Second World War

[shehbazi2001]

While reading about german offensives in mainland Europe and against Britain, I noticed one difference related to Operation Sea Lion.

Operation Sea Lion seems not to have followed the spirit of Blitzkrieg. Blitzkrieg was the simultaneous attack of german armour, infantry and air force. Blitzkrieg tactics won them victories in France, Poland and other european countries.

But when it came to attack on Britain, the Operation Sea Lion, Hitler waited for the Luftwaffe to finish off the RAF. In my view this was unrealistic to talk of finishing off an air force. I dont know why the was Blitzkrieg not adopted for Britain as it would only include one more arm, the Navy. The channel is a short distance to cover. German forces would have needed air cover only, not air superiority.

The RAF would have been exterminated by taking over the air bases and occupying the land. The Allies did the same thing to Luftwaffe. Allies did not root out Luftwaffe. They advanced on the land and destroyed or captured german air bases.

What other members think of this unique feature of Operation Sea Lion??

 

[vish]

I dont know why the was Blitzkrieg not adopted for Britain as it would only include one more arm, the Navy. The channel is a short distance to cover.

Royal Navy

 

[JK!]

Logistics would have been an absolute nightmare for the German army on account of having to cross the channel.

Also during the battle of Britain because of the distance the German fighters were flying they only had enough fuel for a half hour sortie.

 

[ejaz007]

Manpower could have been one issue. Germans were busy on a number of fronts and sparing army for this front might not be possible.

 

[JK!]

Manpower could have been one issue. Germans were busy on a number of fronts and sparing army for this front might not be possible.

Hmm not really at this point in the war it was mostly expansion in Europe the eastern front wasn't on the go yet.

The efforts of the RAF are frequently credited as saving Britain through a combination of radar, good fighters and fighting on home turf.

 

[shehbazi2001]

During the preparation of Operation Sea Lion, or say during Battle of Britain, the Russian front was not yet opened.

Manpower was not a problem at that time. For factories, germans were using Prisoners of War. Even the secret V-2 rockets were made by Prisoners of War and sometimes they tried to do wrong with rockets but the german quality engineer would spot it.

Yes the flying time over England was limited and Luftwaffe could not reach the aircraft manufacturing factories located further away to west and this was a great disadvantage.
Attack on aircraft factories was more important than targeting airbases.

The Royal Navy was not a great problem for landings because Luftwaffe concentrated on RAF but still Luftwaffe sunk many british ships in the channel.

 

[shehbazi2001]

Logistics would have been an absolute nightmare for the German army on account of having to cross the channel.

Also during the battle of Britain because of the distance the German fighters were flying they only had enough fuel for a half hour sortie.

Logistics was not the main issue there. Britain is not far away from Germany, especially after Germans occupied France. The distance from the beaches of France to UK is not that much, one can see the british shore from french side with help of telescopes.

After D-Day landings on Normandy in 1944, Allies built aritifical harbors near the shore of France, called Mulburries. Through Mulburries, all of the heavy equipment and material was easily shifted to the land. So for the big armies, logisitics may be a problem only at very long ranges and not at short ranges.

 

[vish]

The Royal Navy was not a great problem for landings because Luftwaffe concentrated on RAF but still Luftwaffe sunk many british ships in the channel.

True; many ships were sunk.

An amphibious attack needs immense preparation and a very very good navy; the Nazis did not have these. The Nazis intended to mine the Channel to keep Royal Navy at bay. To mine the channel, you need tactical dominance; this the Nazis never were capable of.

Luftwaffe sank many ships, but was in no position to guarantee the safety of the Wermacht forces crossing the channel. The Royal Navy would have ensured the failure of the landings.

Further, you are ignoring the most important parts: reserves and logistics.

 

[JK!]

Logistics was not the main issue there. Britain is not far away from Germany, especially after Germans occupied France. The distance from the beaches of France to UK is not that much, one can see the british shore from french side with help of telescopes.

After D-Day landings on Normandy in 1944, Allies built aritifical harbors near the shore of France, called Mulburries. Through Mulburries, all of the heavy equipment and material was easily shifted to the land. So for the big armies, logisitics may be a problem only at very long ranges and not at short ranges.

Yes but the German navy lacked the capability to conduct amphibious landings in the style of D Day.

Therefore I would refrain from comparing Operation Sea lion to Overlord due to the difference in time over the course of the war.

Most British ships sunk were on account of the German U boat menace.

 

[shehbazi2001]

Yes perhaps I was wrong in saying that RN was not a problem. It was due to the fact that during Battle of the Britain, Luftwaffe focussed on defeating RAF and not the RN ie main threat was understood to be RAF.

If we look at the attack of German forces on France, the British forces there, called British Expeditionary Force had to flee to Dunkirk and were evacuated from there, called Operation Dynamo.

Hitler gave the responsibility of destroying the fleeing british forces to Goering, the Luftwaffe boss. Luftwaffe inflicted serious damage to the evacuating armies despite some air cover provided by RAF.

The point is that British Expeditionary Force somehow succeeded in getting out of France, crossing the channel and reaching England. All this despite heavy aerial attacks by Luftwaffe. This evacuation means that Royal Navy was good and German Navy was not capable at that time to stop the evacuation work, although it did sink some ships.

After just a short span of time, the Germans were not able to cross the channel and waited for the complete destruction of RAF. Additionally at that time, the German U-boats were operating very successfully but in smaller numbers. The U-boats lost their effectiveness only around 1943.

One other thing that needs to be studied are the German Battleships, the Dreadnoughts like Bismark. A little search on internet says that Bismark, which was designed for Atlantic naval battles, was yet not operational.

All this show that Kreigsmarine was yet not powerful enough at that time as compared to Royal Navy.

 

[GFM_EhsanUlHaq]

I think lack of co operation between Kreigsmaraine and luftwaffe and the Hitler behaviour to his generals and commander leads failure to not only Operation sea lion but other operations like market garden and barbarosa......
If hitler have not commanded the army and gave it to Manstein or Rommel,, Histroy might have changed......

 

[bandit]

I think lack of co operation between Kreigsmaraine and luftwaffe and the Hitler behaviour to his generals and commander leads failure to not only Operation sea lion but other operations like market garden and barbarosa......
If hitler have not commanded the army and gave it to Manstein or Rommel,, Histroy might have changed......

Operation Market Garden was an Allied invasion of Holland, not Nazi Germany's.

 

[GFM_EhsanUlHaq]

Operation Market Garden was an Allied invasion of Holland, not Nazi Germany's.

Bandit i know and i am saying that they could be better executed if hitler have given the command to his generals...