Indian Navy News & Discussions

[GuardianRED]

IN plan is 5 CV (prospective plan 2030?) ...3 CV of 45000 Ton class INS Vikramaditya, Vikrant, Viraat. 2 CV of 65-70K Ton class Vishal...old Vikrant was decommed when new Viki started build.. old Vir decommed recently when replacement keel laid

Modi doctrine ..less talk more action...do look at other yards ...check dimensions of new build and compare..check builders data..plus discussion with chai biskoot / nariyalpaaniwalas...chk with BRwalas

Obviously the Navy Chiefs know ...build up of capabilities /assets is required considering PLAN plan / build for 4 CBG ..check Dalian...

Bro, sorry you are simply mistaken and only Relying On Bharat-rakshak forums , shown u need to do some research yourself

First, we do know its confirmed that the IN want 3 CGB , this is to be INS Vikramaditiya CGB, INS Vikrant (Commissioning 2018) CBG and INS Vishal (FUTURE) CBG. We do know that INS Viraat is decommissioned.

Second, INS Vikrant (as of current Report and information) will be the first and only one of her Class (40,000 Tons) Note : INS Vikramaditiya (45,000 Tons)

NOW, INS Vishal will be 65,000 Tons (Hence a class of her own) and there are a dozens of reports of it been nuclear powered , on board EMALS Etc!!... last i read that construction was suppose to start on 2011!!.... so far absolute NO reports that this has started!!!!.....u have any proof? or Current reports? or photos - if you have followed the construction of INS Vikramaditiya - we have seen numerous media reports + photos both of construction and floating out and fitment etc.... so where is for INS Vishal? ... She doesn't even had her plans frozen

Final - There is no reports for 2 more aircraft carriers! u r mistaken

Having said that YES , there is IN Plan for LPH/LPD (2-3 Nos.) Tender i think is floated - which u r mistaken for aircraft carriers, where they are technically not the same!

Just do some simple research and not only rely on BR and wiki

 

[Ankit Kumar]

A doubt.
@PARIKRAMA @Penguin
Do the OPVs of Indian navy fitted with sonar system?

 

[Penguin]

A doubt.
@PARIKRAMA @Penguin
Do the OPVs of Indian navy fitted with sonar system?

No. And why would it be? Thse ships are primarily designed for round the clock, all-weather, coastal patrolling, policing, anti-smuggling,anti-terrorist and Sea-Air search & rescue missions. They have no ASW armament (e.g. lightweight ASW torpedoes) that would necesssitate having a sonar for their effective use. Also, it kind of defeats the purpose of OPV versus e.g. corvette or light frigate: it is those combat related sensors and weapons that drive the cost of the vessel and the OPV is intended as a cheap - relatively speaking - patrol ship.

 

[Dash]

Bro, sorry you are simply mistaken and only Relying On Bharat-rakshak forums , shown u need to do some research yourself

First, we do know its confirmed that the IN want 3 CGB , this is to be INS Vikramaditiya CGB, INS Vikrant (Commissioning 2018) CBG and INS Vishal (FUTURE) CBG. We do know that INS Viraat is decommissioned.

Second, INS Vikrant (as of current Report and information) will be the first and only one of her Class (40,000 Tons) Note : INS Vikramaditiya (45,000 Tons)

NOW, INS Vishal will be 65,000 Tons (Hence a class of her own) and there are a dozens of reports of it been nuclear powered , on board EMALS Etc!!... last i read that construction was suppose to start on 2011!!.... so far absolute NO reports that this has started!!!!.....u have any proof? or Current reports? or photos - if you have followed the construction of INS Vikramaditiya - we have seen numerous media reports + photos both of construction and floating out and fitment etc.... so where is for INS Vishal? ... She doesn't even had her plans frozen

Final - There is no reports for 2 more aircraft carriers! u r mistaken

Having said that YES , there is IN Plan for LPH/LPD (2-3 Nos.) Tender i think is floated - which u r mistaken for aircraft carriers, where they are technically not the same!

Just do some simple research and not only rely on BR and wiki

When did BR say that there will be so many ships? Pls find me an official BR article.

