United Airlines Dragged an Asian American Down Aisle

[Mamluk]

69 year old doctor, randomly chosen to leave overbooked flight, got violently dragged out because he refused to leave:

 

[shadows888]

69 year old doctor, randomly chosen to leave overbooked flight, got violently dragged out because he refused to leave:

he is a doctor and have patients next day that's why he refused to leave.

 

[XDescendantX]

Barbarians love picking on people smaller than them. They only respect/fear power.

 

[Śakra]

Americans seem to have a hard time understanding just because something is legally permissible doesn't mean it's socially nor does it mean that it's the right thing to do. CNN was defending the actions of the authorities who dragged this poor man citing"it's legal though".

 

[jhungary]

Americans seem to have a hard time understanding just because something is legally permissible doesn't mean it's socially nor does it mean that it's the right thing to do. CNN was defending the actions of the authorities who dragged this poor man citing"it's legal though".

It's actually the way it did stuff, or otherwise what do you want United Airline to do beside calling Airport Police?

A flight that's overbook (in this case, it was because of crew replenishment) cannot take off, UInited already offered $800 and travel voucher to anyone who volunteer to leave, no one take up the offer, the next step would either be cancelling the flight or pick 4 people off at random. There are no other way.

If united did not pick random passenger to get off the plane, then the flight would be cancelled and the end result is the same, this time with the whole plane have to disembark, not just 4 pax.

He was asked, and paid compensation for, and he refused to get off the plane, legally, he is violating transport law, and the doctor could actually be arrested, jailed and/or fined for causing the obstruction to crew and airport operation.

Before anyone claim it's racist. Don't forget the process is random, the captain pick a seat number at random and he would not know which seat is Asian or Black or Indian, and this has been done for a while to EVERYONE, and at every airline, I don't know why people are making a hack only this time

A women drag off a plane after refusing to comply to boarding and baggage procedure

http://wreg.com/2016/12/12/authorities-woman-dragged-off-plane-after-refusing-to-leave/

 

[shadows888]

It's actually the way it did stuff, or otherwise what do you want United Airline to do beside calling Airport Police?

A flight that's overbook (in this case, it was because of crew replenishment) cannot take off, UInited already offered $800 and travel voucher to anyone who volunteer to leave, no one take up the offer, the next step would either be cancelling the flight or pick 4 people off at random. There are no other way.

If united did not pick random passenger to get off the plane, then the flight would be cancelled and the end result is the same, this time with the whole plane have to disembark, not just 4 pax.

He was asked, and paid compensation for, and he refused to get off the plane, legally, he is violating transport law, and the doctor could actually be arrested, jailed and/or fined for causing the obstruction to crew and airport operation.

Before anyone claim it's racist. Don't forget the process is random, the captain pick a seat number at random and he would not know which seat is Asian or Black or Indian, and this has been done for a while to EVERYONE, and at every airline, I don't know why people are making a hack only this time

A women drag off a plane after refusing to comply to boarding and baggage procedure

http://wreg.com/2016/12/12/authorities-woman-dragged-off-plane-after-refusing-to-leave/

do you know why it got "overbooked"? because 4 of united employees wanted to go on the flight for free.

bro, your not winning this one. look at twitter, United is getting destroyed for this. it was a mess up by them and hopefully they learned their lesson.

in your article from 2016, it said "According to Delta, the flight from Detroit to San Diego was delayed after the female passenger refused to comply with boarding and baggage check procedures". of course, she didn't get her baggage checked. your making a false equivalence.

 

[jhungary]

do you know why it got "overbooked"? because 4 of united employees wanted to go on the flight for free.

bro, your not winning this one. look at twitter, United is getting destroyed for this. it was a mess up by them and hopefully they learned their lesson.

in your article from 2016, it said "According to Delta, the flight from Detroit to San Diego was delayed after the female passenger refused to comply with boarding and baggage check procedures". of course, she didn't get her baggage checked. your making a false equivalence.

