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America's drone terrorism

A.Rafay

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In the United States, the dominant narrative about the use of drones in Pakistan is of a surgically precise and effective tool that makes the U.S. safer by enabling “targeted killing” of terrorists, with minimal downsides or collateral impacts.

This narrative is false.

Those are the understated opening words of a disturbing, though unsurprising, nine-month study of the Obama administration's official, yet unacknowledged, remote-controlled bombing campaign in the North Waziristan region of Pakistan, near Afghanistan. The report, “Living Under Drones,” is a joint effort by the New York University School of Law's Global Justice Clinic and Stanford Law School's International Human Rights and Conflict Resolution Clinic.

The NYU/Stanford report goes beyond reporting estimates of the civilian casualties inflicted by the deadly and illegal U.S. campaign. It also documents the hell the Pakistanis endure under President Barack Obama's policy, which includes a “kill list” from which he personally selects targets. That hell shouldn't be hard to imagine. Picture yourself living in an area routinely visited from the air by pilotless aircraft carrying Hellfire missiles. This policy is hardly calculated to win friends for the United States.

Defenders of the U.S. campaign say that militants in Pakistan threaten American troops in Afghanistan as well as Pakistani civilians. Of course, there is an easy way to protect American troops: bring them home. The 11-year-long Afghan war holds no benefits whatever for the security of the American people. On the contrary, it endangers Americans by creating hostility and promoting recruitment for anti-American groups.

The official U.S. line is that America's invasion of Afghanistan was intended to eradicate al-Qaeda and the Taliban, who harbored them. Yet the practical effect of the invasion and related policies, including the invasion of Iraq and the bombing in Yemen and Somalia, has been to facilitate the spread of al-Qaeda and like-minded groups.

U.S. policy is a textbook case of precisely how to magnify the very threat that supposedly motivated the policy. The Obama administration now warns of threats from Libya — where the U.S. consulate was attacked and the ambassador killed — and Syria. Thanks to U.S. policy, al-Qaeda in Afghanistan spawned al-Qaeda in Iraq, al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, and al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb.

If that's success, what would failure look like?

Regarding Pakistani civilians, the report states:

“While civilian casualties are rarely acknowledged by the U.S. government, there is significant evidence that U.S. drone strikes have injured and killed civilians.… It is difficult to obtain data on strike casualties because of U.S. efforts to shield the drone program from democratic accountability, compounded by the obstacles to independent investigation of strikes in North Waziristan. The best currently available public aggregate data on drone strikes are provided by The Bureau of Investigative Journalism (TBIJ ), an independent journalist organization. TBIJ reports that from June 2004 through mid-September 2012, available data indicate that drone strikes killed 2,562 — 3,325 people in Pakistan, of whom 474 — 881 were civilians, including 176 children. TBIJ reports that these strikes also injured an additional 1,228 — 1,362 individuals.”

The Obama administration denies that it has killed civilians, but bear in mind that it considers any male of military age a “militant.” This is not to be taken seriously.

The report goes on:
“U.S. drone strike policies cause considerable and under-accounted-for harm to the daily lives of ordinary civilians, beyond death and physical injury. Drones hover twenty-four hours a day over communities in northwest Pakistan, striking homes, vehicles, and public spaces without warning. Their presence terrorizes men, women, and children, giving rise to anxiety and psychological trauma among civilian communities. Those living under drones have to face the constant worry that a deadly strike may be fired at any moment, and the knowledge that they are powerless to protect themselves.”

It's even worse than it sounds:

“The U.S. practice of striking one area multiple times, and evidence that it has killed rescuers, makes both community members and humanitarian workers afraid or unwilling to assist injured victims. Some community members shy away from gathering in groups.”

How can Americans tolerate this murder and trauma committed in their name? But you didn't hear a discussion of this in Monday night's foreign-policy debate. Mitt Romney endorses America's drone terrorism.

America's drone terrorism | DailyComet.com
 
Heard the terrorists don't like being terrorized by drones. That true? Going around killing so called spies in Pakistan because they provide intel on where they are hiding. Also true?
 
In the United States, the dominant narrative about the use of drones in Pakistan is of a surgically precise and effective tool that makes the U.S. safer by enabling “targeted killing” of terrorists, with minimal downsides or collateral impacts.

