India vehemently ratifies the two nation theory after 8 decades of denial.

[MilSpec]

View attachment 30823

Today after 8 decades of self inflicted denial the Hindu majority of India have finally ratified the two nation theory for themselves, by themselves on the democratic ballot box without compulsion or coercion. A resounding victory for the Hindu nationalist leader Narendra Singh Modi indeed is a new chapter in South Asian history. For his Hindu nation he represents a strong leader, for Muslims of India he remains the butcher of Gujarat with blood on his hands.

With his fundamental support coming from the right wing Hindu camp of the BJP being sufficient for such a victory, the BJP did not care about the Muslim vote for the first time ever. They were simply sidelined as no effective election campaign was mounted to attract the Muslim vote. This electoral segregation will have a deep imprint and strategic implications on Indian social makeup of the future. Since the Muslim vote is not included, their participation in an overwhelmingly BJP govt will cease to exist.

For Pakistan it marks the end of an ideological battle spanning 8 decades. This is a victory we must celebrate, as our historic pretext has dawned into the day of correctness and approval. Visionaries who coined the two nation theory saw this day coming 8 decades ago. Its because of their genius, connection to our past, hard work and sacrifices that we Pakistanis today see the dawn of a day which proved us 'historically right' from this side of the border. It also therefore proves that the struggle of our ancestors for independence was both historically correct and strategically right, henceforth the long treacherous journey, that has tested the Pakistani time and again, has been worth it.

What tomorrow holds for India's Muslim is unknown, though for us we can finally rest this debate and move on with our nation building, knowing that our struggle had been righteous despite the tact of Gandhi and Nehru in order to convince our forefathers to the contrary. Those who asked us for proofs and ridiculed us, themselves have democratically ratified the robustness and righteousness of our historic narrative.

Let it be a source of humility and confidence for the Pakistani, as those who conspired to mislead our march in the past, today find themselves marching willingly and proudly along a parallel route, the same route our ancestors had created. Today we can safely write this for the historians that the future of sub continent was shaped by none other than our ancestors.

"The truth can only be delayed"

Aeronaut.

Dear Friend:

I appreciate the well articulated take on the Indian election but, vehemently oppose the point of view presented. The overwhelming national mandate by the populace of India to BJP led National Democratic Alliance is not based on hindu identity but a vast bank of major flaws with the incumbent government.

There has been a saying for a very long time that " India's growth is not due to the government but despite it". This tongue and cheek insult to the leadership has long been a common sentiment among the massive emerging middle class in India. This phrase is an embodiment of the decade long stifling imposed on an aspiring young country. Congress would have been long defeated if a significant focused opposition was ever presented. And to experience this discontent, we do not need to look elsewhere, ample threads exist on this very forum where eminent members have time and again expressed their displeasure over, gross corruption, institutional inaction, weak and indecisive leadership, spineless foreign policy, and the culture of reprimand that has seeped into the bureaucratic structure leading to zero ownership of reformative policies.

This public anger is not just limited to certain Indian members on this forum but indicative across the demographic structure they represent in their geographical and social scale of India. Series of early indicators of this anti-incumbent sentiment was consistently represented in the events that unfolded in last few years, Medical Strike, India Against Corruption AAP etc were precursors for India demanding decisive reforms in the political leadership which now the people realized is the root cause of issues plaguing the development of people of India. Narendra Modi and his style of policy is exactly what appeals as the solution needed by the country, so much that even in 2009, there were mellow voices suggesting him to be the prime runner. More than the party choosing a candidate, this election chose Modi to be prime candidate. If some one like Advani was chosen instead, the outcome would have been the exact opposite.

Narendra Modi; started as Sangh Pracharak, (volunteer corp of RSS); and in his development he was associated with the Jan Sangh, and later BJP, and if you look closely he is known to be a master strategist for BJP. Within his experience the aspirations of people is very well known to him along with his core advisers. To paint him just by the events of the godhra riot's is obfuscation of the policies and agenda which the country voted on. Modi even to his critics like me, represents strong leadership and that is exactly what he promised to provide.

BJP led NDA fought a three pronged election where they presented strong decisive pro business environment which aligned them with Corporate sector, traders, big farms and the upper middle class. BJP also promised transparent government, Economic development and decisive leadership which found overwhelming support in the middle class of India, And the third most important issue was small business promotion, tax reforms, project execution, and highlighting the failures of the UPA2 ensured acceptance in the lower economic strata. Pre poll alliances and good execution in selection process of candidate ensure better representation of lower caste communities aligning themselves with the realities of remote rural demographics.

