Amazing planes that failed

[Sapper]

First of all tell me whats Faulty In the design of LCA??? Is it because its Indian, Is Your ego still refusing to Accept the ground reality that, it really flies

A few Flaws of LCA

It took HAL 20 years to finalize a Delta design, just enough time to find out that rest of the entire world has moved on to Delta-Canards. They are trying to fix this by using LEVCONs.

It also seems odd that HAL chose to build-up a Top mounted wing while all the rest of fighter manufacturing community uses bottom/mid mounted wings for aerodynamic efficiency, faster roll rates, and inherently unstable profile.

HAL made a lot of effort and successfully used huge amounts of composites (an expensive and difficult technology), but failed to set the goal of reduced RCS, which would have been the logical choice while choosing an all composite fighter skin.

LCA was supposed to be the main-stray fighter, the backbone that can do it all, a jack of all trades but master of none, a True Multi-Role platform. This was to complement the specialized air-superiority fighters and ground attack fighters. But as it turns out, the delta design with light wing loading are more suited for slash dash runs at high altitude, thus complimenting the already very promising fleet of air superiority Su30MKI and Mig29, while not catering to the fact that currently IAF lacks serious punch in CAS role as its fleet of Jaguars is getting older and need more emphasis for replacement rather than Su30MKI's.

Regards,
Sapper

 

[sergente rehan]

^^^ guys there is a difference in putting your flag on the moon

AND putting the moon on your flag, please understand this fact and stop TROLLING for heavens sake

For this you put a wheel on your flag!

 

[IndianRobo]

A few Flaws of LCA

It took HAL 20 years to finalize a Delta design, just enough time to find out that rest of the entire world has moved on to Delta-Canards. They are trying to fix this by using LEVCONs.

You are wrong in The very beginning,It took 7 years to Design and Finalize the Delta Wing Design , 1983-1990....and LEVCONS are for Navy which is a separate project...

It also seems odd that HAL chose to build-up a Top mounted wing while all the rest of fighter manufacturing community uses bottom/mid mounted wings for aerodynamic efficiency, faster roll rates, and inherently unstable profile.

The Tejas' aerodynamic configuration is based on a pure delta-wing layout with shoulder-mounted wings. Its control surfaces are all hydraulically actuated. The wing's outer leading edge incorporates three-section slats, while the inboard sections have additional slats to generate vortex lift over the inner wing and high-energy air-flow along the tail fin to enhance high-AoA stability and prevent departure from controlled flight. The wing trailing edge is occupied by two-segment elevons to provide pitch and yaw control. The only empennage-mounted control surfaces are the single-piece rudder and two airbrakes located in the upper rear part of the fuselage, one each on either side of the fin.The digital FBW system of the Tejas employs a powerful digital flight control computer

HAL made a lot of effort and successfully used huge amounts of composites (an expensive and difficult technology), but failed to set the goal of reduced RCS, which would have been the logical choice while choosing an all composite fighter skin.

Its Indeed Logical, Its RCS is too Low and Its Size is an Added advantage over that, Its Air Intakes have been further modified to give it additional stealth.

LCA was supposed to be the main-stray fighter, the backbone that can do it all, a jack of all trades but master of none, a True Multi-Role platform. This was to complement the specialized air-superiority fighters and ground attack fighters. But as it turns out, the delta design with light wing loading are more suited for slash dash runs at high altitude, thus complimenting the already very promising fleet of air superiority Su30MKI and Mig29, while not catering to the fact that currently IAF lacks serious punch in CAS role as its fleet of Jaguars is getting older and need more emphasis for replacement rather than Su30MKI's.

You are wrong, LCA was Just Intended to Replace the Mig 21, which was Not More than an Interceptor, The Flight controls of LCA tejas Were better than Mirage when it conducted its first Flight... 10 yrs and We could very well Imagine the Potentiality of this fighter, Yet again I would make it clear that, we have taken this to the Highest Airfields in Leh and Hot weather trials where it came out with Flying Colors, Keeping in Mind that the Best of the best fighters from MMRCA failed in Leh.... And To replace the Jaguar , we are designing AMCA , its a fighter bomber

Regards,
Sapper

Regards

IndianRobo

 

[Peregrine]

Way to go guys you have totally ruined a perfectly nice thread, Bravo!!

 

[PAFAce]

I just had to individually delete around 15 useless posts. It's a lot easier to just ban a guy, so keep that in mind when you write your next post here.

Also, 35% of NASA is Indian? Why don't they just rename it IASA? Before putting up stats like these, one must realize that 67% of all stats are made up.