This narrative is false.
AQ and taliban leadership needs to be terminated, that is the narrative, Drone strike is the lesser of evil among the strategies that can be employed to do so.
Hot pursuit; or chasing down taliban and aq assets in pakistan is a bipartisan agreed rhetoric, available means are:
1> Giving pakistan the intel and asking them to hunt down the targets
2> Sending US troops in pakistan to do the same
3> Drone strikes

Pakistan cannot be trusted by US involving high value targets; instead of presenting my views on them same; i will post few links of what the rest of the world thinks on this
ISI certainly has links with Taliban, but nature not clear yet: Petraeus. - Free Online Library

Haqqani Network - The New York Times

The ISI and Terrorism: Behind the Accusations - Council on Foreign Relations

BBC News - Pakistani agents 'funding and training Afghan Taliban'

Pakistan's ISI Collaborates With Taliban, Harvard Researcher Reports : The Two-Way : NPR

Next sending troops in pakistan; will endanger ISAF soldiers and further hurt the pakistani establishment as mockery of already deeply hurt sovereignty issue. hence no ground troops

Drone strikes may have collateral damage, but if pakistan doesn't object to it, why should US make a note to it.
Defenders of the U.S. campaign say that militants in Pakistan threaten American troops in Afghanistan as well as Pakistani civilians. Of course, there is an easy way to protect American troops: bring them home. The 11-year-long Afghan war holds no benefits whatever for the security of the American people. On the contrary, it endangers Americans by creating hostility and promoting recruitment for anti-American groups.

United states had helped the mujhideen in the 90's, why did the same mujahideen (taliban as claimed by pakistani members here) aid support al qaueda?? The draconian version of the religion followed by such organisation will always be diametrically opposite to the western democratic values, hence the promotion of anti-americans sentiment is not dependent on drone strikes alone.




The official U.S. line is that America's invasion of Afghanistan was intended to eradicate al-Qaeda and the Taliban, who harbored them. Yet the practical effect of the invasion and related policies, including the invasion of Iraq and the bombing in Yemen and Somalia, has been to facilitate the spread of al-Qaeda and like-minded groups.

U.S. policy is a textbook case of precisely how to magnify the very threat that supposedly motivated the policy. The Obama administration now warns of threats from Libya — where the U.S. consulate was attacked and the ambassador killed — and Syria. Thanks to U.S. policy, al-Qaeda in Afghanistan spawned al-Qaeda in Iraq, al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, and al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb.

If that's success, what would failure look like?

Regarding Pakistani civilians, the report states:

“While civilian casualties are rarely acknowledged by the U.S. government, there is significant evidence that U.S. drone strikes have injured and killed civilians.… It is difficult to obtain data on strike casualties because of U.S. efforts to shield the drone program from democratic accountability, compounded by the obstacles to independent investigation of strikes in North Waziristan. The best currently available public aggregate data on drone strikes are provided by The Bureau of Investigative Journalism (TBIJ ), an independent journalist organization. TBIJ reports that from June 2004 through mid-September 2012, available data indicate that drone strikes killed 2,562 — 3,325 people in Pakistan, of whom 474 — 881 were civilians, including 176 children. TBIJ reports that these strikes also injured an additional 1,228 — 1,362 individuals.”

The Obama administration denies that it has killed civilians, but bear in mind that it considers any male of military age a “militant.” This is not to be taken seriously.

The report goes on:
“U.S. drone strike policies cause considerable and under-accounted-for harm to the daily lives of ordinary civilians, beyond death and physical injury. Drones hover twenty-four hours a day over communities in northwest Pakistan, striking homes, vehicles, and public spaces without warning. Their presence terrorizes men, women, and children, giving rise to anxiety and psychological trauma among civilian communities. Those living under drones have to face the constant worry that a deadly strike may be fired at any moment, and the knowledge that they are powerless to protect themselves.”

It's even worse than it sounds:

“The U.S. practice of striking one area multiple times, and evidence that it has killed rescuers, makes both community members and humanitarian workers afraid or unwilling to assist injured victims. Some community members shy away from gathering in groups.”

How can Americans tolerate this murder and trauma committed in their name? But you didn't hear a discussion of this in Monday night's foreign-policy debate. Mitt Romney endorses America's drone terrorism.

