The US Will Re-Open Massive Philippines Military Bases

Discussion in 'World Affairs' started by ManilaBoy45, Jun 10, 2012.

  1. ManilaBoy45

    ManilaBoy45 FULL MEMBER

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  2. Martian2

    Martian2 SENIOR MEMBER

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    Oh, please! Not some silly tabloid citation.

    In case you haven't heard, the U.S. is slashing $45 billion annually from the military budget right after the presidential election next year. Furthermore, under the budget sequestration, another $60 billion will be slashed annually for the next ten years.

    The annual reduction in the Pentagon budget is $105 billion. Rating agencies S&P and Fitch have already warned they will cut the U.S. credit rating if another 3 trillion isn't cut from the U.S. federal budget in the next ten years.

    The Pentagon is staring at another potential hundred billion or more in annual further cuts. Otherwise, S&P and Fitch may cut the U.S. credit rating and raise U.S. borrowing costs and debt service (e.g. interest rate).

    The Japanese pay at least $2 billion in costs for the basing of U.S. troops. Does the Philippines have billions of U.S. dollars to pay for U.S. soldiers?

    Your thread title is based on wishful thinking and it has no relation to reality.

    Show me a single major American news outlet (e.g. MSNBC, New York Times, Wall Street Journal, Fox News, etc.) that is reporting your b.s. claim as shown in your thread title.

    Anybody with half-a-brain knows major U.S. bases are scheduled for closing in the U.S. and around the world. The idea of opening a new major U.S. base would break the Pentagon budget.

    The mighty Soviet military went belly-up, because it was broke. The Pentagon is broke too. It'll take ten to twenty years, but the U.S. military is about to shrink in a major way.

    ----------

    STEP #1: Try using reputable citations and not that nonsense tabloid crap "Business Insider."

    From the New York Times:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/27/u...osing-bases-to-cut-budget.html?pagewanted=all

    "Defense Budget Cuts Would Limit Raises and Close Bases
    By ELISABETH BUMILLER and THOM SHANKER
    Published: January 26, 2012

    WASHINGTON — The Pentagon took the first major step toward shrinking its budget after a decade of war as it announced Thursday that it wanted to limit pay raises for troops, increase health insurance fees for military retirees and close bases in the United States.

    Although the pay-raise limits were described as modest, and would not start until 2015, they are certain to ignite a political fight in Congress, which since the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, has almost always raised military salaries beyond what the Pentagon has recommended.

    Increasing health insurance fees for retirees and closing bases are also fraught with political risk, particularly when Republican presidential candidates are charging that President Obama is debilitating the military.

    Next year’s Pentagon budget is to be $525 billion, down from $531 billion this fiscal year. Even though the Defense Department has been called on to find $259 billion in cuts in the next five years — and $487 billion over the decade — its base budget (not counting the costs of Afghanistan or other wars) will rise to $567 billion by 2017. But when adjusted for inflation, the increases are small enough that they will amount to a slight cut of 1.6 percent of the Pentagon’s base budget over the next five years.

    Nonetheless, Defense Secretary Leon E. Panetta said he was working with about $500 billion less than he had anticipated having on hand through 2017, meaning that the Pentagon had to trim personnel and favorite high-profile weapons programs. “This has been tough work,” Mr. Panetta said at an hourlong news conference.

    He said that the Army would be reduced over five years to 490,000 troops, down from a peak of 570,000, and that the Marines would be cut to 182,000, down from 202,000. (Ground forces would still be slightly larger than they were before 9/11.) The Pentagon initially will buy fewer F-35 Joint Strike Fighter stealth jets, which are not expected to be in service until at least 2017 and have the distinction of being one of the costliest weapons programs in history. In the Navy, 14 warships will be either retired early or built more slowly.

    Both Mr. Panetta and Gen. Martin E. Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who also addressed the news conference, repeatedly said that the United States would still maintain the strongest military in the world, an assessment that seemed aimed at Republicans as well as America’s adversaries. “Capability is more important than size,” General Dempsey said. He added that “this budget does not lead to a military in decline” and that “it is a military that can win any conflict, anywhere.”

    Although all American combat troops have been out of Iraq since mid-December and the Obama administration is beginning to withdraw what had been more than 100,000 United States forces in Afghanistan, the Pentagon budget includes a request for $88.4 billion next year, above the $525 billion base budget, to pay for combat operations overseas. Mr. Panetta said that Afghanistan, where there are still 90,000 American troops, accounts for the bulk of that money. This year’s budget for combat operations overseas is $115 billion.

