India quickly closing the capability gap with China and will not leave Bhutan to its fate

[gslv mk3]

Seriously, why are Chinese so stupid ? Do they really think that we can't build an aircraft towing tractor ?

 

[ashok mourya]

why didn't iraq bomb washington?
what is on your neck? use it to think.
do you really believe India has weapons and military strong enough to compare with China?
do you really believe India has chance to fire its missiles to China?
do you really believe India can get any help except useless cry from outside world?
do you really believe India has money or weapon industry to support a modern war?
its stupid to show your 3 tier army to us. India is nothing even compared to Japanese or france or briton .If our army is as weak as yours ,China would have been vanished decades ago. only reason we dont give you a lesson is that we have stronger enemies ,US, Japan, some NATO countries.
trust me ,we are not in the same level ,in ALL field.
India is almost at the bottom of the third world ,but China is 2nd biggest economy.

Smoke what ever u like.
Let me present to you some numbers and facts associated with them in order to clarify my view.

Number of regular armymen

China 16 lakh + Reserve forces 8 lakh + PAP 660000 = 3060000 total

India 1325000 + Reserve forces 18 lakh + territorial army = 37 lakh plus total.

China Tanks 7500, Artillery guns 20000, Helicopters 400, armoured vehicles 7500 +

India Tanks 5000, Artillery guns 19800, Helicopters 500, armoured vehicles number not known

Surface to Air Missiles

China 210000 - India 190000

Besides these China has deployed around 1800 ballistic missiles some of which have nuclear warheads. (range between 280-350 kms upto 13000 kms).

On the other hand India has over 1700 missiles belonging to the Prithvi, Agni and Brahmos supersonic Cruise missile category (range between 150 kms upto 5500 kms). Besides these India has also developed a land based missile named Shaurya (range upto 2200 kms) and its submarine based version named Sagarika, both of which are supposed to be in service shortly or might have already been inducted.

The part where India really lags behind China in terms of numbers is the number of aircraft possessed by their airforces and the vessels operated by their respective navies.

China has over 2000 fighter and bomber aircrafts belonging to categories such as Jian, Jianhong, Chengdu, Hong 6, Qiang 5, FC-17, Sukhoi 27 and Sukhoi 30 MKK. (It has to be noted here that over 60% of these aircrafts are second and third generation aircrafts and a large number of those may not even be combat ready. The Sukhoi 30 MKK aircraft which is the premier fighter craft for China is technologically much inferior compared to the Sukhoi 30 MKI version that Indian Airforce operates. Sukhoi 30 MKK can actively engage two targets simultaneously.

India has about 700-800 fighter and bomber aircrafts about 300 belong to the Mig 21 category and 100 to the Mig 27 category. The remaining comprise Mig 29 Air superiority fighters, Mirage 2000 H (being upgraded to M), Jaguar bomber crafts and 300 Sukhoi 30 MKI aircrafts. (Indian airforce aircrafts apart from the Mig 21 series are third and fourth generation aircrafts with the Sukhoi 30 MKI being a generation 4.5 aircraft that can actively engage upto 20 different targets simultaneously (8 of them offensively and tracking the remaining) and can also act as a leader aircraft to a squadron of fighter planes. All of these aircrafts are supersonic planes with the Sukhoi 30 MKI being far superior to any other aircraft possessed by the Chinese Airforce. Besides these, India also operates over 380 UAV's that can perform various roles including missile attacks and bombings.

Besides, this India is also going for mass upgradation of its aircrafts and has already initiated the process of procuring 126 latest fighter aircraft. The Sukhoi 30 MKI is being produced in India now and about 130-189 such aircrafts are to be built and inducted in the next 5 years. Indian Airforce has also placed orders for over 200 indigenously developed fighter crafts named Tejas which shall join the airforce by 2011 when the Mig 21s retire. Apart from this, a fifth generation aircraft is in the advanced stage of development and production of 200 such aircraft will commence once the Sukhoi 30 MKI manufacturing is stopped in 2014 and India is also developing a stealth fighter jet (drawing board stage) that will replace the Mirages and Jaguars once these aircraft retire after 2020.

Last, but not the least, we shall evaluate the naval strength of these two countries. India lags far behind in these numbers, but, the only advantage that we can boast of is having an aircraft carrier which China doesn't have. As Mr Kushwaha pointed out, once we receive the overpriced and much delayed Admiral Gorshkov aircraft carrier from Russia and induct the Arihant class nuclear submarine into the navy, this will become a much leveller playing field for the two nations.