 

[GuardianRED]

Navy Perspective plan 2030 calls for 5 CV break up as given before... Vikis are in the 40-45k medium range... MRSV is 4 LPD ... U235D2O S* guys on it ...viki builders were not permitted to take part in LPD...they complained abt it but were assured all future viki works with them...saint made that happen before he & his congregation banished from vatican.

AFPs on BR...not sure if any on PDF...if they do they will be on R&D and bureau of standards radar.

Again, pal, absolute no report or any article with what u have posted , if you can post where u got this info would shred some light.

What i mentioned is as per current details and information

INS Vikramaditiya wasn't built from the ground up, it is basically a deep upgrade and retrofitting of an existing ship
INS Vikrant is 40,000 TONS (Not Range) and will be only one of her class. THERE is absolutely no INFO of another one of the same being built
INS Vishal - (65,000 TONS) see my previous post
The builder for INS Vikrant - Cochin Shipyard is wasn't permitted because they didn't have an international Partner - IN ask for an existing LPD (or a variation of it ) from an international shipyard where the building of the LPD will be split between the international and local (HSL, L&T, Reliance)

No. And why would it be? Thse ships are primarily designed for round the clock, all-weather, coastal patrolling, policing, anti-smuggling,anti-terrorist and Sea-Air search & rescue missions. They have no ASW armament (e.g. lightweight ASW torpedoes) that would necesssitate having a sonar for their effective use. Also, it kind of defeats the purpose of OPV versus e.g. corvette or light frigate: it is those combat related sensors and weapons that drive the cost of the vessel and the OPV is intended as a cheap - relatively speaking - patrol ship.

@Penguin @Ankit Kumar

Technically they have on board An ECHO sounding device , which is a type of SONAR - used for search and rescue BUT NOT SONARs that one will find on larger warships

 

[Penguin]

Again, pal, absolute no report or any article with what u have posted , if you can post where u got this info would shred some light.

What i mentioned is as per current details and information

INS Vikramaditiya wasn't built from the ground up, it is basically a deep upgrade and retrofitting of an existing ship
INS Vikrant is 40,000 TONS (Not Range) and will be only one of her class. THERE is absolutely no INFO of another one of the same being built
INS Vishal - (65,000 TONS) see my previous post
The builder for INS Vikrant - Cochin Shipyard is wasn't permitted because they didn't have an international Partner - IN ask for an existing LPD (or a variation of it ) from an international shipyard where the building of the LPD will be split between the international and local (HSL, L&T, Reliance)



@Penguin @Ankit Kumar

Technically they have on board An ECHO sounding device , which is a type of SONAR - used for search and rescue BUT NOT SONARs that one will find on larger warships

When I discuss an echo sounder, I call it that. The question clearly was not referring to the ability of the OPV to assess water depth, to find fish, or to map the sea floor.

 

[Abingdonboy]

@GuardianRED what is being said is the truth- the IN's perspective plan calls for 5-6 CBGs in the long term. This is their ultimate goal and frankly has been since the 1980s (as unbelievable as that sounds ). There is no concrete timeline on this but I think 2035 is the target.

As it stands there will be 2 CBGs by 2020 (Vikramditya and Vikran based) and there is the very real possibility an additional Vikrant class will be churned out. From what I understand the IN has delayed the Vishal class by a few years (maybe she will only start being built in 2020 now) because of EMALS issues and propulsion questions ( I no think it is a certainty the Vishal will be nuclear powered but she was not initially set to be so redesigns have to take place along with massive support infrastructure aggregation ).

By 2030 there would/could be 4 CBGs and an additional 2 by 2035. It is very doable and frankly the navy would be stupid not to be thinking big at this point.

 

[GuardianRED]

@GuardianRED what is being said is the truth- the IN's perspective plan calls for 5-6 CBGs in the long term. This is their ultimate goal and frankly has been since the 1980s (as unbelievable as that sounds ). There is no concrete timeline on this but I think 2035 is the target.

As it stands there will be 2 CBGs by 2020 (Vikramditya and Vikran based) and there is the very real possibility an additional Vikrant class will be churned out. From what I understand the IN has delayed the Vishal class by a few years (maybe she will only start being built in 2020 now) because of EMALS issues and propulsion questions ( I no think it is a certainty the Vishal will be nuclear powered but she was not initially set to be so redesigns have to take place along with massive support infrastructure aggregation ).

