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A good explanation i've heard is that Erdogan actually did have all his ducks in a row on this. There was apparently talk of a purge in the military and this is what led to a desperate ill planned coup. Because the government had already 'done the research' so to speak the government was able...

Apparently they all had gulenist ties? Sounds pretty extraordinary. :edit: Better article https://www.neweurope.eu/article/2745-judges-5-members-high-judiciary-court-board-fired-across-turkey-saturday/

Im reading Erdogan is arresting huge numbers of judges and prosecutors now, something on the order of 2700...wtf? I'm starting to wonder whether Erdogan knew about the coup attempt beforehand and is using it to get rid of all his opposition.

Thought you were referring to Napoleon as the iron duke and marshal baton of all nations, thought that was weird... ok so miscommunication. Huh apparently Wellesley was given the rank of Field Marshal by all the allied nations, TIL.

Honestly it depends on the circumstances and the level of bloodshed necessary, there is no hard and fast rule and I'd bet it would differ from culture to culture. The most preferable way in my opinion is a civil establishment, in our case that role pretty much falls on the supreme court, but...

Are you saying the Soviet Union considered the US the 'leader' of the allies? China considered the US the leader of the allies? It was an alliance of convenience, but there was never a clear decided leader except when it came to certain operations. Soviet forces were never under the command of...

In our case it was knowledgeable representatives of the citizenry who drafted the laws. Changing those laws would require far more than a simple 50.1 majority vote. The definition of democracy has never changed, it always has been rule by the majority. That has always been understood to be both...

That is definitely true of our country, I'm unsure how much that applies in Turkey, their cultural view of their military is different and the role of the military there has been different. To my understanding their military does not have a civilian leader, their president doesn't control it...

Disagree to an extent, the will of the people must be constrained by a set of laws, else it just becomes mob rule and eventually dictatorship. The key to a sustainable democracy is figuring out that balance to the extent that people have a voice, but experts still having a say on sound policy...

Reading the Bosphorus straits are now closed.

I've been relatively neutral on this, so your baiting is coming far out of left field for me. I made my view clear about a united effort from a military that has historically supported secular and democratic values. This is evidently not the case with this coup, at least on the united front.

NTV reports that F16s have taken down a Sikorsky owned by the coup-ing military.

a slow coup is not a successful coup. Looking like its going to fail.

Not really, you should worry more when the US is outspoken, that means the Government has had time to form and prepare a statement.

What is the viable alternative to the house of Saud?

Looks like it.

I wouldn't, Obama hasn't set himself up to be a dictator like Erdogan has, and we have explicit term limits anyway. A coup means military rule, and given the laws we have, I would never support that. Our military and national culture are also different from Turkey's, no way would there be...

NBC saying Erdogan requesting Asylum in Germany.

Erdogan apparently on CNN turk!

I'd take what RT says about Erdogan with a grain of salt at the moment, Erdogan wouldn't be very popular in Russia, lets wait for additional confirmation.