On the flip-side, taking a card from the AAP's delhi success, Congress and it's ill fated leadership ran a completely negative campaign of irrelevant issues, hapless agenda, hit and run remarks. Now a negative campaign can only take you to a certain length, which seems to be 42 seats, But when compared to a recipe of a well focused, well planned developmental agenda that promises measurable and quantifiable change, the selection of the Indian public is fairly a very simple one...

I can't help but draw a similarity between your view and that of the incumbent government's, where the presumption is that the population of India will vote on irrelevant issues of vote-bank appeasement instead of development. Suggesting the cumulative mandate of an 800 million strong electorate as just a Hindu vote is completely oblivious to the aspirations of India.

Regards.

 

[Abingdonboy]

@Abingdonboy

• We have no reason to be scared.
• A historic record has been set straight today in India by Indians.

Good for you! I remember analogies being made between Imran Khan and Modi, both progressive and promised development. It must hurt that Modi got into office and by a significant majority against Imran Khan...

I'm pretty convinced a lot of the anti-Modi sentiment shown by Pakistani members here is fuelled significantly by jealousy whether they'd care to admit it to themselves or not. The "Hindu fanatic", "butcher" etc are all just an attempt to justify their dislike for the situation.


But let's admit it, most educated and aware Paksitanis would give their left arms for a leader like Modi who promises development and economy first and has been elected into a position with the ability to do so thanks to the number of seats who won.


The fact is you know under Modi India is going to be moving foreword whilst your country is floundering with the second-rate politicians like NS and Zadari. India is getting away from you and it kills you.

 

[Kompromat]

Dear Friend:

I appreciate the well articulated take on the Indian election but, vehemently oppose the point of view presented. The overwhelming national mandate by the populace of India to BJP led National Democratic Alliance is not based on hindu identity but a vast bank of major flaws with the incumbent government.

There has been a saying for a very long time that " India's growth is not due to the government but despite it". This tongue and cheek insult to the leadership has long been a common sentiment among the massive emerging middle class in India. This phrase is an embodiment of the decade long stifling imposed on an aspiring young country. Congress would have been long defeated if a significant focused opposition was ever presented. And to experience this discontent, we do not need to look elsewhere, ample threads exist on this very forum where eminent members have time and again expressed their displeasure over, gross corruption, institutional inaction, weak and indecisive leadership, spineless foreign policy, and the culture of reprimand that has seeped into the bureaucratic structure leading to zero ownership of reformative policies.

This public anger is not just limited to certain Indian members on this forum but indicative across the demographic structure they represent in their geographical and social scale of India. Series of early indicators of this anti-incumbent sentiment was consistently represented in the events that unfolded in last few years, Medical Strike, India Against Corruption AAP etc were precursors for India demanding decisive reforms in the political leadership which now the people realized is the root cause of issues plaguing the development of people of India. Narendra Modi and his style of policy is exactly what appeals as the solution needed by the country, so much that even in 2009, there were mellow voices suggesting him to be the prime runner. More than the party choosing a candidate, this election chose Modi to be prime candidate. If some one like Advani was chosen instead, the outcome would have been the exact opposite.

Narendra Modi; started as Sangh Pracharak, (volunteer corp of RSS); and in his development he was associated with the Jan Sangh, and later BJP, and if you look closely he is known to be a master strategist for BJP. Within his experience the aspirations of people is very well known to him along with his core advisers. To paint him just by the events of the godhra riot's is obfuscation of the policies and agenda which the country voted on. Modi even to his critics like me, represents strong leadership and that is exactly what he promised to provide.

BJP led NDA fought a three pronged election where they presented strong decisive pro business environment which aligned them with Corporate sector, traders, big farms and the upper middle class. BJP also promised transparent government, Economic development and decisive leadership which found overwhelming support in the middle class of India, And the third most important issue was small business promotion, tax reforms, project execution, and highlighting the failures of the UPA2 ensured acceptance in the lower economic strata. Pre poll alliances and good execution in selection process of candidate ensure better representation of lower caste communities aligning themselves with the realities of remote rural demographics.