    Pentagon officials did not specify what the limits would be on military pay increases in 2015 and beyond, when American troops are due to be home from Afghanistan, although they characterized the change as incremental — an acknowledgment of the political risk of having active and retired members of the armed forces bear the brunt of the budget cuts. “Let me be clear, nobody’s pay will be cut,” Mr. Panetta said.

    Still, the defense secretary has also called military personnel costs “unsustainable.” The Pentagon currently spends $181 billion a year, nearly a third of its base budget, on military personnel: $107 billion for salaries and allowances, $50 billion for health care and $24 billion for retirement pay.

    Military salaries have risen steadily since the Sept. 11 attacks, and officers have in many cases fared better than enlisted personnel.

    A private first class with a family and three years’ experience deployed to a war zone took home $26,700 tax-free in 2001, compared with $36,000 today — an 11 percent raise over inflation. A lieutenant colonel with a family and 20 years’ experience deployed to the same war zone took home $84,000 tax-free in 2001, compared with $120,000 today — a 16 percent increase.

    Posing another political challenge was Mr. Panetta’s announcement that the president would request another round of base closings and realignments — never popular with members of Congress who try to preserve military spending, and jobs, in their districts. Pentagon officials said savings from any base closings were not reflected in the five-year budget Mr. Panetta was sending to the White House.

    There were already objections on Thursday morning, hours before Mr. Panetta made his public presentation. Senator Carl Levin, the Michigan Democrat who is chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, told reporters that until the United States shut down some of its bases in Europe, “I’m not going to be able to support” closing bases in America.

    Mr. Panetta has said that two armored Army brigades — as many as 10,000 troops — would come home from Europe over the next decade, leaving two brigades and some support troops behind.

    Although Mr. Obama has given an aspirational pledge to reduce the nation’s nuclear arsenal to zero, there was nothing in Thursday’s announcement about reaching that goal. All three legs of the nuclear triad — bombers, submarine-launched missiles and land-based missiles — will be preserved. The program to replace the Ohio class nuclear-missile submarine will be delayed by two years.

    Mr. Panetta has repeatedly said that he would preserve financing for Special Operations forces, cyberwarfare and intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance systems, and the budget makes good on that promise.

    The Pentagon did not say how much health insurance fees would increase — the details are to come in early February. Families now pay $520 a year, far below the cost of a private carrier.

    Criticism of the proposed budget came swiftly from senior Republicans on Capitol Hill.

    'These cuts reflect President Obama’s vision of an America that is weakened, not strengthened, by our men and women in uniform,” said Howard P. McKeon of California, chairman of the House Armed Services Committee. “To be clear, the impacts of these cuts are far deeper than Congress envisioned.'”
     
  3. SinoChallenger

    SinoChallenger BANNED

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    Good for the Americans. Now big black GI's can assault little Filipina whenever they feel antsy. The Philippines go back to their familiar role as slaves.
     
  4. Roybot

    Roybot ELITE MEMBER

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    Whats with the rape obsession :undecided:

    And I came here hoping to read some of your ingenious military plans, like submarines down a mountain river or atleast couple of megaton nukes loaded on a mirved missiles. Disappointed :frown:
     
  5. Nan Yang

    Nan Yang FULL MEMBER

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  6. Roybot

    Roybot ELITE MEMBER

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    Constitution can be amended, specially when the sovereignty of the country is under threat from a bully.

    :lol: Imagine China attacking Philippines, and Filipino lawmakers going, oh we can't take help from America cause its unconstitutional! Democratic constitution is made for the people and by the people, but can't expect a communist Chinese to understand that.
     
  7. ManilaBoy45

    ManilaBoy45 FULL MEMBER

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    I'm well aware of the constitution here, posted this topic just for information purposes and I'm not even sure if this article is accurate or not ... I couldn't care less for all I know ! :coffee:
     
  8. anon45

    anon45 SENIOR MEMBER

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    By my understanding we will for the most part be using them to base ships and subs or as a port for rotation, with no permanent basing of troops. It would make sense for the US to keep a very light troops footprint seeing as soldiers at the bases (and probably at all the bases that could be under consideration) would not help too much when it comes to a conflict with China, and it would cost quite a bit to essentially 'rebuild' the base to house troops.

    Expect too see ships ported and on rotation all along South Asia and the Asian Pacific with a fairly light US troop footprint.


    This is not too different from what has been going on with regards to the Philippines already, but it makes it official.
     