By 2030 there would/could be 4 CBGs and an additional 2 by 2035. It is very doable and frankly the navy would be stupid not to be thinking big at this point.

Thanks for the reply, but again haven't read this anywhere!... Still IMO a 3 Carriers is feasible. 5 is overkill ... think the navy should concentrate on the LPD BG, with increase in navy rotary forces , something similar to what the Mistral ClassShip for the Egyptian navy

 

[Abingdonboy]

Thanks for the reply, but again haven't read this anywhere!... Still IMO a 3 Carriers is feasible. 5 is overkill ... think the navy should concentrate on the LPD BG, with increase in navy rotary forces , something similar to what the Mistral ClassShip for the Egyptian navy

Again, this is for the LONG term. 5-6 CBGs wont be overkill in 2035 when India is the 3rd largest economy in the world and spending >$200BN/year on defence. As India's economy grows so will its interests and it will have to step up to the plate instead of shying away as it has down until now.

The IN has also,wisely, pushed back the LPD induction until at least 2020 (work start), they haven't got the requisite infrastructure to necessitate 4-6 LPD (dedicated marine infantry, a surplus of naval transport helos, LCAC etc). In the long term these LPD BGs are essential to dominating the IOR but it is another of term ambition.

Recently a major thrust has been given to ASW and especially Subs, a new class of SSN is now the IN's focus (for the next 3-4 years at least) when they had not originally expected to get the sanction for another 5 years at least.

Correct...Vishal CVN class delayed..due to the Navy trying to make up its mind abt design options N/COGAG +E-drive propulsion, ski/steam/Emals...air wing - Baaz/teja/Frenchfry/F-teen? Navy most practical service...unused capacity at viki builders since viki2 on her way to sea ..plus promise by viki builders to deliver viki3 in 4-5 years compared to 8-9yrs at lower cost in real terms (adjusted inflation)...sarkar wants quick capability to give dhoti shiver up maos backside in SCS ( a la U2/USN concert between maostan & chiangkaistan...major loss of face for the huangdi in the eyes of the aam panda) leverage so they stop relieving themselves on the wrong side of the mountains. Possibility considering DND's push the limits iteratively design philosophy that viki3 may be more than 40-45k but no radical changes like N/emals...just more khan gas for extra wt.

The Vikrant sister ship will be very similar to the Vikrant/IAC-1 herself. She will no doubt feature design refinements but she will essentially be the same; STOBAR with a displacement in the region of 42-45,000 tons. There is nothing to be gained by dramatically changing her design when the Vikranf itself is a very modern design and the whole notion behind another Vikrant class is making use of the experience and churning out another in a dramatically contracted timeline.

What will be most interesting about the Vikrant class itself will in fact be its air wing. If I was a betting man I would say we will be seeing a French flavour going forward (as far as fighters are concerned). The MiG-29Ks the IN has in service/on order are only enough to serve one STOBAR carrier, not two let alone three. There is a reason the IN has been very quiet on this front, if it was to be more MiG-29Ks they wouldn't placed orders for such by now.

 

[Nimitam]

The Vikrant sister ship will be very similar to the Vikrant/IAC-1 herself. She will no doubt feature design refinements but she will essentially be the same; STOBAR with a displacement in the region of 42-45,000 tons. There is nothing to be gained by dramatically changing her design when the Vikranf itself is a very modern design and the whole notion behind another Vikrant class is making use of the experience and churning out another in a dramatically contracted timeline.

What will be most interesting about the Vikrant class itself will in fact be its air wing. If I was a betting man I would say we will be seeing a French flavour going forward (as far as fighters are concerned). The MiG-29Ks the IN has in service/on order are only enough to serve one STOBAR carrier, not two let alone three. There is a reason the IN has been very quiet on this front, if it was to be more MiG-29Ks they wouldn't placed orders for such by now.

The new IAC 2 might fly the Raffy. Maybe that accounts for the 18 raffy for IN.

