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India v/s China: We’ve got Facebook! What’ve you got?

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An interesting analysis in TIME magazine, to the extent that it tries to be an analysis:

The ChIndian Century
And don’t forget to check out these two accompanying arguments, one for India and one for China:

The Case for India: Free to Succeed
The Case for China: The Power of Planning

I plan to blog about this general issue sometime soon. Right now however, I just can’t help commenting on just two points for the time being, particularly because many westerners have humongous misconceptions about these issues. Almost every article on the topic contains at least a reference to these two fallacious points.

From the Case for India article:

The only way either economy can keep growth roaring is to develop high-tech industries and innovative companies — a difficult leap that demands the type of smartly run companies India already has. It also requires democracy and civil liberties. By censoring the Internet, controlling the press and stifling debate, Beijing is suppressing the open exchange of information and risk-taking spirit necessary for entrepreneurial innovation. Indians, enjoying full freedom of expression and association, face no such hurdles
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This absolutely bullshit view – that of relating internet censorship and “human rights” to entrepreneurial spirit and scientific research, and concluding that the former stifles the later – is so common, especially in the west, that it really makes one wonder whether people have lost the ability to think. And I am not talking about the ability to think in any profoundly intellectual way – just normal thinking that separates Homo Sapiens as a species from, say, American politicians.

Analysts and Journalists focus only on the tiny, miniscule, 0.0001% of search results that China does censor – and then extrapolate it to conclude that this will negatively affect (“stiffle” is their favorite word) entrepreneurial spirit and scientific research. Yes – China does censor certain search terms. But what does a search result relating to the Dalai Lama have to do with a citizen who wants to begin a tech startup? How pray will a scientist’s research in quantum physics be affected if the Chinese government censors his google search results about Tiananmen?? (I can just see the headline now – China lags in Physics research due to government cover up of Tiananmen massacre, says scientist). How did the team that created the Sunway system (whose theoretical peak performance is 74% faster than the fastest US supercomputer, and it used homegrown chips) be stifled when they realized that they can’t use Facebook and Twitter?

“Screw government grants and cutting-edge research facilities!” – they’ll say. “We want to tweet and protest. We’re going to India – the land of freedom. So what if its richest city has 42% of its population living in slums and where more people have mobile phones than access to a proper toilet??! We don’t care about about living standards!!! We want freedom of speech and a free internet!! And not just the 99.9999% free internet that China offers! No sir – for us, that 0.00001% censored search results are more important

Now that I think of it – this will make for a good Onion story. I can just see the headline now – Scientist prefers Facebook over better standards of living. “It will make life better for my children” he says.

Another piece of BS:

We can also make the case that India is more entrepreneurial than China. Indian firms like Infosys, Tata Consultancy Services and Wipro practically invented the entire offshore IT-services industry — a sector China is now attempting to copy. At their ever expanding campuses, these companies train and absorb thousands of new hires each year while extending their reach to every corner of the globe — management challenges Chinese executives would struggle to tackle.

The BPO industry in India is based on call-center employees answering stupid phone calls from stupid customers in the US and other countries (BTW – that anecdote about Americans calling to say that their computers are not working when they were not actually plugged in – is actually true). All these call center employees (who go by the fanciful title of “executives”) have no technical skills whatsoever – they just read out the instructions that appear to them on their help screen to customers. It is common knowledge in India that people work at a call center iff (if and only if) they can’t get employment anywhere else – and a few do it for the money. It is nobody’s – and I mean nobody’s – first choice. In fact, joining a call-center is considered a sort of slur and an insult – that they couldn’t get employed anywhere else and had to join a call center and had to work night shifts. In a nutshell – they are “unemployable”. This is the sector that has put India on the global map.

NASSCOM says that 90% Graduates and 75% Engineers in India are unemployable. That explains why companies like Infosys and TCS have to spend an average of 6-8 months and spend crores of rupees training engineering graduates. Yes – those people have already acquired degrees – and they still need months of training! A very large number (perhaps the majority, though I can’t verify it) of fresh engineering graduates that these companies hire during campus recruitment drives – are actually graduates from non-software fields, such as Electronics, Telecommunication, Mechanical etc. And then they train them in software and teach them a few languages, and they are ready and qualified to work in a software MNC! Whatever they learnt in most of the past four years gone to waste – never to be used again. In fact, one recruiter from a major MNC once told me that they just require the “aptitude” of an engineer, they are going to teach them everything else anyway.

