India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war:Indian Army Captain Amarinder

[Pomegranate]

Amarinder: India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war

Written by Man Aman Singh Chhina | Chandigarh | Posted: January 30, 2015 1:15 am
Fifty years after the 1965 Indo-Pak war, deputy leader of Congress in the Lok Sabha, Captain Amarinder Singh, has shed new light on an order allegedly given by the then Army Chief to withdraw Indian Army troops in Punjab, which could have led to the surrender of Amritsar.
Speaking to The Indian Express, Amarinder revealed he is writing a book on the 1965 war to mark its 50th anniversary. The book will trace battles fought in various theatres during the war, and give detailed information about several contentious issues.
One of these is an order allegedly given by then Chief of Army Staff Gen J N Chaudhari to the then General Officer Commanding-in-Chief of Western Command, Lt Gen Harbaksh Singh, to withdraw Indian troops in Punjab. The order, had it been carried out, would have meant the surrender of Amritsar to the Pakistan Army, besides causing panic among Indian troops.
In September 1965, the Pakistan Army surprised Indian defenders in the Khemkaran Sector in Punjab when their armoured division made a dash towards the town of Khemkaran and captured it. The Indian Army had to pull back towards the village of Asal Uttar to consolidate their defence. The Pakistani division was believed to be in a three-pronged attack in which one column was heading towards south of Amritsar, one towards the town of Jandiala and another towards Beas. After the initial surprise, the Indian Army reinforced its presence in the area and the Pakistani advance was defeated in the Battle of Asal Uttar. The village is now known as the graveyard of Patton tanks.
Amarinder, who was the aide-de-camp of the GOC-in-C during the war, said he was a witness to the fact that Lt Gen Harbaksh received a call from Gen Chaudhuri late at night while the Pakistani armoured offensive in Khemkaran was under way. Gen Chaudhuri wanted the Indian troops to withdraw to river Beas, which would serve as a natural barrier to stop the advance of Pakistan’s armoured division.
“We had returned from Khemkaran very late and the general had gone to sleep when I received the call from the chief and put it through to the army commander. The general was heard telling the chief that he would not carry out those orders, and if he wanted this to be done, he should put it down in writing,” said Amarinder.
According to the former Punjab CM, the army chief went to Ambala the next day and met the GOC-in-C but did not mention his order of the previous night, because by then the battle in Asal Uttar had stabilised and the situation was under control.
“Had it been anyone other than Lt Gen Harbaksh, he would not have been able to resist the orders of the army chief. And had those orders been carried out, we would have had to surrender Amritsar, and the road from Beas onwards to Delhi would have been open because there would have been general panic. It would have been a repeat of 1962,” said Amarinder.
The book, expected continued…

Amarinder: India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war | The Indian Express

@Pakistan Shaheen @karakoram @syedali73 @Mosamania @rockstar08 @Zarvan @haviZsultan @gullu butt @JUBA @Gufi @Muhammad Omar @graphican @Gazi @Donatello @Hyperion @Pak_Sher @Gunsnroses @Pakistan First @Pakistani blazzers @Orakzai @KURUMAYA @RescueRanger @Menace2Society @Paksanity @OTTOMAN @Etilla @SpArK @Srinivas @desert warrior @DRAY @pumkinduke @wolfpack @pursuit of happiness @danish_vij @rubyjackass @Star Wars @Ammyy @bloo @Marxist @karan.1970 @Not Sure @Arav_Rana @Avik274 @SamantK @Major Shaitan Singh @Omega007 @farhan_9909 @haviZsultan @Sidak @ranjeet @Yogijaat @ravi Nair @WAR-rior @halupridol @he-man @Indrani @Mike_Brando @SarthakGanguly @sreekumar @OrionHunter @lightoftruth @Water Car Engineer @indiatester @Ind4Ever @13 komaun @anant_s @itachiii @SwAggeR @Brahmos_2 @Blue_Eyes @bhangi bava @SAMEET @naveen mishra @Bagha @utraash @Chanakya's_Chant @Krate M @gslv mk3 @r1_vns @blood @noksss @kurup @PARIKRAMA @thesolar65 @Rohit Patel @wolfschanzze @levina @vostok @rahi2357@Donatello @Lord Zen @Horus

 

[wolfschanzze]

Meh,Was,If's,But's,May have,Maybe are pointless,1965 war Pakistan started with the intention to occupy Kashmir and have Dinner in Delhi, but Ended up Defending Lahore.

In the end it was India which won.

