US-Afghanistan - An Opinion

[53fd]

Every country looks out for their own benefit....

I do think that the US has been an "economic hitman" in many ways, but trust the americans to be smarter than that to do this in less overt ways than go to war.....
To think that Iraq was about oil and Afghanistan about strategic positioning is being myopic....
Iraq had become a genuine threat to its neighbors and American interests....Dont India and Pak bellow about the military and nuclear buildup?....The difference is, if India or Pak were America, they would have done exactly the same pre-emptively....The only shortcoming is that they cant...

Afghanistan was attacked in self defence....
Again...India would love to attack Pakistan to avenge 26/11.....Has it been successful or have the means to decisively punish their enemies? NO...but given the chance and capability it will....
I dont blame America for Afghanistan...

Lets stop being hypocrites.....If its about bodycount in bloodshed and war...nothing beats South Asia...
We killed millions of our own to create new countries
We waged war on our neighbors..
We fought through proxies and killing of innocent civilians
We supported despotic regimes to serve our goals....
We have killed thousands of our own to keep ownership of our land...

But instead of looking inwards...we prefer to project our anger towards the US...

Remember this.....
"Heavy is the head that wears the crown"
The US is in a similar position....Damned they do...Damned they dont....

I dont see Pakistanis criticizing their buddies the Chinese in turning a blind eye to Sudanese genocide to further arms sales or the Taliban that have ruthlessly massacred Afghans...
Nor do I see Indians putting pressure on the Sri-Lankans or the Burmese wrt to their human rights violations.....

Think about it....

Again, Pakistan & India are no angels. But I stand by what I have said before: they do not have the same imperialistic dreams that the US has. Sure, India & Pakistan have played proxy wars against each other. But that is only limited to their neighborhood, their region. You seriously cannot tell me America does the same, when history has proven, whether you look at Central/South America, Central/South East Asia, the Middle East, Africa; the US has unfortunately been in a constant state of heaving its imperialistic tendencies on other sovereign nations, meddling in their internal affairs.

 

[53fd]

I just don't get this join hands and find a solution put forth by Imran Khan and some. Question is with whom? the folks who want to establish a caliphate? who think anybody that is a non Muslim or is not following their interpretation of Islam deserves a death sentence?

Some other points you noted " Why America thought about Taliban after 9/11 when they gave asylum to Osama who were involved in 9/11 according to US"

First it's not just according to the US only as you stated, it is an established fact. If you want an honest debate we have to keep the conspiracy theories aside please. Second, The US did attempt to kill Osma under Bill Clinton in the 90"s when he attacked consulates and USS Cole. You're right about the US walking away from Afghanistan in 80's was a misstep and was much debated here stateside. Nobody then again claims the US was omnipotent . Fact is-the American public would not have allowed US intervening earlier just because some fundamentalist took over a country because you guys would have said the US is attacking Muslims.

Next you claim " The United States of America claims to care for the innocent people of Afghanistan yet keeps on striking civilian targets".

How do you account for such a statement? This statement reads as - that the US intentionally picks civilians targets , disregards civilian populated areas and is basic John Wayne. I will tell you sir as a husband of a Marine, that US has the highest standards of engagement to the detriment of its soldiers lives. You ask for and make a plea for a more humanistic approach yet make a statement as above. Civilians deaths as unfortunate as they are are far more massive in other folks armies, intentional and and done with callous. Mistakes have been made and it is deeply regretable by the US military

You go to say " All these policy and strategy makers, the great thinker's should join hands and find a non-military solution to this problem"

Also say- " As America escalates its offensive, the terrorists fight back by targeting more and more civilians of the same country as they cannot harm America so they vent out their anger on the same innocent people of Afghanistan. The common man is caught between the hammer and the anvil, there is no relief from any side, no one is there to look after the innocent people of Afghanistan and they are paying the price for a crime they did not commit."

Then end with " All these policy and strategy makers, the great thinker's should join hands and find a non-military solution to this problem"

So finally let us look at your strategy advise- Pakistan has tried its " peace initiative" yes? what came of it? did they cease blowing your innocent people?

No rather we saw this : Pakistan's Army Battles Taliban 100 KM from Capital

Pakistan's Army Battles Taliban 100 KM from Capital | News | English

So I end with asking this - Do you want to go back to that tired and failed strategy, is that what you are asking everyone to bank on again?

Again, Pakistan will do everything in its interests, & if the US wants to be insincere & hypocritical to Pakistan by brokering peace deals & implementing power transfer mechanisms to the Taliban, then there will be no progress in the region.

