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India is the revisionist power

S.M.R

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By Ejaz Haider
Published: July 28, 2011

In his famous essay, What is a Nation, the French philosopher, Ernest Renan, argued that selective amnesia — “forgetting”, as he puts it — is an important part of modern nation-building. This is achieved in many ways, but most importantly by controlling the narrative. The narrative determines the core aspects of the identity of a state. It is successful when that identity is internalised by the peoples to a point where those core aspects are not disputed, and where any external challenges to them are simply not entertained.

Using this central benchmark — I make no attempt here to problematise this process — we have to concede that Pakistan lags far behind India in defining the core aspects of its nationhood. Not because India is not internally troubled, which it is, but because India has developed a centre that holds it together. The centre drives India and perpetuates the narrative, deflecting the world’s attention away from India’s musty underbelly: Abject poverty, very high levels of corruption, the near-absence of the state’s writ in the Red Corridor, terrible human rights violations in Occupied Kashmir, crimes against women and, yes, Taliban-style panchayats.

And while the media highlights internal troubles, it is largely pliant to the state when it comes to presenting the state to the outside world and is the most effective vehicle for the state narrative.

It is a common practice for states to sell the narrative internally. But it is a greater exercise in soft compellence to sell it to other collections also. An even greater success would be to make one’s narrative acceptable to sections of another collection with whom one is locked in conflict.

India has done this with Pakistan and, as a realist, I salute them for this success. Of course, India’s success in this regard is directly proportional to Pakistan’s failure to sell itself to its people. This, as I have noted on a number of occasions, is the biggest threat to Pakistan.

One consequence of this is a large number of us swallowing, hook, line and sinker, India’s narrative on its conflict with Pakistan. Here are some examples:

India is a status quo power while Pakistan is a revisionist state; India just wants to live in peace; there’s nothing about Pakistan that interests India; India, the Little Red Riding Hood, has to keep the world’s fourth largest military because Pakistan attacked it four times — ’47, ’65, ’71 and ’99. Let’s just take these up.

(NB: It’s quite another fact that every time Pakistan has tried to engage India on force rationalisation — nuclear and conventional — including as part of the 2004 dialogue framework, India shifts the goalpost by referring to China).

The term ‘status quo power’ is used cleverly in modern interstate relations. It ignores the direct and indirect influence — soft and hard power, and diplomacy — exerted by stronger states on the weaker ones in the former’s areas of concern by focusing instead on whether a state wants to capture another’s territory. Let there be no doubt, however, that rising powers are always revisionist states. They challenge an existing power configuration by spreading their influence and power. China is one; India is lagging far, far behind but following the same paradigm.

Pakistan is accused of being a revisionist state, primarily vis-a-vis Occupied Kashmir. And a part of our self-loathing intelligentsia has accepted this bunkum. Pakistan has no designs on India but Kashmir is not a part of India. It is a disputed area and that fact is also accepted by India. Because this will be deliberately twisted by the ‘what-abouters’, let me clarify that I am not advocating a war with India, merely stating a fact.

As for revisionism, Pakistan, within the region, is a status quo power because it checks India’s desire to project power in South, the West, and southern Asia. A neoliberal paradigm is possible if India is prepared to address the issue of Kashmir meaningfully. The last three years have clearly shown that the problem lies inside Occupied Kashmir. They have also shown that India remains singularly and callously unconcerned about the Kashmiris.

And what about the wars Pakistan is supposed to have thrust on India?

The 1947 war began as an indigenous uprising in different parts of the then State of Jammu and Kashmir (J&K). It is a matter of historical record that Pakistan had no clear state policy on how to use force against India’s illegal invasion of J&K. The ragtag Poonchis and other Kashmiri groups, with help from tribesmen and some elements of the Pakistani military, managed to capture the territory which now forms Azad Kashmir. If they hadn’t, Pakistan would have today needed just the present size of its army to defend the northern salient.