 

[13 komaun]

Amarinder: India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war

Written by Man Aman Singh Chhina | Chandigarh | Posted: January 30, 2015 1:15 am
Fifty years after the 1965 Indo-Pak war, deputy leader of Congress in the Lok Sabha, Captain Amarinder Singh, has shed new light on an order allegedly given by the then Army Chief to withdraw Indian Army troops in Punjab, which could have led to the surrender of Amritsar.
Speaking to The Indian Express, Amarinder revealed he is writing a book on the 1965 war to mark its 50th anniversary. The book will trace battles fought in various theatres during the war, and give detailed information about several contentious issues.
One of these is an order allegedly given by then Chief of Army Staff Gen J N Chaudhari to the then General Officer Commanding-in-Chief of Western Command, Lt Gen Harbaksh Singh, to withdraw Indian troops in Punjab. The order, had it been carried out, would have meant the surrender of Amritsar to the Pakistan Army, besides causing panic among Indian troops.
In September 1965, the Pakistan Army surprised Indian defenders in the Khemkaran Sector in Punjab when their armoured division made a dash towards the town of Khemkaran and captured it. The Indian Army had to pull back towards the village of Asal Uttar to consolidate their defence. The Pakistani division was believed to be in a three-pronged attack in which one column was heading towards south of Amritsar, one towards the town of Jandiala and another towards Beas. After the initial surprise, the Indian Army reinforced its presence in the area and the Pakistani advance was defeated in the Battle of Asal Uttar. The village is now known as the graveyard of Patton tanks.
Amarinder, who was the aide-de-camp of the GOC-in-C during the war, said he was a witness to the fact that Lt Gen Harbaksh received a call from Gen Chaudhuri late at night while the Pakistani armoured offensive in Khemkaran was under way. Gen Chaudhuri wanted the Indian troops to withdraw to river Beas, which would serve as a natural barrier to stop the advance of Pakistan’s armoured division.
“We had returned from Khemkaran very late and the general had gone to sleep when I received the call from the chief and put it through to the army commander. The general was heard telling the chief that he would not carry out those orders, and if he wanted this to be done, he should put it down in writing,” said Amarinder.
According to the former Punjab CM, the army chief went to Ambala the next day and met the GOC-in-C but did not mention his order of the previous night, because by then the battle in Asal Uttar had stabilised and the situation was under control.
“Had it been anyone other than Lt Gen Harbaksh, he would not have been able to resist the orders of the army chief. And had those orders been carried out, we would have had to surrender Amritsar, and the road from Beas onwards to Delhi would have been open because there would have been general panic. It would have been a repeat of 1962,” said Amarinder.
The book, expected continued…

Amarinder: India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war | The Indian Express

@Pakistan Shaheen @karakoram @syedali73 @Mosamania @rockstar08 @Zarvan @haviZsultan @gullu butt @JUBA @Gufi @Muhammad Omar @graphican @Gazi @Donatello @Hyperion @Pak_Sher @Gunsnroses @Pakistan First @Pakistani blazzers @Orakzai @KURUMAYA @RescueRanger @Menace2Society @Paksanity @OTTOMAN @Etilla @SpArK @Srinivas @desert warrior @DRAY @pumkinduke @wolfpack @pursuit of happiness @danish_vij @rubyjackass @Star Wars @Ammyy @bloo @Marxist @karan.1970 @Not Sure @Arav_Rana @Avik274 @SamantK @Major Shaitan Singh @Omega007 @farhan_9909 @haviZsultan @Sidak @ranjeet @Yogijaat @ravi Nair @WAR-rior @halupridol @he-man @Indrani @Mike_Brando @SarthakGanguly @sreekumar @OrionHunter @lightoftruth @Water Car Engineer @indiatester @Ind4Ever @13 komaun @anant_s @itachiii @SwAggeR @Brahmos_2 @Blue_Eyes @bhangi bava @SAMEET @naveen mishra @Bagha @utraash @Chanakya's_Chant @Krate M @gslv mk3 @r1_vns @blood @noksss @kurup @PARIKRAMA @thesolar65 @Rohit Patel @wolfschanzze @levina @vostok @rahi2357@Donatello @Lord Zen @Horus

Already discussed few days ago.

 

[rockstar08]

this is going to be interesting

 

[rubyjackass]

Let us wait till the book's release. I find it wierd that a chief will ask his commander to withdraw without any goals in mind. They must have discussed the scenarios of different outcomes. In any case, there will be lessons to be learnt from a war and as more people write about their experiences, the lessons are better explained.

I am wondering whether any Indian servicemen on this forum read any serious piece in any army journals about the incident?! Somebody must have mentioned it in his/her memoirs?

