Why Kashmiris want independence from India ?

[GumNaam]

Ahh, sounds like a weird addiction for a guy who wear salwar kameez of girls and interested in dhotis..wow. you aren't the "bacha" of afghans, right?

Oh don't worry we are all men something your feminine starving so called soldiers could never hope of being.

 

[GumNaam]

Men whose interest is in dhoti while wearing slawar kameez? Thats why i asked are you a "bacha boy"?

My addiction is lighting you on actual fire. Sorry to disappoint the woman inside you but I wasn't talking about the romantic kinda fire that warms you up all nice and fuzzy!

 

[GumNaam]

Mate i wasn't the one who was interested in dhoti...while wearing salwar kameez..i can understand you can't express yourself in Pakistan openly and now have to deny it..still you can always move out and have all your desires fulfilled in neighboring Afghanistan

And that, dear children, is how an indian talks when it is completely out of anything valid to say!

 

[Tea addict]

And that, dear children, is how an indian talks when it is completely out of anything valid to say!

Nice to meet you an know about your interests..hope you get what you always wanted..see ya.

 

[GumNaam]

Nice to meet you an know about your interests..hope you get what you always wanted..see ya.

Don't wanna be ya!

 

[Kabira]

CIA already described internet hindu decades ago

“In order to offset the fear that they really may be inferior, however, Indians are often so defensive — touchy and sensitive — that they appear to be offensive, that is assertive, vain, and arrogant.”

lol

 

[The Eagle]

Last time i checked it was you crying about your 40000 mujahedeens in mass unmarked graves all over kashmir..most of them were veterans of afghan war and had many chechans,tajiks,arabs,uzbeks as well...all buried deep inside the kashmiri soil by our guys.

Fearful reputation because they weren't some average mujahedeens who are give 3 months of training.they had fought afghan war for decades and knew how to fight...no stereotype,it was they were battle hardened and had experience of urban warfare.


Dont know it was stench of our 3000-4000 casualties in that conflict or 40000 of the mujahedeens..but at the end of the day they ended in unmarked grave and will be remembered by no one while our soldiers name are written on amar jawan jyoti which was saluted by your best friend UAE Prince today itself.

By that logic, the great USSR, I repeat USSR of that time couldn't take down these but torned apart itself yet IA, not just countered the so-called guys in Kashmir but eliminated them all with no one left.... whoaaa.... USSR should have deployed IA in Afghanistan or today US/NATO should leave it to IA alone that can do the job pretty well. You did not even pay a bit of attention to the respect of all these powers dealing with those guys day & night yet couldn't do so what you just claimed only for point scoring and self satisfaction. Not before today but now, I mean today only, I curse the day that Zia died otherwise, the Indian Armchair Generals here wouldn't be comparing the mass graves of innocent Kashmiris with so-called Afghan Mujahideen that I am sure, none of IA has ever faced today or do you want us to wish you even face the cult of TTP once and we will see what IA can do yet alone Taliban/al-Qaida. BTW, on other hand, you are suggesting an idea for IA.

Those graves are full of Kashmiris, innocent Kashmiris and mostly are farmers, shot during illegal raids and abducted for torture to suppress the Kashimiri Freedom Struggle by force only. A mere assumption of bravado wouldn't be enough to walk away like this and to get rid of such haunting, India has to kill every single Kashmiri otherwise, GoI will keep risking the lives of those soldiers that are somehow sons, brothers, husbands to anyone in India as well.

Stop posting baseless and propaganda information that too for the purpose to praise the atrocities and war crimes of IA and GoI in IoK while turning the back or deliberately closing the eyes from the fact.

 

[ZenBird]

Those graves are full of Kashmiris, innocent Kashmiris and mostly are farmers

Afghans in Kashmir isn't under dispute, stop trolling. The USSR fought them in a different era on a completely foreign ground in completely different terrain. India had high casualties initially while fighting them but had the advantage of logistics on the ground and some local support. The response was pretty brutal as wellwhich over time alienated Kashmiri people.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-18738906

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2013/09/2013920153418770798.html

http://foreignpolicy.com/2014/09/05/lets-talk-about-kashmir/

https://books.google.com/books?id=0...v=onepage&q=afghan mujahideen kashmir&f=false

 

[Tea addict]

Afghans in Kashmir isn't under dispute, stop trolling. The USSR fought them in a different era on a completely foreign ground in completely different terrain. India had high casualties initially while fighting them but had the advantage of logistics on the ground and some local support. The response was pretty brutal as wellwhich over time alienated Kashmiri people.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-18738906

