Has NRO only become our destiny?

[Farah Sohail]

@Farah Sohail If you can remember from past, Iftekhar Chaudry was targeting just PPPP. About 99% cases were just against PP. Obviously there were clear reasons.
Now we see all kinds of actions against MQM, some against PP, but even after coming their names in multiple open corruptions, we can't see any action against Noon. There are just words. What can we call it ? NRO ?

NAZI party has already decided before coming into power that they would be no more elections in Germany and they only would reamine in power of Third Reich. Scenario is same in Pakistan, but with different measures. By not allowing thumb impression, fake registered voters, with Police and Judiciary in their pockets, who else than Army remains there to do something ? Is there any electoral way left to defeat them ? They have closed all the doors of their defeat in elections, either with power or with looted money.
These PTIian on roads would be crushed like insects with ruthless power. Someone must has to wake up.

Totally agree with you.... our establishment gives excuse..tht people don't want change..then what can we do?. how are people supposed to bring change, when all instituitions are in the pocket of Nawaz league?.. no one is ready to tell tht

 

[The Eagle]

I must ask a question... Are we destined as a nation, to get NRO only? Has it become our destiny? Do we really deserve this only? Why is it tht everytime theres a public agitation...our government ministers secretly meet army chief, and strike a deal? Andthen all over? Before I proceed further.. I should repaste here, an ISPR press release, from April this yr

Dated: April 19, 2016
No PR139/2016-ISPR
Rawalpindi - April 19, 2016:
General Raheel Sharif, Chief of Army Staff visited Signal Regimental Centre Kohat today. At an installation ceremony COAS pinned the badges of rank on the shoulders of Major General Sohail Ahmed Zaidi, Singnal-in-Chief to formally install him Colonel Commandant of Corps of Signal. Interacting with officers, men and families of Shuhada COAS commended the extra ordinary efforts of ranks of signals Corps in providing communication support to Op Zarb-e-Azb. He also appreciated the sacrifices rendered both by men in uniform and civilians alike in defeating the terrorists and dislodging them from their bases. COAS further said, on going war against terrorism and extremism being fought with the backing of entire nation can not bring enduring peace and stability unless the menace of corruption is not uprooted. Therefore, across the board accountability is necessary for the solidarity, integrity and prosperity of Pakistan. Pakistan Armed Forces will fully support every meaningful effort in that direction, which would ensure a better future for our next generations.

Now the press release i pasted, is from Arpil this year... Now we must ask Gen RaheelSharif. respectfully..Sir where is tht support.? U said, Pak armynwill support every effort for across the board accountability...so were they mere words only? And u didnt mean tht? Were they only for public posturing only? Becausesurely your words havent followed any action...

Its clear from meeting last night of army chief, Shehbaz Sharif, and Ch Nisar, tht a deal has struck between govt and Army... Why do i say this ? Because, uptil day ago, Gen Amjad Shoaib, who is obviously very well informed, said on tv, tht i know for a fact..tht army has given 4 names to the government related to dawn issue..in a meeting, after corps comm conference...... But now everyone related to media says...tht yesterday, army chief has given two names...the names according to Fereeha idrees ...one is Parvez rasheed, and other is Rao Tehseen.... So whoever, the other two were, have been spared by the army, and ofcourse the real masterminds, PM Nawaz and his princess have obviously been spared for treason... What lollipops were given, to army, we dont know yet

Also, after yesterday's meeting..crackdown on PTI also started...why only after yesterday's meeting..crackdown started? What gave government tht confidence? Imran khan house arrested...So i want to ask...will we ever be able to free ourselves from the clutches of NRO? Will everytime, the same cycle is going to repeat? One meeting of Ch Nisar and Shahbaz Sharif, with army chief, and then game over..

I am sooo soo dsiappointed right now

@Rashid Mahmood @The Eagle @Verve @PakSword @!eon @war&peace

And please mods, dont delete this thread...

