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Government considering ban on urea fertiliser

EjazR

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Government considering ban on urea fertiliser

PESHAWAR: The government is considering a six-month ban on urea fertiliser, NWFP Minister for Local Government and Rural Development Bashir Ahmed Bilour said on Saturday.

Talking to reporters after visiting the site of Friday’s bomb attack that targeted an Inter-Services Intelligence office in Peshawar, he said a similar ban on explosives used in mining was also being considered. The government had earlier imposed a ban on the sale of chemical fertilisers in Swat.
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Looks like the NWFP ministers have finally wizened up to the facts that the explosives are being locally made instead of just being provided "Across the border" This temporary ban should be difficult for farmers though so all efforts should be made to shield the affected from the fertiliser ban
 
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locally made explosive is not that powerful to raise an entire building which is not that weak to be raised to ground with locally made explosive.

The matrial locally avialble indeed must be part of the explosive usage. anyway it is going to make problems for farmers but still lets see how they deal with it.

Atleast we can make these scumbags wander for this material
 
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@Jana

explosives made through Urea were responsible for the 1995 bombing of Okhlahoma by American militia led by Tomothy Mcveigh. And how much fertiliser did he need? 40X23kg bags if we are to believe the FBI. Just check out the blast site for that. Oklahoma City bombing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The point is if you want to make powerful explosives you just pack in more of the ammonium nitrate. A car filled is not enough, use a bus, if you want a bigger punch,use a truck. These people have had extensive practice and training in making these and its definitely possible to just used urea based explosives to even bring down buildings although it just tkaes more time and is riskier to prepare.
 
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In Marriott Blast they used the Truck of C-4, Don't tell me they can also make C-4
 
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Do you have any credible report saying C4 was used there? If I remember correctly it was a truck bomb so atleast 500-1000kg of explosives was used that again resembles a urea based bombing strategy. C4 are more compact and it would be a waste if you were going to bomb using a truck bomb anyways. Although the attackers might have used mines or grenades to act as detonators.
 
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Do you have any credible report saying C4 was used there? If I remember correctly it was a truck bomb so atleast 500-1000kg of explosives was used that again resembles a urea based bombing strategy. C4 are more compact and it would be a waste if you were going to bomb using a truck bomb anyways. Although the attackers might have used mines or grenades to act as detonators.

Sorry it was RDX, If i m not wrong there is little difference b/w RDX & C-4,but still

Government advisor Rehman Malik said RDX and TNT were used in the attack. Approximately 600 kg of RDX was mixed with TNT (Torpex or H6) and a mixture of mortar and ammunition to increase the explosive capacity. Aluminum powder was also mixed with the material to further enhance this capability. Torpex is about fifty percent more powerful than TNT by weight. The blast was heard for many miles throughout the capital.
Islamabad Marriott Hotel bombing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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Well there you go, TNT is basically made from urea fertilizers. Processing with acids e.t.c. results in TNT and that was used here to increase the blast radius. The use of RDX and specific deonators like Aluminium powders shows that they are not just using simple techniques but are researching and adopting newer and improved techniques. These people are not dumb and have the brains to improve techniques and because of the free hand they had until beginning of this year, they must have been able to manufacture tons and refined their procedures as well as spread this know how.
 
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Well there you go, TNT is basically made from urea fertilizers. Processing with acids e.t.c. results in TNT and that was used here to increase the blast radius. The use of RDX and specific deonators like Aluminium powders shows that they are not just using simple techniques but are researching and adopting newer and improved techniques. These people are not dumb and have the brains to improve techniques and because of the free hand they had until beginning of this year, they must have been able to manufacture tons and refined their procedures as well as spread this know how as well.

I seriously doubt if they can make Trinitrotoluene(TNT) without any scientific Knowledge & that too in large quantities, TNT is no way an easy to manufacture chemical...

