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"The Rafale Deal Should Be Scrapped And Renegotiated"

Radar cross section of rafale is quite lower than that of Su 30. @sancho or @sandy _3126 can help you.
Due to its large Rcs our enemy will get Su 30 presence even if it is nearer to iur border.



Su 30 is expensive .Its maintenance is too high and its price tag is now around 100 million$ .plus its availability ratio is quite less than that of rafale.Rafale have next gen avionics.
Please refer the link. I really want to know.
BTW maintanance of rafale is cosy, it is only time saving compare to mki.
please refer that link.
 
JF-17 > Rafale. JF-17 has Bad@$$ DSI 21st century air intake technology and looks way meaner than Rafale :bounce:

Pakistani air force has 49 JF-17 > French air force has 45 Rafale C
Actually it is......
Rafel> lca>miraj2000>>>>>>> JF17 thunder
 
2000-03 was the best time for this Multirole fighter. Totally worth at that time. Now, you can get one generation ahead plane with almost same price....

"Time is money".


Time-is-Money.gif


More you late, more you loses the worth.

Multi-role fighter prosperity comes only to those who understand the value and importance of time. That is why it is said that ‘time is money’.
 
The is how France does business. Corruption is used to sway the deal and France knows to push all the right buttons in Delhi.




Sarkozy was detained Tuesday and reportedly questioned by financial investigators in yet another corruption probe. Detained sounds pretty close to being arrested but it does have the stench of political opportunism. There's no way I think Sarkozy should run again any more than Rob Ford should. The Right need to pick another candidate. The Right supports the Left when they pick such corrupt idiots to represent them.

France has always had a history of being passionate supporters of freedom. The French Revolution was based on the principles of Liberty, Equality and Fraternity. The French were the ones that gave the Statue of Liberty to the Americans. Yet what's happening in France is a similar political problem that's happening around the globe.

First there's the obvious concern about political opportunism which goes both ways. One side wants to exploit the fact that there's more dirt on Sarkozy while Sarkozy was working hard to create dirt on his rival candidate. Looking beyond the opportunism, I really think we need to shun extremism. Here we have the right wing candidate that turns out to be a dirty dog, so they go and elect a socialist. That's extremism.

So if we set aside the opportunism and the extremism there are two acts Sarkozy did that we need to remember because they are important. One was Libya the other was Pakistan. Libya was obvious. Sarkozy was trying to convince the world we should trust Gadaffi with nuclear power. It's pretty obvious that he did receive campaign contributions from Gadaffi despite his denial. He was trying to sell Gadaffi a French reactor. As soon as Gadaffi decided to buy a reactor from somewhere else, Sarkozy lead the invasion trying to topple that "dictator."

Only nothing had changed from when Sarkozy was trying to convince the world to trust Gadaffi with nuclear power. If Gadaffi was a dictator when Canada helped France invade Libya, then he was the same dictator when Sarkozy was trying to convince the world to trust him. The only difference was the decision not to buy a French reactor from Sarkozy

As Canadians we need to remember that because we supported that tainted mission. A Canadian General was the poster boy that ran interference for Sarkozy's dirty deed. All this talk about Sarkozy accepting campaign contributions from a rich widow is smoke and mirrors. I don't care who that dirty dog slept with. The fact that he accepted campaign contributions from Gadaffi before he murdered him is totally within the realm of believability.

The other thing we need to remember is Sarkozy's involvement with the Karachi affair in Pakistan. That scandal dates back to 1994 when Sarkozy was budget minister in a government led by his ally and mentor, Prime Minister Édouard Balladur. The Balladur government sealed a deal to sell three Agosta 90 submarines to Pakistan for an estimated $950m. To secure the contract large bribes were allegedly paid to Pakistani politicians and military, as well as commissions to middlemen.

The key issue is whether around €2m of illegal kickbacks from the sale were secretly funneled back to France to fund Balladur's unsuccessful 1995 presidential campaign. As budget minister, Sarkozy would have authorized the financial elements of the submarine sale. At the time he was also treasurer and spokesman for Balladur's campaign.

