Does India really need Russia’s ‘Backfire’ bomber?

[[Bregs]]

Thats last line is the key message.. Bcz with aerial refuelling.. The range and reach is pretty clear what we are trying to convey.. In a way we are securing our Sea Lines of Communication. But the big question is are really going to buy it or keep this pot boiling for 3-4 years and use that propaganda tool to hedge our strategy

we do need these planes because padosiyon ke pankh bahut lambe ho gai hain

 

[T90TankGuy]

Thats last line is the key message.. Bcz with aerial refuelling.. The range and reach is pretty clear what we are trying to convey.. In a way we are securing our Sea Lines of Communication. But the big question is are really going to buy it or keep this pot boiling for 3-4 years and use that propaganda tool to hedge our strategy

Unless we get something updated(the jaguars for maritime strike role) are old, and yes we do need something to keep that sole carrier to the east at bay . This makes sense , plus we have had these birds for a while now(i cant confirm as i heard about it from an old colleague)
Though we do have time , it will take the Chinese at least a decade before their carrier is ready , they still need to refine(formulate) tactics and operations , after all its the first carrier.

 

[jha]

Thanks for tagging ..

IN going for these does make sense. We definitely need a plane with huge payload and long range for IN. I have always hoped for couple of Squads of Maritime version of SU-34.. Backfires are even better.

With "300 Km" ranged Brahmos, I am sure this will send required signals to desired audience. 4 is too low a number. However probably Russians are not ready to sell more.

 

[Hellfire]

Yes India also need A few squadrons Of F-22 raptor along with F-35 naval version. 36 Rafales from France and A made in India fighter jet STUNT..... India also has eyes on SU-34 Bomber along with this one and PAK-FA is also coming soon.

If you cant post anything sensible, can your nonsense

Thanks.

@PARIKRAMA give him a Red .. I cant, or I would have.

Four is not enough. 12 is a better number, equally based on both coasts. It could be used to launch ALCMs, anti-ship missiles, and, most important, nuclear weapons. It will give India the strategic depth it needs against both China and Pakistan.

Elaborate please. Thanks

chinese new base in SCS is 2100km from andaman islands & they can target it using long range bombers in future...we need a counter to keep or sink enemy casino in SCS & not in IOR so yes we need them

I missed this .. what?

First you try to pay $ 700 millions for F 16s.then talk about others !!

Dont feed a troll.

You are warned after corrections.

Dont feed a retard.

to many colours pari...........
and no they wont be getting the tu-22m3's too "potentail" adversarieswont be to happy
also this being a strategic bomber i would assume you can only carry mtcr compliant missies
like on the russain nuclear sub being leased to india ,and that being 300km max.

so wont the adversary see the tu22m like a sore thumb on its radar display even at 300km?

Its a speculative blog. Thats all.

Good article . Thank you for the share n tag .

Navy already had Tu 142 in small numbers. As the need for that also questioned , it was a part of navy .

So , I think that this one too will be with Navy but in a small quantity .

Tu-142s are being phased out or are out for all practical purposes. Only IL-38s were upgraded. So, no.

@PARIKRAMA A speculative blog at best. Makes no sense to buy these as the issue of spares is a serious one. as also it is not required under the limited mandate given to the IN and/or IAF.

IN has been mandated to secure IOR with the so called flag showing in SCS with ability to enforce own freedom of navigation in the said area if situation demands it. Beyond that, the GoI has not mandated any policy or political directive to control and secure the SLOCs into Pacific and across western seaboard of Africa yet.

We are relying on a combination of understanding with US, Australia, Japan and other like minded countries as also under the loose understanding with PSI for the same.

 

[Techy]

@PARIKRAMA Bro, Whether India need these air-crafts or not is a matter of Naval planner's domain but as an Naval enthusiast, I would always like to have them in inventory purely bcz of their capability (There are multiple whispers about 4 Backfires offered as lease since 1999 (Vajpeyee era) and some even suggesting contract being signed secretly ).

