Search Still on for Developmental Partner for Kaveri Engine

[thestringshredder]

Its Confirmed now that India’s GTRE and French engine maker Snecma will not be working together in development of a New Kaveri engine for India’s 5th Generation AMCA aircraft project , as per sources Both couldn’t agree on work sharing agreement and also funding of the project .

Snecma wanted to use Core of uprated derivative of the M88-2 engine that powers the French Rafale fighter for development of New Kaveri engine (K-10) but after failed talks Now, RFP will be send to other Engine manufactures for co-development of new Kaveri engine (K-10) which will power AMCA , Sources have ruled out Kaveri Engine Powering Tejas aircraft in near future , spin-off engine of current Kaveri engine (K-9+) will be used to power India’s first Stealthy Unmanned Strike Air Vehicle (USAV).

GTRE still plans to integrate Kaveri K-9+ engine with Tejas once the Engine is ready to complete its development , A older Tejas test aircraft operated by India’s Aeronautical Development Agency will be used for the integration . Since its first run in 1996 nine Kaveri engines were built. Although, due to the delays in development and insufficient thrust, Kaveri is not destined for the Tejas Indigenous Fighter Aircraft, new engine for AMCA will need to generate at least 90 KN of thrust. ”Development and flight-testing of the new engine will take at least five to six years.”

Link - Search Still on for Developmental Partner for Kaveri Engine | idrw.org

 

[satishkumarcsc]

Its Confirmed now that India’s GTRE and French engine maker Snecma will not be working together in development of a New Kaveri engine for India’s 5th Generation AMCA aircraft project , as per sources Both couldn’t agree on work sharing agreement and also funding of the project .

Snecma wanted to use Core of uprated derivative of the M88-2 engine that powers the French Rafale fighter for development of New Kaveri engine (K-10) but after failed talks Now, RFP will be send to other Engine manufactures for co-development of new Kaveri engine (K-10) which will power AMCA , Sources have ruled out Kaveri Engine Powering Tejas aircraft in near future , spin-off engine of current Kaveri engine (K-9+) will be used to power India’s first Stealthy Unmanned Strike Air Vehicle (USAV).

GTRE still plans to integrate Kaveri K-9+ engine with Tejas once the Engine is ready to complete its development , A older Tejas test aircraft operated by India’s Aeronautical Development Agency will be used for the integration . Since its first run in 1996 nine Kaveri engines were built. Although, due to the delays in development and insufficient thrust, Kaveri is not destined for the Tejas Indigenous Fighter Aircraft, new engine for AMCA will need to generate at least 90 KN of thrust. ”Development and flight-testing of the new engine will take at least five to six years.”

Link - Search Still on for Developmental Partner for Kaveri Engine | idrw.org

The fitting of the M 88 core will need almost a whole new design. And it is not viable at all.

 

[nomi007]

indian are just wasting money of power tax payers
i is better for them to purchase whole produstion line of m53 from france

 

[Abingdonboy]

ONE DAY........

 

[SirHatesALot]

JUST NOT TODAY

 

[Jesus]

At Present AMCA project is on hold. It will take atleast a decade to see the first flight of AMCA, If we encourage the private players definitely they will yield something during the time of induction.

 

[Bullet500]

indian are just wasting money of power tax payers
i is better for them to purchase whole produstion line of m53 from france

Doesnt work that way mate. We need our own engine so that in future we can make our own more powerful and better engines. Making this engine is very important. It will help in realizing many projects which we cant undertake without our own engine.

 

[Manindra]

indian are just wasting money of power tax payers
i is better for them to purchase whole produstion line of m53 from france

We already produce AL-31 Saturn , RD-33MK but we want our own engine. So, we can upgrade , modify , redesign it without seeking anybody's permission & paying royalty.

 

[Abingdonboy]

We already produce AL-31 Saturn , RD-33MK but we want our own engine. So, we can upgrade , modify , redesign it without seeking anybody's permission & paying royalty.

Not to mention the M88 engines on the Rafale will be coming with a high degree of ToT.

 

[Manindra]

Not to mention the M88 engines on the Rafale will be coming with a high degree of ToT.

They think everything come with TOT & then you will able to re-design, upgrade or modify the product without help of OEM.
TOT helps in creating Industrial base but design new product is your line of fire.

 

[Abingdonboy]

They think everything come with TOT & then you will able to re-design, upgrade or modify the product without help of OEM.
TOT helps in creating Industrial base but design new product is your line of fire.

Exactly! Of course the nature of the ToT is also a factor- in the past (with India) ToT meant only imparting "screwdriver tech/knowledge" to India. Nowadays the ToT that India demands is far more intensive and worthwhile. However all ToT provides you is a certain amount of knowledge/info on a finshed product. What India is lacking is the design,testing and development know how and this is where the Kaveri has run into issue. So while ToT from Snecma for the M88s will help India ALOT (just like the AL-31 ToT did), if India wants to get to where it wants to be ie able to design,test and devlop engines on their own then India is going to have to go through this long and exhaustive process of starting from the bottom and going up from there aka Kaveri.

 

[nomi007]

still indian did not have Il-76 Engine Testbed which is very important for engine development
sending engine to russia and than take back to country is costly and as well as lengthy process

 

[Abingdonboy]

still indian did not have Il-76 Engine Testbed which is very important for engine development
sending engine to russia and than take back to country is costly and as well as lengthy process

Lol- do you think India is an established player in engine design and testing yet bro? India is still in the VERY early stages- give it time.

 

[Manindra]

Exactly! Of course the nature of the ToT is also a factor- in the past (with India) ToT meant only imparting "screwdriver tech/knowledge" to India. Nowadays the ToT that India demands is far more intensive and worthwhile. However all ToT provides you is a certain amount of knowledge/info on a finshed product. What India is lacking is the design,testing and development know how and this is where the Kaveri has run into issue. So while ToT from Snecma for the M88s will help India ALOT (just like the AL-31 ToT did), if India wants to get to where it wants to be ie able to design,test and devlop engines on their own then India is going to have to go through this long and exhaustive process of starting from the bottom and going up from there aka Kaveri.

One more point should taken in context that if someone got 100% TOT but he lacks basic knowledge which OEM gains from their R&D.
OEM know which process gonna fail & which succeed. Edison once said,"Who say I am failed, I learned 999 methods to fail."
This learned method to fail is very vital to design any project.

 

[Abingdonboy]

One more point should taken in context that if someone got 100% TOT but he basic knowledge which OEM gains from their R&D.
OEM know which process gonna fail & which succeed. Edison once said,"Who say I am failed, I learned 999 methods to fail."
This learned method to fail is very vital to design any project.

Yes, what one will get from 100% ToT (which no one will ever get unless you're the Chinese ) is the info on a finished/polished product. One will NOT be able to then create an identical product because you won't know how to get to that finished stage. Hence I truly admire what India is doing- taking the long and painful option of going from the ground up on an engine (Kaveri) but SIMULTANEOUSLY getting ToT from the likes of Saturn and Snecma. Should produce some truly excellent results down the road.