Does pakistan have the ability to strike

[Kaiser]

Does pakistan have the ability to strike land targets with cruise missiles that are launched from subs like babur.

 

[A.Rahman]

Originally posted by Kaiser@Oct 23 2005, 05:43 PM
Does pakistan have the ability to strike land targets with cruise missiles that are launched from subs like babur.

[post=1166]Quoted post[/post]​

Pakistan currently donst have SLCM, but they are working on it... I hope they can have one within 1 - 3 years atmost.

If Pakistan gets its own version of babur SLCM, Then I think it will give us the second strike capability.

I heard we are getting some german submarines, whats the status on that ?

what are our chances of gettin a SLCM with a nuclear submarine ... say within 10 years atmost?

 

[EagleEyes]

There was a news 2-3 weeks ago, that Pakistan will buy 2 Perry Class Frigates, in that news.

It cited that Pakistan will be able to cover the Indian navy threat by 2015, and that India is building nuclear capable submarines, when somebody asked that when are we be able to acquire nuclear submarines.

The official said that, we will not be able to acquire submarines from some other country but we will have to build one, and like you know how things go in our R&D things go behind the scene and they just issue to media when needed.

Pakistan is surely building or at least researching on how to build one behind the scenes and if that R&D haven't been going on from some days than the submarine will sure take sometime.

However, i do believe that Babur cruise missile will soon be capable of being fired from submarines, and it is being worked on.

 

[Sharjeel]

Originally posted by Kaiser@Oct 23 2005, 05:43 PM
Does pakistan have the ability to strike land targets with cruise missiles that are launched from subs like babur.

[post=1166]Quoted post[/post]​

not yet but soon.

we can how ever fire exocet missiles from our subs

http://img.tfd.com/wiki/4/4e/Fr_exocet.jpg

the missile as you can see fits inside an torpedo like shell which after ejection from the torpedo tube come off and the missiles points upright. then the booster is fired and the missile pops ut of the water in an upwards motion.

depending on the size of the babur tubes can be modified to do this!

 

[sigatoka]

Pakistani submarines capable of launching nuclear strikes will signficantly alter the military balance in Pakistan's favour. The current situation where the Pakistan military is not assured of second strike capability is an open invitation of nuclear attack.

The addition of nuclear strike submarines will erase from Indian minds the temptation to launch a pre-emptive nuclear strikes on Pakistan and will therefore contrain India's ability to threaten Pakistan's security in a meaningful way.

Even 1.7 million troops deployed along the LOC will demonstrate the futility of their situation, an all out attack by them will invite nuclear retaliation.

With the use of Kashmiri freedom fighters engaging Indian forces, it will be Pakistan which will be holding all the cards not India.

P.S. the acquisition of nuclear weapons by India was the biggest military blunder in their history. It provided a pretext for Pakistan to acquire nuclear weapons and even the playing field.

 

[miroslav]

Originally posted by sigatoka@Oct 29 2005, 10:34 AM
P.S. the acquisition of nuclear weapons by India was the biggest military blunder in their history. It provided a pretext for Pakistan to acquire nuclear weapons and even the playing field.

[post=1630]Quoted post[/post]​

Indian Navy acquisitions are no more Pakistan oriented.

IN's goals and objectives are far beyond that.

For striking against Pakistan Navy, Indian Navy dosent recquire any Nuke Sub.

Current capabilities of IN are more than enough to hold the nation's fate in the Arabian Sea.

Miro

 

[Pyongyang]

Originally posted by miroslav@Oct 30 2005, 10:36 AM
Indian Navy acquisitions are no more Pakistan oriented.

IN's goals and objectives are far beyond that.

For striking against Pakistan Navy, Indian Navy dosent recquire any Nuke Sub.

Current capabilities of IN are more than enough to hold the nation's fate in the Arabian Sea.

Miro

[post=1718]Quoted post[/post]​

Yeah! Miroslav is here!

 

[EagleEyes]

Dear Miro,

I understand your patriotism very well, and i also have very well knowledge regarding Indian naval fleet. Indeed Indian navy will not require any sub for launching an attack on PN, because we don't have any nuclear submarines yet. So do you..

Once we will have nuclear submarines, you will need your nuclear submarines to keep the strategic balance in south asia.

IN's goals are far and maybe beyond PN, but think about it whats going to happen when PLAN and PN gets combined together, not just that when USN will also park its ships near Karachi/Gawadar.

I think IN is in some deep trouble here.. not to mention the future build up of PN and PLAN together.

Regards.

Originally posted by miroslav@Oct 30 2005, 03:36 PM
Indian Navy acquisitions are no more Pakistan oriented.

IN's goals and objectives are far beyond that.

For striking against Pakistan Navy, Indian Navy dosent recquire any Nuke Sub.

Current capabilities of IN are more than enough to hold the nation's fate in the Arabian Sea.

Miro

[post=1718]Quoted post[/post]​

 

[Sharjeel]

Originally posted by miroslav@Oct 30 2005, 03:36 PM
Indian Navy acquisitions are no more Pakistan oriented.

IN's goals and objectives are far beyond that.

For striking against Pakistan Navy, Indian Navy dosent recquire any Nuke Sub.

Current capabilities of IN are more than enough to hold the nation's fate in the Arabian Sea.

Miro

[post=1718]Quoted post[/post]​

the pakistani submarine fleet would have the indian submarine fleet for breakfast thats untill you get the scorpenes youve ordered and IF we doent get anything!

also indian navy sub sub hunting plane fleet is nothing compared to pakistans sub hunting fleet!

and a carrier is as usefull as the boats that protect it! we can strike your carrier from 300 miles away once baburs in our subs! untill you guys get the scorpenes IN is i dare to say CRAP!

and no babur doesnt go in the straight line and it flyes below the radar!!!

your carrier wont know what hit it!

 

[miroslav]

Originally posted by Ahsan Farooqui@Oct 31 2005, 05:23 AM
Dear Miro,

I understand your patriotism very well, and i also have very well knowledge regarding Indian naval fleet. Indeed Indian navy will not require any sub for launching an attack on PN, because we don't have any nuclear submarines yet. So do you..

Once we will have nuclear submarines, you will need your nuclear submarines to keep the strategic balance in south asia.

IN's goals are far and maybe beyond PN, but think about it whats going to happen when PLAN and PN gets combined together, not just that when USN will also park its ships near Karachi/Gawadar.  

I think IN is in some deep trouble here.. not to mention the future build up of PN and PLAN together.

Regards. 

[post=1775]Quoted post[/post]​

Nothing to do with Patriosm. I am not a blind patriot instead I am sticking to reality.

Indian Navy is with talks for leasing 2 Akula Class (Nato Designation Typhoon) Submarines.

Also Indian Navy is building Advance Technology Vessel (Nuke Powered Submarine) which is expected to get commissioned by 2007/8.

So before PN Indian Navy is going to have nuclear submarines and as I said we reaally don't need them against Pakistan even if Pakistan has Nuke Subs.

Nuke Subs are not used against neighbours they are instead used to stay deep in the sea for longer time so that in case of if Retaliation is failed from Land and Air resources then the Subs can answer the enemy.

Regarding U.S Navy : -

May be you will be aware of the fact that Indian Navy vessels are escorting the U.S Navy ships in the Persian Gulf, besides Indian Navy had an excersice with US Navy just a while ago. Apart from this US have some Chinese oriented goals for which the Bush Administration is in love with India and offering goodies like F-18/HawkEye/P-3C Orions etc.

And whether India buys it or not still I don't see any possibility of US Navy coming in between the two navies.

P.S: - May be you can tell me when it was the last time U.S Navy came in help of Pakistan Navy.

Regarding Chinese Navy: -

China has some decent Navy and investment in Gwadar but that really dosent mean that they should mess with the Indian Navy in the Arabian Sea.

Geographically in a full fledge naval war China has a disadvantage against India. May be PLAN put some vessels at Gwadar/Karachi but that really dosent means that they will defeat the Indian Navy and while sending the backup

#1 It will take too much time.
#2 First the PLAN has to enter in Bay of Bengal and then Indian Ocean and then Arabian Sea. So the IN and CG is not gonna let them go easily in war scenario.
#3 IN has more than 10 dedicated naval bases so in the above said waters they will be refuelled/rearmed quickly where as after leaving the Chinese waters PLAN is helpless untill they reach Gwadar/Karachi.

Regards,
Miro

 

[miroslav]

Advanced Technology Vessel (ATV)

The nuclear haves are increasingly relying on sea-based nuclear deterrence in preference to land and air segments. India has a number of foreign-produced cruise missile systems in its arsenal, to include Exocet, Styx, Starbright, Sea Eagle, and perhaps the Russian Sunburn supersonic missile. It also has some indigenous cruise missile systems under development to include the Sagarika and Lakshya variant.

The Sagarika (Oceanic) began development in 1994 as a submarine-launched cruise missile (SLCM) which will have a range of at least 300 kms (a few claim 1000 kms); it was projected for deployment around 2005. The program has met with considerable delays and the missile is not expected to become operational before 2010. Tt will probably arm India's nuclear submarine, the Advanced Technology Vessel (ATV).

India is a nation that fights for entering the select group of countries that build nuclear powered submarines. Its program ATV, or Advanced Technology Vessel, was initiated in 1974. But aftre three decades it still had not presented results that could modify the current picture of the navies with nuclear propulsion.

India has been working actively since 1985 to develop an indigenously constructed nuclear-powered submarine, one that was based on the Soviet Charlie II-class design, detailed drawings of which are said to have been obtained from the Soviet Union in 1989. This project illustrates India's industrial capabilities and weaknesses. The secretive Advanced Technology Vessel (ATV) project to provide nuclear propulsion for Indian submarines has been one of the more ill-managed projects of India.

Although India has the capability of building the hull and developing or acquiring the necessary sensors, its industry has been stymied by several system integration and fabrication problems in trying to downsize a 190 MW pressurized water reactor (PWR) to fit into the space available within the submarine's hull. The Proto-type Testing Centre (PTC) at the Indira Gandhi Centre For Atomic Research. Kalpakkam, will be used to test the submarine's turbines and propellers. A similar facility is operational at Vishakapatnam to test the main turbines and gear box.

According to some accounts India planned to have as many as five nuclear submarines capable of carrying missiles with nuclear warheads. The Indian nuclear powered attack submarine design is said to have a 4,000-ton displacement and a single-shaft nuclear power plant of Indian origin. Once the vessel is completed, it may be equipped with Danush/Sagarika cruise missiles and an advanced sonar system. However, according to some analysts the most probable missile for the Indian submarine would be the Yahont anti-ship cruise missile designed by NPO Mashinostroyeniya.

With the participation he accomplishes of involved Russian scientists and technician in the diverse phases of the program, has possibility of that the first Indian submarine with nuclear propulsion, with 9,400 tons of displacement when submerged and 124 meters of length, can be operational in 2009, will have been launched in 2006-2007.

By 2004 it was reported that the first ATV would be launched by 2007. At that time it was reported that it would be an SSGN and displacing some 6,500 tons, with a design derivative of Russia's Project 885 Severodvinsk-class (Yasen) SSN. The ATV multirole platform would be employed for carrying out long-distance interdiction and surveillance of both submerged targets as well as principal surface combatants. It would also facilitate Special Forces operations by covertly landing such forces ashore. The ATV pressure hull will be fabricated with the HY-80 steel obtained from Russia.

This way would have the possibility of multiple performance: it could use missiles of cruise of average reach (1,000 km), ballistic missiles of short reach (300 km), torpedoes and mines, besides participating of operations special. If it will have success in this taken over on a contract basis, will be valid to assume that the Indian Fleet will count on four to six of these submarines until the year of 2020.

Vessel Type Submarine
Country India
Program Advanced Technology Vessel (ATV)
Total Number 4-6
Unit Cost (US&#036 1B (Est.)
Builder Vishakapatnam Naval Dockyard (VND) with assistance from Mazagon Dock Ltd. (MDL).
Displ. Tons 5,500 – 6,500 (Est.)
Length 100m (328ft) (Est.)
Beam 15m (49.2ft) (Est.)
Draft 9m (29.5ft) (Est.)
Machinery Nuclear: one pressurized water reactor (PWR) using 20% enriched uranium fuel (160-190MW); one turbine (47,000hp/70MW); one shaft; one 7-bladed, high-skew propeller. (Est.)
Speed (Knots) 12-15 (surfaced) 30-34 (submerged). (Est.)
Range Unlimited.
Diving Depth 300 m (984.2ft). (Est.)
Complement Undetermined.
Weapons Torpedoes: Six 21 inch (533mm) torpedo tubes. Mines. A total capacity (mines, torpedoes, and missiles) of 30 weapons. (Est.)
Missiles Submarine launched cruise missiles (SLCM) using either a vertical launch system or a torpedo tube launch, surface-to-surface missiles (SSMs), and a submarine launched ballistic missile (SLBM). (Est.)

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/india/atv.htm

Miro

 

[miroslav]

Project 971 Shuka-B Bars-class
Akula class
Attack Submarine (Nuclear Powered)

The Project 971 Shuka-B Bars-class attack submarine multi-purpose submarine is capable of strikes against groups of hostile ships and against coastal installations. Designated the "Akula" class by the West, and also widely known as the Bars (Snow Leopard) class, the submarine is reported to be officially designated Project 971 Shuka B (shuka is an aggressive breed of fresh water pike). Some 110 meters long, the Akula is double-hulled with considerable distance between the outer and inner hulls to reduce the possible damage to the inner hull. The hull is constructed of low magnetic steel, and divided into eight compartments, and features a distinctive high aft fin. The Project 971, using a steel hull, was initiated in 1976 when it became evident that existing industrial infrastructure was inadequate to mass produce the expensive titanium hulls of the Project 945 Sierra class. The performance of the Project 971 boats was a close approximation to that of the Project 945 design, though the later was significantly more expensive to build and maintain. It has 650 mm and 533 mm torpedo tubes which can use mines as well as Granat cruise missiles, antisubmarine missiles, and torpedoes.

The submarines feature double hull construction, dramatically increasing the reserve buoyancy of the submarine by as much as three times over that of a single hull craft. Ballast tanks and other gear are located between the inner and outer hulls, and limber holes are provided for the free-flooding sections between the hulls. Akula class submarines incorporate limber hole covers that can be closed to reduce or eliminate this source of unwanted noise.

Built to engage surface task forces and coastal facilities, the Akula submarine design was under constant upgrade. NATO designated the Project 971 boats as Akula I, and the Project 971U as "Improved Akula I" while Project 971A was designated Akula II. According to some reports the 'Akula-II' class has a 3.7 meter longer hull to accomdate a quieter propulsion system. There is some non-trivial disagreement between authoritative sources as to launch and commission dates for all units, as well as which units are 'Improved Akula' vs. 'Akuka-II'.

The Akula is the quietest Russian nuclear submarine ever designed, and the low noise levels came as a surprise to Western intelligence. Russia claims the Akula is the quietest of its domestically built submarines and is fitted with acoustic countermeasure equipment. Noise reduction efforts include rafting the propulsion plant, anechoic tiles on the outside and inside of the hulls and possibly other measures such as active noise cancellation. Nonetheless, the American Improved Los Angeles class retained a decisive edge in silencing compared to the Akuka I. The Project 971A Akula II incorporated an improved double layer silencing system for the power train. According to Russian sources, this variant had noise emissions that were roughly the level of a basic Los Angeles and that of the Improved Los Angeles at slow speeds. At medium or high speeds the Improved Los Angeles design retains an acoustic advantage according to Russian sources. The Project 971 uses advanced sound insulation techniques that may not withstand Russian service conditions, and it may actually be noiser than earlier designs using more basic quieting technologies if poorly built or improperly maintained. The Project 971 is said by Russian sources to be at a distinct disadvantage in sensors, with a sonar suite that is roughly one-third as sensitive as the Los Angeles, able to track only two targets simultaneously (as opposed to the multiple target tracking capabilities of the American system).

The Akula can launch a range of anti-submarine and anti-surface vessel torpedoes. The submarine has eight torpedo launch tubes, four 650 millimetre and four 533 millimetre tubes. The Improved Akula and Akula II have ten, with six 533 mm tubes. The four 650 mm tubes can be fitted with liners to provide additional 533 mm weapon launch capacity. The torpedo tubes can be used to launch mines instead of torpedoes. The Akula Class carry up to twelve Granat submarine launched cruise missiles. The missiles are fired from four 533 mm torpedo launch tubes. The submarine's anti-ship missiles are the Novator SS-N-15 Starfish and the Novator SS-N-16 Stallion and an air defence capability is provided by the Strela SA-N-5/8 portable missile launcher with 18 missiles.

The main propulsion machinery consists of a VM-5 pressure water reactor with a model OK-650 b high-density reactor core rated at 190 MW with a GT3A turbine developing 35 MW. Some sources credit Akula with two reactors, but it appears that the Akula has only one reactor, as opposed to older Russian subs, which had two. Two auxiliary diesels rated at 750 hp provide emergency power. The propulsion system drives a seven bladed fixed pitch propeller. The propulsion system provides a maximum submerged speed of 33 knots and a surface speed of 10 knots. A reserve propeller system, powered by two motors rated at 370 kw, provides a speed of 3 to 4 knots. The submarine is rated for a diving depth to 600 meters. The submarine carries sufficient supplies for an endurance of 100 days and is operated by a complement of 73 crew.

