German made Dolphin Subs, Israeli Popeye Turbo and Indian Nirbhay Missiles.

[Major Shaitan Singh]

Estimated comparative size of Popeye Turbo.

Israel's Dolphin submarine (HDW 214 derivative). Are India and Israel jointly developing Nirbhay/Popeye Turbo submarine jet powered cruise missiles for both countries' submarine fleets?
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Germany's Der Spiegel weekly news magazine has receently published a report that some German officials (presumably including engineers and technicians) have known for many years that the Dolphin, (HDW 214 submarines Germany has sold and sometimes given to Israel) are nuclear weapon capable or even electronically designed to accommodate nuclear tipped missiles. see Germany sells Israel nuke-ready submarines - report — RT of 3 June 2012.
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It has been suspected for at least 10 years that the US sourced Harpoon missiles used in Israel's submarines have been fitted with Israeli made nuclear warheads. Hence Israel having nuclear warheads for sea launched purposes is not new - what is news is how much their weapon suppliers know about it. Are Israel's suppliers aiding and abetting nuclear weapon proliferation?

While the US of course has nuclear weapon knowledge to what extent does Germany? For decades under NATO provisions the US has been permitted to supply nuclear missile warheads and B61 freefall bombs to German units in times of war. The NATO arrangements were of course declared and Treaty level. German technical knowledge gained through supplying an undeclared, Non-NPT, nuclear armed Israel, is of course different - but how different?

Is HDW supplying hydraulic ejection systems that enable the ("cold") underwater launch of Popeye Turbo SLCM missiles an act of nuclear proliferation? If the Popeye Turbo's are used for land attack, particularly against countries considered nuclear capable or close to it (like Iran) it can very easily be assumed that the Popeye Turbo would carry a weapon equivalent to what the target-enemy has - which is nuclear. Does this chain of logic automatically place blame on Germany's HDW and German defence officials (including German Defence or Naval Attaches in Israel)?

For the US and Germany the issue is how much do they know about the use by Israel of nuclear warheads on US missiles and in German built submarines. Has the Dolphin Class combat system (sensors, targetting computers and (arming/fusing?) weapon systems) been built by Germany to intentionally accommodate electronic equipment for nuclear warheads? Or is the German equipment warhead explosive neutral with reliance placed on Israeli engineers and technicians modifying the HDW combat systems for nuclear use.

Also is the Popeye Turbo (a jet powered cruise missile) the only missile in question or are German officials (and engineers) conscious of other Israeli nuclear weapons launched by (or under development for) the Dolphin Subs? Other weapons could include torpedo tube lauched small ballistic missiles or nuclear tipped torpedoes (possibly used for port demolition).

Nirbhay - Popeye Turbo SLCM
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On the "new" missile front the Indian Nirbhay cruise missile (Wiki) was tested recently. See another Nirbhay reference here. When I heard about Nirbhay I recalled a mysterious Indian-Israeli missile test south of Sri Lanka a few years back - and thought an Indian-Isreali (Rafael) Popeye Turbo SLCM was possible - Popeye (missile) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia . Israel, after all, cannot conduct the necessary over water missile tests in the Mediterranean, Red Sea or Arabian Sea, off Iran. India has a great deal of sea space for testing.
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Israeli Dolphin Subs Armed with Nirbhay/Popeye Cruise and K-15 Ballistic Missiles?
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If the Popeye Turbo (like Nirbhay) has a diameter of 520-533 mm Popeye-Turbo would fit into the smaller torpedo tubes (533mm) of Israel's Dolphin Class (HDW 214) subs. This leaves use of the Dolphin's larger 650mm tubes as a mystery - perhaps as a pressure chamber to "launch" Israeli "Seal" divers and even a small diametre version of the a notionally Indian designed K-15 ballistic missile.

 

[Shatterpoint]

Wow this is great news, India has so many friends around the world and everyone is benefiting, Indian scientist and engineers are starting to make their mark around the world. German and Israeli tech and Indian engineering skills, a very powerful combination.

 

[Abingdonboy]

It's interesting how this news keeps popping up from time to time. It certainly suggests there is truth to it.

 

[Dash]

I am not able to understand what the article is trying to prove.
Is it that Nirbhay is based on Israeli design?

 

[Abingdonboy]

I am not able to understand what the article is trying to prove.
Is it that Nirbhay is based on Israeli design?

Not really, more that India and Israel are working on a sub-launched version of the Nibhay CM.

 

[ptltejas]

Nirbhay - Popeye Turbo SLCM
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On the "new" missile front the Indian Nirbhay cruise missile (Wiki) was tested recently. See another Nirbhay reference here. When I heard about Nirbhay I recalled a mysterious Indian-Israeli missile test south of Sri Lanka a few years back - and thought an Indian-Isreali (Rafael) Popeye Turbo SLCM was possible - Popeye (missile) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia . Israel, after all, cannot conduct the necessary over water missile tests in the Mediterranean, Red Sea or Arabian Sea, off Iran. India has a great deal of sea space for testing.
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whether bolded part is trueeeeeeeeee???????????

 

[perplexed]

Not really, more that India and Israel are working on a sub-launched version of the Nibhay CM.

holy cow... and what's the touted range of it ? If upwards of 1500 kms then it would be a game changer for the region :woot;

 

[Dash]

Not really, more that India and Israel are working on a sub-launched version of the Nibhay CM.

Its not hard to believe but I think when we can build a supersonic missile, for subsonic missile we should have the tech to make it alone. but it might be true.

 

[sancho]

I am not able to understand what the article is trying to prove.
Is it that Nirbhay is based on Israeli design?

It's not an article, but an estimation of Major Shaitan Singh I think, because the article he linked, is not the same he posted: Germany sells Israel nuke-ready submarines - report — RT

There is actually no base to believe that there is any link between Israel to Nirbhay development, nor of India to the Israeli cruise missiles with nuclear war heads. Israel don't need Nirbhay development, since they are way ahead of us in the missile field, while we don't need a torpedotube launched Nirbhay, with a small nuclear warhead when we have INS Arihant and will have even more capable SSBNs. For Isreal it might make some sense to have such a limited range weapon as 2nd strike option, for India it doesn't.