America's drone terrorism | DailyComet.com
If such strike capability was available in late 90's maybe there wouldn't be any need for WOT in the first place, btw why hasn't NYU ever released forecast on the situation if taliban comes back in control in afghanistan???
 
Drones have devastated Al Qaeda and Taliban.

I say there should be more drone attacks until terrorists from Pakistan are exterminated.
 
Drones have devastated Al Qaeda and Taliban.

I say there should be more drone attacks until terrorists from Pakistan are exterminated.

drones are killing civilians too on massive scale! More than terrorists!
 
drones are killing civilians too on massive scale! More than terrorists!

No they are not.

Majority of the dead are the terrorists. There is a reason why drone strikes are so devastatingly effective and how they have curtailed terrorism in Pakistan from the dark days of 2009 and 2010.

Year.............Civilian Low.....Civilian High.....Total Low.....Total High
2012....................1..................1................210............333
2011....................3..................9................366............599
2010...................11................16 ................608..........1028
2009...................23................27 ................350............721
2008...................20................32 ................219............344
2004-2007...........95...............107................155............200
Total.................153...............192..............1908...........3225

The Year of the Drone | NewAmerica.net

As you can see, in the initial years from 2004-2007, there were high number of civilian casualties as the technology was still new and since 2007, the attacks are very refined and majority of those killed have been the terrorists and their militant allies.
 
Ḥashshāshīn;3538728 said:
@Mercenary, You're wrong. for every 1 terrorist, 40 civilians are killed.

Any proof to back up that claim?
 
Ḥashshāshīn;3538735 said:

Buddy its a blog run by a Fan boy.


Robert Taylor

Robert Taylor has been writing for PolicyMic since January 2011. He spends his time writing, ranting, studying, protesting stupid wars, and advocating the virtues of economic and political freedom. He has written for multiple websites and has dedicated himself to undermining the state's ability to initiate aggression against pea...

Find me some credible news organization.

Not RT, not PressTV or FoxNews. :D
 
But civilians are dying, arent they pakistani, Didnt the US violates the sovereignty of Pakistan!
The Avalon Project - Laws of War : Rights and Duties of Neutral Powers and Persons in Case of War on Land (Hague V); October 18, 1907
Article 1.
The territory of neutral Powers is inviolable.

Art. 2.
Belligerents are forbidden to move troops or convoys of either munitions of war or supplies across the territory of a neutral Power.

Art. 3.
Belligerents are likewise forbidden to:

(a) Erect on the territory of a neutral Power a wireless telegraphy station or other apparatus for the purpose of communicating with belligerent forces on land or sea;

(b) Use any installation of this kind established by them before the war on the territory of a neutral Power for purely military purposes, and which has not been opened for the service of public messages.

Art. 4.
Corps of combatants cannot be formed nor recruiting agencies opened on the territory of a neutral Power to assist the belligerents.

Art. 5.
A neutral Power must not allow any of the acts referred to in Articles 2 to 4 to occur on its territory.

It is not called upon to punish acts in violation of its neutrality unless the said acts have been committed on its own territory.
The belligerent parties here are the US versus the Taliban and al-Qaeda.

Article 1 is good only if Article 5 is vigorously enforced by Pakistan -- IF Pakistan claims neutrality in this conflict. But as long as the Taliban and al-Qaeda continues to use Pakistani territories to recruit and train combatants in a conflict against the US, then Pakistan's incompetence at enforcing Article 5 can be construed by the US as taking a side.
 
But civilians are dying, arent they pakistani, Didnt the US violates the sovereignty of Pakistan!

Civilians will die regardless.

There is no weapon platform on the planet which can guarantee a 100% success rate in killing the bad guys only and not harming any civilians.

It doesn't exist.

And the terrorists roaming freely through the tribal areas is a bigger violation of Pakistan's sovereignty than the drones.

Its like this: A person has smoked cigarettes all his life and now has cancer. The way to treat his cancer is chemotherapy which will kill some healthy tissue but will destroy the cancer. Now will that person refuse chemotherapy because a few healthy tissue will get killed? Of course not. Losing a few healthy tissue is a small price to pay to getting rid of this cancer.

You are a smart person, figure out the analogy and see how it applies to this situation.
 
I was begining to worry...it has been over 12 hours since a new thread whineing about drones was started.:argh:
 
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