 

[JayAtl]

^^^ Huh? did you bother to read my post while quoting it?

 

[ashokdeiva]

India _ US relationship is not a crutch for the US or India. It's very different from US- Pak relationship. what you have to understand is the cooperation is across many fields , bi lateral and not just one where India sees its survivability dependent on their aid or needs the US to babysit its security theater against another country ( like it was during Russian- afghan era) . Both economies actually benefit from the relationship where as US Pak was and is a drain on the US economy ( aid related)

Btw re: your initial two sentences- I know one Pakistani who wants Pak US friendship- you! -unless you are residing in New jersey against your will.

They should be doing business with Pakistan in the same mindset they are coming for ties in different fields in India, rather WOT cost them only money but for the Pakistanis, it cost them lives.

 

[ARSENAL6]

LOL buddy
you just contradicted yourself

first you claim 9/11 was an inside job.....then you say it was committed by a terrorist group

Quataion marks are there becauses I quoted out from some hate -warmongering nazi who hates muslims

Dude have you serioulsy went to school ?

Reading tooo many **** mags don't help dude.

 

[Kevrai]

Quataion marks are there becauses I quoted out from some hate -warmongering nazi who hates muslims

Dude have you serioulsy went to school ?

Reading tooo many **** mags don't help dude.

of course I went to school
I should be asking YOU that question since you incorrectly spelt 'SERIOUSLY'

 

[Peshwa]

Again, Pakistan & India are no angels. But I stand by what I have said before: they do not have the same imperialistic dreams that the US has.

To begin with, Impreialism is an archaic concept.....You should modify your thinking to suit the times....
America doesnt need boots on the ground to control a country when they have the most powerful spy network aided by statellite imagery, excellent diplomacy...their technological prowess alone can ensure their success economically and militarily....
Besides....America has already "imperialized" half the world through Hollywood and the internet.....

I do not subscribe to your theory...

Yes I do agree that the US is resource greedy/hungry....but then again, which large economy isnt?

Sure, India & Pakistan have played proxy wars against each other. But that is only limited to their neighborhood, their region. You seriously cannot tell me America does the same, when history has proven, whether you look at Central/South America, Central/South East Asia, the Middle East, Africa; the US has unfortunately been in a constant state of heaving its imperialistic tendencies on other sovereign nations, meddling in their internal affairs.

I do think that India and Pak if they were in America's position in terms of clout, economy, military and technology would behave no differently...

But then again....we South Asians are known to be kings of denial and love to project our shortcomings outwards.....

 

[53fd]

To begin with, Impreialism is an archaic concept.....You should modify your thinking to suit the times....
America doesnt need boots on the ground to control a country when they have the most powerful spy network aided by statellite imagery, excellent diplomacy...their technological prowess alone can ensure their success economically and militarily....
Besides....America has already "imperialized" half the world through Hollywood and the internet.....

Again, you don't really need boots on the ground in other nations to be imperialistic. I would strongly recommend you to read Noam Chomsky's "Hegemony or Survival: America's Quest for Global Dominance".

Yes I do agree that the US is resource greedy/hungry....but then again, which large economy isnt?

Again, there are more civil ways of doing things. I would argue that China has done a far better job in this department than the US has. I've lived in Nigeria for 4 years, & traveled extensively over Africa. While China has implemented its projects in Africa for their own benefit, their projects directly affect the people (positively) in the region there. China does not dictate terms or meddle into the affairs of sovereign nations the way the US does. And the economic bodies like the World Bank & the IMF are pretty much an extension of the US. And then, even the NATO (which is supposed to be 'neutral') has been used by the US for its military engagements. My point being, despite the 'skirmishes' China has with its neighbors, you cannot compare the actions of China to the US. The US has very imperialistic tendencies that Great Britain used to have, & we know what happened to them.

I do think that India and Pak if they were in America's position in terms of clout, economy, military and technology would behave no differently...

I disagree with you here. India & Pakistan are 'traditional countries', 'built on' ancient lands. The US is a very recent phenomena, its society is more 'plastic', it is a land made of immigrants, it tries to attract the best of the best. The US has no real culture or traditions of its own, & the society here is much more 'morally discontent' (for a lack of better phrasing). America has built itself by taking away resources from the rest of the world, when countries like India, Pakistan & others have huge underutilized resources in their country (unlike the US), why would they need to have the same imperialistic tendencies of America?