 

[Haanzo]

For this you put a wheel on your flag!

probably the greatest invention of man after fire

 

[klimove]

the tiger Shark was offered to PAF in 1980z, some say, with ToT but still wisely enough PAF opted for a more potent F-16.


regards!

tiger shark f-20 was bvr capable while f-16 was not.if we had choosen that aircraft with tot. we would have more capable thunder.it was a wrong decision to have f-16 with restictions. perhaps paf forgot the f-104 who was in miserable condition due to lack of spares. the same situation faced f-16 in kargil.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

tiger shark f-20 was bvr capable while f-16 was not.if we had choosen that aircraft with tot. we would have more capable thunder.it was a wrong decision to have f-16 with restictions. perhaps paf forgot the f-104 who was in miserable condition due to lack of spares. the same situation faced f-16 in kargil.

Who says F-16s were not BVR capable?
Our F-16s had the capability to fire AMRAAMs but they were never released. Still it could fire Maverick AGM which is BVR.

 

[Safriz]

Minus the wings..
It could fly if it had the wings

 

[Penguin]

Who says F-16s were not BVR capable?
Our F-16s had the capability to fire AMRAAMs but they were never released. Still it could fire Maverick AGM which is BVR.

Early models could also be armed with up to six AIM-9 Sidewinder heat-seeking short-range air-to-air missiles (AAM), including a single missile mounted on a dedicated rail launcher on each wingtip. Some variants can also employ the AIM-7 Sparrow medium-range radar-guided AAM, and more recent versions can be equipped with the AIM-120 AMRAAM.

The F-16A/B was originally equipped with the Westinghouse AN/APG-66 fire-control radar. It has four operating frequencies within the X band, and provides four air-to-air and seven air-to-ground operating modes for combat, even at night or in bad weather. The Block 15’s APG-66(V)2 model added a new, more powerful signal processor, higher output power, improved reliability, and increased range in a clutter or jamming environments. The Mid-Life Update (MLU) program further upgrades this to the APG-66(V)2A model, which features higher speed and memory. Taiwan's Block 20 has APG-66(V)3 that added CW mode in order to guide AIM-7M initially sold to Taiwan in the US announced 1992 deal. The APG-66(V)3 radar already able to guide AMRAAM BVR missiles.

The AN/APG-68, an evolution of the APG-66, was introduced with the F-16C/D Block 25. The APG-68 has greater range and resolution, as well as 25 operating modes, including ground-mapping, Doppler beam-sharpening, ground moving target, sea target, and track-while-scan (TWS) for up to 10 targets. The Block 40/42’s APG-68(V)1 model added full compatibility with Lockheed Martin Low-Altitude Navigation and Targeting Infra-Red for Night (LANTIRN) pods, and a high-PRF pulse-Doppler track mode to provide continuous-wave (CW) target illumination for semi-active radar-homing (SARH) missiles like the AIM-7 Sparrow.

The PAF has been using F-16A and, more recently, the newer F-16C/D Block-52.

The most capable fighter in PAF service from 1983 to 2007 has been the F-16 Fighting Falcon: 40 of the F-16A/B Block 15 models were delivered from 1983 to 1987. Deliveries of another 28 F-16A/B were stopped after the 1990 arms embargo imposed on Pakistan under the Pressler Amendment but 14 of these were later delivered during 2005-2008. The F-16A/B fleet is to be upgraded with MLU (Mid-Life Update) modification kits and Falcon Star Structural Service Life Enhancement kits by Turkish Aerospace Industries starting in September 2010 at a rate of 1 per month. Four F-16A/B are already undergoing upgrade in the U.S. for delivery in 2011. The MLU package will include new APG-69v9 radars, Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing Systems and Link-16 data-links, along with other new communications, targeting and electronic warfare systems. In 2006, 12 F-16C and 6 F-16D Block 52+ were ordered with a further 18 aircraft optional. 14 of the optional fighters were ordered in 2010. The first batch of 3 F-16C/D fighters landed at PAF Base Shahbaz, Jacacobad, on 26 June 2010.

A beyond-visual-range missile usually refers to an air-to-air missile that is capable of engaging at ranges beyond 20 nautical miles (37 km). In addition to the range capability, the missile must also be capable of tracking its target at this range or of acquiring the target in flight. Systems in which a mid-course correction is transmitted to the missile have been used. By this definition, air to surface missile such as Maverick do not qualify.

 

[Safriz]

Ok Hal Tejas may be a failed plane..BUt i dont think its a total loss..Look at the technical expertise india acquired along the way..
Built their own engine..Built their own simulators..built their own avionics including their own home made radar.
Even if Tejas project is dumped today..the amount of skill india attained can be easily used in building another aircraft..another engine..another radar..another simulator..the list goes on.