On the flip-side, taking a card from the AAP's delhi success, Congress and it's ill fated leadership ran a completely negative campaign of irrelevant issues, hapless agenda, hit and run remarks. Now a negative campaign can only take you to a certain length, which seems to be 42 seats, But when compared to a recipe of a well focused, well planned and agenda that promises measurable and quantifiable change, the selection of the Indian public is fairly a very simple one...

I can't help but draw a similarity between your view and that of the incumbent government's, where the presumption is that the population of India will vote on irrelevant issues of vote-bank appeasement instead of development. Suggesting the cumulative mandate of an 800 million strong electorate as just a Hindu vote is completely oblivious to the aspirations of India.

I appreciate your thoughts.

 

[Gandhi G in da house]

In Muhammad Ali Jinnah's All India Muslim League presidential address delivered in Lahore, on March 22, 1940, he explained:


“ It is extremely difficult to appreciate why our Hindu friends fail to understand the real nature of Islam and Hinduism. They are not religions in the strict sense of the word, but are, in fact, different and distinct social orders, and it is a dream that the Hindus and Muslims can ever evolve a common nationality, and this misconception of one Indian nation has troubles and will lead India to destruction if we fail to revise our notions in time. The Hindus and Muslims belong to two different religious philosophies, social customs, litterateurs. They neither intermarry nor interdine together and, indeed, they belong to two different civilizations which are based mainly on conflicting ideas and conceptions ......... "


In India , Do Muslims and Hindus intermarry freely ?? Do they prefer to interdine together ?? Do they follow same customs , philosophies , literature etc. ?? And if they don`t , they are not one nation ... and this is what Two Nation Theory stands for .....

Two Nation Theory will fail only when The Hindus and Muslims of India will evolve a common nationality , .. and this isn`t going to happen ever !!

Jinnah`s interpretation of TNT argued for sovereign autonomy, including the right to secede, for Muslim-majority areas of the Indian subcontinent, but without any transfer of populations (i.e. Hindus and Muslims would continue to live together) , So the assertion that TNT failed when a lot of Muslims decided to stay in India , is baseless ......

Intermarry ? No they don't. Interdine ? Yes they do. Especially in urban areas and amongst the youth it is very common.

Customs, philosophies and literature , yes a lot of all that is common.

But a lot more goes into making a nation then intermarriage my wise friend.

The common history we the Indian Muslims and Hindus share, both being native to this land.

The culture, the family values, the dreams and aspirations of jobs and development and a good house and a comfortable life.

Sporting culture , the movies and entertainment we watch, the languages we speak, the music we listen to, the food we eat, the places where go out ot shop, to eat , for entertainment.

The democratic tradition also of course.

All of the above is common.

There is far more in common between Indian Muslims and Hindus than you would ever understand since you barely have any hindus in your country and even those few are largely not a part of your mainstream.

I would sincerely request you to focus on your country and not try to drive a wedge between Indian Muslims and Hindus by making posts like these and pretending that you know anything about India. Until now Pakistanis have always tried to distance themselves from Indians, now don't try to distance Indian Muslims from other Indians. That is out of your jurisdiction.

 

[Kompromat]

Good for you! I remember analogies being made between Imran Khan and Modi, both progressive and promised development. It must hurt that Modi got into office and by a significant majority against Imran Khan...

I'm pretty convinced a lot of the anti-Modi sentiment shown by Pakistani members here is fuelled significantly by jealousy whether they'd care to admit it to themselves or not. The "Hindu fanatic", "butcher" etc are all just an attempt to justify their dislike for the situation.

But let's admit it, most educated and aware Paksitanis would give their left arms for a leader like Modi who promises development and economy first and has been elected into a position with the ability to do so thanks to the number of seats who won.

The fact is you know under Modi India is going to be moving foreword whilst your country is floundering with the second-rate politicians like NS and Zadari. India is getting away from you and it kills you.

Indian economic prosperity or stagnation are none of our concerns.

 

[MilSpec]

In Muhammad Ali Jinnah's All India Muslim League presidential address delivered in Lahore, on March 22, 1940, he explained:


“ It is extremely difficult to appreciate why our Hindu friends fail to understand the real nature of Islam and Hinduism. They are not religions in the strict sense of the word, but are, in fact, different and distinct social orders, and it is a dream that the Hindus and Muslims can ever evolve a common nationality, and this misconception of one Indian nation has troubles and will lead India to destruction if we fail to revise our notions in time. The Hindus and Muslims belong to two different religious philosophies, social customs, litterateurs. They neither intermarry nor interdine together and, indeed, they belong to two different civilizations which are based mainly on conflicting ideas and conceptions ......... "


In India , Do Muslims and Hindus intermarry freely ?? Do they prefer to interdine together ?? Do they follow same customs , philosophies , literature etc. ?? And if they don`t , they are not one nation ... and this is what Two Nation Theory stands for .....

