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Pakistan Air Force - The Best Kill Record in the World in defence

:)hahahhahaha....... did he mention superiority of american jets any where .....
:devil:jealous..................

Did you even read my post?Did you try to comprehend what was saying?It is a well known fact that the US was very friendly towards Pakistan at that time.So friendly that she even send an aircraft carrier at the time of the conflict.It would not be wrong to assume that any article written by an American at that time would be favouring Pakistan over India.
 
Best Kill record my tushi.

Everyday NATO voilates our airspace and they do nothing.

What is the freaking point of this record if it doesn't help defend our borders?
 
How does one of the (if not THE) toughest AF training regime in the world (or so it is claimed) 'train' its pilots to NOT expect a fightback and when confronted with the 'fightback' cannot deal with the'surprise'? What kind of pilot training, trains that "Don't worry, you are the Mighty Zionist, the Arabs will not fight you".

Is that what you beleive?

It is not right to quote and use a portion of a post to make a point that is not required. In the very next sentence i have said that this does not undermine the skill set of the PAF pilots.
And by the way just to reply to this post, no air force (or any attacking force) in the world is "trained" to be complacent, however the alertness level of the attacker varies depending on the expectation of resilience of the defender. This same phenomenon was witnessed at the start of the 1965 war when the Indian Army Generals planned a dinner at Lahore Gymkhana on 6th Sept.
 
i think that only plane which can be escape from our air space safely is american drones and american planes because we get money for there ride in air


and
i assure you that if indian planes will violate the pak air space than PAF will remind them there unbreakable record and thats the only reasonthat why india is not doing a surgical strikes

other wise india has no mercy for pakistan
 
Junaab, let me try again. Your information sources astound me. End of story. I am not sure what you take from that other than that you are privy to some information that I as a lay-person do not have. The cheers symbol was just that a symbol of 'co-operation'....not at all implying that they were partying together.

There is a lot more to Israeli-Pak 'co-operation", for example, during Zia's time and the Russian invasion of Afghnistan, as part of the US Aid, Israel refurbished some of our Armoured Corp equipment. That our drones use Israeli equipment bought in the open market is acknowledgement of the US Taxpayer-subsidized Israeli Tech. industry.

The F-16s are no prize to me at all...lot more efficient platforms out there - another story, another time. But us poor Pakistanis take what we can get and hopefully will defend the country or die doing it....


If by open market you refer to the fact that we bought it from a shady fellow not caring where it came from..no..
The arabs would be the first so sell stuff on the open market..they just never had the guts to let go of their four seasons privilege card if they got caught doing it.
The Israeli parts were bought through contacts with Israeli dealers, money going to Israeli companies with Mossad having full knowledge of it...The problem was delivery and payment.
As an example.. the product would be reviewed in a friendly arab state such as Jordan..
Then.. the order would be placed...small quantities..so as not to tick the Americans off.. cash handed over..the parts would go to jordan..and from there onto a PIA flight and bring them here.
Back in the mid 90's you had very little friends in the world... so anything went..and it did.
Since nobody was willing to sell us anything..and we did not think of decoupling the avionics from the JF-17 project yet..those days we were willing to push the edge anywhere to keep those F-16's flying..Including trying a VR simulator for the F-16 pilots with actual physical input back to the pilots..acceleration, actual G's..via nerve inputs...so they can do their physical flying on the ground as well..whilst the airframes don't actually fly.
(if you thought the Israeli thing was unusual..imagine all your F-16 pilots with clean shaven heads as a must)..unfortunately the AF never had the money to provide the neurologists needed to make it work safely...and the people making the thing did not want a pilot's brain fried during experiments.

Btw..anybody seen blain2.. i think he was the one having all those conversations on that particular board.. I dont post too much there.. quite a bit of anti-Pakistan sentiment thrown around.
 
PAF has had a superior track record against IAF with kill ratio of 5:1 in wars. The PAF is a smaller but much more capable air force than the IAF on any given day.

Aviation week & space technology - December 1968 issue. "For the PAF, the 1965 war was as climatic as the Israeli victory over the Arabs in 1967. A further similarity was that Indian air power had an approximately 5:1 numerical superiority at the start of the conflict. Unlike the Middle East conflict, the Pakistani air victory was achieved to a large degree by air-to-air combat rather than on ground. But it was as absolute as that attained by Israel.

UK - Air International - November - 1991 " the average PAF pilot is almost certainly possessed of superior skills when compared with, say, an average American pilot. As to those who are rated above average, they compare favourably to the very best "

Encyclopaedia of Aircraft printed in several countries by Orbis publications - Volume 5 "Pakistan's air force gained a remarkable victory over India in this brief 22 day war exploiting its opponents weaknesses in exemplary style - Deeply shaken by reverse, India began an extensive modernisation and training program, meanwhile covering its defeat with effective propaganda smoke screen. If you feel more at ease with German and French, then also checkout the followings Air Action (France) December 1988 and January 1989 Flugzeug (Germany) February (2) 1989 In addition to this, PAF put on show for inspection, its entire fleets after BOTH of the wars in presence of world dignitaries and aviation community.

---------

some facts:

1-1965 war-> Indian Airforce was no where near the PAF(IAF had got the more planes plus the modern one's of that time but still was defeated heavily)

Source: Wikipedia, Indian official figures and PAF official figures, Harbaksh Singh's confession, NY time etc.