Overbooking is VERY COMMON in the US and EU, and the seating is allocated to Pilot > Relief Pilot > Crew (Air and Ground Staff) > Relief Crew > Paid Pax > Unpaid Pax (relative of crew and staff). That is the seating arrangement regardless whether the person is going on a vacation wanting to score a free trips or he or she is to take a flight to relief someone.

In civil aviation CREW AND STAFF ALWAYS HAVE PRECEDENT OVER PAID PAX.

The problem is that, when a flight is overbooked, incentive is first offered to the pax who are willing to disembark, then the captain will first try to unload luggague, and then pick a random number from the flight chart and ask these people to leave.

Or would you rather the good doctor not vacated the flight and United to Cancel Flight 3341 and possibly the flight that the crew were to relief as well? So what you are saying is, United Should go after cancelling 2 flight because of the Overbooked Situation instead of asking people to leave at the first one? Would that be creating a problem bigger than just to call the Security and remove one single passenger?

Your point of "I am not winning this one" is absurd, as this is not United Fault, How to remove the pax in question was lied the way how the local LEA dealt with the passenger itself, United Does not have the authority to remove passenger forcibly from the flight, they have to be done by local LEA. The only thing United Did was to overbook the flight, and ask someone to leave, and when someone doesn't they called the Police.

Also, how am I making false equivalence? Can you be sure the crew in the united flight was there to take a cheap discount? Or they are relieving some other crew that worked over hour and prohibited to fly by FAA?

The overbook action is legitimate, and with a legitimate reason, they can ask people to get off their plane, the incident does not start when the captain move the pax before EVERY AVENUE exhausted, he (or she) did already offered miles, and compensation and also voucher to the pax to disembark, and when that does not work, HE HAVE TO REMOVE PAX AT RANDOM, and by non-complying to the crew and the captain instruction to disembark, that Doctor have broken the law already. That is the same consequence for a pax not to stow their luggage or check them in.

He was INSTRUCTED to leave the flight by the captain and the cabin crew, he refused, that is a no-no in aviation safety. Just because he is Asian or a Doctor does not have anything to do with him refusing to leave an aircraft.

 

[shadows888]

i knew eventually banana man will come to defend white masters

don't tell me this guy is asian lmao.

 

[Indika]

lol. Overbooking is VERY COMMON in the US and EU, and the seating is allocated to Pilot > Relief Pilot > Crew (Air and Ground Staff) > Relief Crew > Paid Pax. That is the seating arrangement regardless whether the person is going on a vacation wanting to score a free trips or he or she is to take a flight to relief someone.

In civil aviation CREW AND STAFF ALWAYS HAVE PRECEDENT OVER PAID PAX.

The problem is that, when a flight is overbooked, incentive is first offered to the pax who are willing to disembark, then the captain will first try to unload passenger, and then pick a random number from the flight chart and ask these people to leave.

Or would you rather the good doctor not vacated the flight and United to Cancel Flight 3341 and possibly the flight that the crew were to relief as well? So what you are saying is, United Should go after cancelling 2 flight because of the Overbooked Situation instead of asking people to leave at the first one? Would that be creating a problem bigger than just to call the Security and remove one single passenger?

Your point of "I am not winning this one" is absurd, as this is not United Fault, How to remove the pax in question was lied the way how the local LEA dealt with the passenger itself, United Does not have the authority to remove passenger forcibly from the flight, they have to be done by local LEA. The only thing United Did was to overbook the flight, and ask someone to leave, and when someone doesn't they called the Police.

Also, how am I making false equivalence? Can you be sure the crew in the united flight was there to take a cheap discount? Or they are relieving some other crew that worked over hour and prohibited to fly by FAA?