I have been saying this and would like to repeat again that PMLn is working day night to push Army for take over so the corrupt lot can be called political martyr on behest of their own hatred against Military. @Rashid Mahmood Sir has summed up very well. Army is not going to intervene but on other hand no discount or escape for any traitor so it is a message that the past is past and now they have to face whatever is coming because of their own actions.

There are deliberate attempts to create a hype and to divert the focus from real issues hence all misleading and provoking statements and actions however, the change is to be brought by the People themselves and it is not the job of Army at all so people has to strive for better future rather than waiting for miracles to happen and angels to come.

Don't fall for what PMLn is hell bent to do so and buy what they sell but strive for the change through civilian ways however, Military is not compromising at any level against the security of the nation but the job of political has to be done by the people. Noonees are aware what's coming hence all desperate and provocative moves so that can create a vacuum and can have a breathing space that once again would be able to mislead the people and blind supporters. Hope the best may happen and I am sure, it is going to happen once for all.

 

[Verve]

Sir this is nothing but window dressing ... Sir have your ever worked with beaurcracy ? If not then you cant understand how smart they are in making other fools ...

My just one question ... Is there any one instance of check mate ? There were various occasions where SC could have done that ... But they didnt ... Dont remember IC .. Apparently he send home sitting PM ... In actual PM move was just like sacrificing pawn in order to safe repo ..

Devil worshippers also think they'll get away it all but do they? According to Allah, they do not.

Something will break eventually. If all was so easy and good for Nawaz, he would be sitting pretty right now but he's clearly not.

All it would take is a moment of sanity or insanity by SC judges to pass the judgement against Nawaz and Co. We just don't know who Allah will make do what He wants to.

 

[El_Swordsmen]

The last night meeting with the COAS was about the article in DAWN.
The 3 goons wanted to present 2 escape goats to the Chief, but only on paper. COAS didn't agree. No lollipops were accepted.

It had nothing to do with the crackdown against PTI. This is all being done by the PMLN govt.
There will be no NRO this time. I am sure about it.

So just don't jump the gun as yet.

Do you want the Army to just take over. This is what PMLN wants, but they will not get it this time.

"So i want to ask...will we ever be able to free ourselves from the clutches of NRO?"

Only if we come out and protest as a nation, if we keep sitting in our sofa's and wait to for someone to clean our own mess, then that ain't happening.

”بادشاہوں اور حکمرانوں کے ساتھ سب سے بڑا مسئلہ یہ پیش آتا ہے کہ وہ اپنے درباریوں اور خوشامدی ساتھیوں کے جلو میں گھر کر ملک و قوم میں برپا اضطراب نہیں دیکھ پاتے۔ ملک میں چپے چپے پر مایوسی اور نفرت رقصاں اور پورا سماج لاوے کے مانند کھول رہا ہوتا ہے، مگر عین اس وقت حکمران کے ساتھی اپنی دانست میں اپوزیشن کو شکست فاش دے کرفتح عظیم کے گیت گاتے نظر آئیں گے۔ ہر حاکم اپنے گرد آہنی فصیلیں قائم کرکے اپنی حکومت کو محفوظ اور دیرپا سمجھتا ہے۔ اس سے بےخبر کہ وہ فصیلیں کب کی زنگ آلود ہوچکیں۔ پھر ایک دن اچانک فصلیں مسمار ہو جانے پر حکمران کا واسطہ غیض وغضب سے بھرے عوام سے پڑتا ہے۔ اس وقت ذلت آمیز پسپائی اور رسوا کن شکست کے سوا کوئی راستہ باقی نہیں رہتا۔ کاش کہ حکمران پہلے یہ راز جان سکیں۔“
​

The public is asking the army to take over. But it is Too early to ask for that. The entire move of the government is to create an environment of chaos to suck the army in. If you critically notice, the only survival of the N gang is to escape from Pakistan to cover up their corruption. This is now only possible if the military takes over. If they runaways otherwise, it would be their political and dynastic Waterloo. But if the army takes over, their escape becomes a forced push out and becomes legitimate.