Two Nation Theory will fail only when The Hindus and Muslims of India evolve a common nationality , .. and this isn`t going to happen .. ever !!

Jinnah`s interpretation of TNT argued for sovereign autonomy, including the right to secede, for Muslim-majority areas of the Indian subcontinent, but without any transfer of populations (i.e. Hindus and Muslims would continue to live together) , So the assertion that TNT failed when a lot of Muslims decided to stay in India , is baseless ......

What is secularism?

 

[Abingdonboy]

Indian economic prosperity or stagnation are none of our concerns.

Maybe not for you but you don't speak for all Pakistanis. But I have seen for myself Pakistanis on here rejoicing in anything remotely negative being reported on the Indian economy. And let's think about this logically, your nation has proclaimed India as its number one enemy/rival. Now the economy is the number one factor in determining strength, with a strong economy one can do almost anything, with a crippled economy one has less resources to play with.

In this sense a weaker indian economy is exactly what you would want. Or would you rather the conventional military gap increase between India and Pakistan?

No matter sir, just watch this space. India's stock exchange gained almost 1000 points today to a new high of 25,000 points just on the news of Modi becoming PM-elect and this was only day 1. I have no doubts there will be ups and downs under Modi but as a cynic even I would have to concede there was no better candidate than Modi to lead India to a new period of prosperity and power.

 

[MilSpec]

Indian economic prosperity or stagnation are none of our concerns.

If I was you, It would be a very grave concern... When you refereed to strategic concerns, the most important one in this age is economic.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Dear Friend:

I appreciate the well articulated take on the Indian election but, vehemently oppose the point of view presented. The overwhelming national mandate by the populace of India to BJP led National Democratic Alliance is not based on hindu identity but a vast bank of major flaws with the incumbent government.

There has been a saying for a very long time that " India's growth is not due to the government but despite it". This tongue and cheek insult to the leadership has long been a common sentiment among the massive emerging middle class in India. This phrase is an embodiment of the decade long stifling imposed on an aspiring young country. Congress would have been long defeated if a significant focused opposition was ever presented. And to experience this discontent, we do not need to look elsewhere, ample threads exist on this very forum where eminent members have time and again expressed their displeasure over, gross corruption, institutional inaction, weak and indecisive leadership, spineless foreign policy, and the culture of reprimand that has seeped into the bureaucratic structure leading to zero ownership of reformative policies.

This public anger is not just limited to certain Indian members on this forum but indicative across the demographic structure they represent in their geographical and social scale of India. Series of early indicators of this anti-incumbent sentiment was consistently represented in the events that unfolded in last few years, Medical Strike, India Against Corruption AAP etc were precursors for India demanding decisive reforms in the political leadership which now the people realized is the root cause of issues plaguing the development of people of India. Narendra Modi and his style of policy is exactly what appeals as the solution needed by the country, so much that even in 2009, there were mellow voices suggesting him to be the prime runner. More than the party choosing a candidate, this election chose Modi to be prime candidate. If some one like Advani was chosen instead, the outcome would have been the exact opposite.

Narendra Modi; started as Sangh Pracharak, (volunteer corp of RSS); and in his development he was associated with the Jan Sangh, and later BJP, and if you look closely he is known to be a master strategist for BJP. Within his experience the aspirations of people is very well known to him along with his core advisers. To paint him just by the events of the godhra riot's is obfuscation of the policies and agenda which the country voted on. Modi even to his critics like me, represents strong leadership and that is exactly what he promised to provide.

BJP led NDA fought a three pronged election where they presented strong decisive pro business environment which aligned them with Corporate sector, traders, big farms and the upper middle class. BJP also promised transparent government, Economic development and decisive leadership which found overwhelming support in the middle class of India, And the third most important issue was small business promotion, tax reforms, project execution, and highlighting the failures of the UPA2 ensured acceptance in the lower economic strata. Pre poll alliances and good execution in selection process of candidate ensure better representation of lower caste communities aligning themselves with the realities of remote rural demographics.