TNT is synthesized in a three-step process First, toluene is nitrated with a mixture of sulfuric and nitric acid to produce mono-nitrotoluene or MNT. The MNT is separated and then renitrated to dinitrotoluene or DNT. In the final step, the DNT is nitrated to trinitrotoluene or TNT using an anhydrous mixture of nitric acid and oleum. Nitric acid is consumed by the manufacturing process, but the diluted sulfuric acid can be reconcentrated and reused. Subsequent to nitration, TNT is stabilized by a process called sulphitation, where the crude TNT is treated with aqueous sodium sulfite solution in order to remove less stable isomers of TNT and other undesired reaction products. The rinse water from sulphitation is known as red water and is a significant pollutant and waste product of TNT manufacture.

Control of nitrogen oxides in feed nitric acid is very important because free nitrogen dioxide can result in oxidation of the methyl group of toluene. This reaction is highly exothermic and carries with it the risk of runaway reaction and explosion.

In the laboratory, 2,4,6-trinitrotoluene is produced by a two step process. A nitrating mixture of concentrated nitric and sulfuric acids is used to nitrate toluene to a mixture of mono- and di-nitrotoluene isomers, with cooling to maintain careful temperature control. The nitrated toluenes are separated, washed with dilute sodium bicarbonate to remove oxides of nitrogen, and then carefully nitrated with a mixture of fuming nitric acid and sulfuric acid. Towards the end of the nitration, the mixture is heated on a steam bath. The trinitrotoluene is separated, washed with a dilute solution of sodium sulfite and then recrystallized from alcohol.

And moreover regarding Urea to be used an Explosive I ve found this very interesting & one shocking thing,i.e. u don't need fertilizer for it U can even use Human & animal Urine for Making Urea Nitrate

UREA NITRATE USING HUMAN URINE
1. Boil 10 cups of human urine, until only 10% is left (i.e. 1 cup).
2. Filter the solution.
3. Add 1/3 cup of HNO3 and leave this mixture for 2 hours for full crystallisation.
4. Filter again and leave in air to dry.
5. This is our urea nitrate.

This Link is even providing the Mixtures of Urea Nitrate which will Explode on Detonation, LINK: http://www.freewebs.com/lpumsun/ureanitrate2.html

Now u can see how easy it is to acess info on these Explosives...

Here is another Interesting Question & then Answer regarding Urea Nitrate as Explosive...

Request for Fertilizer in Iraq - Urea Safety Question

Question:


EOD (Explosive Ordnance) individuals that claim they can convert any fertilizer into an explosive. This perception is limiting the availability of fertilizer in the region. It is well-known that the fertilizer Ammonia Nitrate and the ease can cause explosion, but the specific issue in this region is using Urea as fertilizer. From my research Urea CO(NH2)2 is a strongly bonded chemical compound and would required significant chemistry to convert into an explosive. Can Urea be made into an explosive? If it can be made into an explosive can that be done using kitchen equipment or is complex lab required? Are there specific chemicals that are required and can these chemical be controlled?

Currently the one SF (Special Forces) gentlemen has located a large quaintly of Urea on an Iraqi farm and is periodically taking bags of the fertilizer and dumping these into the nearby canal. In the same general area due to the danger of insurgency the Ag manger has not been able to operate the only Ag supply warehouse and it has been empty of any fertilizer since 2006. It is desired to present the need to open the fertilizer supply chain. If Urea is a potential hazard, one solution has is to mix it with clay. Another solution is to import low grade fertilizer. Two Urea manufacturing plants exist in Iraq. All other forms of fertilizer must be shipped into the country. While other forms of nitrogen have less likelihood of being made into an explosive it does cost much more to ship bulky material and to purchase from overseas dealers. There is potential of manufacturing ammonium sulfate here in Iraq due to the sulfur by products from the refining process used in Iraq; but it will be some time before that process can be brought into the county.