 

[GuardianRED]

Again, this is for the LONG term. 5-6 CBGs wont be overkill in 2035 when India is the 3rd largest economy in the world and spending >$200BN/year on defence. As India's economy grows so will its interests and it will have to step up to the plate instead of shying away as it has down until now.

The IN has also,wisely, pushed back the LPD induction until at least 2020 (work start), they haven't got the requisite infrastructure to necessitate 4-6 LPD (dedicated marine infantry, a surplus of naval transport helos, LCAC etc). In the long term these LPD BGs are essential to dominating the IOR but it is another of term ambition.

Recently a major thrust has been given to ASW and especially Subs, a new class of SSN is now the IN's focus (for the next 3-4 years at least) when they had not originally expected to get the sanction for another 5 years at least.


The Vikrant sister ship will be very similar to the Vikrant/IAC-1 herself. She will no doubt feature design refinements but she will essentially be the same; STOBAR with a displacement in the region of 42-45,000 tons. There is nothing to be gained by dramatically changing her design when the Vikranf itself is a very modern design and the whole notion behind another Vikrant class is making use of the experience and churning out another in a dramatically contracted timeline.

What will be most interesting about the Vikrant class itself will in fact be its air wing. If I was a betting man I would say we will be seeing a French flavour going forward (as far as fighters are concerned). The MiG-29Ks the IN has in service/on order are only enough to serve one STOBAR carrier, not two let alone three. There is a reason the IN has been very quiet on this front, if it was to be more MiG-29Ks they wouldn't placed orders for such by now.

Agree the IN Focus should on on its Underwater capability! SSN SSK, SSBN etc

Seriously Hope the IN doesn't go the IAF way by having a 3rd Attack Aircraft in its wing (To many aircraft) think it should maybe have an electronic craft like the Prowler/Growler(Wish list) ASW/ASuW Copters (Urgent Requirement) AEW aircraft like the E3

Plus Read that feasibility studies are been done for modification of the MiG 29K for CATOBAR operations , which is far better and faster induction than bring in a new AC (sorry trying to location whether is an article or someone told me)

 

[Abingdonboy]

Agree the IN Focus should on on its Underwater capability! SSN SSK, SSBN etc

Seriously Hope the IN doesn't go the IAF way by having a 3rd Attack Aircraft in its wing (To many aircraft) think it should maybe have an electronic craft like the Prowler/Growler(Wish list) ASW/ASuW Copters (Urgent Requirement) AEW aircraft like the E3

Plus Read that feasibility studies are been done for modification of the MiG 29K for CATOBAR operations , which is far better and faster induction than bring in a new AC (sorry trying to location whether is an article or someone told me)

The Rafale-M in the IN would actually be the most cost effective and optimal solution. Not only could the IN have a world class naval finger but they could use it for all future carriers both STOBAR and CATOBAR. And what I have heard the IN are most excited by from the Rafale is the maintainability of this type, they are content with the performance of the MiG-29K but are aware that it is a very difficult machine to keep war ready. This is the last thing you want with a carrier fighter when you go to sea with everything needed to keep the birds going and every extra tool/spare/mechanic imposes a heavy cost on a ship with finite space and resources.

My friend @Taygibay may be able to provide more info on how low the Rafale's "footprint" is when deployed on carriers vis a vis "legacy" platforms.

 

[GuardianRED]

The Rafale-M in the IN would actually be the most cost effective and optimal solution. Not only could the IN have a world class naval finger but they could use it for all future carriers both STOBAR and CATOBAR. And what I have heard the IN are most excited by from the Rafale is the maintainability of this type, they are content with the performance of the MiG-29K but are aware that it is a very difficult machine to keep war ready. This is the last thing you want with a carrier fighter when you go to sea with everything needed to keep the birds going and every extra tool/spare/mechanic imposes a heavy cost on a ship with finite space and resources.

My friend @Taygibay may be able to provide more info on how low the Rafale's "footprint" is when deployed on carriers vis a vis "legacy" platforms.

