World's 13b$ Aircraft Carrier

[Genghis khan1]

It's a lot easier to said then done to "Swamp" a carrier actually.

US Carrier does not travel in lone ship, a Carrier have about 14 warship (1 or 2 CG + 3 DDG in a Carrier Strike Group + 1 Destroyer Squadron on a 5 + 3 formation ) defend it's immediately airspace. and it also have 65 fighter aircraft on board any Carrier, with 2 E-2D on board, they can engage a combine over 1000 Target at the same time (96 per Destroyer, 122 per Cruiser) at a range of 250nm plus (The range for E-2D radar and ship board AN/SPY-1B radar is classified, E-2C can detect 2000 target at a range of 550km (290nm) with AN/APS-145 Radar)

This was the official soviet strategy during the cold war against US Aircraft carriers. Like you mentioned their are several layers of defenses but each has its own limitation and advantages. Both Chinese and Russian surly be well aware of these parameters and must be had something in their tool box to counter. It is quite evident, Chinese are making tremendous improvement in their Anti-aircraft weaponry.

 

[jhungary]

This was the official soviet strategy during the cold war against US Aircraft carriers. Like you mentioned their are several layers of defenses but each has its own limitation and advantages. Both Chinese and Russian surly be well aware of these parameters and must be had something in their tool box to counter. It is quite evident, Chinese are making tremendous improvement in their Anti-aircraft weaponry.

.........The mighty DF-Whatever ASBM??

Seriously, beside any stand off engagement (Which is not suitable for moving target) it is quite hard to swamp a carrier group. you did said so yourselves indeed Russia and China are looking to break the US CBG defensive, but that does not mean US is sitting still and simply waiting for them to break thru.

The layers of protect gone over 550 km out in 2006. Which mean whatever within that range can be shoot down by a combination of ship launch SM-3 (have an effective range of 700km) and Super hornet's AIM-120. Times have change from the swamping tactics that the Russian uses and the newer US tech can only push those envelope further away from the carrier. Which means it can only get harder for Chinese or Russia to penetrate thru the defence.

 

[Penguin]

This is not a competition to building swiss watches. Aircraft carriers are the expensive weapon of war and China surely can afford the world's most pimped out carriers, but why build something so fancy and expensive when it can be sunk by missiles costing fraction of the target.

Oldest tactic in the book, Saturate Aircraft carrier defences. It take just one missile to slip through the defences and render multi-billion dollar war machine useless.

You should watch some of the footage of the 1960s fire incidents on Enterprise and Forrestal. On Forrestal 9x 1000lb bombs cooked off on deck. On Enterprise at least 5x 500lb bombs cooked of. Fires from jet fuel pooring through blast holes in the deck into the ship ensued. These ships survived (and damage control / fire fighting has since improved, as has protection)

 

[Mrc]

Df21d is different in a sense that its a medium range ballistic missile on which terminal phase has been made maneuverable enough to hit a slow moving big target like an aircraft career... off course with satellite links and terminal target acquisition and guidance system...
Its apogee can be 1000 km above and hence beyond range of any radar... its descent is probably at mac 20...
It will pass through all known defences and impact alone at that speed can disable a career..

Collin powell said " this missile is not changing rules of the game rather has potential to change game it self...

Russians recently commented that no known counter measures can stop it...

Only question remains is it accurate enough ( at that kind of speed)??


Another advantage of anti ship ballistic missile is range is not really an issue...once u have perfected targetting and accuracy, range ca be enhanced by putting same war head on longer range ballistic missiles... so there is no where to hide....

 

[C130]

Df21d is different in a sense that its a medium range ballistic missile on which terminal phase has been made maneuverable enough to hit a slow moving big target like an aircraft career... off course with satellite links and terminal target acquisition and guidance system...
Its apogee can be 1000 km above and hence beyond range of any radar... its descent is probably at mac 20...
It will pass through all known defences and impact alone at that speed can disable a career..

Collin powell said " this missile is not changing rules of the game rather has potential to change game it self...

Russians recently commented that no known counter measures can stop it...

Only question remains is it accurate enough ( at that kind of speed)??

Russians recently commented that no known counter measures can stop it...

can China stop this?

 

[Mrc]

can China stop this?

Nope

 

[Genghis khan1]

.........The mighty DF-Whatever ASBM??

Seriously, beside any stand off engagement (Which is not suitable for moving target) it is quite hard to swamp a carrier group. you did said so yourselves indeed Russia and China are looking to break the US CBG defensive, but that does not mean US is sitting still and simply waiting for them to break thru.

The layers of protect gone over 550 km out in 2006. Which mean whatever within that range can be shoot down by a combination of ship launch SM-3 (have an effective range of 700km) and Super hornet's AIM-120. Times have change from the swamping tactics that the Russian uses and the newer US tech can only push those envelope further away from the carrier. Which means it can only get harder for Chinese or Russia to penetrate thru the defence.