The submarines were built by the Amur Shipbuilding Plant Joint Stock Company at Komsomolsk-on-Amur and at the Severodvinsk shipbuilding yard. Output of Akula submarines remained steady at one-to-two a year until 1995. Eight Akula class submarines were built in Komsomolsk until activities there ceased in 1993. All sources are in agreement that a total of seven Akula I submarines were built [though there is some dispute as to whether K-461 Volk or K-480 Bars is an Akula I or an Improved Akula I]. These boats were all commissioned between 1985-86 and 1992. The prototype K-284 was decommissioned in 1995 to avoid the expense of a reactor refueling, and is generally not expected to return to service. According to some sources, at least one and perhaps as many as three Akula-Is were placed in reserve status in the late 1990s.

At least two and perhaps as many as four Improved Akulas entered service between 1992 and 1995. An additional Improved Akula I [K.267 Drakon] was launched in 1994 and delivered to the Russian Navy in 1995, though subsequently repossessed by the shipyard due to lack of payment. The boat reportedly remained in the possession of the Komsomolosk yard, which was said to be trying to sell her.

Apparently two additional Akula-Is remained undelivered at Komsomol'sk-na-Amur. Funds were provided in January 2000 for further work on the 82%-85%-finished Modified Akula-I-class Nerpa, laid down in 1986. The 25%-50%-complete Kaban, begun in 1992, may also eventually be completed. As of October 2000 the Amur shipyard had been trying to complete one multi-purpose Bars-class submarine for more than five years. Though construction of the submarine was 85 percent complete, Russia doesn’t have the money to complete the job. The shipyard plant received 5 million rubles ($182,000) from the Defense Ministry in 2000. But to keep the construction hangar at the right temperature, the shipyard spends 70 million rubles a year. Maintaining the hangar temperature is essential, since in 1997 the submarine’s reactor was started, and a stable temperature is required in the hangar to avoid accidents. It would cost more to dismantle the submarine and treat the radioactive reactor than to complete construction. Meanwhile, another submarine remained only half built at the shipyard.

The status of the Akula II program is less certain, with at least one authoritative source maintaining that this class had yet to put to sea as of early 2000. Another authoritative source reports that three Akula II submarines have been built, with the first, Viper, being commissioned in 1995, the second, Nerpa, in December 2000 and the third, Gepard, in August 2001.

The Vepr [which is probably an Akula II] was launched in December 1994 and according to some sources was commissioned in 1995. The Gepard [Cheetah] was laid down in 1991 or 1992, with the sub scheduled to enter active service in 1996. In fact, Gepard remained in the yard at Severodvinsk, and according to some reports had been renamed Belgograd [subsequent reports apparently disconfirm this claim]. The Gepard was launched in 1995. The sub's crew was scheduled to arrive on board in early 1998 while the boat was still under construction. Gepard was finally launched on 18 September 1999 and began state acceptance sea trials in December 2000 in the Baltic Fleet water area. The boat was to be commissioned on 29 July 2001 - Russian Navy Day. Initially it was thought that the final service introduction ceremony would be held in August 2001, since the test runs were completed as early as July 2001. President Vladimir Putin commissioned Gepard in a ceremony on 04 December 2001. The submarine's commissioning took place with Navy C-in-C Vladimir Kuroyedov and acting Northern Fleet commander Vice-Admiral Vladimir Dobroskochenko signing the acceptance report. The presidential visit was entirely symbolic.

The hulls of two additional Akula-IIs [probably named Kuguar and Rys] remain in the Severodvinsk building hall, with at least the former planned for completion. No completion date is projected, and no progress towards completion was evident as of mid-2004. Perhaps as many as two more Akula II units may also await completion, though this may simply reflect confusion between the Akula II units at Severodvinsk and the Akula I-Mod units at Komsomol'sk-na-Amur.

The active submarines of this class are in restricted service to conserve their remaining reactor core lives. There are at least eight Akula submarines currently operational, and by some estimates the number of Akulas in active service may be as great as eleven. At least three more units [and possibly as many as five] remain under construction, and their completion could bring the total inventory to as many as fifteen boats by 2010.

As of January 2003, Janes thought that 9 Akula were thought to be operational, and Periscope agreed as of August 2003.

India Lease
India’s interest in leasing a pair of Type 971 SSNs is based in part on the slow progress in the Advanced Technology Vessel. Reports are in conflict as to whether the submarines in question are the improved Akula or the Akula-II. There are a pair of both types in a state of partial completion.

As of November 2001 it was reported that the the terms of lease for a single Akula II/Schuka-B class nuclear-powered submarine had been finalized in September 2001. The submarine, to be leased for three years at a price of $25 million for it, was expected to arrive in Vishakapatnam in early 2002. However, as of February 2002 the Russian submarines were slated to begin service in the Indian Navy in 2004 under a five-year lease. India was to help finance the construction of the two new Akula class boats with the proceeds allowing Russia to complete the first Type 855 SSN. At that time no agreement had been reached on the transfer of the Admiral Gorshkov aircraft carrier, the proposed lease of two Akulas, or the purchase of four Tu-22M Backfire bombers.

As of mid-2002 the Indian Ministry of Defence was saying little about a move to lease-purchase two Project 971 class nuclear submarines from Russia. But negotiations were reported to be at an advanced stage and India's commitment could include providing money to enable Russia to complete construction work on the subs. The subs in question were believed to be of the Project 971 improved Akula-II class.

On 20 January 2004 India finalized the purchase of the Russian aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov after over a decade of negotiations. But Russian Defense Minister Sergei Ivanov and Indian Defense Minister George Fernandes did not reach agreement on other weapons, such as the Tu-22 Backfire bombers or Akula-class nuclear submarines.

By mid-2005 India appeared set to get at least two Akula class subs on lease — with the option to buy them— from Russia by end of 2005. The construction of a training center for the Indian defence officers in Sosnovy Bor, west of St Petersburg, confirmed Russia’s intentions to lease nuclear submarines to India. The international center started training 300 Indian Naval officers by mid-September 2005. This number suggested 4 Akula crews (2 on, 2 off duty rotations.) The leasing/buying of Akulas would train crews and augment force levels as the ATV goes into serial production.

The two Akulas, one said to be 70-85% complete and the other said to be 40-60% complete, would cost India some $400m. The leasing costs would amount to some $25m a year. The construction of both submarines and training of the crews could run up to around $2 billion. Meanwhile, this article confirms that a Russian Akula-I class submarine will participate in the Russia-India exercises this fall. 5. There are also rumors from reputable sources (this other defense reporter being the other most highly respected/accurate one) saying that the Indian indigenous submarine project ATV is almost ready, and was built with Russian help. My own gut feeling is the Akulas would likely be leased (not bought) until A total of 5-6 ATV submarines are projected to be constructed by 2020.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/971.htm

 

[miroslav]

Originally posted by Yahya@Oct 31 2005, 11:31 AM
the pakistani submarine fleet would have the indian submarine fleet for breakfast thats untill you get the scorpenes youve ordered and IF we doent get anything!

[post=1824]Quoted post[/post]​

I dont agree.

Indian Submarine Fleet consists of 10 Kilo Class Submarines and 4 HDW-209 Class Submarines.

Out of 10 Kilo's 5 are capable (after refit) to launch Club missiles (Range 200+ KmS) from underwater and Underwater SAM.

As far as Pakistani Navy's submarine fleet is concern apart from those 3 Agosta's it's subs are quite old and with outdated techology.

Besides I dont see any Sub/Sub war in the IN V/S PN scenario.

also indian navy sub sub hunting plane fleet is nothing compared to pakistans sub hunting fleet!

Indian Navy anti Submarine Assets.

20 Sea Harrier FRS Mk.51 / T Mk.60
16 MiG-29K (2007)
16+ IAF Jaguar-IM dedicated for maritime strike.
3 IL-38
40 Sea King Mk.42
12 Kamov-28 ASW Helicopters
9 Kamov-31 Airborne Early Warning/ASW Heli's
20+ Chetak/Dhruv

May be you will also enlight me with the fact that who is going to provide Air-Cover to Pakistani Anti Submarine Assets?

and a carrier is as usefull as the boats that protect it! we can strike your carrier from 300 miles away once baburs in our subs! untill you guys get the scorpenes IN is i dare to say CRAP!

Live in reality.

Babur is yet to be tested on Naval Platforms and you have already launched it from the Submarines.

and no babur doesnt go in the straight line and it flyes below the radar!!!
your carrier wont know what hit it!

And how are going to launch babur against a fast moving carrier group?

What will be the platform for launch of Babur?

And even if you fire it against IN carrier why do you think that it is going to dodge the BARRAK Systems fitted on IN carriers and it's escorts.

Miro

 

[Sharjeel]

Originally posted by miroslav@Oct 31 2005, 10:33 AM
I dont agree.

Indian Submarine Fleet consists of 10 Kilo Class Submarines and 4 HDW-209 Class Submarines.

Out of 10 Kilo's 5 are capable (after refit) to launch Club missiles (Range 200+ KmS) from underwater and Underwater SAM.

