India, Russia to create FGFA ahead of schedule

[Agent_47]

Russia and India have agreed to accelerate their work on the creation of a new fifth generation fighter, the Indian TV channel NDTV reported after the Russian Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu visited Delhi.

During the talks, the Indian side expressed their doubts about the feasibility of carrying out new research and development activities on this aircraft, taking into account the fact that several prototype fifth-generation fighters are already being tested in Russia.

“We want to start using a new fighter jet in the Indian Air Force much earlier than the originally designated period – 2024-2025,” NDTV quoted Indian Defense Minister Manohar Parrikar.

We should recall that in early January, Russia and India reached agreement on the design of the new aircraft. Sharing many systems with the PAK FA, the Indian fighter will be a two-seater. Delhi plans to build 127 new fighter jets at the Indian aircraft factory in the city of Nashik. The cost developing the new aircraft is estimated at $25 billion.

India, Russia to create FGFA ahead of schedule | Russia & India Report

 

[Agent_47]

After last days meeting, This is significant because :

• Decision to make it only two-seater.
• Earlier It was reported that after the signing of the final design contract, it will take 94 months to complete.But according to above report,time to complete will be reduced significantly as IAF/HAL is finally getting in to senses and not going to do everything from start.
  
• Indian work share will shoot up because of new two-seater vesion.
• Number is reduced to 126.(not sure if its a mistake)

 

[sancho]

But according to above report,time to complete will be reduced significantly as IAF/HAL is finally getting in to senses and not going to do everything from start.

What do you mean by that?

 

[Agent_47]

What do you mean by that?

By not doing same basic research and development already done by russians.

the Indian side expressed their doubts about the feasibility of carrying out new research and development activities on this aircraft, taking into account the fact that several prototype fifth-generation fighters are already being tested in Russia.

 

[Ind4Ever]

We already have prototypes flying . Just modify with two seater , better engine (tot) , better range and improved work share. It must hardly take 3 year's for 1st prototype to fly. Wonder what is the need to start from scratch which will take another 5 years more

Induct as soon as possible and later improve its avionics . Same like MKI

 

[sancho]

By not doing same basic research and development already done by russians.

Actually, that would mean that we might stick to more of the Russian materials or avionics, rather than implementing own once to the present prototypes, while the reversal to develop the twin seat design will cause far more R&D efforts, since that can't be based on the available versions, but needs to developed new.

 

[cirr]

Talk，talk，talk！

 

[anant_s]

Decision to make it only two-seater.

This is significant considering the earlier news that India wanted to press ahead with Single seater versions owing to delay on program. Obviously some progress has been made and looks like FGFA might be ready for trials in 2018-20 time frame.

Number is reduced to 126

Don't think we should read much into that, budget permitting, the numbers can always increase at a later part as assembly lines will continue production to meet the export requirement.

 

[Agent_47]

Actually, that would mean that we might stick to more of the Russian materials or avionics, rather than implementing own once to the present prototypes, while the reversal to develop the twin seat design will cause far more R&D efforts, since that can't be based on the available versions, but needs to developed new.

lets hope twin seat R&D and time reduction will balance out.

 

[sancho]

lets hope twin seat R&D and time reduction will balance out.

Twin seat R&D was never gone, just done at a later stage to save initial time and costs. I don't see how reversing that can fast track that and more importantly, at what costs?

Obviously some progress has been made and looks like FGFA might be ready for trials in 2018-20 time frame.

That was the timeframe according to the initial plan, with the last FGFA (single seat) prototype before serial production to arrive in Indian in 2019.

 

[Agent_47]

Don't think we should read much into that, budget permitting, the numbers can always increase at a later part as assembly lines will continue production to meet the export requirement.

Actually its quite obvious,We are looking for a balance fleet.
After 2022,In 42 sqd we should squeeze maximum light and medium fighters not heavy fighters(we will already have 15 MKI sq). No air force in the world want more than half of its fleet maintenance hungry beasts.

 

[anant_s]

That was the timeframe according to the initial plan, with the last FGFA (single seat) prototype before serial production to arrive in Indian in 2019.

Sir as per the original plan, India was supposed to have a some fleet of single seat fighters in exact same configuration that Russia would have before FGFA arrived for production and then Russia was supposed to buy some small number of FGFA configuration (2 seat). Total production of this arrangement was supposed to be around 500 pieces divided equally between Russia and India.
Now it seems India has reduced its total commitment (not sure about Russian decision). With the time (2019) u've mentioned, is it likely that IAF would still have some Single seat versions prior to 2019, so that it may get some experience with a Fifth generation machine and this might also serve, to put crudely, some kind of buffer in case FGFA is delayed.

Actually its quite obvious,We are looking for a balance fleet.
After 2022,In 42 sqd we should squeeze maximum light and medium fighters not heavy fighters(we will already have 15 MKI sq). No air force in the world want more than half of its fleet maintenance hungry beasts.

True!
& that perhaps also explains why India has reduced its commitment for the program. A lot would depend on how many J-20 China would be able to field and cost committed to the project has to be in proportion to this threat perception. Also if a naval version of this plane comes up (i'm sure it will), we may see some of these on IAC 2 onwards, which will add to total inventory.

 

[HRK]

Wonder what is the need to start from scratch which will take another 5 years more

Induct as soon as possible and later improve its avionics . Same like MKI

most probably customized avionics for IAF version.

 

[sancho]

Sir as per the original plan, India was supposed to have a some fleet of single seat fighters in exact same configuration that Russia would have.

That's not correct, check this:

India to customise Russia's FGFA planes - The Hindu

 

[Echo_419]

Talk，talk，talk！

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