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Let us wait till the book's release. I find it wierd that a chief will ask his commander to withdraw without any goals in mind. They must have discussed the scenarios of different outcomes. In any case, there will be lessons to be learnt from a war and as more people write about their experiences, the lessons are better explained.

I am wondering whether any Indian servicemen on this forum read any serious piece in any army journals about the incident?! Somebody must have mentioned it in his/her memoirs?

1965 War, the Inside Story by R.D. Pradhan:

In Chapter 8 titled "Of Cowardice and Panic", the author describes the cowardice of Maj. Gen. Niranjan Prasad, the Indian general commanding officer in Lahore sector. When the general was fired upon by Pakistani forces, he "ran away". "On learning that, Lt. Gen. Harbakash Singh and the corps commander drove in a Jonga to the battlefront. Army commander found that the enemy (PAF) air attack had created a havoc on G.T. Road. (Indian) Vehicles were burning and several vehicles of 15 Division abandoned on the road, the drivers having run away, leaving some of the engines still running. Maj. Gen. Niranjan Prasad was hiding in a recently irrigated sugar cane field. As described by Harabakash Singh: "He (Prasad) came out to receive us, with his boots covered with wet mud. He had no head cover, nor was he wearing any badges of his rank. He had stubble on his face, not having shaved." Seeing him in such a stage, Harbakhash Singh asked him: "Whether he was the General Officer commanding a division or a coolie? Why had he removed badges of rank and not shaved? Niranjan Prasad had no answer."

Pradhan's book contains many different entries by Indian Defense Minister Y.B. Chavan. A Sept 9, 1965 entry reads: Had a very hard day on all fronts. Very fierce counter-attacks mounted and we are required to withdraw in Kasur area. COAS was somewhat uncertain of himself. I suggested to him that he should go in forward areas so that he will be in touch of realities. He said he would go next day.

In Line of Duty: A Soldier Remembers, Lt Gen Harbakhsh Singh reveals that not only did Gen Chowdhury play a very small role in the entire campaign, he was so nervous as to be on the verge of losing half of Punjab to Pakistan, including the city of Amritsar. Harbakhsh describes, in clinical detail, how our own offensive in the Lahore sector had come unhinged. The general commanding the division on Ichchogil canal fled in panic, leaving his jeep, its wireless running and the briefcase containing sensitive documents that were then routinely read on Radio Pakistan during the war. Singh wanted to court martial him, Chowdhury let him get away with resignation.

According to Shekhar Gupta, the editor of Indian Express, Harbkhash Singh recounts that a bigger disaster struck a bit to the south where the other division cracked up in assault, just as it encountered a bit of resistance. Several infantry battalions, short on battle inoculation, deserted and Singh gives a hair-raising account – and confirmation of a long-debated rumor – that Chowdhury panicked so badly he ordered him to withdraw to a new defensive line behind the Beas, thereby conceding half of Punjab to Pakistan. Singh describes the conversation with Chowdhury at Ambala where he refused to carry out the order, asking his chief to either put it down in writing or visit the front and take charge of the battle.

 

[13 komaun]

Amarinder: India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war

Written by Man Aman Singh Chhina | Chandigarh | Posted: January 30, 2015 1:15 am
Fifty years after the 1965 Indo-Pak war, deputy leader of Congress in the Lok Sabha, Captain Amarinder Singh, has shed new light on an order allegedly given by the then Army Chief to withdraw Indian Army troops in Punjab, which could have led to the surrender of Amritsar.
Speaking to The Indian Express, Amarinder revealed he is writing a book on the 1965 war to mark its 50th anniversary. The book will trace battles fought in various theatres during the war, and give detailed information about several contentious issues.
One of these is an order allegedly given by then Chief of Army Staff Gen J N Chaudhari to the then General Officer Commanding-in-Chief of Western Command, Lt Gen Harbaksh Singh, to withdraw Indian troops in Punjab. The order, had it been carried out, would have meant the surrender of Amritsar to the Pakistan Army, besides causing panic among Indian troops.
In September 1965, the Pakistan Army surprised Indian defenders in the Khemkaran Sector in Punjab when their armoured division made a dash towards the town of Khemkaran and captured it. The Indian Army had to pull back towards the village of Asal Uttar to consolidate their defence. The Pakistani division was believed to be in a three-pronged attack in which one column was heading towards south of Amritsar, one towards the town of Jandiala and another towards Beas. After the initial surprise, the Indian Army reinforced its presence in the area and the Pakistani advance was defeated in the Battle of Asal Uttar. The village is now known as the graveyard of Patton tanks.
Amarinder, who was the aide-de-camp of the GOC-in-C during the war, said he was a witness to the fact that Lt Gen Harbaksh received a call from Gen Chaudhuri late at night while the Pakistani armoured offensive in Khemkaran was under way. Gen Chaudhuri wanted the Indian troops to withdraw to river Beas, which would serve as a natural barrier to stop the advance of Pakistan’s armoured division.
“We had returned from Khemkaran very late and the general had gone to sleep when I received the call from the chief and put it through to the army commander. The general was heard telling the chief that he would not carry out those orders, and if he wanted this to be done, he should put it down in writing,” said Amarinder.
According to the former Punjab CM, the army chief went to Ambala the next day and met the GOC-in-C but did not mention his order of the previous night, because by then the battle in Asal Uttar had stabilised and the situation was under control.
“Had it been anyone other than Lt Gen Harbaksh, he would not have been able to resist the orders of the army chief. And had those orders been carried out, we would have had to surrender Amritsar, and the road from Beas onwards to Delhi would have been open because there would have been general panic. It would have been a repeat of 1962,” said Amarinder.
The book, expected continued…