The 1965 war was a mistake. Much has been written about it inside Pakistan. But there is absolutely no reason to be apologetic about making an armed attempt to get back territory in occupation of an adversary. Pakistan never violated the Indian territory: It crossed what was then the CFL (ceasefire line). The fact is that it was India that aggressed against Pakistan directly when it attacked across, and violated, the international border.

As for India’s generosity, as mentioned by many Indian analysts, in returning to Pakistan the Haji Pir Pass, I have to give them full marks for dissembling! The Tashkent Agreement required the two sides to go back to status quo ante. India decided to keep Kargil because that secured its road to Leh, and return Haji Pir Pass to get back Chhamb and Jorrian because in that area we were dangerously close to the chicken neck. You cut off the chicken neck and you cut off India from Occupied Kashmir. But the problem is not Indian dissembling; it is our acceptance of this deceptive narrative.

And Pakistan attacked India in 1971!? This actually takes the cake. Ignore India’s full-fledged assault on then East Pakistan and trot out Pakistan’s attack in the west, an attack that came too late. That episode also opens the chapter in this region of covert war. Yes, it was introduced by India when it trained the Mukti Bahini; India repeated this exercise with Sri Lanka when it trained the LTTE. I don’t grudge India any of its actions. States do these things in their interests, perceived or real. But to present India as the babe in the wood? Nah; not happening.

Of course there is Kargil in 1999. More of us have blasted Kargil here, including this writer, than perhaps writers in India. It was a terrible operation at all levels. Worse, it came at a time when Pakistan and India were moving towards normalisation. That process should have been allowed to move forward and bear fruit. But let us not forget India’s occupation of the Saltoro Range, its violation of Pakistani posts along the LoC. In a conflictual model these things happen. Yet I will be the first to deduct marks from the Pakistani military on the Kargil operation. Still, the man who did it also became India’s best partner in peace.

Finally, implying that India can’t have peace until Pakistan accepts India’s diagnosis will not beget India a viable policy. Pakistan wants peace. But it doesn’t want to become a west Bangladesh, to use Stephen Cohen’s phrase. So, let’s get rid of the I-am-the-good-guy-here baloney and level with each other.



Published in The Express Tribune, July 29th, 2011.

India is the revisionist power – The Express Tribune
 
He's spot on! :tup: I am glad that we have at least someone who writes real things on ET, majority of the contributors are Apologist type of part-time writers.
 
I am sorry but is India being indicted during the course of this article? or is it Pakistan? Somehow I got the impression that the author wishes to convey that India is a bigger crook than Pakistan but the fact that Pakistan continues to be the smaller crook of the two is entirely Pakistan's fault, they could and should have done better but alas, that was not to be!!! Please correct me if I am wrong.
 
Pakistan is accused of being a revisionist state, primarily vis-a-vis Occupied Kashmir. And a part of our self-loathing intelligentsia has accepted this bunkum. Pakistan has no designs on India but Kashmir is not a part of India. It is a disputed area and that fact is also accepted by India. Because this will be deliberately twisted by the ‘what-abouters’, let me clarify that I am not advocating a war with India, merely stating a fact.

The author starts off talking about how nations need to define a narrative in order to define themselves. This para is a good example of a narrative that the Pakistani state has been able to sell to its population extremely well. Kudos to them for a job well done. Maybe too well done considering that there are people running around shouting about Gazwa e Hind
 
The problem is he's never got over the a$$-whooping he got from Shashi Tharoor over something he could have just gotten by; Haider decided to tear into Taheer's article, and Tharoor simply returned the favor, in much more melodramatic terms. No amount of highlighting India's problems including its various insurgencies, lawlessness, abject poverty, corruption or the HR Violations in J-K can simply throw away the fact that, India is a country that is on the path to progress. It is a country buoyed by an optimism to look within, help oneself rectify, and at the same time decide the best course of correction ahead. Challenges exist yes, there's a difference of opinion yes, but that is DEMOCRACY, which Pakistan has NEVER encountered for a good 36 years since its inception. The wheels of progress currently are being greased by the dynamic population, and while squeaking and creaking, still it has begun to move steadily. Pakistan is in a quagmire far too deeper than can be imagined. And if Haider wants to short-stroke his local audience with this stuff, he might have just bitten off more than he could have chewed. By being an apologist on justifications for forceful annexation of a disputed land, he has simply shown that Kashmir will drain the National psyche if it continues to be the topic of national debate.
 