Name one software product that has come out of this so-called IT superpower. Name one Indian university that has broken into the top 100 in the world. Name just one piece of innovation (software or otherwise) that you’ve heard of that has come from India, despite its “freedom”. But who cares? We’ve got Facebook!


| Hidden Harmonies China Blog
 
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lol these call centres and software was a part if indian past which will continue big into future. nxt 2 decades growth will come in investment into infrastructure and manufacturing of high tech products. services has matured now its time to overtake manufacturing.
 
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lol these call centres and software was a part if indian past which will continue big into future. nxt 2 decades growth will come in investment into infrastructure and manufacturing of high tech products. services has matured not its time to overtake manufacturing.

:rofl:

nice indian dreaming.
more big talk by the indians then fire blanks.

india will always be a puppet of the western world,majority indians can speak the western language, english, due to being colonized, so they dont need their own companies. if you speak english, you dont need your own indigenous companies. we dont speak english, so we need our own systems, our culture, our heritage, our style.

indian culture is western culture, india is completely westernized, indian culture is no more as colonization destroyed its culture. they have lost their own identity, they are culturally colonized by the british and americans. same with japan.
not only that but indians are very primitive and backward people, its part of the indian system, its corrupt to the core.
im not being racist, but indians are very corrupt people, not all indians are corrupt but most of the corrupt people seem to be indian.

india will always be part of the western world, they speak the westerners language, they have western legal and political systems, western culture, etc.

thats the greatness of china, we have our culture, our history, our civilization, our language, our systems.
 
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(I can just see the headline now – China lags in Physics research due to government cover up of Tiananmen massacre, says scientist). How did the team that created the Sunway system (whose theoretical peak performance is 74% faster than the fastest US supercomputer, and it used homegrown chips) be stifled when they realized that they can’t use Facebook and Twitter?

wow this chap is amazing he accurately predicted this headline


why-china-lags-innovation-creativity

http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/170090-why-china-lags-innovation-creativity-3.html
 
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:rofl:

nice indian dreaming.
more big talk by the indians then fire blanks.

india will always be a puppet of the western world,majority indians can speak the western language, english, due to being colonized, so they dont need their own companies. if you speak english, you dont need your own indigenous companies. we dont speak english, so we need our own systems, our culture, our heritage, our style.

indian culture is western culture, india is completely westernized, indian culture is no more as colonization destroyed its culture. they have lost their own identity, they are culturally colonized by the british and americans. same with japan.
not only that but indians are very primitive and backward people, its part of the indian system, its corrupt to the core.
im not being racist, but indians are very corrupt people, not all indians are corrupt but most of the corrupt people seem to be indian.

india will always be part of the western world, they speak the westerners language, they have western legal and political systems, western culture, etc.

thats the greatness of china, we have our culture, our history, our civilization, our language, our systems.

how did u survive till now dude???
come on lets talk nicely and make this a usefull thread instead of derailing it???
 
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The BPO industry in India is based on call-center employees answering stupid phone calls from stupid customers in the US and other countries (BTW – that anecdote about Americans calling to say that their computers are not working when they were not actually plugged in – is actually true). All these call center employees (who go by the fanciful title of “executives”) have no technical skills whatsoever – they just read out the instructions that appear to them on their help screen to customers. It is common knowledge in India that people work at a call center iff (if and only if) they can’t get employment anywhere else –

Hidden Harmonies China Blog[/url]


its a very common myth. the reality is indian outsourcing is a lot more

Jobs outsourced to India - YouTube
 
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:rofl:

nice indian dreaming.
more big talk by the indians then fire blanks.

india will always be a puppet of the western world,majority indians can speak the western language, english, due to being colonized, so they dont need their own companies. if you speak english, you dont need your own indigenous companies. we dont speak english, so we need our own systems, our culture, our heritage, our style.

indian culture is western culture, india is completely westernized, indian culture is no more as colonization destroyed its culture. they have lost their own identity, they are culturally colonized by the british and americans. same with japan.
not only that but indians are very primitive and backward people, its part of the indian system, its corrupt to the core.
im not being racist, but indians are very corrupt people, not all indians are corrupt but most of the corrupt people seem to be indian.

india will always be part of the western world, they speak the westerners language, they have western legal and political systems, western culture, etc.

thats the greatness of china, we have our culture, our history, our civilization, our language, our systems.

you are scared of indias's rise.. its reality, underneath the chaos there is a powerful engine in india.
 
