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SHAHEEN III actual range 5000 KM ????

Hi dear @Genghis khan1
It isnt really that easy either.We are not talking about DIY rockets but advanced ICBMs that are design to fly more than 5500kms! Let me elaborate based on my own experience-
View attachment 309678

P.C- Missile guidance and control,George M sioris
Journey of any ICBM can be divided into three (in some literature two) stages-
(a)Powered flight
(b)Free fall
(c) Re-entry
Kindly note that both (b) and (c) are free falling.From a purely control engineering perspective,one would need to select optimum burnout point somewhere around 450-500kms altitude for a specific target. The steering of ICBM from launch point to burnout point is perhaps the most difficult and crucial phase of any ICBM as it has to encounter varying dynamic pressure.Now to understand the reason why is this phase most important,requires some decent amount of aerospace engineering.
View attachment 309681
Here is a simplified Free body diagram of a ICBM RV,I have resolved forces in perpendicular direction,hence in perpendicular direction
QSCl*cos(Theta-alpha)=W+QSCd*sin(theta-alpha)---------------------------(1)
Kindly note that I've not included thrust, but it'll appear on the LHS of (1).
where Q is the dynamic pressure,
S=surface area
Cl=coefficient of lift=which again can be approximated by Clalpha*alpha
Cd=coefficient of drag= which again can be approximated by Cd0+k*Cl^2
theta=attittude angle or pitch angle
alpha=AoA
gamma=flight path angle(between velocity vector and the local horizontal)---not shown in the pic
Eqn 1 must be balanced all the time,but the missile is constantly accelerated till the burnout point meaning an ever increasing velocity and hence a varying dynamic pressure Q. For (1) to hold and we wish to keep theta at a certain value(as will become apparent later in my explanation),we would have to have some control over alpha. And alpha can be controlled by elevator deflection or actuating the jet vanes(--like shaheen and other older missiles),or by deflecting the nozzle using a servo-mechanism(in agni-4 or agni-5).
Once it has reached the burnout point,the missile should have a requisite velocity and escape angle denoted by fi(subscript bo) in fig-1.These two parameters are determined by the type of elliptic trajectory we want- again depends on mission profile- whether we want a depressed trajectory or a normal min-energy trajectory.These two parameters are so important that a minor deficiency can lead to huge errors later during the re-entry. Kindly note that fi(bo) is closely related to theta above.
The trajectory after burnout point till re-entry is elliptical with centre of earth being at one of the foci,hence normal elliptical equations apply(considering a TWO-BODY PROBLEM!,for three-body problem involving the effect of other bodies,more robust numerical solutions are required).
With initial conditions fi(bo) and v(bo) we can solve the harmonic differential equation(again posing it as two-body problem) to yield the velocity with which it will splash again into atmosphere at the time of re-entry.I have done a simulation for shaheen missile here-->
https://defence.pk/threads/recent-i...-samar-mubarakmand.430471/page-6#post-8334986

Now the challenges for pakistan-
Here in this section of my post,i will briefly touch upon the engineering challenges being faced by pakistan and i am sure my friends @JamD and @The Deterrent would agree and perhaps shed some more light .
1)To cover a larger distance-downrange,missile must have a higher v(bo) and an optimal angle fi(bo) at burnout point.For a larger vi(bo) one would require a larger motor to accelerate the RV from 0(at the time of launching) to vi(bo) at burnout point. Now keeping aside the control challenges,pakistan would have to first fabricate such a big motor that will take a 1tonne payload from 0 to v(bo).This wont be too difficult to achieve(however i believe in tests and pakistan hasnt really shown such big solid rocket motor),However what is difficult to achieve is "weight reduction" by using composite motors and casing--- which is certainly off limits for pakistan at the moment. This in turns requires complex filament winding machines.The composite must be able to withstand the radial pressure exerted during the powered flight regime---unlike a liquid engine,in solid rocket,entire casing undergoes a radial pressure during itz operation.