2-PAF fought against Afghan Airforce and got a clear superiority at the end. Please see the stats of First Afghan war.

3-PAF is the only Airforce whose Pilots shot most Israeli planes(Ever shot by anyone else). Check Arab War stats and also see the performance of Saiful Azim(a PAF pilot fought in Arab war against Israel) downed more then 10 Israeli planes. He is positioned in the list of '22 Eagles of the World'. No Indian pilot is named in that list yet.Please check: Saiful Azam

4-If you say that 1971' was the IAF's victory on PAF then i can just smile on this kind of stupidity. There was only Dhaka's base from where PAF could have been active which was destroyed already. Check the kills from both sides. Even in the lost war PAF had more kills then India.

Please check for your consolation:

main-qimg-adecaa5f693b6bf9f5e0ba2164b35636


5-M.M Alam is rewarded to be the ace of the day. 5 Indian jets down in less 1 minute. Just have a look on the aviators who have got this achievement.

Aviators who became ace in a day

I am sorry but there is no Indian in this list just like there was no Indian in the 22 Eagles.

PAF though always remained numerically inferior from the IAF but still it has got such professional pilots who have never given any roam to the enemy on their soil. And one of my Indian friend said that IAF got full superiority in Kargil war. Sorry for my words brother, but---Didn't it feel shame to say this? Because in Kargil war PAF didn't take part and still IAF lost some planes. If there had been PAF what would have been the result then :p

Sorry but everyone has to talk with facts and logic. IAF has never ever got the superiority over PAF not even in the 71'. So please someday try to put the habit of accepting the clear losses.
 
The best kill record goes to the Israeli AF..
82-2 in the Beka valley engagement.
I suggest you look up all the kills of PAF.. including the fact that there was a fratricide in the afghan war by the PAF. It is a good record.. but not the best.
And this thread has all the potential to turn into a bandwidth wasting flamewar.
Similar threads have come and gone.. all have eventually ended up locked.

If my memory serves me right, this was when the Israelis had BVR and the Syrians didn't.
 
Are you some kind of a drugged up joker? What were the Zionist Jewish AF shooting - doves? Fact is, PAF fought air campaign against tyrannical illegal Zionist state and shot down numerous fighters of theirs without incurring any losses of its own in the 1967 Zionist Jew - Arab conflict. The Zionist Jews knew not what hit them. The same is true in 1973 Yom Kippur, as PAF took down 10 Zionist Jew jet fighters, again, without incurring any losses, alhumdulillah! Take a reality check!
Please keep your religiously biased and delusional trash out of this thread. Banned.
 
You cannot make a comparison between Pakistan Air Force and indian air force over here. 1971 war PAF aircraft was outnumbered by 4:1 in West Pakistan and 10:1 in East Pakistan. . .

Maybe in East Pakistan ... I doubt PAF was outnumbered 4:1 in West Pakistan. Maybe the IAF had a 2:1 edge at best.
Israelis faced similar numerical odds against Arab air forces. They come out victors.

On a personal note there are a lot of Israeli experts in radars, signal processing, cryptography and communications. I have not seen very few Pakistanis. I doubt Pakistani air force has the expertise in these areas to wage a war against a high caliber opponent.
 
On a personal note there are a lot of Israeli experts in radars, signal processing, cryptography and communications. I have not seen very few Pakistanis. I doubt Pakistani air force has the expertise in these areas to wage a war against a high caliber opponent.
can u be specific here?
 
Lol. God blessed all of us with the best armed forces in the world. Everyone thinks they have the best, nothing but human nature. I think threads like this only helps keep the patriot kids happy. I don't think any of our air forces been involved in a war lately to gauge their performance. Even the coalition air forces are fighting terrorists who dont have any air support. Is it really a means to gauge performance? If one argues about performance in exercises, which airforce employs their best tactics on exercises with another country? Appreciate everyone's love for their armed forces, but best not belittle others. A wise man never underestimates his opponents. Showing off is the fools idea of glory!

Good Day to all the wise people of PDF!
 
can u be specific here?

this is not scientific basis for drawing conclusions ...

there are tons of Israeli experts. i have meet some of them in signal processing, information theory and cryptography. i have not meet any Pakistani individual in these areas. my geographical domain is North America. The Israeli experts have made Israeli air force a potent fighting arm.

To the degree the Pakistani air force wants to be world class air force you need expertise in these areas. the lack of expertise will degrade your ability to fight a prolonged war against high caliber opponent.
 
this is not scientific basis for drawing conclusions ...

there are tons of Israeli experts. i have meet some of them in signal processing, information theory and cryptography. i have not meet any Pakistani individual in these areas. my geographical domain is North America. The Israeli experts have made Israeli air force a potent fighting arm.

To the degree the Pakistani air force wants to be world class air force you need expertise in these areas. the lack of expertise will degrade your ability to fight a prolonged war against high caliber opponent.

For sake of information , all i want to know is what have Israelis (whom you met) achieved in "signal processing, information theory and cryptography"?
 
For sake of information , all i want to know is what have Israelis (whom you met) achieved in "signal processing, information theory and cryptography"?

Look at what IAI, Rafael, Elbit Systems and other Israeli companies produce. Most of the Isrealis do not work for those companies. They work for NDS (part of Cisco), Intel, Broadcom and other companies. They studied in the same universities the IAI, Rafael, Elbit Systems engineers studied.
 
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