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Round One JF17 - Poor Display By Tejas Took 10 more sec Than JF17 To Go Up

Dont even play the card "oh we got sanctioned by americans" which caused delays to LCA project. Its incompetency on Indian side that even with France, Sweden, Germany, GB, Israel, Russia, and US support India is struggled for 4 decades with this project. US placed sanctions in end of 1990s and then lifted in early 2000s..


The only homework you guys do here is just copy paste from wikipeedia and bahratraksaw...

As if u have done your homework , genius (i would much harsher rebuke if it wasn't PDF) ....

Read this : US ends export controls for India, lifts ban on ISRO, DRDO . That was in 2011 . Read the year again . It was in 2011 .

http://www.hindustantimes.com/world...n-isro-drdo/story-OsWnlzvnadl0zEX5y4oTsN.html


" The US on Monday cleared the way for the resumption of high technology defense and aerospace exports to India ending a restrictive control mechanism in place since the Pokhran II nuclear tests in 1998.
Nine Indian state-owned defense and aerospace companies were taken off the list of entities to which US companies cannot sell dual-use technology – with both civilian and military uses – without their government’s permission.
India is also being placed in a category of countries free to import from the US material that could be used in the construction of missiles or nuclear, chemical and biological weapons, but not verifiably intended for such use.
Though the dismantling of the export controls was announced by President Barack Obama on his November tour of India, it became effective Monday with the publication of a notice updating the US’s Export Administration Regulations.
The third part of the deal – membership for India to international export control regimes such as the Nuclear Suppliers Group and the missile technology control regime, an administration official said, work is under way.
Commerce secretary Gary Locke, whose department made these changes, called them a “significant milestone’ and said “moving forward with export control reforms … will facilitate high technology trade and cooperation”.
But here is what this means, minus the hype and the jargon.
“Indian entities not directly involved in the nuclear weapons program will be able to import a range of dual-use technologies far more easily than they have in the past,” said Ashley Tellis, former US official closely involved with the India-US nuclear deal.
A delegation of 24 US companies is going to India with Locke early February in search of such export orders in these same sectors of high-technology defense and aerospace decontrolled on Monday.
It has not been a highly lucrative trade for either country yet – amounting to less than one per cent of the annual turnover of $36 billion. But there is a huge potential here. It is the “greatest market of opportunities”, said an administration official.
The controls never took the shape of sanction except in the early years since 1998. As relations between the two countries improved the nature of the controls changed from being blanket to case-by-case.
But the rollback was anything but easy. It was on the wish list of the Indian government constantly since the signing of the India-US civilian use nuclear deal, which loudly proclaimed India’s return to the fold.
The rest should have followed. But didn’t, not as smoothly as expected. The negotiations were painstakingly slow and often seemed in the way of the two countries’ desire to see the same obstacle go.
“Sometimes too slowly – but surely – the obstacles are being removed that impede a more robust U.S.-India economic ties,” said Karl Inderfurth, former assistant secretary of state with longstanding expertise on South Asia.
The controls are not gone completely though.
For one, India can’t buy a nuclear submarine if it wanted to. There are other controls still in place, imposed by other departments such as state and defense and applicable, and enforced indiscriminately by the US on its closest allies. "

That only proves India is world class pathological liars who steal others credits.
USA was not the only nation involved in this project, as India had multiple companies involved in this project so if one company got kicked out or pulled out on its own another was in line. Initially US was in charge of FCS but after sanctions France took in charge of FCS...

This individual contributed a lot more to LCA FCS then entire team of Indian on LCA program. lol

https://fr.linkedin.com/in/olivier-volto-8824482b
Consultant for Indian Light Control Aircraft (LCA), Flight Control System
CASSIDIAN
février 2009 – août 2013 (4 ans 7 mois)Région de Bengaluru , Inde

EADS single point of contact for Indian Light Combat Aircraft Consultancy program (w.r.t. Air Data System and Wake Penetration Flights)

- Successful and thorough review of the complete FCS Air Data System Design of the Indian combat aircraft LCA "Tejas"
- Identification of design issues and proposal for alternative concepts/architectures
- Design recommendations for 6 DoF wake penetration simulations
- Establishment of a Qualification, Verification and Validation Concept for the Wake penetration flights behind target aircraft (based on simulations and on flight testing)

Award: Cassidian Air Systems Engineering Award 2011 “Top Innovation or Design” with Indian LCA Consultancy Team


Its like saying Whole US space program of NASA and Missile development by USAF wasn't indigenous since they were developed under the close guidance and mentorship of of captured Nazi German scientist Wernher von Braun and his German associate .

See irrespective of where parts and tech comes , HAL of India is the sole designer and manufacture of the aircraft called LCA Tejas where as in case of JF-17 even the screws and bolts are made in china .
 
Come out of your princely delusions, have you not seen the never-ending price cut negotiations on Rafael?
It's not because you can afford it financially, it's only because you can't afford to not have a reliable "foreign" equipment because untill now you have not been able to develop anything worthwhile despite spending decades in time and billions in Rupees and the few ones that have don't stand a chance in a war

B what is this blabbering for? what 100 units are you talking about?

Rivets are flying and selling, composites are rotting in the warehouse or piggybacking on tata truck

lol, because we can afford it.