Amarinder: India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war | The Indian Express

@Pakistan Shaheen @karakoram @syedali73 @Mosamania @rockstar08 @Zarvan @haviZsultan @gullu butt @JUBA @Gufi @Muhammad Omar @graphican @Gazi @Donatello @Hyperion @Pak_Sher @Gunsnroses @Pakistan First @Pakistani blazzers @Orakzai @KURUMAYA @RescueRanger @Menace2Society @Paksanity @OTTOMAN @Etilla @SpArK @Srinivas @desert warrior @DRAY @pumkinduke @wolfpack @pursuit of happiness @danish_vij @rubyjackass @Star Wars @Ammyy @bloo @Marxist @karan.1970 @Not Sure @Arav_Rana @Avik274 @SamantK @Major Shaitan Singh @Omega007 @farhan_9909 @haviZsultan @Sidak @ranjeet @Yogijaat @ravi Nair @WAR-rior @halupridol @he-man @Indrani @Mike_Brando @SarthakGanguly @sreekumar @OrionHunter @lightoftruth @Water Car Engineer @indiatester @Ind4Ever @13 komaun @anant_s @itachiii @SwAggeR @Brahmos_2 @Blue_Eyes @bhangi bava @SAMEET @naveen mishra @Bagha @utraash @Chanakya's_Chant @Krate M @gslv mk3 @r1_vns @blood @noksss @kurup @PARIKRAMA @thesolar65 @Rohit Patel @wolfschanzze @levina @vostok @rahi2357@Donatello @Lord Zen @Horus

Amarinder: India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war

 

[Menace2Society]

At a ratio of 3:1 PA stood firm. Be proud. This is the essence of what Pakistanis are capable of.

 

[Zarvan]

Meh,Was,If's,But's,May have,Maybe are pointless,1965 war Pakistan started with the intention to occupy Kashmir and have Dinner in Delhi, but Ended up Defending Lahore.

In the end it was India which won.

You started the war and got hell of a beating in return

 

[third eye]

Let us wait till the book's release. I find it wierd that a chief will ask his commander to withdraw without any goals in mind. They must have discussed the scenarios of different outcomes. In any case, there will be lessons to be learnt from a war and as more people write about their experiences, the lessons are better explained.

I am wondering whether any Indian servicemen on this forum read any serious piece in any army journals about the incident?! Somebody must have mentioned it in his/her memoirs?

This subject has been dicussed in another thread.

It did happen.

In wars each side has various contingency plans for alternatives. One such plan was to withdraw to the Beas .

Information sharing back then was not as real time as it is today, based on available inputs the Chief must have given clearance for an alternative plan to be set in motion.Giving freedom to the Commander on ground to do as he pleases.

This the Commander did not do . Instead breached canal banks ( which is also part of contingency planning) and submerged vast areas making it impossible for Pak tanks to operate.

Such things happen during war.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Pakistan almost lost Lahore in 1965

 

[OrionHunter]

Meh,Was,If's,But's,May have,Maybe are pointless,1965 war Pakistan started with the intention to occupy Kashmir and have Dinner in Delhi, but Ended up Defending Lahore.

Spot on! Pakistan's grand design of capturing Kashmir in 1965 came a cropper what with Operation Grand Slam and Operation Gibraltar resulting in spectacular failures!

They are now clutching at straws to rationalise their abject defeat by plucking an odd story here and there where they had very limited success.

 

[Krate M]

The Russians almost lost St. Petersburg (Leningrad) in WW2 but we all know what happened next.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

At a ratio of 3:1 PA stood firm. Be proud. This is the essence of what Pakistanis are capable of.