The overbook action is legitimate, and with a legitimate reason, they can ask people to get off their plane, the incident does not start when the captain move the pax before EVERY AVENUE exhausted, he (or she) did already offered miles, and compensation and also voucher to the pax to disembark, and when that does not work, HE HAVE TO REMOVE PAX AT RANDOM, and by non-complying to the crew and the captain instruction to disembark, that Doctor have broken the law already.

So whose problem was that ? Customer's? Airlines can hide under a law which is totally anti-customer but that does not absolve them of the fault. Once a ticket is confirmed it they are morally bound to fly him out. Airlines out of greed over book flights and should customer's pay for that?

As far as monetary compensation is concerned that is absolute nonsense. Will they compensate him for the time he lost ? Will it alleviate the trauma he faced?

Instead of asking all such questions you can ask was it avoidable ? yes if not for the airlines greed.

 

[jhungary]

So whose problem was that ? Customer's? Airlines can hide under a law which is totally anti-customer but that does not absolve them of the fault. Once a ticket is confirmed it they are morally bound to fly him out. Airlines out of greed over book flights and should customer's pay for that?

As far as monetary compensation is concerned that is absolute nonsense. Will they compensate him for the time he lost ? Will it alleviate the trauma he faced?

Instead of asking all such questions you can ask was it avoidable ? yes if not for the airlines greed.

My wife was a Flight Attendant for SAS Airline and my brother fix aircraft with Boeing, and NO, THIS CANNOT BE AVOID.

This particular incident cite from 4 United Crew member need to relief another United Flight crew, and this replacement is last minutes. And it cannot be avoided. It's not like they have 225 seat and they sold 229 tickets.

When a flight crew flew over hours and cannot make it back to hub on time, a relief crew was called, in this case, the United had called 4 relief crew to board this flight and go and replace the other crew. And that particular flight are fully booked, so 4 people have to go.

So what if the flight leave without asking anyone to leave? Then the other flight will have to be cancel as they are over the work hours allowed, then you will have to remove 225 pax instead of 4. Now, you do the maths.

Or the plane itself does not go, and you have to remove all 225 pax from this flight.

Also worth notice that the severe weather in East Coast of US in April, flight is overbook to fill cancellation, not to make extra money, in this case, 4 crew want to board that particular flight, they are within their legal right to do so, I honestly don't see why this is a problem.

The only problem in your head is that the doctor is Asian, to be hoenst, I don't think you will care if that pax is white.

 

[MultaniGuy]

horrible for that to happen to anyone

 

[jhungary]

horrible for that to happen to anyone

Maybe. If you are a casual traveller.

You need to know there exist traveller who actually earn a living from getting bump off planes, in case of the US, FAA require compensation if you are bump off planes either voluntary or involuntary. Some traveller actually earn money and publish a full account on the internet as to how to score a maximum compensation on airline that is trying to bump you off.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/laurab...-to-fly-to-florida-this-weekend/#26a807304de1

depending on how and why you take a flight, experience vary.

 

[Indika]

My wife was a Flight Attendant for SAS Airline and my brother fix aircraft with Boeing, and NO, THIS CANNOT BE AVOID.

This particular incident cite from 4 United Crew member need to relief another United Flight crew, and this replacement is last minutes. And it cannot be avoided. It's not like they have 225 seat and they sold 229 tickets.

When a flight crew flew over hours and cannot make it back to hub on time, a relief crew was called, in this case, the United had called 4 relief crew to board this flight and go and replace the other crew. And that particular flight are fully booked, so 4 people have to go.

So what if the flight leave without asking anyone to leave? Then the other flight will have to be cancel as they are over the work hours allowed, then you will have to remove 225 pax instead of 4. Now, you do the maths.

Or the plane itself does not go, and you have to remove all 225 pax from this flight.

You are looking at it from legal or technical view hence it looks ok but not morally.

As I said thats not the problem of customer. Why cannot airlines have extra staff ? bcos they will lose money but are ok with throwing out confirmed passengers. Its issue with airlines not with customer.