As far as Pakistani Navy's  submarine fleet is concern apart from those 3 Agosta's it's subs are quite old and with outdated techology.

Besides I dont see any Sub/Sub was in the IN V/S PN scenario.
Indian Navy anti Submarine Assets.

as a matter of fact the pakistani agosta 70s are better equipped then the indian kilos you mention not only that they are also able to fire exocet anti ship missiles!

20 Sea Harrier FRS Mk.51 / T Mk.60
16 MiG-29K (2007)
16+ IAF Jaguar-IM dedicated for maritime strike.
3 IL-38
40 Sea King Mk.42
12 Kamov-28 ASW Helicopters
9 Kamov-31 Airborne Early Warning/ASW Heli's
20+ Chetak/Dhruv

the sea harriers, mig 29k, jaguar have submarine hunting abilitys??? how they goin to see a sub genius! what equipment do they have onboard to detect underwater submarines??

this is sub hunting fleet!

Lockheed P-3C Orion (Update II).

ACTIVE : 3
OPERATIONAL SPEED : 410 kt (760 km/h).
SERVICE CEILING : 28,300 ft (8,625 m).
RANGE A/C : 4,000 n miles (7,410 km).
ROLE/WEAPON SYSTEMS : Order completed in 1991 but held up by the Pressler amendment, until delivery in December 1996. Sensors: APS-115 search radar; up to 100 sonobuoys; ASQ 81 MAD; ESM. Weapons: four Type 244S torpedoes or Mk 11 depth charges for ASW; four Harpoon for ASV.

Update II: (Model 285A) Applied to 45 aircraft built from August 1977; added InfraRed Detection System (IRDS) and Sonobuoy Reference System (SRS); Harpoon missile system incorporated from August 1977. Total of 36 USN P-3Cs received interim Update II.5 of 1981 including more reliable navigation and communication systems; IACS submarine communications link; MAD compensation group adaptor; standardised wing pylons; and improved fuel tank vents. Also added AN/ASH-33 digital magnetic tape system ILO of RD-319 tape system.

DESIGN FEATURES: Pressurised cabin. Wing section NACA 0014 (modified) at root, NACA 0012 (modified) at tip; dihedral 6°; incidence 3° at root, 0° 30' at tip.

FLYING CONTROLS: Hydraulically boosted ailerons, elevators and rudders; fixed tailplane; Lockheed-Fowler trailing-edge flaps.

STRUCTURE: Conventional aluminium alloy with fail-safe box beam wing.

LANDING GEAR: Hydraulically retractable tricycle type, with twin wheels on each unit. All units retract forward, mainwheels into inner engine nacelles. Oleo-pneumatic shock-absorbers. Mainwheels have size 40-14 Type VII 26 ply tubeless tyres, pressure 7.58 to 12.41 bars (110 to 180 lb/sq in) at 36,287 kg (80,000 lb) T-O weight, 12.41 bars (180 lb/sq in) at 57,606 kg (127,000 lb) T-O weight, 13.10 bars (190 lb/sq in) at 61,235 kg (135,000 lb) maximum normal T-O weight. Nosewheels have size 28-7.7 Type VII tubeless tyres, pressure 10.34 bars (150 lb/sq in). Hydraulic brakes. No anti-skid units.

POWER PLANT: Four 3,661 kW (4,910 ehp) Allison T56-A-14 turboprops, each driving a Hamilton Standard 54H60-77 four-blade constant-speed propeller. Fuel in one tank in fuselage and four wing integral tanks, with total usable capacity of 34,826 litres (9,200 US gallons; 7,660 Imp gallons). Four overwing gravity fuelling points and central pressure refuelling point. Oil capacity (minimum usable) 111 litres (29.4 US gallons; 24.5 Imp gallons) in four tanks.

ACCOMMODATION: (P-3C) Normal 10-man crew: pilot, co-pilot, and flight engineer on flight deck; tactical co-ordinator, nav/com operator, two acoustic sensor operators, MAD operator, ordnance man and flight technician; up to 13 additional relief crew or passengers. Flight deck has wide-vision windows and circular windows for observers are provided fore and aft in the main cabin, each bulged to give 180° view. Main cabin is fitted out as a five-man tactical compartment (containing advanced electronic, magnetic and sonic detection equipment), an all-electric galley and large crew and rest area.

SYSTEMS: Air conditioning and pressurisation system supplied by two engine-driven compressors. Pressure differential 0.37 bar (5.4 lb/sq in). Hydraulic system, pressure 207 bars (3,000 lb/sq in), for flaps, control surface boosters, landing gear actuation, brakes and bomb bay doors. Three hydraulic pumps, each rated at 30.3 litres (8.0 US gallons; 6.7 Imp gallons)/min at 0 to 152 bars (0 to 2,200 lb/sq in), 22.7 litres (6.0 US gallons; 5.0 Imp gallons)/min at 205 bars (2,975 lb/sq in). Class one non-separated air/oil reservoir. Type B pressurised. Electrical system utilises three 60 kVA generators for 120/208 V 400 Hz AC supply. 24 V DC supply. Integral APU with 60 kVA generator for ground air conditioning, electrical supply and engine starting. Anti-icing by bleed air on wing and electrical heating on tailplane and fin. Electrically de-iced propeller spinners.

AVIONICS: The AN/ASQ-114 general purpose digital computer is the heart of the P-3C system. Together with the AN/AYA-8 data processing equipment and computer-controlled display systems, it permits rapid analysis and utilisation of electronic, magnetic and sonic data. Nav/com system comprises two LTN-72 inertial navigation systems; AN/APN-227 Doppler; AN/ARN-81 Loran A and C; AN/ARN-118 Tacan; two VIR-31A VOR/LOC/GS/MB receivers; AN/ARN-83 LF-ADF; AN/ARA-50 UHF direction-finder, AN/AJN-15 flight director indicator for tactical directions; HSI for long-range flight directions; glide slope indicator; on-top position indicator; two AN/ARC-161 HF transceivers; two AN/ARC-143 UHF transceivers; AN/ARC-101 VHF receiver/transmitter; AN/AGC-6 teletype and high-speed printer; HF and UHF secure communication units; AN/ACQ-5 datalink communication set and AN/AIC-22 interphone set; AN/APX-72 IFF transponder and AN/APX-76 SIF interrogator. Electronic computer-controlled display equipment includes AN/ASA-70 tactical display, AN/ASA-66 pilot's display, AN/ASA-70 radar display and two auxiliary readout (computer stored data) displays.

ASW equipment includes AN/ARR-72 sonar receivers, replaced in Update III by AN/ARR-78; two AN/AQA-7(V)8 DIFAR (directional acoustic frequency analysis and recording) sonobuoy indicator sets, replaced in Update III by AN/UYS-1 Proteus; hyperbolic fix unit; acoustic source signal generator; time code generator and AN/AQH-4(V) sonar tape recorder; AN/ASQ-81 magnetic anomaly detector; AN/ASA-64 submarine anomaly detector; AN/ASA-65 magnetic compensator; AN/ALQ-78 electronic countermeasures set; AN/APS-115 radar set (360° coverage); AN/ASA-69 radar scan converter; undernose AN/AAS-36 IRDS; KA-74 forward computer assisted camera (deleted with IRDS installation); KB-18A automatic strike assessment camera with horizon-to-horizon coverage; RO-308 bathythermograph recorder.

Additional items include AN/APN-194 radar altimeter; two AN/APQ-107 radar altimeter warning systems; A/A24G-9 true airspeed computer; AN/ASW-31 automatic flight control system. P-3Cs delivered from 1975 have the avionics/electronics package updated by addition of an extra 393 kbit memory drum and fourth logic unit. Omega navigation, new magnetic tape transport, and an AN/ASA-66 tactical display for the sonar operators. To accommodate the new systems a new operational software computer programme was written in CMS-2 language. GEC-Marconi AQS-901 acoustic signal processing and display system in RAAF P-3Ws. AN/ALR-66(V)5 passive radar detection system (ESM), to be housed in wingtip pods, is under development by Litton, and will also provide targeting data for the aircraft's Harpoon missiles. AN/ALR-66(V)3 installed in Japanese and Norwegian P-3Cs and as retrofit in P-3P and CP-140. Wing span increased by some 0.81 m (2 ft 8 in) to accommodate ESM antennae and receivers. Loral AN/ALQ-157 IR jammers retrofitted each side of rear fuselage on USN P-3Cs. AN/ALR-66(V)5 replaces Loral AN/ALQ-78A on Korean P-3C.

EQUIPMENT: Searchlight replaces one wing pylon, starboard. Search stores, such as sonobuoys and sound signals, are launched from inside cabin area in the P-3A/B. In the P-3C sonobuoys are loaded and launched externally and internally. Sonobuoys are ejected from P-3C aircraft with explosive Cartridge Actuating Devices (CAD), eliminating the need for a pneumatic system. Australian P-3Ws use SSQ-801 Barra sonobuoys.