  9. Martian2

    Martian2 SENIOR MEMBER

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    AFP, Reuters, AP: No New U.S. base in Philippines

    Here are the facts. Notice the reputable citations at the end of the article: "With reports from AFP, Reuters, AP."

    1. Aquino only gets a 1 to 1.5 hour meeting with Obama.

    2. "Mr. Aquino has agreed to let a greater number of US troops rotate-but not set up bases-in the archipelago."

    3. "Carandang said that under no circumstances would Mr. Aquino's talks with Obama include a discussion about the return of US bases to the country or 'basing rights.'"

    4. Less than 2,500 U.S. troops will rotate through the Philippines.

    5. Philippines will only receive $30 million in military aid, which is triple the 2011 military aid.

    ----------

    US to boost Philippines defense

    "US to boost Philippines defense
    By Daxim L. Lucas
    Philippine Daily Inquirer/Asia News Network
    Saturday, Jun 09, 2012

    WASHINGTON - The United States pledged to help the Philippines step up its defenses in the face of a rising China, as President Benigno Aquino III and President Barack Obama prepared to meet at the White House amid Philippine warnings that "weakness invites aggression."

    Obama's meeting with Mr. Aquino at the Oval Office was scheduled for 2 p.m. on Friday (2 a.m. on Saturday in Manila) and expected to last between one and one-and-a-half hours, according to Malacañang.

    "History shows you that weakness invites aggression and the more we have an ability to defend ourselves, the less we'll be subject to actual aggression by anybody," Presidential Communications Secretary Ricky Carandang told reporters.

    "Given those strategic directions of both our governments, we are looking at ways to enhance our cooperation to our mutual benefit on the security side. That's going to be a large focus of the discussion," Carandang said.

    He said the confrontation between the Philippines and China over disputed territories in the West Philippine Sea (South China Sea) would be discussed at the meeting.

    Hours before the Aquino-Obama talks, the top US military officer, Gen. Martin Dempsey, said that during his talks with Mr. Aquino on Monday in Manila, he spoke about expanding cooperation with the former US colony beyond recent efforts focused on fighting Islamic insurgents.

    The Philippines "has been inward-focused on its internal terrorism and insurgent issues for some time-for decades really-and so [has] a very limited capability to project power or to influence activities around it," said Dempsey, chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

    "We think that they need some of that, particularly in maritime security," Dempsey said.

    The United States has already been helping to upgrade the notoriously antiquated Philippine military and Mr. Aquino has agreed to let a greater number of US troops rotate-but not set up bases-in the archipelago.

    Butting heads


    The cooperation comes as the Philippines sees particularly tense relations with China, which has butted heads with a number of its neighbors over territorial disputes in strategic waters.

    Friction escalated in April when Chinese and Philippine vessels approached Panatag Shoal (Scarborough Shoal), which lies near Luzon. Manila says the rock formation falls within its exclusive economic zone. China claims the shoal along with nearly all of the West Philippine Sea.

    Mr. Aquino, well regarded by the US government, has raised the profile of the Philippines in Washington through his pledges to tackle corruption and to boost its military relationship with the United States.

    Credible deterrence

    Carandang noted that the United States had made "a strategic rebalancing" of its security posture.

    "They're moving their forces into Asia," he said. "They want to have a larger presence in the Asia-Pacific region because this is where the economic and political center of the world, they say, will shift in the coming decades."

    He said this coincided with Mr. Aquino's desire to develop a "minimum credible deterrent capacity."

    "Over the decades our military capability, particularly our naval capability, has fallen behind that of our neighbors," Carandang said.

    No new US bases

    Carandang declined to give specifics on how much military hardware or capability would constitute a minimum credible deterrent capability but said this would include surveillance equipment and an increased ability to patrol the country's shores more effectively.

    He repeated Mr. Aquino's statement that the military hardware the Philippines would acquire would not necessarily come from the United States alone.

    But he stressed that the Philippines had no intention of acquiring offensive weapons and that all the military hardware it would acquire would be of a defensive nature.

    Carandang said that under no circumstances would Mr. Aquino's talks with Obama include a discussion about the return of US bases to the country or "basing rights."

    Instead, the discussions would likely center on the United States having greater access to Philippine seaports and airports for use on a "rotational" basis, Carandang said.

    "What we're looking at is a lot more mobile, a lot less permanent and probably a lot more frequent than what we have now," he said.

    Future relationship


    Mr. Aquino's visit highlights the Philippines' growing importance in US strategic thinking as both countries worry about China's intentions.

