What's new

With Rafale deal stuck, Eurofighter looks to swoop in

DB has to back up subsytems which are transferred by it, this is not a vave project but a transfer of technology project, thus if a subsystem that goes through the standard work specified by DB and eventually has a warranty or concession claim, it is dassault'ss responsibility to ensure that Pfmea and dfmea processes were followed for the process implemented by HAL. In other words, every assembly line will have a Dassault certification process, and if it goes through it and comes up with a problem, dassault needs to back it up.


if anything it worked for India then, if the plant worked DB would have been under excess pressure that it will lose out.

What if the bold part has been compromised on? That unless Dassault was directly involved in the process, it is not liable for any mess.
 
What if the bold part has been compromised on? That unless Dassault was directly involved in the process, it is not liable for any mess.
Standard work has checklists, and sign off sheets, No engineer put's his name on anything unless he is sure that the process has been followed.

It will be DB's responsibility to ensure that, during tech transfer, the correct standard work documentation and material flow maps for CE were established.

Example :
For say transfer of hydraulic actuators, dassault specifies the oil type, and O ring specifications.
If there are o ring leaks at elevated temps - For which there is no failure mode analysis done by DB- DB should bear the concession claim.
If the oil type used was incorrect or the o ring material was non conformal then HAL's fault and HAL will bear concession claim.

If NCMS for the non-conformance was approved by DB, and then the sub-system failed then HAL - DB will share concession claim.
 
How does that solve the problem of 'Dassault' being the sole guarantor of work?
I guess the understanding reached between Dassault and HAL is that each will be taking guarantee of its share of work with Dassault providing support to HAL.

For say transfer of hydraulic actuators, dassault specifies the oil type, and O ring specifications.
If there are o ring leaks at elevated temps - For which there is no failure mode analysis done by DB- DB should bear the concession claim.
If the oil type used was incorrect or the o ring material was non conformal then HAL's fault and HAL will bear concession claim.
This part is interesting and i'll quote an example from Indian Railways when it inducted WAP 5 and WAG 9 class locomotives from ADTRANZ (now bombardier). Like the Rafale Deal, initial 10 & 15 pieces came to India in assembled or Kits which CLW assembled and tested supported by Adtranz. Subsequently, CLW started manufacturing with imported and indigenous components and slowly CLW developed its own specifications (vetted by OEM) and started procuring from local manufacturers. Today both locos hardly have anything imported.
Now in case of Rafale too, i think similar pattern will be followed with HAL introducing components manufactured ingeniously with progressive reduction in imported component. As far as assembly process is concerned, HAL's own facility will establish a similar or exact replica of Dassault's plants in France.
With time, India will also establish a matured Supply Chain for supply of parts and sub assemblies and needless to say that price per piece should also come down.
I guess this is the kind of maturity India wants (from Industry point of view) from a large deal like this.
 
@Oscar even though you have a legitimate argument, you cant win against an Indian. So leave it :)
 
@Oscar even though you have a legitimate argument, you cant win against an Indian. So leave it :)
Argument? I thought they are discussing in a healthy manner which is what meant on a forum like this. I wonder why you see that as argument.
 
Aww yiss!!! This can never be bad. It could even force Dassault to soften their stand and give in to our demands.
 
what's the difference between Indian and Russian manufactured mkis ?

The former nods their canards like this whenever their pilots do something
indian-head-nod-o.gif



They also have different vendors from the original Russian order which are outsourced Indian and European firms. More Israeli input along with the obvious increase in Indian built parts.
 
what's the difference between Indian and Russian manufactured mkis ?
Nothing exactly the one that manufactured by HAL have improvements and better.


But @MilSpec said that Dassault will be responsible in every part of verification in production that fact it doesn't Knew.
 
The MFD on the MKIs that shut off midflight is a fiasco that HAL wants to avoid on the Rafales


Wasnt that for the first few batches of MKIs that had Russian MFDs? Phase 1 was knocked down kits from Russia. HAL added DARE/Samtel Avionics MFDs later on.
 
The MFD on the MKIs that shut off midflight is a fiasco that HAL wants to avoid on the Rafales
Well that was issue with certain batch of fighters and issue was resolved as soon as it came into light of Russians.this topic was discussed to death last year.
 
Wasnt that for the first few batches of MKIs that had Russian MFDs? Phase 1 was knocked down kits from Russia. HAL added DARE/Samtel Avionics MFDs later on.
Well that was issue with certain batch of fighters and issue was resolved as soon as it came into light of Russians.this topic was discussed to death last year.

Discussing to death does not mean it wasn't a problem that did not factor on the heads of HAL when making this deal.
 

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom