Vietnam premier wants to finish privatizing 289 state-run firms by 2015

[rcrmj]

POE should leave strategic sectors. I don't like China becomes another Russia. It's about nation security, which has nothing to do with innovation.

such as?`````apart from defense, national security, cant think of any

 

[AndrewJin]

such as?`````apart from defense, national security, cant think of any

Railway, energy, water supply, etc. Enough lessons have been learned.

 

[rcrmj]

The POE auto companies suck bad equally.

We already leave a lot of room for the company like Ali/Tencent/Baidu/Xiaomi/Huawei/Lenovo, but it doesn't mean that we have to give up our SOE.

As I said, both SOE and POE should play a distinct important role for China's economy.

Just go back to read Xi Jinping's governing philosophy carefully.

given only few years experiences and constant harassment from inside and outside, there are way more private made cars running on road than state made cars (domestic or overseas), this fact speaks

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

such as?`````apart from defense, national security, cant think of any

Also the natural resources.

Just look at the privatization of China's coal industry, absolutely a disaster.

Those coal tycoons, I think I don't need to mention their reputation in the Chinese society for one more time.

Good thing is that their sugar daddy in CPC was Ling Jihua, and after the collapse of Ling Jihua, most of them were thrown into the jail.

 

[rcrmj]

Railway, energy, water supply, etc. Enough lessons have been learned.

yet most corruptions are from these sectors```have you not following the anti-corruption campaign lately```?

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

given only few years experiences and constant harassment from inside and outside, there are way more private made cars running on road than state made cars (domestic or overseas), this fact speaks

Well, the SOE made our HSR become extremely competitive and the top notch in the world.

You cannot deny this fact as well.

yet most corruptions are from these sectors```have you not following the anti-corruption campaign lately```?

The privation is only to gift those SOE to the corrupt officials or their family members.

When those multi-billion SOE, which person without any family background can handle it?

Those corrupt officials with family members are already becoming the managers of SOE, while the privatization will only bestow more power to them.

 

[rcrmj]

Also the natural resources.

Just look at the privatization of China's coal industry, absolutely a disaster.

Those coal tycoons, I don't need to mention their reputation in the Chinese society one more time.

Good thing is that their sugar daddy in CPC was Ling Jihua, and after the collapse of Ling Jihua, most of them were thrown in to the jail.

please understand the facts before speak```do you have any idea how those 'private' coal mines work?
SOE has sole monopoly in energy sector, those who have good contacts or with huge bribe money can gain the mining licence from SOEs or the government, and they have to pay huge amount of 'tributes' to SOE from their daily operation```

so these so called 'private' mining companies are no more than a 'tribute' to SOE mining companies, and they have to lower their operation budget in order to make handsome income```hence alarming working conditions you can find from those private mining companies

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

please understand the facts before speak```do you have any idea how those 'private' coal mines work?
SOE has sole monopoly in energy sector, those who have good contacts or with huge bribe money can gain the mining licence from SOEs or the government, and they have to pay huge amount of 'tributes' to SOE from their daily operation```

so these so called 'private' mining companies are no more than a 'tribute' to SOE mining companies, and they have to lower their operation budget in order to make handsome income```hence alarming working conditions you can find from those private mining companies

Those private mining companies were mostly formed by the family members of the SOE managers.

They all have family background and connection.

When you allow the privatization, then you are simply gifting the entire SOE to the family members of the corrupt SOE managers.

You are simply fulfilling their dream here.

 

[AndrewJin]

yet most corruptions are from these sectors```have you not following the anti-corruption campaign lately```?

Anti-corruption is not privatization. Corruption within private sectors are legal. They are different issues. I'd rather they keep corruptive than sold to private ones and let them absorb our blood legally.

 

[AndrewJin]

yet most corruptions are from these sectors```have you not following the anti-corruption campaign lately```?

Just have a look at privatization in railway sector. Check Guangzhou-Shenzhen Company. And how they increase the prices. No matter private or state-owned, railway is monopoly.

 

[rcrmj]

Well, the SOE made our HSR become extremely competitive and the top notch in the world.

You cannot deny this fact as well.



The privation is only to gift those SOE to the corrupt officials or their family members.

When those multi-billion SOE, which person without any family background can handle it?

Those corrupt officials with family members are already becoming the managers of SOE, while the privatization will only bestow more power to them.

yeah, sure with top down supervision, national level projects, huge amount of investment they better make a solid product````but this centrally planned scheme can only be good for strategic projects

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Anti-corruption is not privatization. Corruption within private sectors are legal. They are different issues. I'd rather they keep corruptive than sold to private ones and let them absorb our blood legally.

The graft is illegal in the SOE sector.

While for the POE sector, they can do whatever they want, it is always legal.

Someone will defend the POE by saying it is their own property, so they can do whatever they want.

But they forgot how those properties were acquired? For example, a company that worth 1 billion was sold for 1 million, this was simply the pillage.

yeah, sure with top down supervision, national level projects, huge amount of investment they better make a solid product````but this centrally planned scheme can only be good for strategic projects

Of course, those POE cannot handle the trillion mega project like this.

Why you keep fighting for a losing argument? Do you think your strong dislike for SOE would change the status quo in China's economic structure?

Heck, this was already decided by Xi Jinping and his group of think tank.

 

[rcrmj]

Just have a look at privatization in railway sector. Check Guangzhou-Shenzhen Company. And how they increase the prices. No matter private or state-owned, railway is monopoly.

and do you know how much they pay for state rail?
do you know how much Shunfeng, Yuantong, Suda ect couriers companies pay for China post annual?
do you know how much our editing house have to pay to state owned publisher, even though they doing nothing for China's intellectual sectors?
there are too many to list``

SOE is becoming an obstacle of our economy now, as the fundamental fact of SOEs is that their performence is policy driven but not market and innovation driven

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Just have a look at privatization in railway sector. Check Guangzhou-Shenzhen Company. And how they increase the prices. No matter private or state-owned, railway is monopoly.

Yes, as the natural born monopoly sectors, the SOE monopoly is still far better than the POE monopoly.

BTW, Li Keqiang and his incompetent team need to be sacked, since his privatization plan has failed badly.

Except Zhou Enlai, I simply don't trust any Premier in our history. And they are more likely becoming the puppet for those strong princeling families.

 

[AndrewJin]

and do you know how much they pay for state rail?
do you know how much Shunfeng, Yuantong, Suda ect couriers companies pay for China post annual?
do you know how much our editing house have to pay to state owned publisher, even though they doing nothing for China's intellectual sectors?
there are too many to list``

SOE is becoming an obstacle of our economy now, as the fundamental fact of SOEs is that their performence is policy driven but not market and innovation driven

Again, don't generalize. I say they should not get involved in strategic sectors, and I am not saying what you have mentioned is not correct. And private companies are not just Shunfeng, Baidu and Alibaba, those models. Selling this country is so easy.