same as "ghar", andar = inside)

So your primary god is Mitra who is worshiped through the Fire (same as vedic Hinduism). Only you seem to have forgotten Mitra and have started thinking that its the Fire you worship. (same as a Kamdev in another thread who said Rajputs actually think their weapon is a god)

So now Mithra for you became Zoroastrian angelic divinity. You called that "yazata".

And now you know who the Yazidi's are. They are the same guys who worship "Yazata" i.e. Angels.

So basically both of you are Mithra worshippers who ended up forgetting Mithra. Same as Hindus who do not worship Mithra anymore though he is one of the primary deity in the Rig Veda.

Sigh I want to thank the post for your undeniable knowledge of Hinduism.

But you insist on screwing it up with your ignorance of Mithraism and Zoroastrianism.

Zarathustra is our prophet.

Ahura Mazda is our God.

We do not worship fire.

The Atash is Ahura Mazda's son.

Mithraism was dualist.

Zoroastrianism is monttheist.

Cheers, Doc
 
What nonsense is this.

What nonsense.

Iyengars are vaishnavites while Iyers are shaivites.

Did I say Iyengars are not Vaisnavites ?

My post was to highlight how ancient an Tamil religion (in this case the Mayon cult) was hijacked (appropriated) by brahmins. Similar to Sankara's appropriation of Ayappa.

Appropriation of Ayyappa Cult: The History and Hinduisation of Sabarimala Temple
www.thewire.in/history/appropriation-of-ayyappa-cult-the-history-and-hinduisation-of-sabarimala-temple

Ramanuja appropriated Tamil vaisnavism and converted it into a Vedic brahmanists religion. This he achieved by reconciling Tamil philosophy with vedic religion. His philosophical system is known as Visistadavita (qualified non dualism) and his followers are brahmins Iyengars.

Ramanandis of North Indian and Gujarat Swami Narayan sects are off shoots of Ramanuja's Sri Sampradaya

Bhagwan Swaminarayan accepted Ramanuja's Vishishtadvaita philosophy (qualified non-dualism), propounding worship of God with form and of murti puja, entailing the observation of all the bhakti rituals. In total, from the beginning of His ministry at the age of twenty-one to the age of forty-nine, He initiated over two thousand men as sadhus and Paramhansas.

https://www.swaminarayan.org/lordswaminarayan/biography/6.htm
 
Sigh I want to thank the post for your undeniable knowledge of Hinduism.

But you insist on screwing it up with your ignorance of Mithraism and Zoroastrianism.

Zarathustra is our prophet.

Ahura Mazda is our God.

We do not worship fire.

The Atash is Ahura Mazda's son.

Mithraism was dualist.

Zoroastrianism is monttheist.

Cheers, Doc

Yeah, I know Ahura mazda was your god. Slip of tongue.

The persians always replaced the "s" with and "h". Sindhu became "Hindu".

Asura became "Ahura".

I am not sure what you mean by Mithraism was dualist ? In Vedas Mithra is always spoken in association with Varuna.

Varuna is the ocean, Mithra is the Consciousness that brings people together. I suspect in Vedas the Mithra-Varuna indicates to people migrating together over the ocean, out of Africa and into India.

"Mitr" or "friend" comes from that. One who shares similar conscious as you.

What is the relationship between Mithra, Fire and Ahura Mazda ?
 
Yeah, I know Ahura mazda was your god. Slip of tongue.

The persians always replaced the "s" with and "h". Sindhu became "Hindu".

Asura became "Ahura".

I am not sure what you mean by Mithraism was dualist ? In Vedas Mithra is always spoken in association with Varuna.

Varuna is the ocean, Mithra is the Consciousness that brings people together. I suspect in Vedas the Mithra-Varuna indicates to people migrating together over the ocean, out of Africa and into India.

"Mitr" or "friend" comes from that. One who shares similar conscious as you.

What is the relationship between Mithra, Fire and Ahura Mazda ?

On my phone ....

http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer...opics/Religion/Mithraism/David_Fingrut**.html

Mithraism was the state religion of more than half the civilized world.

Including the Greco-Roman world for over 300 years.

And directly preceded impacted and lent to Judaism and Christianity.

@I.R.A you might find some interesting discoveries too ....

@Sinnerman108

Mithra was Ahura Mazda's divine representative on Earth (the plane, not necessarily the planet).

He was the God of Souls. The keeper of Contracts. Promises. The fighter of Ahriman's forces.

The dualist nature comes from both Ahura Mazda and Ahriman being Gods. Of good and evil.

It was post Zarathustra that Ahura Mazda was was revealed as the one true God.

And the Pantheon heirrarchial structure laid out.

Before Mithraism was Magiism. Before that was Manicheanism.

All evolutions of the same theological stream, same ancestry.

Cheers, Doc
 
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On my phone ....

http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer...opics/Religion/Mithraism/David_Fingrut**.html

Mithraism was the state religion of more than half the civilized world.

Including the Roman empire for over 300 years.

And directly preceded impacted and lent to Judaism and Christianity.

@I.R.A you might find some interesting discoveries too ....

Mithra was Ahura Mazda's divine representative on Earth (the plane, not necessarily the planet).

He was the God of Souls. The keeper of Contracts. Promises. The fighter of Ahriman's forces.

The dualist nature comes from both Ahura Mazda and Ahriman being Gods. Of good and evil.

It was post Zarathustra that Ahura Mazda was was revealed as the one true God.

And the Pantheon heirrarchial structure laid out.

Before Mithraism was Magiism. Before that was Manicheanism.

All evolutions of the same theological stream, same ancestry.

Cheers, Doc

1. You still did not explain the role of the Fire and its relationship to the other two.

2. Ahriman would translate as Asriman i.e. Asri-man. Asri is luck/wealth and man is mind or consciousness.

So Ahriman would be the money minded person vs Ahur Mazda the noble minded person.


Funny how parsis ended up being the richest people in India. :azn:

Ahriman won and Ahur Mazda lost in a very real sense.
 
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