ARMAMENT: Bomb bay 2.03 m wide, 0.88 m deep and 3.91 m long (80 x 34.5 x 154 in), forward of wing, and 10 underwing pylons. Stores can include (weapons bay/underwing, maximum) Mk 46 torpedo 8/0; Mk 50 torpedo 6/0; Mk 54 depth bomb 8/10; B57 nuclear depth charge 3/0; Mk 82 560 lb bomb 8/10; Mk 83 980 lb bomb 3/8; Mk 36 destructor 8/10; Mk 40 destructor 3/8; LAU-68A pod (seven 2.75 in rockets), or LAU-69AS (19 2.75 in rockets), or LAU-10A/C (four 5 in rockets), or SUU-44A (eight flares) 0/4; Mk 52 mine 3/8; Mk 55 or Mk 56 mine 1/6; Mk 60 torpedo 0/6; AGM-85 Harpoon anti-ship missile 0/8. Two AIM-9L Sidewinder AAMs underwing for self-defence. Maximum total weapon load includes six 2,000 lb mines under wings and a 3,290 kg (7,252 lb) internal load made up of two Mk 101 depth bombs, four Mk 44 torpedoes, pyrotechnic pistol and 12 signals, 87 sonobuoys, 100 Mk 50 underwater sound signals (P-3A/B), 18 Mk 3A marine markers (P-3A/B), 42 Mk 7 marine markers, two B. T. buoys, and two Mk 5 parachute flares. Harpoon missiles are standard fit on a proportion of US Navy P-3Cs. US Navy is conducting analysis of arming its P-3C Orions with the Joint Air-to-Surface Standoff Missile (JASSM). The US Navy has fitted the AGM-65 Maverick air-to-surface missile and carried out successful launch of AGM-84 Standoff Land Attack Missile (SLAM).

DIMENSIONS, EXTERNAL:

Wing span.......................................30.37 m (99 ft 8 in) Wing chord: at root.............................5.77 m (18 ft 11 in) at tip..........................................2.31 m (7 ft 7 in) Wing aspect ratio................................................7.5 Length overall................................35.61 m (116 ft 10 in) Height overall.............................10.27 m (33 ft 8{1/2} in) Fuselage diameter................................3.45 m (11 ft 4 in) Tailplane span.................................13.06 m (42 ft 10 in) Wheel track (c/l shock-absorbers)................9.50 m (31 ft 2 in) Wheelbase........................................9.07 m (29 ft 9 in) Propeller diameter...............................4.11 m (13 ft 6 in) Cabin door: Height................................1.83 m (6 ft 0 in) Width...........................................0.69 m (2 ft 3 in)

DIMENSIONS, INTERNAL:

Cabin, excl flight deck and electrical load centre:

Length........................................21.06 m (69 ft 1 in) Max width.....................................3.30 m (10 ft 10 in) Max height......................................2.29 m (7 ft 6 in) Floor area................................61.13 m{2} (658.0 sq ft) Volume....................................120.6 m{3} (4,260 cu ft)

AREAS:

Wings, gross.............................120.77 m{2} (1,300.0 sq ft) Ailerons (total)..............................8.36 m{2} (90.0 sq ft) Trailing-edge flaps (total).................19.32 m{2} (208.0 sq ft) Fin, incl dorsal fin........................10.78 m{2} (116.0 sq ft) Rudder, incl tab..............................5.57 m{2} (60.0 sq ft) Tailplane...................................22.39 m{2} (241.0 sq ft) Elevators, incl tabs..........................7.52 m{2} (81.0 sq ft)

WEIGHTS AND LOADINGS (P-3B/C): {st} Weight empty...................................27,890 kg (61,491 lb) Max fuel weight................................28,350 kg (62,500 lb) Max expendable load.............................9,071 kg (20,000 lb) Max normal T-O weight.........................61,235 kg (135,000 lb) Max permissible weight........................64,410 kg (142,000 lb) Design zero-fuel weight........................35,017 kg (77,200 lb) Max landing weight............................47,119 kg (103,880 lb) Max wing loading......................507.0 kg/m{2} (103.8 lb/sq ft) Max power loading...........................4.18 kg/kW (6.87 lb/ehp)

PERFORMANCE (P-3B/C, at max T-O weight, except where indicated otherwise):

Max level speed at 4,575 m (15,000 ft) at AUW of 47,625 kg (105,000 lb) .............................................411 kt (761 km/h; 473 mph) Econ crusing speed at 7,620 m (25,000 ft) at AUW of 49,895 kg (110,000 lb) .............................................328 kt (608 km/h; 378 mph) Patrol speed at 457 m (1,500 ft) at AUW of 49,895 kg (110,000 lb) .............................................206 kt (381 km/h; 237 mph) Stalling speed: flaps up.....................133 kt (248 km/h; 154 mph) flaps down.................................112 kt (208 km/h; 129 mph) Rate of climb at 457 m (1,500 ft)...............594 m (1,950 ft)/min Time to 7,620 m (25,000 ft)...................................30 min Service ceiling..................................8,625 m (28,300 ft) Service ceiling, OEI.............................5,790 m (19,000 ft) T-O run...........................................1,290 m (4,240 ft) T-O to 15 m (50 ft)...............................1,673 m (5,490 ft) Landing from 15 m (50 ft) at design landing weight..845 m (2,770 ft) Mission radius (3 h on station at 457 m; 1,500 ft).....1,346 n miles ....(2,494 km; 1,550 miles) Max mission radius (no time on station) at 61,235 kg (135,000 lb) ...............................2,070 n miles (3,835 km; 2,383 miles) Ferry range....................4,830 n miles (8,950 km; 5,562 miles) Max endurance at 4,575 m (15,000 ft): two engines............................................17 h 12 min four engines...........................................12 h 20 min

Fokker F27-200.
ACTIVE : 5
OPERATIONAL SPEED : 250 kt (463 km/h).
SERVICE CEILING : 29,500 ft (8,990 m).
RANGE A/C : 2,700 n miles (5,000 km).
ROLE/WEAPON SYSTEMS : Acquired in 1994-96 for maritime surveillance. Sensors: APS 504(V)2 radar, Thomson-CSF DR 3000A ESM.

Breguet Atlantic 1

ACTIVE : 4 OPERATIONAL SPEED : 355 kt (658 km/h). SERVICE CEILING : 32,800 ft (10,000 m). RANGE A/C : 4,855 n miles (8,995 km). ROLE/WEAPON SYSTEMS : Long-range MR/ASW cover for Arabian Sea; ex-French and Dutch stock. Upgraded in 1992-93. Three more acquired in 1994 for spares. Sensors: Thomson-CSF Ocean Master radar, Thomson-CSF DR 3000A ESM, MAD, sonobuoys, Sadang 1C sonobuoy signal processor. Weapons: ASW; nine Mk 46 or244/S torpedoes, Mk 11 depth bombs, mines. ASV; two AS 12 or AM 39 Exocet missiles.

PROGRAMME: On 31 July 1974, Dassault-Breguet delivered the 18th Breguet 1150 Atlantic maritime patrol aircraft ordered by the Italian government. This completed the production programme for 87 operational Atlantics of the basic type, made up of 40 aircraft for the French Navy, three of which were passed on to Pakistan. Manufacture was shared by companies in France, Germany, Italy and Pakistan, with additional airframe components supplied by the Belgian ABAP group and some equipment from the USA and UK.

UPGRADES: Alenia: See separate entry in Italy section. Dornier: See separate entry in Germany section. Germany: In late 1996 the German government announced that it was developing a requirement for a life-extension programme for the German Navy's fleet of 18 Atlantic 1 maritime patrol aircraft. The programme will add 12,000 hours to the airframe life to keep the aircraft in service until 2010. The requirement also includes retrofitting the following equipment: a Forward-Looking InfraRed (FLIR) sensor as well as improved navigation, communications (GMDSS) and Electronic Support Measures (ESM) systems. All equipment is to be Commercial Off The Shelf (COTS).

Thomson-CSF: Awarded contract to upgrade Pakistan Navy Atlantic 1 aircraft with the AMASCOS mission system (see separate entry in France section).

OPERATORS: Versions of the Atlantic are in service with the armed forces of the following countries: Germany (19); Italy (18) and Pakistan (4). The following description applies to the basic version.

DESIGN FEATURES: Cantilever mid-wing monoplane. Wing section NACA 64 series. Dihedral on outer wings only. Fixed-incidence tailplane.

FLYING CONTROLS: Conventional all-metal ailerons actuated by SAMM twin-cylinder jacks. All-metal slotted flaps, with bonded light-alloy honeycomb filling, over 75 per cent of span. Three hinged spoilers on upper surface of each outer wing, forward of flaps. Metal airbrake above and below each wing. No trim tabs. Tail unit control surfaces operated through SAMM twin-cylinder jacks. No trim tabs.