China - Destroyer Ships 26, Frigates 49, Large and medium landing ships 27 and 31 respectively, fast attack vessels 200 +, nuclear submarines 10, conventional submarines 60, upto 500 aircrafts including various types of helicopters.

India - Destroyer ships 8, Frigates 13, Landing ships Large and medium 22 in all, fast attack vessels 52, nuclear submarines 0, conventional submarines 16. number of aircrafts not specified.

If we compare the nuclear arsenal of both the countries, though, China has a larger number of devices, the stockpile of both nations is enough to almost wipe out the other from its existence.

 

[Jackdaws]

this rhetoric of war seems to be a case of "who blinks first". India's side of narrative says it is defending Bhutan, Chinese narrative says It is Chinese territory. while the neutral narrative seems to be that this is "disputed territory".

whichever way, when 2 countries claim the same area, and country A unilaterally decides to build infrastructure, then other country B has 2 choices:
1) let the country A build the infra and eventually give up claims of the location (a la SCS nine dash line)
2) Country B can challenge country A with whatever means available there by showing that it will give up the claim for the disputed land.

In this case, the country B is Bhutan. but the army helping it is from India. This complicates the matter just a little bit.

For all practical purposes, Bhutan is an Indian protectorate. Wouldn't a country like Liechtenstein depend on Germany or whoever is its closest ally if threatened by a France?

 

[Arsalan 345]

My friend didn't you hear about the big Chinese attack on Indian posts which killed 158 soldiers and many more just last week. There were 3 threads on PDF citing many Pakistani sources with pictures. By that news the attack has already happened.

hahaha.yes that was fake.that was horrible fake news.i hope things will remain calm between india and china.

 

[Han Patriot]

Seriously, why are Chinese so stupid ? Do they really think that we can't build an aircraft towing tractor ?

You actually don't build it. You import it btw.

Smoke what ever u like.
Let me present to you some numbers and facts associated with them in order to clarify my view.

Number of regular armymen

China 16 lakh + Reserve forces 8 lakh + PAP 660000 = 3060000 total

India 1325000 + Reserve forces 18 lakh + territorial army = 37 lakh plus total.

China Tanks 7500, Artillery guns 20000, Helicopters 400, armoured vehicles 7500 +

India Tanks 5000, Artillery guns 19800, Helicopters 500, armoured vehicles number not known

Surface to Air Missiles

China 210000 - India 190000

Besides these China has deployed around 1800 ballistic missiles some of which have nuclear warheads. (range between 280-350 kms upto 13000 kms).

On the other hand India has over 1700 missiles belonging to the Prithvi, Agni and Brahmos supersonic Cruise missile category (range between 150 kms upto 5500 kms). Besides these India has also developed a land based missile named Shaurya (range upto 2200 kms) and its submarine based version named Sagarika, both of which are supposed to be in service shortly or might have already been inducted.

The part where India really lags behind China in terms of numbers is the number of aircraft possessed by their airforces and the vessels operated by their respective navies.

China has over 2000 fighter and bomber aircrafts belonging to categories such as Jian, Jianhong, Chengdu, Hong 6, Qiang 5, FC-17, Sukhoi 27 and Sukhoi 30 MKK. (It has to be noted here that over 60% of these aircrafts are second and third generation aircrafts and a large number of those may not even be combat ready. The Sukhoi 30 MKK aircraft which is the premier fighter craft for China is technologically much inferior compared to the Sukhoi 30 MKI version that Indian Airforce operates. Sukhoi 30 MKK can actively engage two targets simultaneously.

India has about 700-800 fighter and bomber aircrafts about 300 belong to the Mig 21 category and 100 to the Mig 27 category. The remaining comprise Mig 29 Air superiority fighters, Mirage 2000 H (being upgraded to M), Jaguar bomber crafts and 300 Sukhoi 30 MKI aircrafts. (Indian airforce aircrafts apart from the Mig 21 series are third and fourth generation aircrafts with the Sukhoi 30 MKI being a generation 4.5 aircraft that can actively engage upto 20 different targets simultaneously (8 of them offensively and tracking the remaining) and can also act as a leader aircraft to a squadron of fighter planes. All of these aircrafts are supersonic planes with the Sukhoi 30 MKI being far superior to any other aircraft possessed by the Chinese Airforce. Besides these, India also operates over 380 UAV's that can perform various roles including missile attacks and bombings.

