Why are we so adamant in our support for Palestine when they themselves support India against us?

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

I told you not to quote me if besides shit posts nothing else comes out of your mouth, can't you understand simple English?

Report him as I did.

If he doesn't want to discuss minorities in Pakistan in a thread on the topic, he shouldn't be able to drag it into every topic to silence Pakistanis.

I will now begin reporting any personal insults as well, including extremist, terrorist, etc.

This kind of discourse should not be acceptable on PDF.

We should be moving away from labels and discuss the topics, as Mod team (including
@AgNoStiC MuSliM ) have recommended.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

This is a recurring argument and flashpoint on the forum (The Holocaust).

We have seen many a good member banned over it.

I have, for the sake of a united and consistent position, asked all PDF management to weigh in on an internal discussion on forum policy on the holocaust in order to provide clarity for all members.

My personal opinion is that denying the holocaust or allowing threads discussing holocaust denial should not be allowed on this forum. Even the Germans (those accused of committing the holocaust) have accepted their guilt and don't deny it, so this shouldn't be up for debate.

Doing so damages the credibility of the forum.

There was a genocide of Jews in Europe at the hands of the Nazis - this is established historical fact.

 

[Beny Karachun]

This post says plenty. Palestine existed and there was and is a Palestine nation. Until that is accepted then one can move forward.
Israel denying Palestinians their right is the basic core issue in this issue. Now unless this is accepted Israel is living in dreamland.

eventually there will be an Arab leader with the balls to remove the vermin. I wait for that day. Enjoy your evening.

Show me a Palestinian leader before the Brits and the Turks. Show me the Palestinian currency. Show me their exact borders. Tell me about some deals they had with neighboring countries that clearly indicate on relations between a state called Palestine, and another country.

Well, there was a Mandatory Palestine in 1947 and there were people living there. People whom you displaced and have suppressed, and continue to suppress since 1948. It doesn't matter who owned that land.

Mandatory Palestine was under British control.
Solely the name "Palestine" doesn't indicate it was controlled by the people that call themselves now Palestinians.

 

[Naofumi]

controlled

That would render every ex-colony as a fake nation.

 

[xeuss]

Show me a Palestinian leader before the Brits and the Turks. Show me the Palestinian currency. Show me their exact borders. Tell me about some deals they had with neighboring countries that clearly indicate on relations between a state called Palestine, and another country.


Mandatory Palestine was under British control.
Solely the name "Palestine" doesn't indicate it was controlled by the people that call themselves now Palestinians.

So every country that emerged from the decolonization of the Spanish, British, French and Dutch have no reason to exist?

That is the lamest argument I have heard.

 

[QWECXZ]

Mandatory Palestine was under British control.
Solely the name "Palestine" doesn't indicate it was controlled by the people that call themselves now Palestinians.

Nobody said it wasn't under British control. That's irrelevant.

It remains a fact that Mandatory Palestine was a country with Muslims, Jews and Christians living together in peace until Nakba. About 20% to 25% of the population were Jews living in harmony with others until Zionist settlers went there (most of whom were Ashkenazi Jews with little genetic link to that land after years of mixing with Eastern Europeans) in 1948 and displaced Palestinians and claimed it as their Promised Land. You committed ethnic cleansing to increase your own percentage of the population and since then you have been occupying their lands.

 

[Beny Karachun]

Nobody is asking you to go soft on any deal. Everyone is advocating to be practical in that deal making.

The higher the bid you start with, the higher stakes there would be that both sides will be saying what you are saying about the last deal they made and it will continue the cycle on repeat.

Seeds of the 2nd world war were sown in the PEACE DEAL of the WW1.

How is the weather by the way over there and Covid situation?

We made a deal. They already rejected it.

The 2nd and 1st world war situation is a great example of why we shouldn't give them any land.

The allies defeated the Germans, humiliated them with the peace deal, but in the end they gave them too much freedom and Germany came back stinging.

Without "opening the mouth for Satan" (It's an expression we have in Hebrew), the COVID-19 virus is almost over, only a dozen infection cases per day.

That would render every ex-colony as a fake nation.

Too bad for you, because until then, Palestinian land is illegitimate.

So every country that emerged from the decolonization of the Spanish, British, French and Dutch have no reason to exist?

That is the lamest argument I have heard.

My point was that even when that land was decolonized, a nation called "Palestine" would never have emerged.