2)Secondly pakistan would have to improve controls. They would have to let go external surfaces.Currently,pakistani missiles use external surfaces for stabilization and possibly jet vanes for control. This can be replaced by flex-nozzle with servo-mechanism,however it is much more complex arrangement and again none of the pakistani strategic missiles have been tested with this setup. Kindly note that external control surfaces increase drag!

Really awesome, man....
 
Long range Cruise missiles are more deterrent weapon system than longer range ballistic missiles having huge CEP rates If you ask me. Just concentrate development of 1500-2500km variants of Babur covering almost all hostile nation's strategic grounds and put some nuclear input inside of warhead and enjoy the pin-point accuracy with huge destructive effect.
 
Yes range could be 5000+ if you take it 3000+ kms close to the target and fire it :D

One need to understand, physics plays and important role, the coefficient of burn x fuel is not the only calculation to get the range, weight, wind direction, design and playload are other major factors too.

Given that even small achievements are boasted I would not be surprised is 2750 is extended range of S3.
Even with 2750 km range s3 got india is not 5000+miles away from pakistan you guys are only next door so keep that in mind
 
Yes range could be 5000+ if you take it 3000+ kms close to the target and fire it :D

One need to understand, physics plays and important role, the coefficient of burn x fuel is not the only calculation to get the range, weight, wind direction, design and playload are other major factors too.

Given that even small achievements are boasted I would not be surprised is 2750 is extended range of S3.
I would agree with you if Shaheen III was developed by india.
 
First its range is not less than 3500 KM. Secondly their are massive rumours going on in Army about an ICBM getting tested soon.

Don't spread rumors, Pakistan will not test ICBM even if we have them, because it's strategic blunder, whole west will be running to stop our nuclear program as they will feel threatened, due to Islamic bomb fear.

Pakistan may only show ICBM capability when it's tectonic shift in strategic policy.
 
Some immature lot here suffers from chronic oral diarrhea and keep splattering everywhere without understanding the consequences. Never forget, "lose lips, sink ships"


Don't spread rumors, Pakistan will not test ICBM even if we have them, because it's strategic blunder, whole west will be running to stop our nuclear program as they will feel threatened, due to Islamic bomb fear.

Pakistan may only show ICBM capability when it's tectonic shift in strategic policy.
 
13419222_908371975941654_7485436169420359183_n.jpg


According to a report submitted to US Senate by their National Air and Space Intelligence Center (NASIC) , the actual range of Pakistan's Shaheen-3 missile is 5000 Km. The organization has access to long range radars and plethora of spy satellites with the added bonus of having experience of building missiles since 1950s,so their data and statement is as credible as it gets.
Pakistan is deliberately firing the missile at a lower range of 2750 Kilometres.
The reason of keeping the range lower is to have a higher speed. The fuel which could carry the missile to greater distance, is being used in giving the missile a higher velocity, specially when it re-enters the atmosphere.

https://www.facebook.com/**********...6691342443057/908371975941654/?type=3&theater


Actually Pakistan just requires a range of 3600 KM. Pakistan already has this covered...

upload_2016-11-20_13-53-29.png
 
when india is within our range in missile less than 2000 km y we need such missile??
 
5000 kms may cover russia japan australia and some pat of europe.
 
maybe it is true, cos Wikipedia shows it covers 3500-4500km.
 
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Long range Cruise missiles are more deterrent weapon system than longer range ballistic missiles having huge CEP rates If you ask me. Just concentrate development of 1500-2500km variants of Babur covering almost all hostile nation's strategic grounds and put some nuclear input inside of warhead and enjoy the pin-point accuracy with huge destructive effect.
Trade-off here is cruise missiles are more vulnerable to target nations defenses than a ballistic missile.
 
for shaheen III they closed the airspace from Pakistan to Nigeria or some African country. You can get some hints about its range but its confirmed that the Shaheen III is not 2700 KM missile
 
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