Look we have some thing called values/principles, if we accept for a job or agree to do something we live up to it. Airlines is a big entity which has enormous money and man power it can always find better ways/means to avoid it.

Why does an army says leave no man behind? They can also convert that to numbers and say 1 is ok 2 is fine, three is extreme... We have socially accepted norms and values that we need to follow.

In my opinion airlines just lost a chance to show how good they are and instead became an example of corporate rogue behavior.

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

Barbarians love picking on people smaller than them. They only respect/fear power.

The passenger's seat was picked at random. 1/2 of a couple was chosen also so both decided to leave.

bro, your not winning this one. look at twitter, United is getting destroyed for this. it was a mess up by them and hopefully they learned their lesson.

As far as monetary compensation is concerned that is absolute nonsense. Will they compensate him for the time he lost ? Will it alleviate the trauma he faced?

The man will be solicited by top notch law firms. His Great-Great-Great-Great Grandkids will have paid education to any school in the US, alone with free first class travel. He just made a payday.

No one is defending United not after back to back incidences from their planes running out of fuel, breaking people's Guitars, legging (albeit company dress policy). And the follow on statement by the CEO "I apologize for having to re-accommodate these customers. Our team is moving with a sense of urgency to work with authorities and conduct our own detailed review of what happened."

This @jhungary is always ready to shield a group of people who hate his race.

The thread title makes it seem the passenger was targeted for his race/ ethnicity. He was not but chosen at random. Legally the airline can remove a passenger provided they are given 4x one way fare. United messed up. $400 was offered then $800, then the pilot came and started randomly choosing seats. Everyone has a price. I was aboard a Southwest airplane where they came to offer $900 and hotel, I was an idiot in high school and didnt accept.

 

[jhungary]

You are looking at it from legal or technical view hence it looks ok but not morally.

As I said thats not the problem of customer. Why cannot airlines have extra staff ? bcos they will lose money but are ok with throwing out confirmed passengers. Its issue with airlines not with customer.

Look we have some thing called values/principles, if we accept for a job or agree to do something we live up to it. Airlines is a big entity which has enormous money and man power it can always find better ways/means to avoid it.

Why does an army says leave no man behind? They can also convert that to numbers and say 1 is ok 2 is fine, three is extreme... We have socially accepted norms and values that we need to follow.

In my opinion airlines just lost a chance to show how good they are and instead became an example of corporate rogue behavior.

morally? It's about 4 pax and thee other 221 pax. Or morally, do you want your flight, or some one else's flight to fly unsafely?

Because overbooking happens whether or not this is because some guy want to score some cheap ticket and the aviation hierarchy put him in front of you, or they want to replace crew that flew overtime.

How are you going to have more crew when you are talking about a flight to some place else, it's not like you are taking a bus to work or something, you are talking about entirely another city or country. Unless you have crew everywhere and anywhere, THIS ALWAYS GOING TO HAPPEN. and I don't know how your business is going to survive when you have crew everywhere in the world just to serve as an emergency.

The moral of this story is, in a usual way to deal with overbooking, you refuse pax from actually boarding a flight, this way, you don't have these drama playing out. The problem for this is, when a pax is already boarded, and the crew are notified the need to fly out a relieve crew, that is the question why pax are forcibly remove from the flight to begin with,

On the other hand, if you don't remove the 4 people, picked at random, what is the moral value done to the other 221 pax, for them have to disembark in an act of god? None of those 221 pax are doing anything wrong, as much as the 4 randomly picked pax, so because you need to be moral to those 4 randomly picked pax, you have to be immoral to the other 221 pax?

Or you are going to have a way to keep flight on time, weather in check and all other thing at a constant, because crew replenishment and overbooking is always going to be in the aviation world, as long as flight get delay, or flight got cancelled, there will ALWAYS be overbooking, so tell me, how Airline can morally deal with thsese problem ?

You are thinking this is not the pax at fault, but was this actually the fault of the airline instead?