    "The meeting between President Aquino and President Obama will lay the groundwork for the future of the strategic partnership between the Philippines and the United States," said Jose Cuisia, the Philippine ambassador in Washington.

    Mr. Aquino was also to meet senior US lawmakers for "discussions on our bilateral economic and defense cooperation, the shift in the focus of the United States toward the Asia-Pacific and ways to revitalize our alliance," Cuisia said.

    Washington's "rebalancing" of forces to the Asia-Pacific region has accelerated under Obama as a response to China's rapid military modernization and growing assertiveness in that region.

    Subic and Clark

    A US official said Washington saw Mr. Aquino as a leader who is "trying to do the right thing" to tackle the corruption, cronyism and red tape that have held back the economy of his nation of more than 90 million people.

    No new bases are envisioned under the US plan, although 2,500 US troops will rotate through and train in Darwin, Australia. Any new arrangements with the Philippines would be smaller than the Australian program, officials said.

    Asked if former US facilities on Subic Bay and Clark Air Force Base were under consideration, Dempsey said: "I wouldn't say specifically Subic and Clark, although they are obvious locations were we to increase our exercise and rotational presence."

    After high-level bilateral security and diplomatic talks in late April, the Obama administration pledged to increase its annual foreign military sales program to the Philippines to $30 million, about three times the level of the 2011 program.

    "We've been working with the Philippines on military modernization for 12 or 13 years, very intensively," said Walter Lohman, a Southeast Asia expert at Heritage Foundation, a Washington-based think tank. "The only thing that has changed is the urgency of this and the seriousness the Philippines has shown under the Aquino administration," he said.

    Plaudits for Aquino

    The United States is formally neutral on West Philippine Sea territorial issues. But Washington's promotion of multilateral diplomacy to handle the disputes clashes with China's insistence on bilateral talks with its weaker neighbors.

    "We want to empower international rules of the road in maritime security, not to isolate any one nation or to take a position on a claim-for instance, in the [West Philippine Sea]-but rather to make sure that claims can be resolved peacefully," said a senior US official.

    Mr. Aquino, the son of democracy heroes, has emerged as a willing partner of the United States as it looks to build a stronger presence in Southeast Asia.

    With reports from AFP, Reuters, AP"
     
  10. kawaraj

    kawaraj SENIOR MEMBER

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    This is really sad and stup1d decision though I am always on the Philippine side against China and Vietnam.

    Corazon Aquino had been fought her life, together with those left alliance, to drive out the American troops, ending the foreign occupation in real sense for the first time in history, and brought real democracy to the nation by exile American puppet dictator Marcos.

    Today her son decides to invite the invader back, to undo the whole nation's bloody efforts over a century. How sad is this to be, to the Philippine elites, especially his parents, the Aquino couple.
     
  11. Martian2

    Martian2 SENIOR MEMBER

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    Obama's $30 million pledge to Aquino can't even buy a single Chinook helicopter

    It should be obvious to everyone the U.S. only lends verbal support to the Philippines. With Obama's pledge of $30 million to the Philippines in military aid for 2012, the Filipinos can't even buy a single $35 million American Chinook helicopter.

    The real message from the U.S. to the Philippines: You're on your own against China. Good luck!

    Reference: Boeing CH-47 Chinook - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
  12. ChineseTiger1986

    ChineseTiger1986 ELITE MEMBER

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    How about buying more Brahmos missiles from our Shupa Powa India? :coffee:
     
  13. AADHAAR

    AADHAAR FULL MEMBER

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    Throw out your CPC govt... and you could prevent the use of Brahmos and anything else...

    You still have some time to make the choice...
     
  14. AADHAAR

    AADHAAR FULL MEMBER

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    Note the language .... and listen to Hitler's speeches about Sudetenland.

    There should be no "Munich pact" offered to China... the world must learn from history.

    And it's good for Chinese as well .... Japan luckily escaped with only Nagasaki and Hiroshima.

    China will not be spared so cheaply ... given the technological progress. Pacific Ocean could be made to overlow the populated eastern one-third of china (i.e. the real china, east of the chinese wall).

    World population will shrink by about 1.3 billion or so... and land area will also reduce.

    But, the chinese people are being warned.... in advance. take care.
     
  15. harpoon

    harpoon ELITE MEMBER

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    Phillipines inviting back US troops, Japan & Korea arming herself, Taiwan buying more weapons, India trying to reorient her troops to the North, US marine base in Australia..even Vietnam who lost millions of men fighting US is now allying herself with that country. So other then the ever subservient Pakistan, almost all of China's neighbors are in one way or another pissed off at PRC.