B) we have 4th largest army, 5th largest AF and 7th largest Navy,

Whatever weapons Thunder has, are operational, your space-age weapons are good for what? put them on tata truck instead

IAF already convinced and order 100+ units and after that more advance, IAF is not in a desperate like PAF.

In the last 4 decades they master the composite planes , where your JFT still made on using Rivets and 70's technology , despite being made in 1990.

Your JFT don't have many weapons which Tejas already had , moreover IAF not even consider JFT type plane worth of considering, if offered.
 
Come out of your princely delusions, have you not seen the never-ending price cut negotiations on Rafael?
It's not because you can afford it financially, it's only because you can't afford to not have a reliable "foreign" equipment because untill now you have not been able to develop anything worthwhile despite spending decades in time and billions in Rupees and the few ones that have don't stand a chance in a war

B what is this blabbering for? what 100 units are you talking about?

Rivets are flying and selling, composites are rotting in the warehouse or piggybacking on tata truck
price Nego is something which everyone do , we are good buyers and not fools and make every penny counts.

I think you better look into , Indian's Already started and developing things. Yes , SLBM , SAM, Choppers etc are developed by you,

100 + units of tejas I am talking about ....... First look into yourself and then talk with us. you always buys 2nd equipment OR Either Donated OR Used ones. at least we can afford the new one.

The Rafael you are talking about you cant even afford a single Unit.
 
Why can't both the counties accept that the other has a fighter program, indeginous or not, and the fighters are pretty deadly. There is only one way to find out which jet is better then the other and that's in actual war which won't be happening any time soon. So just buzz off. What a wasted thread this turned out to be
 
Why can't both the counties accept that the other has a fighter program, indeginous or not, and the fighters are pretty deadly. There is only one way to find out which jet is better then the other and that's in actual war which won't be happening any time soon. So just buzz off. What a wasted thread this turned out to be

Mourning Sage - bhai sahab, this thread wasn't created by the two countries. It was created by one of the members and it has done nothing but feed the troll-trash exponentially - barring a very few KNOWLEDGABLE people on both sides who appreciate the weaknesses and strengths of each others nations. I bet 99% of posters on this thread defending their respective country's aircrafts haven't even sat in a fighter pilot's seat, leave alone anything else.
 
That only proves India is world class pathological liars who steal others credits.


So what exactly you are trying to say? Every system takes time to develop. Concept of Rafale was first drawn in 1975 and finally inducted in 2001. Yes, LCA took little more time to induct. But atleast we are induct a indigenous fighter after dealy, unlike you PAF which is inducting F16 now as USA put ban on sale after 1989.

Anyway, you can bark as much as you can. What you really learnt!
 
@MastanKhan ,
Sir, sorry to be a bit late to comment on your well observed analyst....however you seem to have missed out on pointing out the advantage and disadvantage of the respective aircraft performance. While Indians are claiming that the Tejas lifted off quicker than the Thunder, they fail to understand that the Tejas still needed to bare down the runway in an effort to gain speed and energy to gain altitude. The JF-17 may have taken longer to lift off but it reached the same altitude some 15 seconds quicker where it had to level out to conduct it's performance.....the Indian members are also reminded that it was NO low pass by their aircraft rather the video captures the Tejas at the end of it's take off run before it shoots up, and those comparing with the F-22 attitude should remember that the American aircraft has super cruise capability, it bares down the runway not to build up speed but rather to demonstrate it's TVC to the audience.
Here's a scenario, say there's a sudden enemy raid on each base, and both aircraft scramble.....which has a better chance of survival......the one that has reached a safe altitude to engage the attackers or the one still baring down the runway.......in all probability.....Tejas will be toast.
 
Here's a scenario, say there's a sudden enemy raid on each base, and both aircraft scramble.....which has a better chance of survival......the one that has reached a safe altitude to engage the attackers or the one still baring down the runway.......in all probability.....Tejas will be toast.

Here's a scenario, say there's a sudden enemy raid on each base, nd both the runways are destroyed partially...which one will have better change of being able to short take off for scramble......in all probability....jf17 wont b available for toastig

@Abingdonboy @PARIKRAMA @Manas @SpArK @Penguin your views :lol::lol::lol::lol:
 
Here's a scenario, say there's a sudden enemy raid on each base, nd both the runways are destroyed partially...which one will have better change of being able to short take off for scramble......in all probability....jf17 wont b available for toastig

@Abingdonboy @PARIKRAMA @Manas @SpArK @Penguin your views :lol::lol::lol::lol:

Pity the HF-24 pilots can't share your views as what happens before or after the raid. :cheesy:
 
Hi,


What a joke this display is---the aircraft releases brake at 5:29---wheels up at 5:41---sticks its wheels in at 5:49---and keeps on flying low to gain speed till 5:59---ie is 10 seconds and when it gathers speed---and when it has enough energy buildup---it goes up---.

30 seconds---half a minute-----

What a chicken sh-it lack of power display----
Please listen to commentator at 3:50-4:00 explaining what will be done during take off and why. And again 5:57. This is not representative of a normal take off. Nor is the display flight of the JF-17. You can only compare if you have both aircraft do exactly the same thing.
 
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Why you want to wake him up?
I'm not commenting on a person but on a statement, on the nature of a comparison made. Besides, here we are on page 26, and I'm waking someone up? Different wing geometry and hence low speed handling may also be a factor.
 
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