That ratio is BS. Pakistan was equal in terms of infantry fielded on the ground and had a numerical and technological superiority in tanks and artillery. Not to mention the Air Force.

 

[pursuit of happiness]

Amarinder: India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war

Written by Man Aman Singh Chhina | Chandigarh | Posted: January 30, 2015 1:15 am
Fifty years after the 1965 Indo-Pak war, deputy leader of Congress in the Lok Sabha, Captain Amarinder Singh, has shed new light on an order allegedly given by the then Army Chief to withdraw Indian Army troops in Punjab, which could have led to the surrender of Amritsar.
Speaking to The Indian Express, Amarinder revealed he is writing a book on the 1965 war to mark its 50th anniversary. The book will trace battles fought in various theatres during the war, and give detailed information about several contentious issues.
One of these is an order allegedly given by then Chief of Army Staff Gen J N Chaudhari to the then General Officer Commanding-in-Chief of Western Command, Lt Gen Harbaksh Singh, to withdraw Indian troops in Punjab. The order, had it been carried out, would have meant the surrender of Amritsar to the Pakistan Army, besides causing panic among Indian troops.
In September 1965, the Pakistan Army surprised Indian defenders in the Khemkaran Sector in Punjab when their armoured division made a dash towards the town of Khemkaran and captured it. The Indian Army had to pull back towards the village of Asal Uttar to consolidate their defence. The Pakistani division was believed to be in a three-pronged attack in which one column was heading towards south of Amritsar, one towards the town of Jandiala and another towards Beas. After the initial surprise, the Indian Army reinforced its presence in the area and the Pakistani advance was defeated in the Battle of Asal Uttar. The village is now known as the graveyard of Patton tanks.
Amarinder, who was the aide-de-camp of the GOC-in-C during the war, said he was a witness to the fact that Lt Gen Harbaksh received a call from Gen Chaudhuri late at night while the Pakistani armoured offensive in Khemkaran was under way. Gen Chaudhuri wanted the Indian troops to withdraw to river Beas, which would serve as a natural barrier to stop the advance of Pakistan’s armoured division.
“We had returned from Khemkaran very late and the general had gone to sleep when I received the call from the chief and put it through to the army commander. The general was heard telling the chief that he would not carry out those orders, and if he wanted this to be done, he should put it down in writing,” said Amarinder.
According to the former Punjab CM, the army chief went to Ambala the next day and met the GOC-in-C but did not mention his order of the previous night, because by then the battle in Asal Uttar had stabilised and the situation was under control.
“Had it been anyone other than Lt Gen Harbaksh, he would not have been able to resist the orders of the army chief. And had those orders been carried out, we would have had to surrender Amritsar, and the road from Beas onwards to Delhi would have been open because there would have been general panic. It would have been a repeat of 1962,” said Amarinder.
The book, expected continued…

Amarinder: India almost lost Amritsar in ’65 war | The Indian Express

@Pakistan Shaheen @karakoram @syedali73 @Mosamania @rockstar08 @Zarvan @haviZsultan @gullu butt @JUBA @Gufi @Muhammad Omar @graphican @Gazi @Donatello @Hyperion @Pak_Sher @Gunsnroses @Pakistan First @Pakistani blazzers @Orakzai @KURUMAYA @RescueRanger @Menace2Society @Paksanity @OTTOMAN @Etilla @SpArK @Srinivas @desert warrior @DRAY @pumkinduke @wolfpack @pursuit of happiness @danish_vij @rubyjackass @Star Wars @Ammyy @bloo @Marxist @karan.1970 @Not Sure @Arav_Rana @Avik274 @SamantK @Major Shaitan Singh @Omega007 @farhan_9909 @haviZsultan @Sidak @ranjeet @Yogijaat @ravi Nair @WAR-rior @halupridol @he-man @Indrani @Mike_Brando @SarthakGanguly @sreekumar @OrionHunter @lightoftruth @Water Car Engineer @indiatester @Ind4Ever @13 komaun @anant_s @itachiii @SwAggeR @Brahmos_2 @Blue_Eyes @bhangi bava @SAMEET @naveen mishra @Bagha @utraash @Chanakya's_Chant @Krate M @gslv mk3 @r1_vns @blood @noksss @kurup @PARIKRAMA @thesolar65 @Rohit Patel @wolfschanzze @levina @vostok @rahi2357@Donatello @Lord Zen @Horus

--
nice dig.. that too from good source..
question is..
what was objective of pak .. getting amritsar or kashmir in 65?
as other member gave details .. i dont want to repaet..
in war you loose or verge on loose some battle but waht matters you WIN war..
so today 65 gave india shimala agreemt which tied kashmir to it.. and amritsar still in india..