Hassan Nisar: UAE's warning is deserved for Pakistan !

[TankMan]

wong analogy. paksitanis are like the native americans and mayans etc who are existing today. if they say that they want to return to their roots no one will question them. And similarly for pakitanis, you converted once, you could do it again.

Nonsense. I didn't make an analogy, I gave an example. There's a difference. The native Americans are 0.9% of the modern American population, they were colonized and the people now known as Americans were once the colonists.

Pakistanis are almost a hundred percent of the current Pakistani population and everything has already happened - the area now comprising Pakistan is full of people whose lineage comes from Arabs, Turks, Persians and so on; Pakistanis today are a very diverse combination created by all that happened over the decades. We don't need to have a pure indigenous race to be a successful nation - that is the point I made with all those examples.

There is no ''conversion''.

u want your version of history, which is obviously selective and harmful.

Utter nonsense. What 'version' do you want? If you want to believe Pakistanis are just Muslim Indians, go ahead, but that's wrong. A lot of Pakistanis are descendants of all the ''invaders'' you hate so much, and they are as Pakistani as the indigenous Punjabis - the same goes for Mohajirs, Pakhtuns, Sindhis, Jatts, Mughals and any other ethnicity. Like I said, Pakistan is very diverse and people from many historical backgrounds are Pakistanis.

Your version of history denies mixed lineage and culture, which is a reality. Trying to ''return to our roots'' after so many centuries is what's actually harmful.

 

[mauka]

Nonsense. I didn't make an analogy, I gave an example. There's a difference. The native Americans are 0.9% of the modern American population, they were colonized and the people now known as Americans were once the colonists.

Pakistanis are almost a hundred percent of the current Pakistani population (not counting Afghan refugees) and everything has already happened - the area now comprising Pakistan is full of people whose lineage comes from Arabs, Turks, Persians and so on; Pakistanis today are a very diverse combination created by all that happened over the decades. We don't need to have a pure indigenous race to be a successful nation - that is the point I made with all those example.

There is no ''conversion''.


Utter nonsense.

I disagree. while I don't deny that there are people with Turkic/Arabic/mongol male lineages (pathan/Baluch), the bulk are still indic (Punjabis/sindhis/kashmiris) I am not saying that you all need to convert , but the argument that like Americans cannot revert back to native indian, Pakistanis also cannot revert back to indigenous ways is wrong. whilte are colonialists in US. Pakistan have succumed to an alien ideology called islam rather than them being colonialists.

 

[TankMan]

I disagree. while I don't deny that there are people with Turkic/Arabic/mongol male lineages (pathan/Baluch), the bulk are still indic (Punjabis/sindhis/kashmiris)

The Turkic, Arabic and Mongol are just as integral to Pakistan as the other 'Indic' lineages.

I am not saying that you all need to convert , but the argument that like Americans cannot revert back to native indian, Pakistanis also cannot revert back to indigenous ways is wrong

It is not wrong at all. Like I said, The Turkic, Arabic and Mongol are just as integral as the other Indic lineages. They can not be separated. Returning to 'indigenous ways' is nonsense because these ''alien ways'' are the ways of modern Pakistan. Returning anywhere means abandoning the nation-state; before we do any of that, I'd like to see the Germans abandon the ''alien ideology'' forced upon them by the Romans and return to their old Germanic tribal system.

whilte are colonialists in US. Pakistan have succumed to an alien ideology called islam rather than them being colonialists.

Yeah right, ''evil alien Ideology'' and we should all return to glorious Hinduism - go away and troll somewhere else, I'm not going to bother with this part of your post.

 

[Psychic]

I disagree. while I don't deny that there are people with Turkic/Arabic/mongol male lineages (pathan/Baluch), the bulk are still indic (Punjabis/sindhis/kashmiris) I am not saying that you all need to convert , but the argument that like Americans cannot revert back to native indian, Pakistanis also cannot revert back to indigenous ways is wrong. whilte are colonialists in US. Pakistan have succumed to an alien ideology called islam rather than them being colonialists.

You better stop trolling.

I remember you were the genius who once stated that Baluchistan is a shia state

 

[mauka]

The Turkic, Arabic and Mongol are just as integral to Pakistan as the other 'Indic' lineages.

It is not wrong at all. Like I said, The Turkic, Arabic and Mongol are just as integral as the other Indic lineages. They can not be separated. Returning to 'indigenous ways' is nonsense because these ''alien ways'' are the ways of modern Pakistan. Returning anywhere means abandoning the nation-state; before we do any of that, I'd like to see the Germans abandon the ''alien ideology'' forced upon them by the Romans and return to their old Germanic tribal system.

Yeah right, ''evil alien Ideology'' and we should all return to glorious Hinduism - go away and troll somewhere else, I'm not going to bother with this part of your post.

Please don't reply. Turkish, Arab etc are not integral to Pakistan. The Hindus who have been eradicated in Pakistan were.

You better stop trolling.

I remember you were the genius who once stated that Baluchistan is a shia state

I may have been wrong on that but they are an Iranian people. That's why I thought they were Shi'a

 

[TankMan]

Turkish, Arab etc are not integral to Pakistan

The Balochis are descendants of Arabs and Persians. They are integral to Pakistan. Many Punjabis and Kashmiris are the descendants of Mughals. They are integral to Pakistan. Similarly, there are entire ''castes'' (zaat) like Malik, Syed, Hashmi, Abbasi, Khawaja etc. that are descendants of said ''foreigners''. They are all integral to Pakistan and make up a very big portion of the population.

The Hindus who have been eradicated in Pakistan were.

