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Southern Han Chinese and their relationship with the Baiyue

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Y Chromosome only shows part of the picture, nevertheless an important part of a person's genetic make up. Y Chromosome give information of paternal ancestry.

One of strongest evidence that East and North Asian gene came from SE Asia is that the C is both associated with Mongols and Siberians as well as dark pacific islanders, like Maori, and Australian aboriginals.

Genetist deduce that C must be from SE Asia. One branch went North and the other went South. Not possible that the Mongolian canoe thousands of km to New Zealand, or Maori jump ship at China, march to Mongolia then start learning horseback riding.
 
Vietnam elites for a long time after her independence from China, are Chinese. In Korea, the natives control the country after her independence from China.

This is quite indisputable.

I don't think so, In Vietnam we say: " Văn Hóa Làng Xã, " its villages culture or regionalism, is very important item for ruling the country until now, it mean the warlords controlled first the country when Vietnam regained independence from China.

After Ngo Quyen regained independence of Vietnam 938 ACE, but Dinh Bo Linh was unified the country after defeated on 12 warlords. Dinh Bo Linh was Vietnamese. The Dinh Dynasty is recognized the first official Dynasty of Vietnam, not Ngo Quyen.

In time of feudalism ruled Vietnam, Tran and Ho Dynasty is reported Chinese in origin, but for Tran Dynasty origin is debated. In according to The An Nam Chi Luoc (literally Abbreviated Records of An Nam) wrtten by Le Tac around 1,300 ACE, Tran family ancestor is Jiaozhi man.

Thảo luận:Nhà Trần – Wikipedia tiếng Việt
 
George Washington is founder USA, he is English man and president of USA when it became independent state from UK. Same as Zhao Tuo did with the NanYue Kingdom.

George Washington did win the independence war against Britain, while Zhao Tuo failed to do so against the Han Dynasty.

I don't think so, In Vietnam we say: " Văn Hóa Làng Xã, " its villages culture or regionalism, is very important item for ruling the country until now, it mean the warlords controlled first the country when Vietnam regained independence from China.

After Ngo Quyen regained independence of Vietnam 938 ACE, but Dinh Bo Linh was unified the country after defeated on 12 warlords. Dinh Bo Linh was Vietnamese. The Dinh Dynasty is recognized the first official Dynasty of Vietnam, not Ngo Quyen.

In time of feudalism ruled Vietnam, Tran and Ho Dynasty is reported Chinese in origin, but for Tran Dynasty origin is debated. In according to The An Nam Chi Luoc (literally Abbreviated Records of An Nam) wrtten by Le Tac around 1,300 ACE, Tran family ancestor is Jiaozhi man.

Thảo luận:Nhà Trần – Wikipedia tiếng Việt

China did not claim that Vietnam belonged to China historically, so neither Vietnam should claim South China as its historical land.
 
An international study has found that the Chinese people originated not from Peking Man in northern China, but from early humans in East Africa who moved through South Asia to China some 100,000 years ago, Hong Kongs Ming Pao daily reported yesterday in a finding that confirms the single origin theory in anthropology.

According to the newspaper, a research team led by Jin Li (of Fudan University in Shanghai has found that modern humans evolved from a single origin, not multiple origins as some experts believe.

In China, school textbooks teach that the Chinese race evolved from Peking Man, based on a theory that humans in Europe and Asia evolved from local species.

But Jin and his fellow researchers found that early humans belonged to different species, of which only the East African species developed into modern humans.

This new finding nullifies the theory that the ancestors of the Chinese people were Peking Man who lived in northern China 400,000 years ago.

Based on DNA analyses of 100,000 samples gathered from around the world, a number of human families evolved in East Africa some 150,000 years ago, said Li Hui, a member of Jins team.

About 100,000 years ago, some of those humans began to leave Africa, with some people moving to China via South and Southeast Asia, Li said.

According to the newspaper article, it has been proven that the 65 branches of the Chinese race share similar DNA mutations with the peoples of East and Southeast Asia.

It said that the Shanghai scientists were part of an international team comprised of researchers from Russia, India, Brazil and other nations in a five-year project studying the geographic and genealogical routes related to the spread and settlement of modern humans.

copy from: trinicenter.com - Ancient Chinese
 
George Washington did win the independence war against Britain, while Zhao Tuo failed to do so against the Han Dynast

but Nan Yue guo was existed in China history, like WuYue.

China did not claim that Vietnam belonged to China historically, so neither Vietnam should claim South China as its historical land.

We can, because from 18,000 to 5,500 years BCE, there was no Tonkin delta. It was under sea level. When Astria-Asiatic people (Mon/Khmer people included) were in mainland of China today, mountainous area of GungXi and Guangdong.

Lịch sử Việt Nam – Wikipedia tiếng Việt
 
but Nan Yue guo was existed in China history, like WuYue.



We can, because from 18,000 to 5,500 years BCE, there was no Tonkin delta. It was under sea level. When Astria-Asiatic people (Mon/Khmer people included) were in mainland of China today, mountainous area of GungXi and Guangdong.

Lịch sử Việt Nam – Wikipedia tiếng Việt

Wu Yue was once of the heart land of Bai Yue's civilization, but they decided to join the union of Hua Xia, so it is now China's territory.

But some oversea Viets are claiming the entire South China, which is too far fetched for the reality.