This is a very serious matter for the armed forces who have been very patiently bearing with the idiosyncrasies of this nasty gang. The only option left with the army is to keep their cool till the end. The Noons are now playing with the lives of the people of Pakistan. They are playing with the security of Pakistan. They are poking their nose into extremely sensitive internal matters of the Army, Judiciary and other political parties. They are doing everything possible to ignite the armed forces and ask them to retaliate and take over.

Having said that, please note that even the inner circles of the N are getting ready for an in house change. The N people are a bunch of Lootas, most of them were with almost all the previous regimes. Now the situation is that, NS and Co have to leave the country immediately by hook or by crook to avoid a legal crackdown on the corruption cases. This will leave the party in the hands of those who are very likely to over throw the N crown forever. This great escape of N family will end the dynastic rule of Shareefs for ever. This is very clear to NS that if he escaped without the army take over, it will mark the end of their kingship. Thus, they are not leaving any stone unturned to get the army in to provide them a safe exit.

Remember, we the people of Pakistan must help the army in keeping the policy of cool head going. Don't get impatient please. Just watch the moves. IK is teasing them, if he comes to Isb, the judiciary will have to hurry up and get the PM and family down. The Panama gate is a simple enough scandal for the court to order an arrest of the Ns. However in many other ways IK's move if turned into chaos, may merit a military intervention to stop the clash. More deaths of innocent people would be planned to create a state of emergency in the country to ask for the army to take over. Which is not going to happen even then. However Ns are determined to convert every opportunity into a reason for an army take over.

well said Sir,
the problem with NS is that he lives in a delusion that if military takeover happens, people will come out in support of democracy just like in Turkey, what he don't realize is that people will come out but in support of military & to distribute sweets. I strongly agree that military should keep calm & avoid takeover as much as possible. This corrupt dynasty will try every thing to provoke military & to become "political martyrs" once again.

 

[Farah Sohail]

There are deliberate attempts to create a hype and to divert the focus from real issues hence all misleading and provoking statements and actions however, the change is to be brought by the People themselves and it is not the job of Army at all so people has to strive for better future rather than waiting for miracles to happen and angels to come.
.

@bold...Please...I am desperate to find an answer ..but no body is giving me a satisfactory answer for tht.. I can agree with you, others and what Sir Rashid Mehmood said..but just give me an answer...and I will relax..

how are people supposed to bring change themselves? please elaborate... in this electoral system..even.elections are rigged
I will again copy, what I said in another thread..we cant wait tht ..with time, people will grow mature and start electing better people, due to many reasons...First this rotten system is not producing good educated, sensible people.. People who a ruling have not even the least interest, in educating pakistanis.. Its in their interest, tht people remain the same and they continue to loot and plunder... So even in next 20 yrs, if this system is not changed, people will continue to elect nawaz, then zardari, then nawaz, and so again... Heck even elections are not fair.. So even if people want change, nawaz, zardari will continue to win through dhandli... And do we have this much time? Tht we can wait for next 10 yrs, tht things will automatically change for the better, in this system? where will Pakistan, economically be, in next 10 to 20 yrs, if the same system conitinues?

People have no power... We have no power to manipulate... What should i do, and my likes do, if we want to bring change? Just go around, and start firing...tht look..i have come here.. I want to change the whole system..and i will kill anyone who comes in my way? Should i go and start firing on national assembly, prime ministers house? Because other than this, this system isnt providing me any opportunity to bring change.

When people gather for protest, theres crackdown.. workers are arrested, leaders house arrested, roads are blocked, and when people cant gather...then establishment / army can conveniently give the excuse tht what can we do..when ppl don't want change...people will have to bring change themselves...what? is this system allowing people to bring change, themselves, in the first place?.

When insitituitions like, police, judiciary, Election commission, NAB, are in the pockets of Nawaz league..how do people bring change? I am curious to know...or just as I said..should go around and start firing on prime ministers house and national assembly and similar places? is this what is meant..by people bringing the change themselves?

