Vietnam Defence Forum

[Viet]

Since 1979, bro.

I think it is all worth the money to have Cambodia on our side.

 

[NiceGuy]

VN successfullu produce anti-tank gun SPG-9T2. (upgrade version of SPG-9) .effective range :800, max range: 1,300m.

 

[Carlosa]

hm...Carlosa, is it true as the article suggests there was no sign of any purchases of the Klub land-attack variant?
I find this link below is very useful. some recent news included.
Vietnam’s Russian Restocking: Subs, Ships, Sukhois, and More
?

Well, I can't say for sure about the land attack Club missiles, SIPRI would be another source to check for that, but anyway, VN can order those missiles later, land attack is more of a secondary mission and maybe they are already bought, but it has not been announced.

Yes, that restocking link is good, I've been following that link for about 3 years now, but sometimes they mention things that are not confirmed, like it says there that there are a total of 6 Gepards deployed and in order, but everywhere else is 4, so I don't quite believe that. It says that Molniys ships carry 6 KH-35 missiles when its actually 16........... so can't trust everything they say.

The thing is, VN is so damn secretive about all this, that you never know anything for sure until you see it.

 

[Viet]

Well, I can't say for sure about the land attack Club missiles, SIPRI would be another source to check for that, but anyway, VN can order those missiles later, land attack is more of a secondary mission and maybe they are already bought, but it has not been announced.

Yes, that restocking link is good, I've been following that link for about 3 years now, but sometimes they mention things that are not confirmed, like it says there that there are a total of 6 Gepards deployed and in order, but everywhere else is 4, so I don't quite believe that. It says that Molniys ships carry 6 KH-35 missiles when its actually 16........... so can't trust everything they say.

The thing is, VN is so damn secretive about all this, that you never know anything for sure until you see it.

I read from a source (forgotten it) that we have ordered land attack version.
an interesting side aspect is, this sort of cruise missile fired through torpedo tubes can be fitted theoretically with nuclear warheads. staying undetected before a shore, the kilo with klub-s 300km range missiles can pose a serious threat to potential enemy.

 

[Viet]

thanks to Russia: the naval version of the Pantsir anti-aircraft missile and gun system incidentally installed on the Gepards sent to Vietnam. The range of the Pantsir-M’s SAMs is 20 km. Interesting, our warships have this gun before the russian navy.

Russian Navy to buy marine version of the Pantsir AAMG system | Russia & India Report

 

[Carlosa]

I read from a source (forgotten it) that we have ordered land attack version.
an interesting side aspect is, this sort of cruise missile fired through torpedo tubes can be fitted theoretically with nuclear warheads. staying undetected before a shore, the kilo with klub-s 300km range missiles can pose a serious threat to potential enemy.

Yes, that's what the Israelis are doing with their subs, they use long range cruse missiles armed with a nuclear warhead that are launched from the torpedo tubes (those subs have 10 torpedo tubes). That's their ultimate nuclear deterrence.

Its not an easy thing to make a nuclear warhead small enough to fit it into a cruise missile, I don't think VN is going to be able to do that anytime soon, but in theory, I guess it could work. Actually, it would be much easier for VN to make a nuclear warhead for Scud missiles.

thanks to Russia: the naval version of the Pantsir anti-aircraft missile and gun system incidentally installed on the Gepards being sent to Vietnam. The range of the Pantsir-M’s SAMs is 20 km.

Russian Navy to buy marine version of the Pantsir AAMG system | Russia & India Report

Yes, that's a very nice system, but the next batch of Gepards are coming with the Palma system.

The problem with the Palma is that it uses laser guided missiles (Sosna-R) and in bad weather, fog, etc, the laser doesn't work well. That's a big issue in a marine environment.

 

[William Hung]

thanks to Russia: the naval version of the Pantsir anti-aircraft missile and gun system incidentally installed on the Gepards sent to Vietnam. The range of the Pantsir-M’s SAMs is 20 km. Interesting, our warships have this gun before the russian navy.

Russian Navy to buy marine version of the Pantsir AAMG system | Russia & India Report

The article said the ones installed on the Gepard are Palma. Naval Pansir-M won't be in service til 2016.