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NASSCOM says that 90% Graduates and 75% Engineers in India are unemployable. That explains why companies like Infosys and TCS have to spend an average of 6-8 months and spend crores of rupees training engineering graduates. Yes – those people have already acquired degrees – and they still need months of training! A very large number (perhaps the majority, though I can’t verify it) of fresh engineering graduates that these companies hire during campus recruitment drives – are actually graduates from non-software fields, such as Electronics, Telecommunication, Mechanical etc. And then they train them in software and teach them a few languages, and they are ready and qualified to work in a software MNC! Whatever they learnt in most of the past four years gone to waste – never to be used again. In fact, one recruiter from a major MNC once told me that they just require the “aptitude” of an engineer, they are going to teach them everything else anyway.

this is complete bs and ppl read such stuff thinking that this is a chronic problem india is facing lol
i am doing engineering at waterloo canada world ranked 35. i can assure even graduating from waterloo ur nothing but a crap engineer who cant even program without copying assignments from top 1% of class. all companies train u and whatever u learnt in ur 4 yrs will never be used again.

50% of my engineering class is chinese and they r completely same. good part about being an engineer is not knowing everything but the ability to learn anything when needed in life.

you are scared of indias's rise.. its reality, underneath the chaos there is a powerful engine in india.

dude dont reply to ws 10 engine. he is not worth talking. he is here to derail the thread.
 
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what people dont understand is that, the IT services revolution started first in late 80s early 90s. BPO started only in late 90s. I remember one of my cousing graduating from college in late 80s and visiting US for the first time and earning a $ salary. He was a hero back home then.. I remember in late 90s when india was a few hundred million $ in IT, but there was always optimism and a huge buzz.
Let the chinese think what they want , tell what they want . As long as we rake in the money honestly I am happy. If Chinese ridicule IT services let them. its their loss.
 
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:rofl:

nice indian dreaming.
more big talk by the indians then fire blanks.

yeah right , our population is increasing.. Ask your parents , it is only your govt that has forced them to fire blanks once you were born !!!!
but i wished they fired blanks even before you were born
 
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But due to China's iron curtains and lack of transparency world don't believe in Chinese stats. China should open to world mesia and analysts then only there will be fair comparison between India and China.
 
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But due to China's iron curtains and lack of transparency world don't believe in Chinese stats. China should open to world mesia and analysts then only there will be fair comparison between India and China.
you think in this way thats because you are brainwashed, my western suppliers finding any ways possible to estabilish business presence in China, but runing away from India...so in reality the India's 'world biggest middle class' propaganda is as BS as India is democracy. because in any country middle class is the main driving force of the nation's economy consumption, yet in reality China consumes 2 Indian economies every year in domestic market alone
 
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:rofl:

nice indian dreaming.
more big talk by the indians then fire blanks.

india will always be a puppet of the western world,majority indians can speak the western language, english, due to being colonized, so they dont need their own companies. if you speak english, you dont need your own indigenous companies. we dont speak english, so we need our own systems, our culture, our heritage, our style.

indian culture is western culture, india is completely westernized, indian culture is no more as colonization destroyed its culture. they have lost their own identity, they are culturally colonized by the british and americans. same with japan.
not only that but indians are very primitive and backward people, its part of the indian system, its corrupt to the core.
im not being racist, but indians are very corrupt people, not all indians are corrupt but most of the corrupt people seem to be indian.

india will always be part of the western world, they speak the westerners language, they have western legal and political systems, western culture, etc.

thats the greatness of china, we have our culture, our history, our civilization, our language, our systems.

India v/s China: We’ve got Facebook! What’ve you got?

We got Bollywood , and You have Tiananmen Square !!!
 
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you think in this way thats because you are brainwashed, my western suppliers finding any ways possible to estabilish business presence in China, but runing away from India...so in reality the India's 'world biggest middle class' propaganda is as BS as India is democracy. because in any country middle class is the main driving force of the nation's economy consumption, yet in reality China consumes 2 Indian economies every year in domestic market alone

india has a 300-400 million strong middle class good enought to drive our economy, worry abt ur economy which is only being driven by over consumption. more than quarter of ur economy is simply real estate which is nothing but a bad investment. u can goo and see what real estate ppl of china are saying. one billionaire called china "dubai 1000 times or worse".
ur real estatae magnets are leaving china and setting up safe houses in us and canada, they know they would need to fled away from country soon.

exactly similiar position was japan in 25 yrs ago. huge reserves, huge manufacturing base, huge spending power, worrlds biggest banks all set to takeover america. what happned? banks grew but the country went bankrupt and is now crippling. china price rise will itself hurt china bad. i dont say china will collapse but it will suffer with low economic growth soon.
 
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you think in this way thats because you are brainwashed, my western suppliers finding any ways possible to estabilish business presence in China, but runing away from India...so in reality the India's 'world biggest middle class' propaganda is as BS as India is democracy. because in any country middle class is the main driving force of the nation's economy consumption, yet in reality China consumes 2 Indian economies every year in domestic market alone

It's not me, it's you who is brainwashed comrade. Anybody can sense your frustration over Indian Democracy and middle class rise.
 
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