 

[The Accountant]

Devil worshippers also think they'll get away it all but do they? According to Allah, they do not.

Something will break eventually. If all was so easy and good for Nawaz, he would be sitting pretty right now but he's clearly not.

All it would take is a moment of sanity or insanity by SC judges to pass the judgement against Nawaz and Co. We just don't know who Allah will make do what He wants to.

Agreed, but Allah don't help those who don't help themselves ... Looking at judiciary for doing something is not right ,,, I think decisions will be taken on streets ...

 

[Shah01]

how are people supposed to bring change themselves? please elaborate... in this electoral system..even.elections are rigged

What change do you want?
Electoral system could do with a reform but how do you change people's perception? I have explained this many times on this forum that people follow their cast/chaudary/family to vote. So the whole household/cast/village will vote for xyz if the head said so..... This will only change with education and awareness. Urbanization will have a major affect on this too.
The next step is devolution of power (Councils etc) which Mushy did and that is a must to make the system fair.

Because other than this, this system isnt providing me any opportunity to bring change.

One has to create opportunities........ What opportunities do you want?

 

[Verve]

Agreed, but Allah don't help those who don't help themselves ... Looking at judiciary for doing something is not right ,,, I think decisions will be taken on streets ...

Was there a revolt in Mecca during Quresh era?

Allah will do what Allah wants to and He will use anyone He wants.

Decisions on streets will lead to bloodshed and possible civil war or public executions of these Noonees (like the French revolution). Maybe that'd be Allah's will that more blood is required to teach us a severe lesson in getting rid of Pakistan from these wrong doers once and for all and to be never returned again.

 

[The Accountant]

Was there a revolt in Mecca during Quresh era?

Allah will do what Allah wants to and He will use anyone He wants.

Decisions on streets will lead to bloodshed and possible civil war or public executions of these Noonees (like the French revolution). Maybe that'd be Allah's will that more blood is required to teach us a severe lesson in getting rid of Pakistan from these wrong doers once and for all and to be never returned again.

Sir that was Allah's house .. Allah protected that ...

You don't remember Badar, Uhud ???

Our beloved prophet SAW had to shed his blood as well ... So if are saying that system will auto-correct itself then you are just living in fools paradise,,, somebody has to take the pain,, yes there will be bloodshed ,, yes there will be chaos,,, but to get something you have to loose something ,,,

Anyways it is too early for French revoultion type of something ,,, IK is not as pious (although he is much much better than existing but still his team is also of opportunitists) further,, Army as an institution is still very strong to stop any such chaos ...

This all is being done to undermine the armed forces so that the only united institute in Pakistan gets destroyed and we became another Iraq ...

Anyways,,, nothing will happen if you don't step up yourself

 

[The Eagle]

@bold...Please...I am desperate to find an answer ..but no body is giving me a satisfactory answer for tht.. I can agree with you, others and what Sir Rashid Mehmood said..but just give me an answer...and I will relax..

how are people supposed to bring change themselves? please elaborate... in this electoral system..even.elections are rigged
I will again copy, what I said in another thread..we cant wait tht ..with time, people will grow mature and start electing better people, due to many reasons...First this rotten system is not producing good educated, sensible people.. People who a ruling have not even the least interest, in educating pakistanis.. Its in their interest, tht people remain the same and they continue to loot and plunder... So even in next 20 yrs, if this system is not changed, people will continue to elect nawaz, then zardari, then nawaz, and so again... Heck even elections are not fair.. So even if people want change, nawaz, zardari will continue to win through dhandli... And do we have this much time? Tht we can wait for next 10 yrs, tht things will automatically change for the better, in this system? where will Pakistan, economically be, in next 10 to 20 yrs, if the same system conitinues?