STRUCTURE: All-metal three-spar fail-safe structure, with bonded light-alloy honeycomb skin panels on torsion box and on main landing gear doors. The fuselage is an all-metal `double-bubble' fail-safe structure, with bonded honeycomb sandwich skin on pressurised central section of upper fuselage, weapons bay doors and nosewheel door. The tail unit is a cantilever all-metal structure with bonded honeycomb sandwich skin panels on torsion boxes.

SYSTEMS: Kleber-Colombes pneumatic de-icing boots on wing leading-edges. Kleber-Colombes pneumatic de-icing boots on tail unit leading-edges.

LANDING GEAR: Retractable tricycle type, supplied by Messier-Hispano, with twin wheels on each unit. Hydraulic retraction, nosewheels rearward, main units forward into engines nacelles. Kleber-Colombes dimpled tyres, size 956 x 319-392 mm on mainwheels, 637 x 190-319 mm on nosewheels. Tyre pressures: main 9.52 bars (138 lb/sq in), nose 6.07 bars (88 lb/sq in). Messier-Hispano disc brakes with Maxaret anti-skid units.

POWER PLANT: Two 4,553 kW (6,106 ehp) SNECMA-built Rolls-Royce Tyne RTy.20 Mk 21 turboprop engines, each driving a Ratier-built HSD four-blade constant-speed propeller. Six integral fuel tanks with total capacity of 21,000 litres (5,547 US gallons; 4,619 Imp gallons). Provision for wingtip tanks to be fitted.

ACCOMMODATION: Normal flight crew of 12 comprising observer in nose; pilot and co-pilot on flight deck; a tactical co-ordinator, navigator, two sonobuoy operators, and radio, radar and ECM/MAD/Autoycus operators in tactical compartment; and two observers in beam positions. On long-range patrol missions a further 12 crew can be carried as relief crew. The upper, pressurised section of the fuselage, from front to rear, comprises the nose observer's compartment, flight deck, tactical operations compartment, rest compartment for crew, and beam observers' compartment.

SYSTEMS: SEMCA air conditioning and pressurisation system. Hydraulic system pressure 207 bars (3,000 lb/sq in). Electrical system provides 28.5 V DC, 115/200 V variable-frequency AC and 115/200 V stabilised-frequency AC. AirResearch GTCP 85-100 APU in starboard side of front fuselage, adjacent radar compartment, for engine starting and ground air conditioning, can also power one 20 kVA AC alternator and one 4 kW DC generator for emergency electrical power supply.

ARMAMENT AND OPERATIONAL EQUIPMENT: Main weapons carried in bay in unpressurised lower fuselage. Weapons include all NATO standard bombs, 175 kg (385 lb) US or French depth charges. HVAR rockets, homing torpedoes, including types such as the Mk 46 Brush or LX.4 with acoustic heads, or four underwing air-to-surface missiles with nuclear or high-explosive warheads. Electronic equipment includes a retractable Thomson-CSF radar installation, a MAD tailboom and an electrical countermeasures pod at the top of the tailfin. Sonobuoys are carried in a compartment aft of the main weapons bay, while the whole of the upper and lower rear fuselage acts as a storage compartment for sonobuoys and marker flares. Compartment for retractable Thomson-CSF radar `dustbin' forward of the main weapons bay. Forward of this, the lower nose section acts as additional storage for military equipment and the APU. Weapons system includes Plotac optical tactical display, 80 x 80 cm (31.5 x 31.5 in) in size, consisting of separate tables for search display and localisation and attack display. At 1:30,000 scale, this gives coverage of any area 21,950 x 21,950 m (72,000 x 72,000 ft) to an accuracy of 1 mm (that is less than 30.5 m; 100 ft at that scale). Heading references provided by duplicated gyrosopic platforms of the 3-gyro (1° of freedom) 4-gimbals type, with magnetic compasses as back-up system. Janus-type Doppler has stabilised antenna and works in the Ke band to provide direct indication of ground speed and drift. In case of failure an automatic switch is made to the air data system. The analogue type navigation computer is accurate to 0.25 per cent. The MAD is of the atomic resonance type and uses light simulation techniques. Plotac system has provision to accept additional detectors. Radar has `sea-return' circuits and stabilised antenna enabling it to detect a submarine snorkel at up to 40 n miles (75 km; 46 miles) even in rough seas.

Thomson-CSF AMASCOS multisensor system

Type: Maritime sensor (air).

Description

The AMASCOS (Airborne MAritime Situation COntrol System) is a family of integrated maritime patrol and surveillance mission systems, designed for building up and updating tactical situations in real time and as a decision aid for operators. The modular systems can be integrated on any type of fixed-wing aircraft or helicopter. The typical AMASCOS configuration integrates Thomson-CSF equipment with the Ocean Master radar developed by Thomson-CSF and Daimler Benz Aerospace. The three versions of AMASCOS - AMASCOS 100, AMASCOS 200 and AMASCOS 300 - correspond to three broad categories of mission requirement ranging from simple maritime surveillance to anti-surface and anti-submarine warfare.

AMASCOS 100 is a lightweight configuration which weighs less than 250 kg. It includes radar and FLIR plus an integrated tactical computer and is suited for a wide range of missions, such as EEZ surveillance, search and rescue and law enforcement. It can be fitted on carrier or ground-based helicopters and light turboprop aircraft with one or two operators working in close co-ordination with the cockpit crew.

AMASCOS 200 adds ESM equipment to the AMASCOS 100 for anti-surface missions and can be extended to provide an Anti-Submarine Warfare (ASW) capability. It can be fitted to fixed- and rotary-wing aircraft in the 8 ton class. Two or three operators are required.

In addition to basic maritime patrol and surveillance functions, AMASCOS 300 offers both anti-surface and ASW capabilities and is suitable for naval operations command and control assignments. It can be installed on any maritime patrol aircraft in the 10 ton class and above. Three or more operators are required. The heart of the system is a dedicated tactical computer which collates and processes data from different sensors and other onboard equipment. The system can be equipped with the following: the Ocean Master radar, Sextant Avionique Nadir Mk II inertial GPS, Thomson-CSF Optronique Chlio FLIR, Thomson-CSF DR 3000 ESM, Thomson-CSF Link W data link, Thomson Sintra ASM Sadang 1000 sonobuoys, Thomson Sintra ASM HS 312S dipping sonar and Sextant Avionique MAD Mk III.

Operational status

In 1994 the Indonesian Navy chose AMASCOS 100 for its CN-212 maritime patrol aircraft and NBO-105 helicopters. This will include the Ocean Master radar and Chlio FLIR. In January 1997 the Indonesian Navy ordered a further six systems for the CN-212. In 1993 the Pakistan Navy chose AMASCOS to refurbish its four Atlantic long-range maritime patrol aircraft and three MPA Fokker 27. By the first quarter of 1996 the first aircraft modification was complete, including the integration of the Ocean Master Radar, the DR-3000-A ESM with interferometry, the SADANG 1001-C Acoustic Processor and a new radio-navigation set.

COMPANY NAME : Thomson-CSF Radars & Contremesures (RCM)

DIMENSIONS, EXTERNAL:

Wing span......................................36.30 m (119 ft 1 in) Wing aspect ratio..............................................10.94 Length overall.................................31.75 m (104 ft 2 in) Height overall..................................11.33 m (37 ft 2 in) Fuselage: Max width...............................2.90 m (9 ft 6 in) Max depth.................................4.00 m (13 ft 1{1/2} in) Tailplane span...........................12.31 m (40 ft 4{1/2} in) Wheel track...............................9.00 m (29 ft 6{1/4} in) Wheelbase......................................9.44 m (31 ft 0 in) Propeller diameter...............................4.88 m (16 ft 0 in)

DIMENSIONS, INTERNAL:

Tactical compartment: Length................8.60 m (28 ft 2{1/2} in) Height..........................................1.93 m (6 ft 4 in) Max width.................................2.70 m (8 ft 10{1/2} in) Rest compartment: Length....................5.10 m (16 ft 8{3/4} in) Height..........................................1.93 m (6 ft 4 in) Max width.................................2.70 m (8 ft 10{1/2} in) Beam observer's compartment: Length.....................................1.00 m (3 ft 3{1/4} in) Main weapons bay: Length....................9.00 m (29 ft 6{1/4} in) Height..........................................1.55 m (5 ft 1 in) Height under wing..........................1.00 m (3 ft 3{1/4} in) Max width..................................2.20 m (7 ft 2{1/2} in)

AREAS:

Wings, gross...............................120.34 m{2} (1,295 sq ft) Ailerons......................................5.40 m{2} (58.0 sq ft) Trailing-edge flaps (total).................26.80 m{2} (288.4 sq ft) Spoilers (total)..............................1.66 m{2} (17.8 sq ft) Fin.........................................16.64 m{2} (179.1 sq ft) Rudder........................................5.96 m{2} (64.1 sq ft) Tailplane....................................32.5 m{2} (349.7 sq ft) Elevators.....................................8.28 m{2} (89.1 sq ft)