Even in the start of the war in 1947, Jerusalem was under control of Jordan and most of the Sinai was under control of Egypt, not some Palestinian state.

 

[Naram_Sin]

Watch Trump's deal of the century.
It includes massive infastracture plans and Israel gives up on land.

The Palestinians and Arabs rejected it.

It is not a surprise that looking at this brings to mind some of the maps one might see in those cheap mobile games, reason being this is not how the map of a state should look like, this is how a concentration camp is supposed to look like, which is precisely what this is.

A big jail for the slave worker population.

 

[QWECXZ]

We made a deal. They already rejected it.

I know you don't like me interrupting your very "solid" defenses of your policies. But you can't get rid of me, ketchup. I will haunt you like a ghost as long as you come up with this "we made a deal" nonsense.

A real two-state solution must split Palestine in half with access to the Mediterranean Sea for both sides. Both sides should be whole in one piece, not a bunch of disconnected tiny dots inside the other's territory. Ideally, Jerusalem should be declared an independent territory. It can be under the Israeli administration. You can even make money from Muslims visiting there.

What you have offered Palestinians after 1948 has never been a serious deal, but they were knavish tricks to steal their lands. You know it too. I know you know it. You can't deny it.

 

[Beny Karachun]

It remains a fact that Mandatory Palestine was a country with Muslims, Jews and Christians living together in peace until Nakba. About 20% to 25% of the population were Jews living in harmony with others until Zionist settlers went there (most of whom were Ashkenazi Jews with little genetic link to that land after years of mixing with Eastern Europeans) in 1948 and displaced Palestinians and claimed it as their Promised Land. You committed ethnic cleansing to increase your own percentage of the population and since then you have been occupying their lands.

No one disputed the fact that Muslims were living here, it's just that there was never a Palestinian nation controlling this area.

That's simply wrong.
Jews had wars with Arabs since the late 1800s, with frequent Arab raids on Israeli villages.

Read about Trompeldor for example.

Our genetic makeup has nothing to do with this.

 

[Awan68]

The Arabs and Palestinians are not bothered about being occupied so why should we care? Not our concern or problem. When did the Arabs and Palestinians ever care about indian occupied Kashmir?

Read my post again, the support is not for Palestinians but for the occupation of Qibla e Awal, the same way we feel obligated to protect the two holy cities, it is not about the people who inhabit those places but the holy places themselves.

 

[HAIDER]

Read my post again, the support is not for Palestinians but for the occupation of Qibla e Awal, the same way we feel obligated to protect the two holy cities, it is not about the people who inhabit those places but the holy places themselves.

Qibla awal is no doubt a major issue.... Don't know how Israeli defend there position... its very dangerous and trivial.

 

[Awan68]

You own them none. Even if you send your umma Lashkar of liberation chumma. These B**tareds will turn on you in the name Arab Land or rather prefer to favor their Jew cousins.

I met a Newly immigrant 50 yoa Egyptian in masjid, out of nowhere he start talking big about Egypt and than With hand gestures say Pakistan is weak . After conversations his only comeback was, Jew are our cousins, so we make peace.


They are the inhabitants their, what if the don’t want your help or don’t want you there. What is your justification of invading or interfering in the land.

No one muslim ethinicty can claim ownership of Al Quds, it is a collective obligation and in relation to that we owe answer not to the people but to Allah Himself. The inhabitants can do what they like, our problem is the illegal occupation of our holy site by Zionists not the liberation of the people there. Al Quds does not belong to the Palestinians, it belongs to anyone who considers themselves muslim.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Turks were not occupiers of Palestine, the were the same people, both were Muslims. Turks respected Palestinian affairs and largely left them to govern themselves. Before them, various Arab, Kurd, and other Muslim rulers were governing the region. They were not occupiers.

The whole region was divided into administrative districts by Ottomans, Vilayat, namely Damascus, Aleppo, Jerusalem, Beirut, and Mt. Lebanon.

 

[Naofumi]

Too bad for you, because until then, Palestinian land is illegitimate.


My point was that even when that land was decolonized, a nation called "Palestine" would never have emerged.

Even in the start of the war in 1947, Jerusalem was under control of Jordan and most of the Sinai was under control of Egypt, not some Palestinian state.

By this criteria, nearly all of the Africa and dozens of Asian nations needs to be redrawn.
Nation-state is itself a modern idea originated in western Europe, Palestinian nationalism is as fake/real as Israeli one.