People have no power... We have no power to manipulate... What should i do, and my likes do, if we want to bring change? Just go around, and start firing...tht look..i have come here.. I want to change the whole system..and i will kill anyone who comes in my way? Should i go and start firing on national assembly, prime ministers house? Because other than this, this system isnt providing me any opportunity to bring change.

When people gather for protest, theres crackdown.. workers are arrested, leaders house arrested, roads are blocked, and when people cant gather...then establishment / army can conveniently give the excuse tht what can we do..when ppl don't want change...people will have to bring change themselves...what? is this system allowing people to bring change, themselves, in the first place?.

When insitituitions like, police, judiciary, Election commission, NAB, are in the pockets of Nawaz league..how do people bring change? I am curious to know...or just as I said..should go around and start firing on prime ministers house and national assembly and similar places? is this what is meant..by people bringing the change themselves?

You mean information with respect to seeking for an answer then, the information for the public is already available in domain and rest are not be shared and I can't.

People don't need to go out how you stated but need to elect the lawmakers fir the change in system or need to boycott such rigged elections so the message will be delivered but the irony is, people still vote the same lot rather to boycott and start to complain and ask Military to intervene.

We need to educate people firstly about the power of their vote and who to vote and that can be done starting from home and so on.

 

[Zibago]

So bismillah ji jitney ziyada pakwaan utni achi dawat

 

[Farah Sohail]

You mean information with respect to seeking for an answer then, the information for the public is already available in domain and rest are not be shared and I can't.

People don't need to go out how you stated but need to elect the lawmakers fir the change in system or need to boycott such rigged elections so the message will be delivered but the irony is, people still vote the same lot rather to boycott and start to complain and ask Military to intervene.

We need to educate people firstly about the power of their vote and who to vote and that can be done starting from home and so on.

I already responded abt .educating people and about electing better people in my post...tht the current system doesn't allow us, even tht...majority of ppl are illiterate, and uneducated without a mind of their own.. why? because..the current system doesn't want to produce educated and sensible Pakistanis..its not even the last priority of our ruling elite, tht ppl get educated and become literate, and know their rights....whose responsibility is to give quality education, country wide and reduce illiteracy? the govt... but they will never do it...because its in their interest tht people remain the same...so tht they can continue to loot and plunder...

vote for better lawmakers? how? elections are rigged... election commission, NAB, FIA, judiciary are in their pockets

boycott? so thts the solution.. who doesn't know tht majority of ppl in occupied Kashmir, want freedom from India..heck even they vote... so only boycotting elections will be a signal tht ppl want change? so do we assume, tht ppl in occupied Kashmir are satisfied with the system, they live in, just because they take part in elections?

and even if we focus on what u said like educating ppl and all..it will still not take less than good 10-20 yrs, IF any change can still come through tht... because I believe tht change cant come even, in next 20 yrs also under the current system, because of the reasons, I mentioned...

 

[Verve]

Sir that was Allah's house .. Allah protected that ...

You don't remember Badar, Uhud ???

Our beloved prophet SAW had to shed his blood as well ... So if are saying that system will auto-correct itself then you are just living in fools paradise,,, somebody has to take the pain,, yes there will be bloodshed ,, yes there will be chaos,,, but to get something you have to loose something ,,,

Anyways it is too early for French revoultion type of something ,,, IK is not as pious (although he is much much better than existing but still his team is also of opportunitists) further,, Army as an institution is still very strong to stop any such chaos ...

This all is being done to undermine the armed forces so that the only united institute in Pakistan gets destroyed and we became another Iraq ...

Anyways,,, nothing will happen if you don't step up yourself

This system will never auto-correct. A major intervention is required but I don't think that removing Nawaz should be done by the Army. There's a slim chance that SC will do it, but a chance nonetheless.

Once Nawaz is out and in-fighting breaks in all political ranks, then I think the Army should step in and implement an interim system that cleans up and resets the country in 5-10yrs and designs a new system for longer term.

Getting Nawaz out of PM seat and Shahbaz out of CM seat is critical. Zardari is as good as dead anyways as he has no presidential protection anymore.