Besides, this India is also going for mass upgradation of its aircrafts and has already initiated the process of procuring 126 latest fighter aircraft. The Sukhoi 30 MKI is being produced in India now and about 130-189 such aircrafts are to be built and inducted in the next 5 years. Indian Airforce has also placed orders for over 200 indigenously developed fighter crafts named Tejas which shall join the airforce by 2011 when the Mig 21s retire. Apart from this, a fifth generation aircraft is in the advanced stage of development and production of 200 such aircraft will commence once the Sukhoi 30 MKI manufacturing is stopped in 2014 and India is also developing a stealth fighter jet (drawing board stage) that will replace the Mirages and Jaguars once these aircraft retire after 2020.

Last, but not the least, we shall evaluate the naval strength of these two countries. India lags far behind in these numbers, but, the only advantage that we can boast of is having an aircraft carrier which China doesn't have. As Mr Kushwaha pointed out, once we receive the overpriced and much delayed Admiral Gorshkov aircraft carrier from Russia and induct the Arihant class nuclear submarine into the navy, this will become a much leveller playing field for the two nations.

China - Destroyer Ships 26, Frigates 49, Large and medium landing ships 27 and 31 respectively, fast attack vessels 200 +, nuclear submarines 10, conventional submarines 60, upto 500 aircrafts including various types of helicopters.

India - Destroyer ships 8, Frigates 13, Landing ships Large and medium 22 in all, fast attack vessels 52, nuclear submarines 0, conventional submarines 16. number of aircrafts not specified.

If we compare the nuclear arsenal of both the countries, though, China has a larger number of devices, the stockpile of both nations is enough to almost wipe out the other from its existence.

You call the SU-30MKI superior? With no AESAs, it's a sitting duck. Do you know China is the largest drone exporter on earth, do you even have HALE drones? Hw do you compare Liaoning to Vikram, check the specs before talking.

For land army, check the number of MLRS systems, attack helis, howitzers and light tanks. All produced in China. Btw, we have operational stealth fighters, guess what are we gonna use it on. Do you have strategic bombers?

 

[Genesis]

Smoke what ever u like.
Let me present to you some numbers and facts associated with them in order to clarify my view.

Number of regular armymen

China 16 lakh + Reserve forces 8 lakh + PAP 660000 = 3060000 total

India 1325000 + Reserve forces 18 lakh + territorial army = 37 lakh plus total.

China Tanks 7500, Artillery guns 20000, Helicopters 400, armoured vehicles 7500 +

India Tanks 5000, Artillery guns 19800, Helicopters 500, armoured vehicles number not known

Surface to Air Missiles

China 210000 - India 190000

Besides these China has deployed around 1800 ballistic missiles some of which have nuclear warheads. (range between 280-350 kms upto 13000 kms).

On the other hand India has over 1700 missiles belonging to the Prithvi, Agni and Brahmos supersonic Cruise missile category (range between 150 kms upto 5500 kms). Besides these India has also developed a land based missile named Shaurya (range upto 2200 kms) and its submarine based version named Sagarika, both of which are supposed to be in service shortly or might have already been inducted.

The part where India really lags behind China in terms of numbers is the number of aircraft possessed by their airforces and the vessels operated by their respective navies.

China has over 2000 fighter and bomber aircrafts belonging to categories such as Jian, Jianhong, Chengdu, Hong 6, Qiang 5, FC-17, Sukhoi 27 and Sukhoi 30 MKK. (It has to be noted here that over 60% of these aircrafts are second and third generation aircrafts and a large number of those may not even be combat ready. The Sukhoi 30 MKK aircraft which is the premier fighter craft for China is technologically much inferior compared to the Sukhoi 30 MKI version that Indian Airforce operates. Sukhoi 30 MKK can actively engage two targets simultaneously.

India has about 700-800 fighter and bomber aircrafts about 300 belong to the Mig 21 category and 100 to the Mig 27 category. The remaining comprise Mig 29 Air superiority fighters, Mirage 2000 H (being upgraded to M), Jaguar bomber crafts and 300 Sukhoi 30 MKI aircrafts. (Indian airforce aircrafts apart from the Mig 21 series are third and fourth generation aircrafts with the Sukhoi 30 MKI being a generation 4.5 aircraft that can actively engage upto 20 different targets simultaneously (8 of them offensively and tracking the remaining) and can also act as a leader aircraft to a squadron of fighter planes. All of these aircrafts are supersonic planes with the Sukhoi 30 MKI being far superior to any other aircraft possessed by the Chinese Airforce. Besides these, India also operates over 380 UAV's that can perform various roles including missile attacks and bombings.

you forgot to mention 60%+ of your aircraft is also 3rd generation. So that negates that comment on China. China's new j16, and j10 is certainly no worse than your su30. At least 100+ j10 and j16 have aesa radar, that none of your fighters have.

So your assertion of far superior is not true.