WEIGHTS AND LOADINGS:

Useful load....................................18,551 kg (40,900 lb) Max zero-fuel..................................30,500 kg (67,252 lb) Max T-O weight................................46,000 kg (101,430 lb)

PERFORMANCE (at max T-O weight):

Max level speed at high altitudes.........350 kt (648 km/h; 403 mph) Cruising speed............................300 kt (556 km/h; 345 mph) Service ceiling..................................9,144 m (30,000 ft) T-O to 10.7 m (35 ft), ISA........................1,500 m (4,925 ft) T-O to 10.7 m (35 ft), ISA + 17°C, 15° flap.......1,700 m (5,575 ft) Max range......................4,200 n miles (7,778 km; 4,838 miles) Max endurance at patrol speeds of 169 kt (320 km/h; 195 mph)....18 h

May be you will also enlight me with the fact that who is going to provide Air-Cover to Pakistani Anti Submarine Assets?
Live in reality.

mirages, f16s, thunders, latest acquisition! taking off from oman, yemen, pakistan!!!
USS nimitz class carriers with their f18s. chinese fleet in gwader. you have any idea what damage it will do to the US, European and Chinese economys if you blockade gwader when its fully active?

Babur is yet to be tested on Naval Platforms and you have already launched it from the Submarines.
And how are going to launch babur against a fast moving carrier group?

What will be the platform for launch of Babur?

And even if you fire it against IN carrier why do you think that it is going to dodge the BARRAK Systems fitted on IN carriers and it's escorts.

a: missile boats, submarines, cruisers, destroyers, fishing boats!
b: whats the lowest the barak can see? what does it look with?? what electronics can be used to disable it!

 

[miroslav]

Originally posted by Yahya@Oct 31 2005, 06:02 PM
not only that they are also able to fire exocet anti ship missiles!

[post=1835]Quoted post[/post]​

Sorry Agosta-70 don't. Besides Agosta-90 is said to have that ability where as PN haven't procured a single Exocet missile to fit on Agosta's.

as a matter of fact the pakistani agosta 70s are better equipped then the indian kilos you mention

That's your personal opinion.

Vessel Type: Submarine, Type 877EKM.

Names & Pennant Numbers with commission dates:
INS Sindhugosh S55 (30 April 1986) - Refit Complete
INS Sindhuvaj S56 (12 June 1987)
INS Sindhuraj S57 (20 October 1987) - Refit Complete
INS Sindhuvir S58 (26 August 1988) - Refit Complete
INS Sindhuratna S59 (22 December 1988) - Refit Complete
INS Sindhukesari S60 (16 February 1989) - Refit Complete
INS Sindhukirti S61 (04 January 1990)
INS Sindhuvijay S62 (08 March 1991) - Undergoing Refit
INS Sindhurakshak S63 (24 December 1997)
INS Sindhushastra S65 (19 July 2000)

Structure: The Kilo Class submarine has a single shaft with a double hull. Six compartments separated by bulkheads to enable it to remain afloat even when one is flooded. To reduce the submarine's acoustic signature, the flooding ports have been removed from the fore-body. Anechoic tiles are fitted on casings and fins. The submarine also has a new gas-freeing system to reduce risk of detection. The hull of the submarine is covered with rubber anti-sonar protection tiles which have a special ozonising layer to combat the sun's effects in tropical waters. The bow planes are positioned close to the mid-ship to improve sonar performance.

An engine change is probable during major refits in Russia which started in 1997, with INS Sindhuvir. A German-designed, Indian-built main battery, with a five year life has replaced the Russian batteries in all the vessels. Battery cooling has been improved as a result of the change.

Displacement: Surfaced; 2325 tons.
Dived; 3076 tons.

Dimensions: Length; 72.6 meters.
Beam; 9.9 meters.
Draught; 6.6 meters.

Diving Depth: Operational Depth; 240 meters.
Maximum Depth; 300 meters.

Main Machinery: Two diesel-electric motors with 3650 hp, one 5900 hp motor, two auxiliary motors with 204 hp and one economic speed motor with 130 hp.

Maximum Speed: Surfaced; 10 knots.
Snorting; 9 knots.
Dived; 17 knots.

Maximum Range: 6000 miles at 7 knots snorting.
400 miles at 3 knots dived.

Complement: 52 (incl. 13 Officers).

Endurance at Sea: 45 days.

Radar: Navigation; One MRP-25 (NATO: Snoop Tray) radar at I-band frequency. Has a target separation system.

Sonar: One MG-519 (NATO: Mouse Roar) hull mounted sonar, active search with high frequency.
One MGK-400 (NATO: Shark Teeth/Shark Fin) hull mounted sonar, active/passive search & attack with medium frequency. A new sonar system (probably the MGK-400EM) is likely being installed during mid-life refits. INS Sindhugosh is fitted with a new indigenous Panchendriya package, which includes a sonar (USHUS) plus a fire control system.

Maintaining the dimensions of the MGK-400 sonar basic antennas, the MGK-400EM sonar optimally meets the requirements for diesel-electric submarines. The antenna comprises advanced receiving elements. The system's hardware consists of modern, high-speed data processing computers and multifunctional displays. Modern circuitry elements make it possible to employ effective data processing algorithms and significantly expand the range of its functions (in addition to those fulfilled by the MGK-400 system), including: target classification; LOFAR and DEMON procedures; automatic tracking of up to 12 targets; active search with complex sounding signals; new types of communications and IFF signals; detecting active signals of torpedo homing heads in an extended frequency range of the hydro-acoustic signal detection mode; measuring detected active signal parameters, etc.

The system's tactical and technical characteristics, specifically the sonar operation range and target positioning accuracy, have been significantly improved. The system has new service functions, such as measurement & control of noise and jamming conditions and prediction of the sonar operation range in the main modes. Automatic test and fault diagnosis capability significantly enhances the quality, reliability and ease of operation of the system. To reduce submarine sonar crew, MGK-400EM incorporates the MG-519EM mine-hunting system with presentation of its data on the MGK-400EM's common information display. The system is being further upgraded by introducing a channel of low-frequency echo-ranging which uses a flexible trailing antenna or extensive onboard antennas.

Weapons Control: Uzel MVU-119EM TCFS.

Weapons: From INS Sindhuvir onwards, a shoulder-held 9M36 Strela-3 (SA-N-8) SAM launcher is placed in the fin and is used when the submarine is surfaced. The missile has a range of 3.2n miles; 6 km with a 2 kg HE-FRAG warhead and uses infra-red homing for guidance. INS Sindhushastra is armed with the Klub-S (3M-54E) ASCM. This gives the Indian Navy, it's first under-water launched missile capability. The other submarines in the class will also be fitted with the capability during their mid-life refits. A maximum of five missiles can be carried, leaving room for a mix of torpedoes.

Six 533mm torpedo tubes which carries 18 heavyweight torpedoes (six in the tubes and 12 on the racks). It uses an automatic rapid loader which is remotely controlled from the main control panel or by the controls in the launch station. Two of the tubes can fire wire-guided torpedoes, while the other four have automatic reloading. Torpedo types include the Type 53-65 passive wake homing torpedo, at a range of 10.3n miles; 19 km at 45 knots with a 305 kg warhead and the TEST 71/76 anti-submarine, active & passive homing torpedo at a range of 8.1n miles; 15 km at 40 knots or 10.8n miles; 20 km at 25 knots with a 200 kg warhead.

Jane's Defence Upgrades (JDU) reported in November 2000 that eight upgraded torpedoes, designated as the TEST-71ME-NK, were sold to the Indian Navy. This electric, remotely-controlled homing torpedo can be used against either submarines or surface ships (previous models were for submarine engagements only) and has a maximum speed of 40 knots with a claimed range of 20 km. Weighing 1820 kg, the torpedo has a 205 kg explosive warhead and is powered by a silver-zinc single-use ampoule battery. Target detection ranges are 1500 meters for submarines and 180 meters for surface vessels. Equipped with acoustic and electromagnetic influence exploders, this new torpedo's operational characteristics allow reduced preparation time both at base and on-board the submarine. A practice version is available to allow training firing. Another version, TEST-71MKE, is for use against submarines only and is fitted with active sonar homing and tele-control systems.

Carries 24 DM-1 mines in lieu of torpedoes.

Countermeasures: A 'Squid Head' radar warning is used for ESM purposes.