My specific question is nitric acid a controlled substance in Iraq and what restrictions and safe guards are in place within Iraq for shipment and storage of nitric acid? This chemical is an industrial commodity that has little commercial use except for making explosives from nitrogen compounds. The control of nitric acid would mitigate the potential of IEDs made from fertilizer and enable the use of the low cost Urea fertilizer. Nitric acid is used in manufacturing of explosives including nitroglycerin, trinitrotoluene (TNT) and cyclotrimethylenetrinitramine (RDX), as well as fertilizers such as ammonium nitrate. Also, in ICP-MS and ICP-AES techniques, nitric acid (with a concentration from 0.5% to 2.0%) is used as a matrix compound for determining metal traces in solutions. Ultrapure acid is required for such determination, because small amounts of metal ions could affect the result of the analysis. It has additional uses in metallurgy and refining as it reacts with most metals, and in organic syntheses. When combined with hydrochloric acid, it forms aqua regia, one of the few reagents capable of dissolving gold and platinum.

Why is nitrogen fertilizer important? It is a basic plant food necessary for the Agricultural industry to improve production of crops. For example current Diyala wheat production is approximately 240-300 Kg per Donum. This is one half or less what production would be under good management which includes the use of nitrogen fertilizer. If the use of Urea fertilizer cannot be safely made available in Iraq or certain provinces are unable to provide the increased security on the transport and storage of the fertilizer and the control of the Nitric acid, the chemical necessary to convert Urea to an explosive, then the Agriculturists need to have a policy to use substitute fertilizers. In addition the industry section of OPA/PRT need to consider encouraging the country to manufacture other formulations of nitrogen compounds.
Bottom line is, whether is possible to recommend using Urea in Diyala or not? This supposed to be a country wide policy decision for the development of the industry.

Response:

The first response states that Urea Nitrate, not Urea per se, is a highly feared explosive. Urea is a natural excretion of mammals, including humans, so a keen maker of Urea Nitrate need not necessarily get hold of the fertilizer. See http://www.freewebs.com/lpumsun/ureanitrate2.html for methods of making its crystals from the fertilizer as well as from human urine (called an Advanced Method!!!).

As you see from the above site's recipes, highly concentrated Nitric Acid is required to make Urea Nitrate. This is the key ingredient that must be controlled. I hope this information will help David make a decision. As a reminder, urea offers the following Advantages as a nitrogen source fertilizer (per USDA/NRCS and other sources):

· High N (46%)

· Inexpensive

· Easy to handle

· Can be put in water, dilution keeps pH down

· Low salt index (26.7)

· Volatility losses lower than anhydrous ammonia

· The disadvantages include:

· Being highly soluble and leachable (= high losses in sandy soil)

· Can raise soil pH, although it hydrolyzes into ammonia quite quickly

· May undergo high volatility losses

The other answer could state that ammonium nitrate can be mixed to keep it from being used as an explosive. This can touch also how unstable the nitric acid is that would be needed to convert urea into urea nitrate.

It has been checked with IFDC's lab division and the best way to keep ammonium nitrate from being an explosive is to mix it with 40% ammonium sulphate. That was the solution in Northern Ireland.

Urea is not an explosive but can be converted to urea nitrate using nitric acid but that is difficult to do and the resulting compound is very unstable - about like nitro glycerine.

There is some active research on ammonium nitrate to keep it from being an explosive at present. The suggestion is that urea can be used as a nitrogen fertilizer as a first choice and if that is not possible go to 40% ammonium sulfate mixed into the ammonium nitrate. It is not sure how happy the Army would be about mixing ammonium nitrate with ammonium sulphate because this would mean having ammonium nitrate around that could come up missing.

There are several approaches.

1) use ammonium sulfate

2) add significant quantities of phosphorus and or potassium chloride) This will form a dirty form and limit the chain reaction. It is best if it is pelleted together. A very good chemist could figure out the

solubilities and densities and do a slurry separation method (but this is not going to be done by your average individual in a garage)

3) mix the urea and ammonium nitrate together and form UAN liquid In theory you can chill this and salt out the ammonium nitrate and urea at different temperatures

Urea has a lot more processing to do in order to make it an explosive. First off, the normal approach is to form a urea-nitrate complex. This is done blending nitric acid with urea and results in a very powerful explosive similar or greater than TNT. As a result, mixing other reagents or fertilizers in with the urea will not have the same "chain blocking" approach as it would with nitrate salts and fuel oil. Nitric acid can be formed using ammonia or via several reactions with copper and nitrate salts.