As to drones, you don't really want to compare with China here, China has exported more drones than you possess.

Besides, this India is also going for mass upgradation of its aircrafts and has already initiated the process of procuring 126 latest fighter aircraft. The Sukhoi 30 MKI is being produced in India now and about 130-189 such aircrafts are to be built and inducted in the next 5 years. Indian Airforce has also placed orders for over 200 indigenously developed fighter crafts named Tejas which shall join the airforce by 2011 when the Mig 21s retire. Apart from this, a fifth generation aircraft is in the advanced stage of development and production of 200 such aircraft will commence once the Sukhoi 30 MKI manufacturing is stopped in 2014 and India is also developing a stealth fighter jet (drawing board stage) that will replace the Mirages and Jaguars once these aircraft retire after 2020.

ok how old is this,lol. Tejas obviously didnt materialize in 2011, 5th gen is also no where near ready or real. While J20 has entered into limited service.

Obviously Rafael has decreased in number and China's j20 has entered service before rafael did.

Last, but not the least, we shall evaluate the naval strength of these two countries. India lags far behind in these numbers, but, the only advantage that we can boast of is having an aircraft carrier which China doesn't have. As Mr Kushwaha pointed out, once we receive the overpriced and much delayed Admiral Gorshkov aircraft carrier from Russia and induct the Arihant class nuclear submarine into the navy, this will become a much leveller playing field for the two nations.

carriers we have 1 apiece, our shandong will enter service about 3 years before your vikrant, and our 3rd will be launched (currently already underconstruction in shanghai) before your 3rd get off the drawing board.

China - Destroyer Ships 26, Frigates 49, Large and medium landing ships 27 and 31 respectively, fast attack vessels 200 +, nuclear submarines 10, conventional submarines 60, upto 500 aircrafts including various types of helicopters.

India - Destroyer ships 8, Frigates 13, Landing ships Large and medium 22 in all, fast attack vessels 52, nuclear submarines 0, conventional submarines 16. number of aircrafts not specified.

If we compare the nuclear arsenal of both the countries, though, China has a larger number of devices, the stockpile of both nations is enough to almost wipe out the other from its existence.

this is more or less right though china has 5 20000 ton ldp with another already under consrruction, while india has 1, that refurbished american one. Also our subs have aip.

 

[SrNair]

Ermm, when did we beg? You are the ones putting up banners, wishing Xi happy bday and sending 4 times trip to China.

Or warnings

 

[djsjs]

your comparison make no sense. do you want your one hundred and thirty million soldiers climb up himalayan mountain?Do you have enough parts to repair the weapons bought from all over the world?Are you old soldiers well trained.How many of those fat guys elder than forty years old?How many of the jets can fly?

 

[gslv mk3]

You actually don't build it. You import it btw.

Yawn...the company's name is BEML.

And I have nothing to say if an idiot think India, a country with world's fifth largest auto industry can't build an ATT...

your comparison make no sense. do you want your one hundred and thirty million soldiers climb up himalayan mountain?

Now where exactly is Doklam BTW?

 

[djsjs]

Seriously, why are Chinese so stupid ? Do they really think that we can't build an aircraft towing tractor ?

do you think our gap is only building a tractor? we manufacture and export from toys to nuclear plant facilitates, from swimsuits to submarines.what do you have except big mouth?

 

[gslv mk3]

do you think our gap is only building a tractor? we manufacture and export from toys to nuclear plant facilitates, from swimsuits to submarines.

And we develop commercial Fast Breeder reactors, something your country is yet to do. Now whine !!

 

[hans]

Now India already intrude into China territory for a few days.
It will not be a matter if China do the same way to enter India.
If you don`t want that, then leave China territory right now

The absence of military experience is obvious which is unfortunate considering this is a military forum.



In all Military history , can you seek & share one example of maneuver in mountains ?

The terrain dictates movement along narrow defined lines .


To cut off supply lines you have to intrude into Indian territory not to mention that the narrow Chumbi Valley is dominated by Sikkim on the west & Bhutan on the East.

Consider who can get cut off & trapped .

So far the dispute is about & on Bhutanese territory, entering Indian territory opens a Pandora's box with countless implications & options.

 

[gslv mk3]

^^^and that's warning number ?

 

[Han Patriot]

Or warnings

Warnings are begging? Wow........like how we warn you in 1960s? We were begging then?

Yawn...the company's name is BEML.

And I have nothing to say if an idiot think India, a country with world's fifth largest auto industry can't build an ATT...



Now where exactly is Doklam BTW?

Can you show me?

 

[gslv mk3]

Can you show me?