US is using the same tactic to counter Russian S-400 Triumf system. Use transport planes to deploy larger numbers of Miniature Air-Launched Decoy (MALD) from a safe distance and let the attackers swoop in to do their job. Considering Aircraft-carriers is an offensive weapons and will be away from home. Enemy or the carriers attacking forces will have advantage in numbers due to close proximity to home.

S-400 Triumf SAM Killer.

 

[Mrc]

can China stop this?

But u do realise chinese also have these?

 

[C130]

But u do realise chinese also have these?

affirmative

 

[KAL-EL]

But u do realise chinese also have these?

Yes they do, but the difference is, the United States isn't surrounded by a magical indestructible force shield.

China apparently is...

 

[war&peace]

No country is a match for U.S navy to be honest. The gap between the U.S navy and the next 5 top naval powers combined is still huge.

All it will take is one or two DF21s to dispatch this slow moving buffalo deep into the ocean abyss.
The time is not more advanced and smart weapons with agility, stealth and sophistication. It has none.

 

[mike2000 is back]

All it will take is one or two DF21s to dispatch this slow moving buffalo deep into the ocean abyss.
The time is not more advanced and smart weapons with agility, stealth and sophistication. It has none.

With all due respect Only a fool will think the PLAN stands any chance against the U.S navy in any naval confrontation(not even your Chinese buddies are that naive to believe that). So calm down with your cheer-leading.lol.

 

[war&peace]

With all due respect Only a fool will think the PLAN stands any chance against the U.S navy in any naval confrontation(not even your Chinese buddies are that naive to believe that). So calm down with your cheer-leading.lol.

With due respect then include 75% of elite of Pentagon in that list. BTW Zumwalt is something that is impressive and futuristic but this AC is just big and most of power will be wasted to overcome the drag due to its weight and size.

 

[jhungary]

US is using the same tactic to counter Russian S-400 Triumf system. Use transport planes to deploy larger numbers of Miniature Air-Launched Decoy (MALD) from a safe distance and let the attackers swoop in to do their job. Considering Aircraft-carriers is an offensive weapons and will be away from home. Enemy or the carriers attacking forces will have advantage in numbers due to close proximity to home.

S-400 Triumf SAM Killer.

lol........no......this is not the way US deal with S-400, this may be other AF way to deal with S-400 but not the US. Since the desert storm, the US have use a combination of Electronic Attack Aircraft, Jammer and Attack aircraft to deal with Iron Hand Mission. The old Wild Weasel was not adopted anymore.

In Desert Storm, the USAF would fly a single EF-111A raven into the target area to supress Iraqi Radar at the same time plot their electronic signature for the following F-16CJ or F-15E squadron to deal with the Radar Station as well as launch site sussed out by the EF-111A.

Today, this particular kill cycle have been replaced by a joint Navy-Air Force. The EF-111A Raven have been replaced by EA-18G with next gen jammer to jam the enemy communication and radar, a EC-130H Compass Call to detect the enemy location and a strike squadron to attack and saturated the area.

Also, S-400 radar is a single unit with 160 simultaneously engagement with 8 to attack per missile for up to 600km. Compare to a combination of E-2D and 14 warship, they can track 2500+ target simultaneously with 1000 to attack for up to at least 600km out. The situation is different between a S-400 battery and a Carrier Battle Group.

 

[Genghis khan1]

lol........no......this is not the way US deal with S-400, this may be other AF way to deal with S-400 but not the US. Since the desert storm, the US have use a combination of Electronic Attack Aircraft, Jammer and Attack aircraft to deal with Iron Hand Mission. The old Wild Weasel was not adopted anymore.

In Desert Storm, the USAF would fly a single EF-111A raven into the target area to supress Iraqi Radar at the same time plot their electronic signature for the following F-16CJ or F-15E squadron to deal with the Radar Station as well as launch site sussed out by the EF-111A.

Today, this particular kill cycle have been replaced by a joint Navy-Air Force. The EF-111A Raven have been replaced by EA-18G with next gen jammer to jam the enemy communication and radar, a EC-130H Compass Call to detect the enemy location and a strike squadron to attack and saturated the area.

Also, S-400 radar is a single unit with 160 simultaneously engagement with 8 to attack per missile for up to 600km. Compare to a combination of E-2D and 14 warship, they can track 2500+ target simultaneously with 1000 to attack for up to at least 600km out. The situation is different between a S-400 battery and a Carrier Battle Group.

If you have watched the video, you can clearly see, these measure are being developed by Raytheon for USAF to counter long range chinese and and Russians SAMs. I don't know which other AF is foolish enough to mess with Russian or Chinese Air-defence system unless they are part of NATO or their close buddy. Outdated Iraqi air defence units were a duck shoot for USAF. Nonetheless, Chinese and Russians learned valuable lesson on expense of US adventures overseas and are developing exactly what they needed to counter USAF strategies. Russians are leading in long range SAMs, while Chinese are trying to beat US in electromagnetic warfare.

US Has Lost ‘Dominance In Electromagnetic Spectrum': Shaffer « Breaking Defense - Defense industry news, analysis and commentary