Turns out the "Aryan" invaded Europe :D

[Pakistani E]

Yup Yup I was mentioning them in previous comment .
From their invasion/migration to development of Vedas it took over 500 years . So Vedic sanskrit came into existence many centuries later .
Now what happened to Indigenous people of IVC ? Were they erased , were they displaced ?
If IVC got extinct due to natural reasons , then where did this forced people to migrate ?

Did Aryans migrated at the end or after the end of civilization ?

So many questions not answered by the AMT .

I wasn't even talking about IVC, I have never stated they were wiped out by an invasion. I agree with @Jaanbaz on that issue. Don't know why you keep bringing this up, as I mentioned previously, I believe there to have been successive migrations over many years.

As for the language issue, I have already told you that Indo-Europeans or whatever you want to call them were not a single unified tribe. Their ofshoots travelled in directions, they contributed to spreading IE languages in Western Europe as well which is why Sanskrit is similar to so many European languages, together with Genetic similarities. Languages are fluid, they adopt, they assimilate and they replace.

We can invent as many stories as we like, Genetics doesn't lie. There are known similarities between South Asians and European populations. It seems like you want me to accept that it was people from South Asia who migrated to these lands, is this what you have been trying to point towards ?

 

[Water Car Engineer]

This migration a lot times was due to the fact their original land, women, etc. was taken over by an opposing tribes. Going back wasnt an option.

Their Calvary tactics was too much for certain civilizations who haven't developed the same, don't have strong breed of horses.

 

[faithfulguy]

Can you please provide the proof or any references/sources ??
How come the people in central asia (Caspian and Aral Sea) forget sanskrit as they brought it to India?

It's been proven that Indo Iranian Proto language produced Avestan and Sanskrit, Avesta produced Iranian languages, while Sanskrit generated Indo Aryan languages. If Indo Europeans come from India, you will see the most language diversity within India, which is not the case.

The best example of how that would look like is the Austronesian language. It started out in Taiwan and 11of the 12 highest level subdivisions are only found in Taiwan. The 12th subdivision span the pacific.

 

[Indika]

Indo European Aryans did pushed the original inhabitants of Europe out of the way. Their examples are the Walsh and Isle of Manns people of Britain and the Basque people of Spain.

So the same group of people that traveled to Europe also traveled to India and displaced the natives. In India, it's called Aryan invasion. It's clear and Sanskrit was brought to India. Only Hindu nationalist reject this fact based on national pride. But facts point to an Aryan invasion of India.

yeah sanskrit was brought to India in a bucket. do you know sanskrit ? stop making comments just for the sake of it.

There was no Aryan invasion to India, maybe some migration did take place, ''Aryans'' also didn't destroy Indus Valley civilisation(it was the severe change in weather and drying up of river/s?), these lies were spread by some racist British colonists to divide and rule in South Asia.

Also If I'm not wrong Arya has nothing to do with ethnicity but for a title for religious or noble people? @Kashmiri Pandit

Its high time institutions in subcontinent conducted their own historical research and put the facts on table instead of simply believing what was said to us by british. Even after Independence if we start believing grandma's fairy tales then the problem is with us than them.

I wasn't even talking about IVC, I have never stated they were wiped out by an invasion. I agree with @Jaanbaz on that issue. Don't know why you keep bringing this up, as I mentioned previously, I believe there to have been successive migrations over many years.

As for the language issue, I have already told you that Indo-Europeans or whatever you want to call them were not a single unified tribe. Their ofshoots travelled in directions, they contributed to spreading IE languages in Western Europe as well which is why Sanskrit is similar to so many European languages, together with Genetic similarities. Languages are fluid, they adopt, they assimilate and they replace.

We can invent as many stories as we like, Genetics doesn't lie. There are known similarities between South Asians and European populations. It seems like you want me to accept that it was people from South Asia who migrated to these lands, is this what you have been trying to point towards ?

yup migrations would have taken place just like modern times, but an invasion ? thats a bit far fetched. If they were so advanced to organize and invade then should have left big tell tale signs or records of it.

 

[Pakistani E]

yup migrations would have taken place just like modern times, but an invasion ? thats a bit far fetched. If they were so advanced to organize and invade then should have left big tell tale signs or records of it.

Agreed, I don't buy this big dedicated "Aryan" invasion. The truth is always more complicated. Human migration is fueled by the need for resources and especially in those times, when whole nations were on the move. It is not far fetched to then believe that there were migrations and maybe even small scale invasions, as that's what they would become if it involved violence, did indeed take place.

 

[kempe]

It's been proven that Indo Iranian Proto language produced Avestan and Sanskrit, Avesta produced Iranian languages, while Sanskrit generated Indo Aryan languages. If Indo Europeans come from India, you will see the most language diversity within India, which is not the case.

The best example of how that would look like is the Austronesian language. It started out in Taiwan and 11of the 12 highest level subdivisions are only found in Taiwan. The 12th subdivision span the pacific.

Why is English considered a European language if it originated in Central Asia? The Proto-Indo-European language originated from Central Asia, but when it split, it split to many different parts of the world. The actual language Sanskrit did not develop until the Proto-Indo-Europeans who split off toward India were near India; before that, it was only Proto-Indo-European, or Proto-Indo-Iranian, and so forth.

Sanskrit is a thoroughly Indian language because the earliest form of the language that could be called Sanskrit developed only on the Indian subcontinent.

 

[TruthHurtz]

Why is English considered a European language if it originated in Central Asia? The Proto-Indo-European language originated from Central Asia, but when it split, it split to many different parts of the world. The actual language Sanskrit did not develop until the Proto-Indo-Europeans who split off toward India were near India; before that, it was only PIE, or Proto-Indo-Iranian, and so forth.