 

[Carlosa]

The article said the ones installed on the Gepard are Palma. Naval Pansir-M won't be in service til 2016.

When the naval pantsir gets approved for export (eventually, probably in a few years), it would be nice to retrofit it into the Gepards and the Palmas removed from the Gepards could go into lesser quality ships like the Molniya class where one Palma would be superior to the 2 systems AK-630 that they have now. That would be a nice trade. Some of the Molniya class ships in the Russian Navy use the Palma in that same way already.

 

[Viet]

The article said the ones installed on the Gepard are Palma. Naval Pansir-M won't be in service til 2016.

oh you are right

 

[William Hung]

oh you are right

When the naval pantsir gets approved for export (eventually, probably in a few years), it would be nice to retrofit it into the Gepards and the Palmas removed from the Gepards could go into lesser quality ships like the Molniya class where one Palma would be superior to the 2 systems AK-630 that they have now. That would be a nice trade. Some of the Molniya class ships in the Russian Navy use the Palma in that same way already.

Maybe, who knows.

Btw, is there any reason why the Gepard is missing a helicopter hangar? Pretty sure that model with 2 AK630 was designed to accommodate a hangar. And I doubt a hangar would cost over 1million to install. So why spend over 100mil on a ship and don't spend a little more for a hangar that would give it more ASW capability?

 

[NiceGuy]

Btw, is there any reason why the Gepard is missing a helicopter hangar? Pretty sure that model with 2 AK630 was designed to accommodate a hangar. And I doubt a hangar would cost over 1million to install. So why spend over 100mil on a ship and don't spend a little more for a hangar that would give it more ASW capability?

Coz we dont use Gepard for hunting sub, so no need hangar

 

[Carlosa]

Maybe, who knows.

Btw, is there any reason why the Gepard is missing a helicopter hangar? Pretty sure that model with 2 AK630 was designed to accommodate a hangar. And I doubt a hangar would cost over 1million to install. So why spend over 100mil on a ship and don't spend a little more for a hangar that would give it more ASW capability?

The Gepard does have a hangar. Its the tall triangular section that is at the rear of the 2 AK-630'S, but I wonder if its big enough for the full body of the helicopter.

The helicopter in the Gepard is specifically to hunt submarines.

 

[William Hung]

The Gepard does have a hangar. Its the tall triangular section that is at the rear of the 2 AK-630'S, but I wonder if its big enough for the full body of the helicopter.

The helicopter in the Gepard is specifically to hunt submarines.

View attachment 47914

View attachment 47915

I had these in mind:

There was another one with the Uran configured like your current Gepard.

To carry a ASW heli, a hangar would be needed as it provides a proper workspace for the engineers to perform maintenence on the heli and re-arm/resupply. e. g. the lighting, shelter, storage for tools, equipment, etc.

 

[Carlosa]

I had these in mind:

There was another one with the Uran configured like your current Gepard.

To carry a ASW heli, a hangar would be needed as it provides a proper workspace for the engineers to perform maintenence on the heli and re-arm/resupply. e. g. the lighting, shelter, storage for tools, equipment, etc.

There are 5 main versions of the Gepard (1 to 5), plus sub versions such as 3.9 (Vietnam), 5.1, 5.3, etc. Some versions have hangars, some not. Version 3 has hangar, the thing is, when I see the Gepard pic with the hello, I just don't see how the full length of the hello can fit there.

The two upcoming Gepards for Vietnam seem to be the version 5.3, also with hangar.

I just don't see why they don't continue the triangular space all the way for extra protected space, I don't see the point of having it open like that. This is intriguing.

Yes, it makes sense that need to have a full hangar for an ASW hello.

 

[William Hung]

I just don't see why they don't continue the triangular space all the way for extra protected space, I don't see the point of having it open like that. This is intriguing.

Yes, it makes sense that need to have a full hangar for an ASW hello.

That's what I mean. They can extend it all the way further back, then they can add a roller door, or not. Then, it would be more or less a hangar. It is weird with the semi triangle open design. Never seen those before.

Its like they want to cut corners.

P. s. look at your last picture, it looks like the length from the Uran to the back of the AK630 platform is long enough to accommodate that KA.