SglLD1h.png
 
George Washington is founder USA, he is English man and president of USA when it became independent state from UK. Same as Zhao Tuo did with the NanYue Kingdom.
Zhao Tuo wanted to be an emperor the truth is Nanyue contained more then just Vietnamese people?

Why don't you address my other claims?

What evidence do you have that Nanyue is Vietnamese?
 
Well I am from Zhejiang, and we are still being called Yue or 越 as commonly used in 吴越 but we are so so far away from Vietnam that it would be rather far stretching to claim I am in anyway related to Vietnamese.

Unlike some Vietnamese, we people living in Zhejiang, the seat of Yue Kingdom during Warring States and Spring and Autumn periods, dare not to claim all of the lands from Yangtze River to Vietnam belong to us, or even related to the extent that we are the same group of people in ethnic terms.

The OP, Grand Historian, very eloquently explained "Baiyue" or hundreds of yue refer only to unsinicized native people in South China in ancient time, just like northern barbarians are referred to as "戎Rong," eastern barbarians as "夷Yi" western barbarians as Qiang 羌。 They are very broad terms only to describe those natives foreign to original Han Chinese. To claim that the whole southern tribes all belong to the same ethnicity defies common sense. Plus, I doubt uncivilized tribes at that time even have any idea of "belonging to the same group."

I am amateur on this topic, just my 2 cents.
 
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We can, because from 18,000 to 5,500 years BCE, there was no Tonkin delta. It was under sea level. When Astria-Asiatic people (Mon/Khmer people included) were in mainland of China today, mountainous area of GungXi and Guangdong.
Lịch sử Việt Nam – Wikipedia tiếng Việt
I already debunked this claim before,Austro Asiatics are not exclusively Vietnamese and did not identify with the concept of Vietnam.
 
Well I am from Zhejiang, and we are still being called Yue or 越 but we are so so far away from Vietnam that it would be rather far stretching to claim I am in anyway related to Vietnamese.

Unlike some Vietnamese, we people living in Zhejiang, the seat of Yue Kingdom during Warring States and Spring and Autumn periods, dare not to claim all of the lands from Yangtze River to Vietnam belong to us, or even related to the extent that we are the same group of people in ethnic terms.

The OP, Grand Historian, very eloquently explained "Baiyue" or thousands of yue refer only to unsinicized native people in South China in ancient time, just like northern barbarians are referred to as "戎Rong," eastern barbarians as "夷Yi" western barbarians as Qiang 羌。 They are very broad terms only to describe those foreign people to original Han Chinese. To claim that the whole southern tribes all belong to the same ethnicity defies common sense. Plus, I doubt uncivilized tribes at that time even have any idea of "belonging to the same group."

I am amateur on this topic, just my 2 cents.

Some Zhejiangnese seem to have huge amount of amount of Bai Yue blood, while the rest is predominantly Han Chinese.

Here is an example of pure Bai Yue looking Zhejiangnese, Jack Ma, the founder of Alibaba.

120893024437507_1.jpg
 
Notice how EastSea is trying to claim Southern China with an unproven myth(Hung Kings) and he cherry picks information when it suits him.

He mentions An Nam Chi Luoc yet he fails to mention that the author doesn't even mention the Xich Quy,Van Lang or the Hung kings.

Furthermore he has failed to provide the quotation in Hanzi,
 
Notice how EastSea is trying to claim Southern China with an unproven myth(Hung Kings) and he cherry picks information when it suits him.

He mentions An Nam Chi Luoc yet he fails to mention that the author doesn't even mention the Xich Quy,Van Lang or the Hung kings.

Furthermore he has failed to provide the quotation in Hanzi,

Vietnam is always trying to hide their true ambition.

They first want to claim the entire South China Sea and to unite Southeast Asia. With the available rich natural resources, they will eventually grow stronger and try to claim the entire South China.

I am not surprised that their government is already spreading the propaganda to their ultra-nationalists that the entire South China belongs to Vietnam, and it should be taken back in the future generation.
 
It must be a trait of Vietcongs to claim things which don't belong to them. They claim almost every islands in SCS to be theirs and now Southern China are ancient Vietnam territory and Southern Chinese are part of their ancient ancestors. Just how long is he gonna keep spreading these nonsense. While you guys have provided plenty of evidence this guy keeps talking about myths.
 
Wu Yue was once of the heart land of Bai Yue's civilization, but they decided to join the union of Hua Xia, so it is now China's territory.

But some oversea Viets are claiming the entire South China, which is too far fetched for the reality.

SglLD1h.png

Wu Yue was first Kinhdom of Bai Yue people. 越王句踐, CouJian was great Emperor in China history. and also in according to Đại Việt sử lược (), Cou Jian was sended envoy to Hung King of Van Lang to establish the ally to counter Ngô Phù Sai: 吳夫差. Hung King of Van Lang refused the proposal.
 
Notice how EastSea is trying to claim Southern China with an unproven myth(Hung Kings) and he cherry picks information when it suits him.

He mentions An Nam Chi Luoc yet he fails to mention that the author doesn't even mention the Xich Quy,Van Lang or the Hung kings.

Furthermore he has failed to provide the quotation in Hanzi,

Sometimes I don't know how some so called sinologists can even do research if they don't know Chinese, let alone be able to read original source books. I mean educated high school Chinese students can probably read Shi Maqian's "Record of the Grand Historian," while I dare say majority of sinologists cannot. How do they do research? lol Do they just quote from each other's books, which are probably adaptions and translations, and then add a bit of their thoughts, or more precisely revisionist imaginations?
 
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