On the flip-side, taking a card from the AAP's delhi success, Congress and it's ill fated leadership ran a completely negative campaign of irrelevant issues, hapless agenda, hit and run remarks. Now a negative campaign can only take you to a certain length, which seems to be 42 seats, But when compared to a recipe of a well focused, well planned developmental agenda that promises measurable and quantifiable change, the selection of the Indian public is fairly a very simple one...

I can't help but draw a similarity between your view and that of the incumbent government's, where the presumption is that the population of India will vote on irrelevant issues of vote-bank appeasement instead of development. Suggesting the cumulative mandate of an 800 million strong electorate as just a Hindu vote is completely oblivious to the aspirations of India.

Regards.

I'm sorry but on this topic @Aeronaut sir is stuck in a VERY backward mindset and unable to understand how INDIANS are able to look beyond petty things like caste, creed, colour and religion for the greater good of their country. I guess one can expect this from a nation where the notion of national identity is as weak as it is in Pakistan.

 

[Kompromat]

If I was you, It would be a very grave concern... When you refereed to strategic concerns, the most important one in this age is economic.

India's economy is for Indians to worry about. Modi's economic performance will only be deemed after five years. As per some experts the BJP will face great hurdles in recovering Indian economy.

 

[Abingdonboy]

If I was you, It would be a very grave concern... When you refereed to strategic concerns, the most important one in this age is economic.

Precisely.

 

[Kompromat]

I'm sorry but on this topic @Aeronaut sir is stuck in a VERY backward mindset and unable to understand how INDIANS are able to look beyond petty things like caste, creed, colour and religion for the greater good of their country. I guess one can expect this from a nation where the notion of national identity is as weak as it is in Pakistan.

You are failing to appreciate the indifference we feel towards India. What happens there doesn't affect us directly therefore no one cares. India has gotten over the cast, religious divide or it hasn't is something that has no implications on Pakistan nor it is our issue or business. You are missing the crux of this debate.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Intermarry ? No they don't. Interdine ? Yes they do. Especially in urban areas and amongst the youth it is very common.

So you admit ... and I hope you understand that The Urban Area Youth does not represent the whole of India ...

Customs, philosophies and literature , yes a lot of all that is common.

Denial ?? or is it your ignorance ??

The common history we the Indian Muslims and Hindus share, both being native to this land.

Yes , But the hero of one is a foe of the other and, likewise, their victories and defeats overlap !!

the dreams and aspirations of jobs and development and a good house and a comfortable life.

That is something universal , has more to do with human nature ... And if that is your definition of a "nation" , then mankind , as a whole , is one nation ...

I would sincerely request you to focus on your country and not try to drive a wedge between Indian Muslims and Hindus by making posts like these and pretending that you know anything about India. Until now Pakistanis have always tried to distance themselves from Indians, now don't try to distance Indian Muslims from other Indians. That is out of your jurisdiction

Learn to accept the truth , Hindus are Hindus , and Muslims are Muslims ... And they can never evolve a common nationality .

 

[Abingdonboy]

India's economy is for Indians to worry about. Modi's economic performance will only be deemed after five years. As per some experts the BJP will face great hurdles in recovering Indian economy.

Such as? And anyway the fundamentals of India's economy are still strong it just need someone with the mandate to do so to tap these and for that Modi with 300+ seats there is few better candidates.

Yes the ship will take a while to turn around but it WILL happen of that you can have no doubt. As I've said, these elections of 2014 were all about development and the economy. If Modi fails he'll be out and someone else will be there but they'll have promise development and growth too to even stand a chance.

Indian elections have changed forever and you need to come to terms with this. It is not about Hindus vs Muslims.

 

[MilSpec]

I'm sorry but on this topic @Aeronaut sir is stuck in a VERY backward mindset and unable to understand how INDIANS are able to look beyond petty things like caste, creed, colour and religion for the greater good of their country. I guess one can expect this from a nation where the notion of national identity is as weak as it is in Pakistan.

Not at all, I actually disagree with you on this too.... Modi might have won over the Indian Electorate, but NOT the most vocal intellectual media elite for their own reasons keep bringing the communal card back over and over again to try and project a hard-line hindu image, for a myriad of different reasons. Foreign nationals and western media who have followed these elites opinions like to play word association games, Modi-Hindu, that's it... It is this Myopia dispersed by Indian Intellectual elites that leads to such theories and concerns propping up against the secular fabric of Indian construct.