Comments: Kilo Class submarines have been nicknamed 'Black Hole' by NATO for their silent operation in the sea. An agreement with Russia was concluded in the mid-1980s for the transfer of eight Kilo Class submarines. The first submarine in the class - INS Sindhugosh - was commissioned in April 1986 in Riga, Russia and seven more boats entered service with the Indian Navy in another five years. In January 1997, two 'improved' Kilo Class boats were ordered by the Indian Navy and the first - INS Sindhurakshak - was commissioned in December 1997 in St. Petersburg, Russia. This submarine was a spare Type 877EKM hull built for the Russian Navy, but was never purchased. The second boat - INS Sindhushastra - commissioned in July 2000 also at St. Petersburg, is rumoured to be a Type-636.

INS Sindhuvir completed a two-year mid-life refit at the Admiralty Shipyard, St. Petersburg in April 1999 and she was ready for active service in October 1999. INS Sindhuraj returned to Mumbai after completing her refit, also at the Admiralty Shipyard. INS Sindhukesari returned to Mumbai after completing her refit at the Zvyozdochka (Little Star) shipyard in Severodvinsk. INS Sindhuratna also completed her refit at Zvyozdochka SY and in September 2002, left on her return journey to India. INS Sindhugosh is the third submarine to complete her refit at the Zvyozdochka SY and she is expected to return to India towards the end of 2005. INS Sindhuvijay is the next submarine expected to undergo a modernisation, also at the Zvyozdochka SY, which began in June 2005.

The upgrade package is designed by Zvyozdochka's Onega Research & Development Technological Bureau and costs US $80 million. This refit sees the submarines being installed with the Klub-S ASCM (a maximum of five missiles can be carried) and the associated Lama-ER control system, new sonars (probably the MGK-400EM), electronic warfare systems, new control systems from Avrora such as the Palladij-M machinery control system and the AICS (Automated Information & Control system) integrated weapon control system. A complete overhaul of the submarine, including its hull structure, is also part of this mid-life refit.

INS Sindhugosh has likely been equipped with the 3M-14E land-attack cruise missile, a member of Klub family. The submarine has also been equipped with a Panchendriya package, which includes an Indian sonar (USHUS) developed by NPOL (Naval Physical Oceanographic Laboratory) of the Indian Navy and by BEL (Bharat Electronics Limited) and a fire control system developed by BEL and the Indian Navy's WEESE (Weapons Engineering & Electronics System Engineering) unit. The remaining submarines due for their mid-life refits, are to be fitted with this new indigenous Panchendriya package. The USHUS sonar is reported to offer superior performance over comparable Russian sonars.

At the February 2002 India-Russia Inter-Governmental Commission on Military Technical Cooperation, then-incumbent Defence Minister George Fernandes stated, "It has also been agreed to accord priority to the setting up of facilities required for the medium refit and upgradation of 877EKM submarines in India." This indicates that future refits of the remaining submarines might occur in India itself, rather than being sent to Russia. Reports indicate that the mid-life refits of two more submarines (possibly INS Sindhukirti and INS Sindhuvaj) will occur at the Hindustan Shipyard Limited, Vishakapatnam under Russian technical supervision.

A spokesperson of the Zvyozdochka SY stated that INS Sindhugosh would be launched on 22 April 2005 and the submarine will undergo sea trials after modernisation. The spokesperson also mentioned that submarine's crew arrived at the shipyard in March 2005 to take part in these trials and confirmed that Indian equipment (not specified) was installed onboard the submarine by 'representatives' of the customer. Another shipyard official at Zvyozdochka stated that the program for the sea trials of INS Sindhughosh, would include three sorties into the open sea, including the testing of the submarine's new armament system. Subsequently on 22 April 2005, the boat was indeed launched as planned. The Russian news agency, Itar-Tass, reported on 27 June 2005 that INS Sindhughosh had sailed out to the Barents Sea for performance trials, with the submarine's first cruise expected to last three weeks. The agency also stated that a second cruise is planned and she will be handed over to the Indian Navy soon after.



MiG-29K FULCRUM-D

Avionics: The Indian Navy's MiG-29K are more likely to be equipped with downsized NIIP N011M Bars-29 passive phased array radar, rather than the Phazatron Zhuk-MSE multifunctional radar, to ensure commonality with the Indian Air Force's Su-30MKI. The Bars radar will have functions for operations in air-to-air and air-to-ground modes and a helmet-mounted sight. The cockpit will incorporates two large-screen, multi-function, liquid-crystal displays and HOTAS (Hands On Throttle And Stick).

The aircraft's avionics will be based on MIL-STD 1533 bus. The core of the onboard computer command system will be all Russian and will include a central computer, four target designation systems (radar, TV, IR and helmet-mounted sight) and a head-up display. Although primarily to be armed with Russian weapons, Western weapons may be offered as an option. Integration of Western-made weapons is not expected to present problems, as RSK MiG has amassed experience of a variety of Western weapon systems during development of the Russian-French MiG-AT jet trainer and the mating the Kopyo radar on the MiG-21-93 for the IAF.

Weapons: Due to an integrated weapon selection panel, the MiG-29K can use a wide range of weapons, which includes no less than eight types of air-to-air missiles and 25 air-to-surface weapons. The weapon selection system enables the pilot to fire more than one type of weapon per attack. The aircraft is armed with an internal 30mm GSh-301 gun, with 150 rounds. In the air superiority role, the MiG-29K can be armed with the close-combat R-60MK and the R-73RDM2, the medium-range R-27RE1/TE1 and the beyond-visual-range R-77RVV-AE air-to-air missile. In the air-to-surface role, the AS-20 (air-launched 3M-24E) anti-ship missile can be carried.

Full Information on the Indian Navy MiG-29K

I was referring to Jaguar-IM Maritime Attack aircraft of the Indian Air-Force.

Avionics: BAe-built Jaguars have the NAVWASS (NAVigation and Weapon-Aiming Sub-System) avionics suite, while HAL-built Jaguars have the more modern DARIN (Display Attack and Ranging Inertial Navigation) avionics suite which features a wide field-of-view Smiths (GEC Avionics) Type 1301 HUDWAC (Head-Up Display & Weapon Aiming Computer), a GEC-Ferranti COMED 2045 (Combined Map & Electronic Display), a SAGEM ULISS 82 INS and a LRMTS (Laser Ranger and Marked Target Seeker). The system also includes locally-designed IFF, ADF, radar altimeter, V/UHF and HF/SSB equipment. HAL-built Jaguars also have the MIL-STD-1553B digital databus, allowing for the fitting of a wide range of new weapons and systems.

The maritime attack variant, the Jaguar IM, has a nose-mounted Agave radar. The radar display is presented either in the head-up display (HUD) or in the normal COMED display. The radar, which is capable of air-to-air operations but optimised for maritime air-to-surface operations, scans through 140º in azimuth and through 6º or 12º in elevation (from a 60º arc).

Armament: Two 30mm Aden guns with 150 rds of ammunition in the single seater and one 30mm Aden gun on the port side fitted in the trainer. The Jaguar IS carries a variety of un-guided ordnance such as the AS-30L ASM, Hunting BL755 CBUs (cluster bomb units), RAF-type slick and retarded 1000 lb (454 kg) bombs, Matra Durandal anti-runway bombs, Lepus 8in reconnaissance flares and Matra F1 and 155 (SNEB) rocket pods. The Jaguar IS also carries two Magic-II missiles over the wing, for protection from enemy interceptors. The aircraft is also suited to carry a tactical nuclear payload. The Jaguar IMs use the Sea Eagle AShM for maritime strike.

Full info of IAF Jaguar

Sea Harrier

Avionics: Ferranti Blue Fox non-coherent pulse radar, which has four operating modes - search, air-to-air, air-to-surface and bore-sight for close combat.


Weapons: The aircraft has four wing and three under-fuselage stations. The inner wing pylons carry drop tanks of 900 kg each. The two outer wing pylons can carry up to 450 kg each. Two under-fuselage stations are normally occupied by two 30mm gun pods, with 120 rounds per gun. Indian Navy Sea Harriers use Magic-IIs for air defense. In the anti-ship role, the Sea Harrier can carry two Sea Eagle AShMs.

Full info on IN Sea-Harriers

mirages, f16s, thunders, latest acquisition! taking off from oman, yemen, pakistan!!!

and you really think that PAF gonna spare any one of them for the PN when they are busy with Flankers, Fulcrums, Vajra's and 126 MRCA's to be acquired.

Also please enlight me when it was the lat time PAF spared it's jet's for the PN.

USS nimitz class carriers with their f18s. chinese fleet in gwader.

Ohh sorry. But we are not discussing imaginations and dreams.

you have any idea what damage it will do to the US, European and Chinese economys if you blockade gwader when its fully active?

Indian Navy's primary objective is Karachi.

a: missile boats, submarines, cruisers, destroyers, fishing boats!

By 2010? Babur is yet to be teted on the naval platforms whereas Brahmos is already fitted on one of the Kashin's after tests. Tu-142 and Flankers can carry and fire them anytime.

b: whats the lowest the barak can see? what does it look with?? what electronics can be used to disable it!

Go here

Thanks,

Miro