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2013/09/2013920153418770798.html

http://foreignpolicy.com/2014/09/05/lets-talk-about-kashmir/

https://books.google.com/books?id=0zRZBwAAQBAJ&pg=PA81&lpg=PA81&dq=afghan+mujahideen+kashmir&source=bl&ots=_2O3baGOte&sig=PRBzpnp45tXhWxzBPehhyfNBxNc&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiFoN_jieDRAhWhwlQKHYSOBfoQ6AEIhQEwFg#v=onepage&q=afghan mujahideen kashmir&f=false

While Soviet army consisted of demoralized conscripts for whom there was no motivation for the afghan war, while we were fighting for integral part of our country..these people somehow thinks since they couldn't control them, we can't either.
BTW i dont think it would have stopped even if they have got kashmir,if you listen to Lashkar speeches, the clearly say their aim is to hoist the islamic flag in Delhi's red fort.
And you being a punjabi and me being a haryanvi will be a Frontline state if kashmir ever falls..thats why our boys join the army in large numbers ..we know what we are fighting for.

By that logic, the great USSR, I repeat USSR of that time couldn't take down these but torned apart itself yet IA, not just countered the so-called guys in Kashmir but eliminated them all with no one left.... whoaaa.... USSR should have deployed IA in Afghanistan or today US/NATO should leave it to IA alone that can do the job pretty well. You did not even pay a bit of attention to the respect of all these powers dealing with those guys day & night yet couldn't do so what you just claimed only for point scoring and self satisfaction. Not before today but now, I mean today only, I curse the day that Zia died otherwise, the Indian Armchair Generals here wouldn't be comparing the mass graves of innocent Kashmiris with so-called Afghan Mujahideen that I am sure, none of IA has ever faced today or do you want us to wish you even face the cult of TTP once and we will see what IA can do yet alone Taliban/al-Qaida. BTW, on other hand, you are suggesting an idea for IA.

Those graves are full of Kashmiris, innocent Kashmiris and mostly are farmers, shot during illegal raids and abducted for torture to suppress the Kashimiri Freedom Struggle by force only. A mere assumption of bravado wouldn't be enough to walk away like this and to get rid of such haunting, India has to kill every single Kashmiri otherwise, GoI will keep risking the lives of those soldiers that are somehow sons, brothers, husbands to anyone in India as well.

Stop posting baseless and propaganda information that too for the purpose to praise the atrocities and war crimes of IA and GoI in IoK while turning the back or deliberately closing the eyes from the fact.

USSR conscripts were not fighting for their homeland, they were in foreign soil.. they faced much more organized and radicalized enemy in Chechnya and crushed them to the extent that they are fighting from Syria to Afghanistan but can'tt do shit in Chechnya..
And your post in second part is based on the assumption that since you guys couldn't do it, we can't either..well it was @CleanWell ancestors who invaded afghan lands and you got them from British empire...so our people have already done that what you guys couldn't do to afghans .

 

[ZenBird]

Frontline state if kashmir ever falls

It is pretty evident to me that borders drawn right now will never change either in Kashmir or in Balochistan. The stakes are too high for either country to start a full scale war. They should demarcate borders, stop the rhetoric and make every effort to get along.

 

[The Eagle]

Afghans in Kashmir isn't under dispute, stop trolling.

Before being judgmental, read first the quoted post where member was referring Kashmiri Freedom Fighters as Afghan Mujahideen that had nothing to do with Kashmir Freedom Fight. There were no fighters from Afghan War in Kashmir but the same is propagated to make it controversial.

 

[Tea addict]

It is pretty evident to me that borders drawn right now will never change either in Kashmir or in Balochistan. The stakes are too high for either country to start a full scale war. They should demarcate borders, stop the rhetoric and make every effort to get along.

Exactly, we just need to keep our defence spending less than 2℅ of our budget while maintaining status quo...if Pakistan doesn't resolve this, they will end up in a economic situation like USSR in 1989 which bankrupted itself because of its very very very big armed forces.

Before being judgmental, read first the quoted post where member was referring Kashmiri Freedom Fighters as Afghan Mujahideen that had nothing to do with Kashmir Freedom Fight. There were no fighters from Afghan War in Kashmir but the same is propagated to make it controversial

Afghans has been in kashmir since 1947..they were the first ones to invade kashmir in 1948.

 

[The Eagle]

USSR conscripts were not fighting for their homeland, they were in foreign soil.. they faced much more organized and radicalized enemy in Chechnya and crushed them to the extent that they are fighting from Syria to Afghanistan but can'tt do shit in Chechnya..
And your post in second part is based on the assumption that since you guys couldn't do it, we can't either..well it was @CleanWell ancestors who invaded afghan lands and you got them from British empire...so our people have already done that what you guys couldn't do to afghans .