In time of conflict, these beauties armed with Brahmos or standard kh-22 can be really handy if say escorted by MIG-29Ks providing cover from nearest CBG deployed in vicinity somewhere .


google translation from a Russian Article:

The flight path of missile Kh-22

After throwing (1) shot Kh-22 saddle-about 100 m. Mixing the two components in the combustion chamber of the engine self-ignition occurred. Following an increase in tension at 81 kN (2) went into a climb. The first stage engine burned (3) and shot an excess rate climbed to 22,500 meters where she autopilot transferred to horizontal flight (4).

After the flight chamber ignition engine with a thrust of 5.7 kN shot velocity of 3.44 M continued to target. Objective was monitored active radar head in a horizontal plane and vertical plane. Shot maneuvered so that it was in its longitudinal axis autopilot and maintain a constant height. The moment deflection radar antenna has reached the limit downward deflection (5), transferred autopilot shot into a dive at 30 and shut off the engine.

Heads conducted last flight path correction (6), for the last few hundred meters have already been flooding own reflected signal receiver so that the missile attack directly. When it was set to hit the cumulative effect of optical proximity lighter warhead approximately 8 m above the target (7).
Nuclear warhead variants later introduced PSI / A teed off, having made the desired distance, barometric lighter at a predetermined height above the target, or contact the lighter after hitting the target. When shooting at a maximum distance shot hit the goal in 6 minutes.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We can have similar approach with Brahmos with multiple flight profile. Imagine Couple of Backfires operating in battle theater with Brahmos and Kh-22 combo supported by Mig-29Ks armed with 2-3 Brahmos Mini each... a death knell
for enemy's Naval Armada for sure!!
A purely wishful thinking from enthusiastic point of view. Please feel free to correct/suggest regarding tactics if the plane is indeed in Indian Arsenal or rather going to join in near future.

 

[Local_Legend]

Tu-142s are being phased out or are out for all practical purposes. Only IL-38s were upgraded. So, no.

There were mixed reviews when they were introduced to IN Air Arm . Still they got in . I meant that .

India used to say No Thank you for many generous offers made by USSR followed by Russia.
This time , India shown interest . If reports are true , they will be in Tamilnadu .

 

[Hellfire]

There were mixed reviews when they were introduced to IN Air Arm . Still they got in . I meant that . .

We must get Tu-160 then. Up the ante!!

 

[Local_Legend]

We must get Tu-160 then. Up the ante!!

Are they offered or India shown interest ? Then why not ?

 

[ito]

Bombers are brutal. And they can bring enemies to knees so much faster.

Look at the destruction they do. They can create a fear in enemy's mind that can act as a barrier for enemy to start the war. Why does India wants? There can be many reasons ranging from power projection to Pakistan factor to Chinese factor.

 

[Param]

I am not aware of cost implications and if India can absorb these high cost planes at present moment.Also,with respect to sense of buying these offered models which are comparatively old,costly to maintain.It appears as this is Russia strategy to sell these strategic weapons to a safe buyer as India,just like nuclear submarines,and invest that money to build Yasen Class submarines and new bombers.

Also,from my personal point of view - 4 is enough,for it projects our capability yet doesn't take major proportion of our defense budget.

From strategic point of view,i think its an important purchase.Southern most part of Andaman&Nico Is is called Indira Point.Shipping lanes entering Malacca St and Singapore St pass just 50 nm south of this point.Commercial Shipping carrying cargo to and from South China Sea,which basically means all of ASEAN countries,Japan and part of Russia, pass through this narrow part.If you want to avoid Malacca St,you have to use Sunda St/Lombok St,etc.This will increase the route distance,increasing the cost of carriage.Thus no commercial shipping line uses these Indonesian St.

(1)China needs to protect its shipping line and will increase its strength in Indian Ocean.

(2) China has continued its policy of encircling India,whether its String of Pearls or Silk Route.Setting naval bases in Sri Lanka,Pakistan,Burma,Africa,etc.

(3) Its special interest is Andaman and Nicobar Islands.It has leased a Burmese island close to Andaman- Coco Islands.It has recently stated that legitimacy of India can be questioned on Andaman Islands.Chinese submarines are sighted very close to these islands,atleast every 3 months.It wanted to build a channel passing through a narrow part of Thailand(Kra Channel),thus avoiding Malacca St.If it would have been accepted by Thailand,then this shipping lane would have passed just few miles north of A&N Is.

(4) China has planned to build and deploy a fleet in Indian Ocean.

India can not match Chinese growth of its naval power,much less reduce the strength gap.A few of these Russian bombers,which can hit Chinese vessels in South China is hence required.For sooner or later,China is going to push India on A& N Islands and challenge India's right on it.And projection of capability by these bombers will be important at such time.I wish its range can be such that it gives us capability to hit Chinese vessels in SCS,where they feel more secured.Or we have a strategic partner,which will allow us to refuel.Not possible though!!

I am no defense expert but i feel more than naval ships,India should develop more silent n attack submarines, and build ASW capabilities.A submarine lurking somewhere deep down,silent and undetectable,can send scores of ships running for cover.

 

[Kraitcorp]

I am confused. Do we really have them or in the process of acquiring it? Because in wiki it say undisclosed operators as Indian navy with reference pointing to the book " Significance of Indo-Russian Relations in 21st Century"
https://books.google.com/books?id=pbRFIHhzf9cC&hl=en
I dont have access to the book.

 

[PARIKRAMA]

Suppose we acquire these birds hypothetically. Can the systems onboard these planes work in conjunction with Tu 142/ P8 for targeting enemy shipping?

@Abingdonboy - Can confirm about communication systems interlinking
as well as mission compatibility.. can they be directed and payload used in combined mission of all 3 platforms?

I am confused. Do we really have them or in the process of acquiring it? Because in wiki it say undisclosed operators as Indian navy with reference pointing to the book " Significance of Indo-Russian Relations in 21st Century"
https://books.google.com/books?id=pbRFIHhzf9cC&hl=en
I dont have access to the book.

page 130

In the search box type - Tu 22, it will direct you to page 130 and this page will show..

Hope it helps

 

[Hellfire]

@Abingdonboy - Can confirm about communication systems interlinking
as well as mission compatibility.. can they be directed and payload used in combined mission of all 3 platforms?

As far as I last recall, no. Where is @Abingdonboy hiding? He has started assuming proportions to Rajnikant ...... springing up when least expected otherwise not seen around...

But coming back ... Rukmini

 

[surya kiran]

A Tu22 with Nirbhay has a stand off range which is lethal.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Suppose we acquire these birds hypothetically. Can the systems onboard these planes work in conjunction with Tu 142/ P8 for targeting enemy shipping?

@Abingdonboy - Can confirm about communication systems interlinking
as well as mission compatibility.. can they be directed and payload used in combined mission of all 3 platforms?

The Tu-22 will be linked with every other IN asset for sure but whether the P-8 will be providing targeting data to the Tu-22 is not a technical question but rather an operational/tactical question. The occasions when a subsonic and relatively large asset such as a LRMPA will be in a position to safely provide target designation to the Tu-22 seem to be so rare as to be unimaginable in a real world scenerio.

This goes for the Tu-142/IL-38s too but they will be phased out in the next decade so it is fair to keep the P-8 at the centre of such an analysis.

A Tu22 with Nirbhay has a stand off range which is lethal.

If combined with the Brahmos, the Tu-22 will be a serious nightmare for enemy planners. HOWEVER, the utility of this platform will be rather curtailed once the Brahmos-M is in service and thus the ALCM variant more readily availble across multiple platforms (Rafale, MiG-29K and Mirage-2000).