Urea based fertilizers can be converted into explosives with the use of nitric acid. Thus making a urea nitrate explosive with a higher yield than ANFO. As a reference, this type of explosive was used during the World Trade Center bombing in the 1990's. The more difficult N only fertilizers to make into explosives are UAN (urea ammonium nitrate) which is a liquid at room temperature, and 83-0-0 (anhydrous ammonia) which is a pressurized liquid which boils at temperatures above -80F. With the proper refrigeration system, UAN could be separated out into its urea and ammonium nitrate parent materials. The anhydrous ammonia is very difficult to work with due to temperatures and requires significant chemistry to oxidize it and handle the extreme hydrothermic reactions.

Everyone may agree that urea is not as safe as people have been led to believe. This doesn't mean that it can't be made even more difficult to make into an explosive, it is not something that could be made in the kitchen. The introduction of highly soluble salts into the material will prevent the continuous chain reaction of NO3- ion destruction to O2 and N2, effectively preventing it from being used as an explosive. Blending and better yet, peeling the material together with 50% potassium chloride (0-0-60) should be more than adequate to prevent all but the most technical and industrially motivated from getting it back to an explosive feedstock.

Now its pretty much clear that converting these little Chemicals to a potential bomb can be done by dumbest of dumbest people who have a only a little info but one question remains, how do they manufacture it on a large scale without active monetary & scientific help
 
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@emo_girl

If you can find all that info with just a few minutes of googling, can you imagine what dedicated people trained during the Soviet-Afghan war can do? like I said these are not dumb people. They have been trained by intelligence agencies. These guys had full fledged bomb labs running in Afghanistan and FATA and the drug money among others to fuel it. If you cut the funding now, its affect will be felt few months down the track not immediately. And until end of 2008, these people still had a free hand in the FATA region and parts of Afghanistan. Confiscated bomb manuals shown on Pakistani TV channels show the sophistication of these people so its naive to assume that AQ and affiliated groups could'nt make these at a "massive" scale.
 
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Point of this ban of Urea Fertiliser is foolish - there are lot of other ways then baning the material being used by poor farmers.

The GOP could keep an audit of all the material sold with proper antecedants.
 
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The explosives trade



‘SHOCKING’ is a word bandied about with such ease to describe various situations, serious and not-so-serious alike, that it can rightly be claimed the word has largely lost its meaning. But we are shocked — shocked in the original sense — by reports that two trucks laden with 58,500 kg of explosives were merrily motoring their way unmonitored from Haripur in NWFP through Punjab (the law finally caught up with them in D.G. Khan) and onwards apparently to Saindak in Balochistan. The mind boggles at the possibility of such a breathtaking breakdown of security in a country that is supposed to be on high alert and where bombs are exploding on an almost daily basis. Little is known about where the militants are acquiring the explosives they are using to such deadly effect and there is no proof that explosives-manufacturing factories are involved in that chain, but 60 tonnes of what may be officially unaccounted for explosives being driven across three provinces is a staggering administrative, law-enforcement and intelligence failure.



The state has now, belatedly, swung into action, shutting down the factory from where the explosives originated and launching official enquiries into the explosives trade in the country. To give some idea of how little the state knows about the issue, even the military is believed to have launched its own investigation. The questions that have yet to be answered are incredibly serious and urgent. Are explosives manufacturers reporting the full extent of their production or are they under-reporting it to evade taxes and other official requirements? Who are the explosives being sold to, licenced buyers or also buyers in the black market who may be smuggling it out of the country or selling it to third parties? What security provisions are there in place to ensure that explosives, detonators and other related paraphernalia are transported securely from point A to B? The fact that these questions have to be asked at all at this time and that state officials didn’t think they needed to know until now is truly alarming. Only blind luck seems to have averted a terrible tragedy until now.

DAWN.COM | Pakistan | The explosives trade
 
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Point of this ban of Urea Fertiliser is foolish - there are lot of other ways then baning the material being used by poor farmers.

The GOP could keep an audit of all the material sold with proper antecedants.

********.com - Taliban IED Makers - Afghanistan

In the starting of this video they clearly show a Urea sack.
 
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