Do you know the meaning of the word 'integral'? It means:
''necessary to make a whole complete; essential or fundamental.''

How can the Hindus have been integral if they've already been ''eradicated''? And I thought the Indians' theory was that all Pakistanis are just ''converted Hindus'' but now you're saying all Hindus have been eradicated - looks like y'all haven't decided yet.

I may have been wrong on that but they are an Iranian people. That's why I thought they were Shi'a

Ethnicity and religion are different things. You could've looked up ''Baloch people'' and you'd find that their religion is predominantly Sunni Islam
Baloch people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[gau8av]

he makes a great point, apart from Islam, what other cultural ties do Pakistanis have with Arabs or Turks etc ?

it's also true that Arabs are some of the most race obsessed (racist) people on earth and their disdain toward us people from the subcontinent is quite well known.

so why should Pakistani soldiers die for a foreign cause ?

these al saud worshiping hardliner Islamists in Pakistan are a bunch of freaks.

funny to see some of the comments here, I would otherwise have thought that any sane Pakistani would be outraged by such "warnings" coming from the sauds' lackeys, the emirates.

 

[TankMan]

I would otherwise have thought that any sane Pakistani would be outraged by such "warnings" coming from the sauds' lackeys, the emirates.

We were outraged. But how long can one stay outraged? It has been a week since they said that. Anyway, It's best to take politics without emotions and outrage is an emotion.

Pakistani forces won't fight in Yemen, no matter what the Arabs say.

 

[gau8av]

We were outraged. But how long can one stay outraged? It has been a week since they said that. Anyway, It's best to take politics without emotions and outrage is an emotion.

ok, fair enough but I was making a bigger point, that a non, or as less as can be 'intervention' in Yemen would be in Pakistan's own interest.

Hassan Nisar saab seems to be arguing the same point very passionately.

Pakistani forces won't fight in Yemen, no matter what the Arabs say.

good to hear, and I hope that's exactly how it pans out.

and since we're at it.. how do you feel about the Saudi obsessed Islamist hardliners in Pakistan who view this whole Yemen shebang as some sort of prophetic end times 'pure' Islam vs the non believer deviant sect and other kaffir holy war ?

there's a few on this forum btw

 

[TankMan]

ok, fair enough but I was making a bigger point, that a non, or as less as can be 'intervention' in Yemen would be in Pakistan's own interest.

Hassan Nisar saab seems to be arguing the same point very passionately.

Pakistani forces are already in Saudi Arabia to help protect their borders, yes I agree with your point that intervening but with as less as possible loss of life would be in Pakistan's interest. That is precisely why the Parliamentary resolution included a clause about the protection of Saudi sovereignty.

good to hear, and I hope that's exactly how it pans out.

That's how it'll most likely work out - the public opinion is strongly against such an intervention and the military doesn't want to do it either because, while they can afford to divert some squadrons or soldiers, they can't afford to divert the attention of the top brass; especially while Zarb-e-Azb and other internal security measures are being taken.

and since we're at it.. how do you feel about the Saudi obsessed Islamist hardliners in Pakistan who view this whole Yemen shebang as some sort of prophetic end times 'pure' Islam vs the non believer deviant sect and other kaffir holy war ?

Well, mullahs will be mullahs. They fail to realize that the conflict is purely political even though it is clear as the Houthis have many Sunni allies while the Yemeni government has many Shia allies. Or, they realize it very well but have been told by their Arab sponsors to try and change public opinion.

I am sure that it has nothing to do with any Islamic prophecies.

The Pakistani public is very strongly against being involved in any other wars but the mullahs know the only thing that will change that opinion is a threat to the Holy sites in Makkah and Madinah - so now the mullahs are trying to make it look like the Houthis are somehow trying to destroy those places.

Thankfully, the public isn't buying it. The media has also remarkably handled it very well and I have seen mostly responsible discussions on talk shows and analyses etc. Even more remarkably, the parliament's decision matches public opinion perfectly. Personally I don't think we have anything to worry about with regards to this, but like the adage goes, hope for the best but expect the worst.

 

[moisrar47]

totally not agree with this

 

[halupridol]

An Indian uploaded the video, obviously he'll twist the wording to make it look like something else.

yes!.obviously indeed

="TankMan, post: 7064046, member: 161069"]Pakistan will stay neutral in the conflict but will help protect Saudi borders if necessary.

yes,,,,,obviously thats what being neutral means.

then why should we Pakistanis drive ourselves crazy trying to 'return to our roots' and look for 'indigenous heroes'??

well

 

[TankMan]

yes,,,,,obviously thats what being neutral means.

According to the Fifth Hague Convention, yes.
Hague Convention (V) Respecting the Rights and Duties ofNeutral Powers and Persons in Case of War on Land
Pakistan is not breaking any of those rules by vowing to help defend Saudi borders in case of a threat to their territorial integrity.

 

[halupridol]

According to the Fifth Hague Convention, yes.
Hague Convention (V) Respecting the Rights and Duties ofNeutral Powers and Persons in Case of War on Land
Pakistan is not breaking any of those rules by vowing to help defend Saudi borders in case of a threat to their territorial integrity.

i agree,,PA is there to defend Saudi territorial integrity being threatened by houthies,,,obviously.

 

[TankMan]

i agree,,PA is there to defend Saudi territorial integrity being threatened by houthies,,,obviously.

IN CASE it is threatened. The Houthis have already shot up a border post and killed three Saudi soldiers. They actually can attempt an insurgency within Saudi borders and that will be a problem for the Saudis that Pakistan can help solve because of the PA's experience in counter-insurgency.
Deaths as Houthi rebels in Yemen attack Saudi border - Al Jazeera English