Let there be blood - even mine - if it brings about a change for good in Pakistan

 

[SBD-3]

Army has her inherent interests. Dharna I seemed to be a cover up for Mushi's escape and Dharna II (Wanabe) seems like a cover to push government on Dawn leak. Baqi COAS can't do anything on his own. CCs share power with him now. Well a bad day for worshipers, the idol turns out to be a humanoid. Army has been intervening for almost half of our national history and always ends up breeding the same "corrupt" leadership. Btw I do honestly believe that had Quaid e Azam lived for 5-6 more years, he would have also been ousted by the Army branding him "corrupt" Army has alot of interest to look after, political interests, media interests, business interests and national interests. Which comes first is really a dubious debate. The beauty is that they can take the corrupt and brand him clean and the using him as a puppet.

 

[Zarvan]

I must ask a question... Are we destined as a nation, to get NRO only? Has it become our destiny? Do we really deserve this only? Why is it tht everytime theres a public agitation...our government ministers secretly meet army chief, and strike a deal? Andthen all over? Before I proceed further.. I should repaste here, an ISPR press release, from April this yr

Dated: April 19, 2016
No PR139/2016-ISPR
Rawalpindi - April 19, 2016:
General Raheel Sharif, Chief of Army Staff visited Signal Regimental Centre Kohat today. At an installation ceremony COAS pinned the badges of rank on the shoulders of Major General Sohail Ahmed Zaidi, Singnal-in-Chief to formally install him Colonel Commandant of Corps of Signal. Interacting with officers, men and families of Shuhada COAS commended the extra ordinary efforts of ranks of signals Corps in providing communication support to Op Zarb-e-Azb. He also appreciated the sacrifices rendered both by men in uniform and civilians alike in defeating the terrorists and dislodging them from their bases. COAS further said, on going war against terrorism and extremism being fought with the backing of entire nation can not bring enduring peace and stability unless the menace of corruption is not uprooted. Therefore, across the board accountability is necessary for the solidarity, integrity and prosperity of Pakistan. Pakistan Armed Forces will fully support every meaningful effort in that direction, which would ensure a better future for our next generations.

Now the press release i pasted, is from Arpil this year... Now we must ask Gen RaheelSharif. respectfully..Sir where is tht support.? U said, Pak armynwill support every effort for across the board accountability...so were they mere words only? And u didnt mean tht? Were they only for public posturing only? Becausesurely your words havent followed any action...

Its clear from meeting last night of army chief, Shehbaz Sharif, and Ch Nisar, tht a deal has struck between govt and Army... Why do i say this ? Because, uptil day ago, Gen Amjad Shoaib, who is obviously very well informed, said on tv, tht i know for a fact..tht army has given 4 names to the government related to dawn issue..in a meeting, after corps comm conference...... But now everyone related to media says...tht yesterday, army chief has given two names...the names according to Fereeha idrees ...one is Parvez rasheed, and other is Rao Tehseen.... So whoever, the other two were, have been spared by the army, and ofcourse the real masterminds, PM Nawaz and his princess have obviously been spared for treason... What lollipops were given, to army, we dont know yet

Also, after yesterday's meeting..crackdown on PTI also started...why only after yesterday's meeting..crackdown started? What gave government tht confidence? Imran khan house arrested...So i want to ask...will we ever be able to free ourselves from the clutches of NRO? Will everytime, the same cycle is going to repeat? One meeting of Ch Nisar and Shahbaz Sharif, with army chief, and then game over..

I am sooo soo dsiappointed right now

@Rashid Mahmood @The Eagle @Verve @PakSword @!eon @war&peace

And please mods, dont delete this thread...

Those who don't understand these matters often end up writing these things. Army has sent clear message to Nawaz than they don't trust him until he fires the person responsible for feeding that false story to media. He has also been warned not to appoint next Army Chief until its done. As for political situation well Army is trying to remain neutral but I think they won't be able to do it for long.