The problem is he's never got over the a$$-whooping he got from Shashi Tharoor over something he could have just gotten by; Haider decided to tear into Taheer's article, and Tharoor simply returned the favor, in much more melodramatic terms.

In case you missed it, Ejaz Haider reduced S Tharoor's pompous and shallow rhetoric to the bottom of the 'intellectual heap' status it deserved with his riposte, which was EH's article preceding this one.

Tharoor and Taseer's articles matched each other in their shallow and disingenuous nature.
 
History is merely the winner's version of events, and international geopolitics is never played on a level field.

Neither of which preclude highlighting the inaccuracies of history and attempting to 'level the playing field', or highlighting the discrimination for local and/or international audiences.
 
In case you missed it, Ejaz Haider reduced S Tharoor's pompous and shallow rhetoric to the bottom of the 'intellectual heap' status it deserved with his riposte, which was EH's article preceding this one.

Tharoor and Taseer's articles matched each other in their shallow and disingenuous nature.
Yeah right, and Haider's article is right at the highest echelons of intellectual unbiased debating. Haider was rebuffed and sundered by his own fellow Pakistanis, who says
many of Pakistan’s urban liberal elite are nothing but an extension and an accessory of Pakistan’s military establishment (just as Islamo-fascists are), who carefully guard their own socio-economic and political interests and lifestyle by remaining complicit to or silent on Pakistan army’s brutalities to democracy and the people.
<snip/>
Also, in my humble view, by placing Marvi Srimed in the same league as that of Mosharraf Zaidi and Ejaz Haider, Mr. Tharoor has shown that he remains unaware of the internal heterogeneity of &#8220;Pakistani liberals&#8221;. While Mosharraf Zaidi, Ejaz Haider and some others in Pakistani media are widely known to have a pro-military establishment stance, Marvi Srimed is a victim of the military establishment and its various agencies.
The link : Deconstructing Pakistani liberals: A response to Shashi Tharoor and Raza Rumi

Haider in plain terms is but a "military stooge" ; I will not even go into what Shashi Tharoor's accomplishments are ; The guy is a career diplomat, someone who's been in the second highest rung in the UN, a former MoS. Above all, he qualifies his comments with the way he understands it. So, Haider for all of his jingoism came with a naive retort to Taseer, and keeps on digging his liberal grave with further posts, that all but highlights Taheer's points in the first place.
 
This whole article was nothing but Mr. Haider tryiing to justify Pakistan's attacks on India.

According to Mr. haider-

1948 war: It was not the Pakistan army , but Indigenous uprising against the occupation of Kashmir by Indian Army

1965: We did not attack India. we just crossed the CFL(LOC) and attacked and killed Indian Soldiers.:hitwall:

1971: It was not Our fault that 10 million Bangladeshis entered India to escape from genocide even though India had repeatedly asked West Pakistanis to honour the election results of 1970.it is India's fault that they did not have a strong economy to take in those 10 million refugees and had to resort to war.

1999: India did Siachen so it is not fault we had to try Kargil(and failed badly):taz:
 
Neither of which preclude highlighting the inaccuracies of history and attempting to 'level the playing field', or highlighting the discrimination for local and/or international audiences.

Sure, highlighting one's point of view and trying to level the playing field are continuous efforts.
 
Haider in plain terms is but a "military stooge" ; I will not even go into what Shashi Tharoor's accomplishments are ; The guy is a career diplomat, someone who's been in the second highest rung in the UN, a former MoS. Above all, he qualifies his comments with the way he understands it. .