Sanskrit is a thoroughly Indian language because the earliest form of the language that could be called Sanskrit developed only on the Indian subcontinent.

Lies, Sanskrit is a fully Proto-Pakistani language, it was stolen by Indians from Muhammad Ali Khan in the 10th century BC. Hindu is actually closer in similarity Vietnamese which is the ancestral language of the indian people.

 

[Mamluk]

The actual language Sanskrit did not develop until the Proto-Indo-Europeans who split off toward India were near India; before that, it was only Proto-Indo-European, or Proto-Indo-Iranian, and so forth.

How do you know?

 

[kempe]

How do you know?

Sanskrit language's origin is in The Vedas. The Vedas are the first source of the Sanskrit language, this language is referred to as Devabhasha or gIrvANa-vAni or Gairvani for short. There aren't any cultures, cities or civilizations outside Indian subcontinent that practiced Rigveda. The Rigveda specifically mentions the Saraswati as between the Yamuna and the Sutlej, that can only be the Ghaggar river bed. There is also no mention of a central asian landscape in the Rigveda; it is specific in that it mentions the Kabul river to the west and the Ganga to the east. There is awareness of the Himalayas.

The word Samskritam for the language is of a later origin.

Pāṇini standardized the Grammar for the language. It is not that Panini was the first Grammarian. There were many vyAkaraNas(Grammars) like Aindra and mAheshwaraVyākaraṇa. Only that in all those previous books the number of rules were huge like about 1,00,000. Several efforts might have been made to write the governing rules for the language. The best and the most compact grammar contained within 4000 sutras and 4 other adjunct books were the output of the genius of Panini and comes in the form of Classical Sanskrit.

 

[Aryzin]

@kempe , I am not an expert but you say that Aryan folk would want to conquer their ancestral land once they took over India, point is they did not need to as the areas now known as central Asia was then populated by their kinfolk. Turkic/Mongolian groups migrated there and assimilated Iranic population much later on. Again I am no expert but why do people think Aryan were blonde and blue eyed? Aryan only means noble or who does not hide their hands ( only thieves or non trustable people hide their hands), for all we know Indo-European languages were introduced to Europe by Indo Aryan people who conquered the natives. After all they had superior military skills and could easily defeat farming communities. Pretty much same as what Turkic people did to Iranic when they had quit the nomadic lifestyle and became civilized (sedentary ). Just saying that it could well be that Aryans could have migrated to Europe then after a while moved back into Asia With CONQUERED Europeans. Would this be a possibility? Again I am not s historian, I just remembered I read about it long time ago.
Regards

 

[911]

Lies, Sanskrit is a fully Proto-Pakistani language, it was stolen by Indians from Muhammad Ali Khan in the 10th century BC. Hindu is actually closer in similarity Vietnamese which is the ancestral language of the indian people.

Random

yeah sanskrit was brought to India in a bucket. do you know sanskrit ? stop making comments just for the sake of it.

Love Chinese trolls hahah.

 

[Kashmiri Pandit]

I wasn't even talking about IVC, I have never stated they were wiped out by an invasion. I agree with @Jaanbaz on that issue. Don't know why you keep bringing this up, as I mentioned previously, I believe there to have been successive migrations over many years.

As for the language issue, I have already told you that Indo-Europeans or whatever you want to call them were not a single unified tribe. Their ofshoots travelled in directions, they contributed to spreading IE languages in Western Europe as well which is why Sanskrit is similar to so many European languages, together with Genetic similarities. Languages are fluid, they adopt, they assimilate and they replace.

We can invent as many stories as we like, Genetics doesn't lie. There are known similarities between South Asians and European populations. It seems like you want me to accept that it was people from South Asia who migrated to these lands, is this what you have been trying to point towards ?

There are many possibilities but lets keep that for a separate day . Feeling too lazy today .
But to answer in short , Vedas and Sanskrit were developed here in South Asia and not the steeps of Central Asia .

 

[Kabira]

The caste system is the evidence of Aryan invasion. Also, I never said they were large in number. The lower caste and tribals were the natives that was conquered.

Unlike in Europe, where the natives were displaced, slaughtered or assimilated, Aryans in India created the caste system for both the conquered and the conquerer. As a result both groups survived separately to this day. As the number of invaders were not that big, they inevitably had to breed with the natives.

Since Sanskrit and Persian originated from the same language, Aryan have the same meaning. This is yet another example supporting Aryan invasion.

This is well known fact, the same proto IE people who invaded central and south asia also moved to europe and merged with indigenous european population replacing languages. Only difference being that proto IE people were more similar to indigenous europeans genetically then they were to indigenous south and central asians.

Difference between indigenous Indian tribals and proto aryans is like day and night, hence the need for caste system in India but not europe?

 

[Tiger Genie]

the re-discovery of r.saraswathi and genetic distance analysis have conclusively proven there was no scaled aryan invasion to India and it is plain to see there is no great genetic distance between north and south Indians.

Remember most of the history books written till about 30 years ago did not have the benefit of genetic science and everyone believed whatever the germans wrote. The number of mis-translations of sanskrit works by germans is another major issue that needs correction.

 

[Jaanbaz]

Indians are Dravidians. Most of these so called Aryans are ancestors of modern day Pakistanis, and that's why the Dravids hate us so much There's a rivalry going back thousands of years.

Most Pakistanis also carry a bit of what you call ''Dravidian''. In some groups its highers then what you might think. You too have South Indian in you, unless you believe you are some Arab invader or something.