They are Kashmiri Freedom Fighters and none of any fighter from Afghan participated in that war but the same is deliberately propagated by Indian Government to play a victim card and portray the same as fake terrorism to gain sympathy and to cover the war crimes in IoK. IA brutally killed innocent people during fake raids and encounters just to show that there are imported resistance which is contrary to the fact. Your obsession with Afghans and the Doval analogy is clear that will fight Pakistan till the last Afghan. Why to generalize too much when subject is clear as Why Kashmiris Want Independence from India. Like USSR in Afghanistan as alien, same is Indian Army in IoK hence all the resistance and struggle for freedom.


WikiLeaks cables: India accused of systematic use of torture in Kashmir
Beatings and electric shocks inflicted on hundreds of civilians detained in Kashmir, US diplomats in Delhi told by ICRC

Unrest in Kashmir, where a leaked cable said the Indian government 'condoned torture'. Photograph: Tauseef Mustafa/AFP/Getty Images


Jason Burke in Delhi

Thursday 16 December 2010 21.30 GMTFirst published on Thursday 16 December 2010 21.30 GMT

This article is 6 years old
Shares
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US officials had evidence of widespread torture by Indian police and security forces and were secretly briefed by Red Cross staff about the systematic abuse of detainees in Kashmir, according to leaked diplomatic cables.

The dispatches, obtained by website WikiLeaks, reveal that US diplomats in Delhi were briefed in 2005 by the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) about the use of electrocution, beatings and sexual humiliation against hundreds of detainees.

Other cables show that as recently as 2007 American diplomats were concerned about widespread human rights abuses by Indian security forces, who they said relied on torture for confessions.

The revelations will be intensely embarrassing for Delhi, which takes pride in its status as the world's biggest democracy, and come at a time of heightened sensitivity in Kashmir after renewed protests and violence this year.


Also,,,,,,

One frequent accusation is that Indian security forces in Kashmir have killed innocent civilians in staged gun battles and passed them off as separatist militants to earn rewards and promotions. One such alleged incident last year provoked rioting throughout most of the summer.

This summer, however, has proved relatively quiet with tourists returning to the region.

Indian authorities have consistently denied systematic human rights violations in Kashmir and say they probe all such reports and punish the guilty.

A US diplomatic cable leaked by WikiLeaks and published by the Guardian last December revealed a briefing to the US embassy in Delhi by representatives of the International Committee of the Red Cross which described continuing torture and arbitrary detention by security forces.

The Association of Parents of Disappeared Persons, which estimates around 10,000 people have gone missing in the past 20 years, says many may have ended up in these unmarked graves. "We appeal to international human rights groups and Indian authorities to identify the people buried," said Parveena Ahanger, founder and chair of the group. International human rights groups have also repeatedly asked the Indian authorities to investigate the unmarked graves.

It has to be kept in mind that it is India that denied access to UNHRC in Indian occupied Kashmir only to avoid the exposure of those war crimes.

Saying all the facts as assumptions is not new from India and you are doing nothing different than usual copy paste of same lines. Read the above links provided and there is no need to acknowledge the same here but shared for the interest of reading, if you have and sources are The Guardian and Times of India.

It is pretty evident to me that borders drawn right now will never change either in Kashmir or in Balochistan. The stakes are too high for either country to start a full scale war. They should demarcate borders, stop the rhetoric and make every effort to get along.

Nice try to divert the topic with Baluchistan that has nothing to do here. Still, Baluchistan unrest is caused by terrorists that are widely operating on support of India from Afghanistan and many of them are banned organizations otherwise, everybody has the liberty to call UN as such in the matter. Check out what people of Baluchistan has to say about those so-called Sardars but foreign agents. Gwadar is in Baluchistan connecting CPEC and many countries are showing interest to take part in the same project including Russia, UK, Iran as well as Germany and soon many others which is not the case in favour of India at all that too in IoK. The difference is huge while comparing the situation of Baluchistan with IoK as the former is province of Pakistan and latter is occupied forcefully. Avoid derailing the topic further.

Afghans has been in kashmir since 1947..they were the first ones to invade kashmir in 1948.

Now you jumped to 1948 and labeling the same with Afghans... by the same logic, India shouldn't be in Afghanistan at all and all that love. You are again generalizing too much and making baseless claims without any substance or backup. If you are referring ethnic or racial relations then that is totally different which is mixing of the two different topics.

 

[Tea addict]

They are Kashmiri Freedom Fighters and none of any fighter from Afghan participated in that war but the same is deliberately propagated by Indian Government to play a victim card and portray the same as fake terrorism to gain sympathy and to cover the war crimes in IoK. IA brutally killed innocent people during fake raids and encounters just to show that there are imported resistance which is contrary to the fact. Your obsession with Afghans and the Doval analogy is clear that will fight Pakistan till the last Afghan. Why to generalize too much when subject is clear as Why Kashmiris Want Independence from India. Like USSR in Afghanistan as alien, same is Indian Army in IoK hence all the resistance and struggle for freedom.