Do not mistake career experience , this post and that post for accuracy or truth.
After all.. the former IMF chief was equally celebrated.
 
By Ejaz Haider
Published: July 28, 2011

In his famous essay, What is a Nation, the French philosopher, Ernest Renan, argued that selective amnesia &#8212; &#8220;forgetting&#8221;, as he puts it &#8212; is an important part of modern nation-building. This is achieved in many ways, but most importantly by controlling the narrative. The narrative determines the core aspects of the identity of a state. It is successful when that identity is internalised by the peoples to a point where those core aspects are not disputed, and where any external challenges to them are simply not entertained.

Using this central benchmark &#8212; I make no attempt here to problematise this process &#8212; we have to concede that Pakistan lags far behind India in defining the core aspects of its nationhood. Not because India is not internally troubled, which it is, but because India has developed a centre that holds it together. The centre drives India and perpetuates the narrative, deflecting the world&#8217;s attention away from India&#8217;s musty underbelly: Abject poverty, very high levels of corruption, the near-absence of the state&#8217;s writ in the Red Corridor, terrible human rights violations in Occupied Kashmir, crimes against women and, yes, Taliban-style panchayats.

And while the media highlights internal troubles, it is largely pliant to the state when it comes to presenting the state to the outside world and is the most effective vehicle for the state narrative.

It is a common practice for states to sell the narrative internally. But it is a greater exercise in soft compellence to sell it to other collections also. An even greater success would be to make one&#8217;s narrative acceptable to sections of another collection with whom one is locked in conflict.

India has done this with Pakistan and, as a realist, I salute them for this success. Of course, India&#8217;s success in this regard is directly proportional to Pakistan&#8217;s failure to sell itself to its people. This, as I have noted on a number of occasions, is the biggest threat to Pakistan.

One consequence of this is a large number of us swallowing, hook, line and sinker, India&#8217;s narrative on its conflict with Pakistan. Here are some examples:

India is a status quo power while Pakistan is a revisionist state; India just wants to live in peace; there&#8217;s nothing about Pakistan that interests India; India, the Little Red Riding Hood, has to keep the world&#8217;s fourth largest military because Pakistan attacked it four times &#8212; &#8217;47, &#8217;65, &#8217;71 and &#8217;99. Let&#8217;s just take these up.

(NB: It&#8217;s quite another fact that every time Pakistan has tried to engage India on force rationalisation &#8212; nuclear and conventional &#8212; including as part of the 2004 dialogue framework, India shifts the goalpost by referring to China).

The term &#8216;status quo power&#8217; is used cleverly in modern interstate relations. It ignores the direct and indirect influence &#8212; soft and hard power, and diplomacy &#8212; exerted by stronger states on the weaker ones in the former&#8217;s areas of concern by focusing instead on whether a state wants to capture another&#8217;s territory. Let there be no doubt, however, that rising powers are always revisionist states. They challenge an existing power configuration by spreading their influence and power. China is one; India is lagging far, far behind but following the same paradigm.

Pakistan is accused of being a revisionist state, primarily vis-a-vis Occupied Kashmir. And a part of our self-loathing intelligentsia has accepted this bunkum. Pakistan has no designs on India but Kashmir is not a part of India. It is a disputed area and that fact is also accepted by India. Because this will be deliberately twisted by the &#8216;what-abouters&#8217;, let me clarify that I am not advocating a war with India, merely stating a fact.

As for revisionism, Pakistan, within the region, is a status quo power because it checks India&#8217;s desire to project power in South, the West, and southern Asia. A neoliberal paradigm is possible if India is prepared to address the issue of Kashmir meaningfully. The last three years have clearly shown that the problem lies inside Occupied Kashmir. They have also shown that India remains singularly and callously unconcerned about the Kashmiris.

And what about the wars Pakistan is supposed to have thrust on India?