The MiG 29K isnt a legacy Aircraft! Its an ALL new Aircraft that happens to be based on the MiG 29. The IN footed the bill of development and proved a worthy aircraft that the RuN has ordered them

Still would like to see the info your friend has on the Rafael M

 

[Penguin]

Thanks for the reply, but again haven't read this anywhere!... Still IMO a 3 Carriers is feasible. 5 is overkill ... think the navy should concentrate on the LPD BG, with increase in navy rotary forces , something similar to what the Mistral ClassShip for the Egyptian navy

5 carriers allows you to have 1 on station at all times (hence, US maintains 10 minimum)

 

[Local_Legend]

INDIAN NAVY’S WARSHIPS VISIT SOUTH KOREA; PART OF EASTERN FLEET’S DEPLOYMENT TO SOUTH CHINA SEA

The ships are under the command of Flag Officer Commanding Eastern Fleet, Rear Admiral S V Bhokare, YSM. During the visit, the ships will have professional interaction with the Republic of Korea (ROK) Navy towards further enhancing co-operation between the two forces
In line with continuing focus on India's 'Act East' policy, Indian Navy's warships Sahyadri, Shakti and Kirch arrived today in Busan on a four day visit, as part of deployment of the Eastern Fleet to the South China Sea.
“In addition, calls on senior Government and military authorities, sporting and cultural interactions and sharing of best practices, aimed at strengthening ties and mutual understanding between the two Navies, are also planned. The visiting ships are also likely to conduct exercises with the ROK Navy, aimed at enhancing interoperability in communication as well as Search and Rescue procedures, post departure from Busan. INS Sahyadri is commanded by Captain K S Rajkumar, INS Shakti is commanded by Captain Gagan Kaushal and INS Kirch is commanded by Commander Sharad Sinsunwal,” said the Defence Ministry release.

Defence and Security relations between India and Republic of Korea have evolved steadily over the years and have received a renewed impetus with the visit of Indian defence delegation led by Defence Minister in April 16, the release said. “Subscription to training courses, participation in multi-lateral seminars/forums, reciprocal port visits, high-level delegations and training exchanges have bolstered naval cooperation between the two countries. In addition, both countries have forged ties in the field of military R&D, with MoU signed between Indian Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) and the Defence Acquisition program Administration (DAPA) of RoK. The last visit by an IN ship to Republic of Korea was in October 2015, when Sahyadri berthed at Incheon,” it added.
The current visit seeks to enhance maritime cooperation between the Indian Navy and the ROK Navy. It will further bolster the strong bonds of friendship between India and Republic of Korea and contribute to security and stability in this vital part of the world, the release concluded.

http://www.indiandefensenews.in/2016/06/indian-navys-warships-visit-south-korea.html


INS Sindhuvir to undergo refit at HSL

After the successful launch of INS Sindhukirti after refit, another Sindhughosh class Russia-made submarine INS Sindhuvir will undergo refit at the Hindustan Shipyard Limited (HSL) from January 2017. The order for complete repairs is estimated at Rs.400 crore. The delivery time fixed for the submarine, which took part in several operations of the Navy, is two years. It will join operations immediately after the refit.“It will be another prestigious project for us after delivering the new-look Sindhukirti last year. We will learn from our previous experience and complete the job better this time,” HSL Chairman and Managing Director L.V. Sarat Babu told The Hindu on Monday. The HSL had to face criticism in certain quarters for the inordinate delay in completing retrofitting of INS Sindhukirti. “It completed diving and harbour trials. There was some delay due to certain forces beyond our control,” he said. Defence project The HSL is also in the race among other Defence PSUs, and L&T and Pipavav Defence for bagging the contract for construction of 10 futuristic submarines to augment the capacity of the Navy at an estimated cost of Rs. 60,000 crore under P-75 (1) project. Under ‘Make-in India’ programme, the HSL pins high hopes on bagging the project going by the ecosystem prevailing in the city. The HSL also tied up with Hyundai Heavy Industries of Korea for technical cooperation. It formed a consortium with MIDHANI and BHEL in 2014 for more financial security to bag the contract. Asked to comment on the status of the project, Rear Admiral Sarat Babu said due to the new Defence procurement policy, a decision was awaited on strategic partnerships.“A decision on P 75 (1) is expected only after stand-on strategic partnerships is spelt out,” he clarified. It is expected to cost Rs.400 crore and the delivery time fixed is two years from January 2017

http://idrw.org/ins-sindhuvir-undergo-refit-hsl/