WikiLeaks cables: India accused of systematic use of torture in Kashmir
Beatings and electric shocks inflicted on hundreds of civilians detained in Kashmir, US diplomats in Delhi told by ICRC

Unrest in Kashmir, where a leaked cable said the Indian government 'condoned torture'. Photograph: Tauseef Mustafa/AFP/Getty Images


Jason Burke in Delhi

Thursday 16 December 2010 21.30 GMTFirst published on Thursday 16 December 2010 21.30 GMT

This article is 6 years old
Shares
11k
Comments
478
US officials had evidence of widespread torture by Indian police and security forces and were secretly briefed by Red Cross staff about the systematic abuse of detainees in Kashmir, according to leaked diplomatic cables.

The dispatches, obtained by website WikiLeaks, reveal that US diplomats in Delhi were briefed in 2005 by the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) about the use of electrocution, beatings and sexual humiliation against hundreds of detainees.

Other cables show that as recently as 2007 American diplomats were concerned about widespread human rights abuses by Indian security forces, who they said relied on torture for confessions.

The revelations will be intensely embarrassing for Delhi, which takes pride in its status as the world's biggest democracy, and come at a time of heightened sensitivity in Kashmir after renewed protests and violence this year.


Also,,,,,,

One frequent accusation is that Indian security forces in Kashmir have killed innocent civilians in staged gun battles and passed them off as separatist militants to earn rewards and promotions. One such alleged incident last year provoked rioting throughout most of the summer.

This summer, however, has proved relatively quiet with tourists returning to the region.

Indian authorities have consistently denied systematic human rights violations in Kashmir and say they probe all such reports and punish the guilty.

A US diplomatic cable leaked by WikiLeaks and published by the Guardian last December revealed a briefing to the US embassy in Delhi by representatives of the International Committee of the Red Cross which described continuing torture and arbitrary detention by security forces.

The Association of Parents of Disappeared Persons, which estimates around 10,000 people have gone missing in the past 20 years, says many may have ended up in these unmarked graves. "We appeal to international human rights groups and Indian authorities to identify the people buried," said Parveena Ahanger, founder and chair of the group. International human rights groups have also repeatedly asked the Indian authorities to investigate the unmarked graves.

It has to be kept in mind that it is India that denied access to UNHRC in Indian occupied Kashmir only to avoid the exposure of those war crimes.

Saying all the facts as assumptions is not new from India and you are doing nothing different than usual copy paste of same lines. Read the above links provided and there is no need to acknowledge the same here but shared for the interest of reading, if you have and sources are The Guardian and Times of India.



Nice try to divert the topic with Baluchistan that has nothing to do here. Still, Baluchistan unrest is caused by terrorists that are widely operating on support of India from Afghanistan and many of them are banned organizations otherwise, everybody has the liberty to call UN as such in the matter. Check out what people of Baluchistan has to say about those so-called Sardars but foreign agents. Gwadar is in Baluchistan connecting CPEC and many countries are showing interest to take part in the same project including Russia, UK, Iran as well as Germany and soon many others which is not the case in favour of India at all that too in IoK. The difference is huge while comparing the situation of Baluchistan with IoK as the former is province of Pakistan and latter is occupied forcefully. Avoid derailing the topic further.



Now you jumped to 1948 and labeling the same with Afghans... by the same logic, India shouldn't be in Afghanistan at all and all that love. You are again generalizing too much and making baseless claims without any substance or backup. If you are referring ethnic or racial relations then that is totally different which is mixing of the two different topics.

All links ....here are my links then
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2013/09/2013920153418770798.html
@The Eagle look at this al Jazeera link

http://www.jammu-kashmir.com/archives/archives1998/98october04a.html

http://freepresskashmir.com/troops-kill-sudanese-five-militants-in-kashmir/

Every kind of jihadis fought in kashmir and yes the jihadis also had local kashmiris as well, where did i deny it..i said their were afghans,tajiks,chechans and arabs in kashmir who came here after fighting in afghan jihad and never returned..no one care which mass graves their bullet riddled bodies were thrown into.

And iam talking about 1948 because afghans and tribals have been used by you guys before too..not just during 90s.

 

[Kabira]

Exactly, we just need to keep our defence spending less than 2℅ of our budget while maintaining status quo...if Pakistan doesn't resolve this, they will end up in a economic situation like USSR in 1989 which bankrupted itself because of its very very very big armed forces.


Afghans has been in kashmir since 1947..they were the first ones to invade kashmir in 1948.

Pakistan GDP spent on defence is around 2.4%, higher then India but not by much. Combined Pakistan army is less then Indian army in IoK alone. Another difference is Indian soldiers in IoK are all pretty much foreigners unlike in AJK. By some estimates India spend around $35-40 billion in IoK which isn't even integral part of India. You don't deploy million non-native soldiers to secure integral part of country.