The 1947 war began as an indigenous uprising in different parts of the then State of Jammu and Kashmir (J&K). It is a matter of historical record that Pakistan had no clear state policy on how to use force against India&#8217;s illegal invasion of J&K. The ragtag Poonchis and other Kashmiri groups, with help from tribesmen and some elements of the Pakistani military, managed to capture the territory which now forms Azad Kashmir. If they hadn&#8217;t, Pakistan would have today needed just the present size of its army to defend the northern salient.

The 1965 war was a mistake. Much has been written about it inside Pakistan. But there is absolutely no reason to be apologetic about making an armed attempt to get back territory in occupation of an adversary. Pakistan never violated the Indian territory: It crossed what was then the CFL (ceasefire line). The fact is that it was India that aggressed against Pakistan directly when it attacked across, and violated, the international border.

As for India&#8217;s generosity, as mentioned by many Indian analysts, in returning to Pakistan the Haji Pir Pass, I have to give them full marks for dissembling! The Tashkent Agreement required the two sides to go back to status quo ante. India decided to keep Kargil because that secured its road to Leh, and return Haji Pir Pass to get back Chhamb and Jorrian because in that area we were dangerously close to the chicken neck. You cut off the chicken neck and you cut off India from Occupied Kashmir. But the problem is not Indian dissembling; it is our acceptance of this deceptive narrative.

And Pakistan attacked India in 1971!? This actually takes the cake. Ignore India&#8217;s full-fledged assault on then East Pakistan and trot out Pakistan&#8217;s attack in the west, an attack that came too late. That episode also opens the chapter in this region of covert war. Yes, it was introduced by India when it trained the Mukti Bahini; India repeated this exercise with Sri Lanka when it trained the LTTE. I don&#8217;t grudge India any of its actions. States do these things in their interests, perceived or real. But to present India as the babe in the wood? Nah; not happening.

Of course there is Kargil in 1999. More of us have blasted Kargil here, including this writer, than perhaps writers in India. It was a terrible operation at all levels. Worse, it came at a time when Pakistan and India were moving towards normalisation. That process should have been allowed to move forward and bear fruit. But let us not forget India&#8217;s occupation of the Saltoro Range, its violation of Pakistani posts along the LoC. In a conflictual model these things happen. Yet I will be the first to deduct marks from the Pakistani military on the Kargil operation. Still, the man who did it also became India&#8217;s best partner in peace.

Finally, implying that India can&#8217;t have peace until Pakistan accepts India&#8217;s diagnosis will not beget India a viable policy. Pakistan wants peace. But it doesn&#8217;t want to become a west Bangladesh, to use Stephen Cohen&#8217;s phrase. So, let&#8217;s get rid of the I-am-the-good-guy-here baloney and level with each other.



Published in The Express Tribune, July 29th, 2011.

India is the revisionist power &#8211; The Express Tribune

Same old rants like Kashmir and why India is developing its Military etc.....etc......
One question.......would Pakistan stop its military mordanisation if India did??
And when the Kashmir issue is brought into.......why only India???.......Pakistan and China also hold huge chunks of Territory Inside Kashmir.
 
The author appears confused

Begins well by describing in his terms the two nations and falls into the old rut of ' you hit me first " which when seeing the larger picture has no relevance to where the two nations are today.

Who cares about who started it , what matters is who is going to solve it & how. Not to mention the slippery slope Pak has been for about a decade - and accelerating.

It is tiring to read & re read the same oft flogged point of 47, 65, 71 & Kargil. No one in India wants Pak to be West BD. Pak is doing a fine job by appearing / making itself into East Afganistan. The similarities would make any neighbour nervous.

India wants Pak to be a stable, responsible and self dependent neighbour. Reoconciliation to our geography is the first step to move ahead. I couldn't care less what Tharoor said to whom or what EH did. What matters is I would not like to leave for my son the kind of India & the sub continent I inherited from my dad.

On the subject of wars, India always has been a slow starter and took a page of PA's book. Only India was sucessful while Pak was not.
 
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