The initial claim was that France was supposed to pay kickbacks and commissions to Pakistan for the submarines but failed to do so. As a result, “terrorists” bombed French engineers. The pivotal point is that Sarkozy set up a shell company so some of the kickbacks would be funneled back to him. He had his best man carry the cash. So he is the one that would be upset the kickbacks didn’t happen. I’m not saying he bombed the French engineers and blamed it on terrorists but I am saying he had a motive to do so and that is the root of the allegations.

Sarkozy's involvement with the Karachi affair in Pakistan isn't just about Sarkozy getting kickbacks from an arms deal. It's about Sarkozy being involved with murder under the guise of a terrorist act when those kickbacks were stopped. That is what we need to remember.
 
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2000-03 was the best time for this Multirole fighter. Totally worth at that time. Now, you can get one generation ahead plane with almost same price....

"Time is money".


Time-is-Money.gif


More you late, more you loses the worth.

Multi-role fighter prosperity comes only to those who understand the value and importance of time. That is why it is said that ‘time is money’.
Which next gen fighter we should buy, please tell us.
And in 2000-2003,it was not multirole.
 
Which next gen fighter we should buy, please tell us.
.
F35.... Nobody can beat this.... There are few minor bugs but i am sure they will fix it soon as there are already many countries involved in this project... Nobody can beat F35 in this decade.
Rafale or F35 :azn:

But India is rich country , you can afford Rafale at almost same price.

Best of luck for Rafale projectl!!
 
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F35.... Nobody can beat this.... There are few minor bugs but i am sure they will fix it soon as there are already many countries involved in this project... Nobody can beat F35 in this decade.


Agreed. But investing on AMCA makes more sense to me. Reason being there are already too many customers awaiting to get on F35s. India will only get 1st deliveries by 2023-24 if we start negotiating a deal nw. Amca has similar time frame. also if we scrape MMRCA deal now, it will be a major setback to IAF which is already suffering from squadron shortages.
 
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Agreed. But investing on AMCA makes more sense to me. Reason being there are already too many customers awaiting to get on F35s. India will only get 1st deliveries by 2023-24 if we start negotiating a deal nw. Amca has similar time frame. also if we scrape MMRCA deal now, it will be a major setback to IAF which is already suffering from squadron shortages.
Induction of Rafale will also take time till 2018-2020... Even Pakfa is still flying prototype, forget about AMCA in this decade.
Mate, this is long process.... U.S.A is already decade ahead than Russia and others. That's why i said about F35 which also absorbs technology of F22. 100+ already built....
 
Induction of Rafale will also take time till 2018-2020... Even Pakfa is still flying prototype, forget about AMCA in this decade.
Mate, this is long process.... U.S.A is already decade ahead than Russia and others. That's why i said about F35 which also absorbs technology of F22. 100+ already built....

I got your point. But we can't ignore the fact that it will comwe with too many strings attached to it. Plus senctions to hamper operational capabilities. We simply cant trust USA. Better look elsewhere. No point buying a gun which you cant fire in need.
Otherwise I would have gone with F35.

(come) typing mistake
 
I got your point. But we can't ignore the fact that it will comwe with too many strings attached to it. Plus senctions to hamper operational capabilities. We simply cant trust USA. Better look elsewhere. No point buying a gun which you cant fire in need.
Otherwise I would have gone with F35.

(come) typing mistake
I think you missed the discussion.. Your senior members even accepted, Nobody will give you full TOT. Forget about this. Its just assembling the parts etc.... France can also place sanction on India if U.S.A asks them.... They are always in same boat....
Anyway, Rafale is very good fighter. Better than anything in our PAF service.
Best of luck!!
 
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Guys, hurry up to pay!
Everyone knows that French people pay a lot of bribery, the money is not wasted.
As everyone knows, India and France, is more of a political factor.
As for aircraft, in fact is not particularly important factor.
 
I think you missed the discussion.. Your senior members even accepted, Nobody will give you full TOT. Forget about this. Its just assembling the parts etc.... France can also place sanction on India if U.S.A asks them.... They are always in same boat....
Anyway, Rafale is very good fighter. Better than anything in our PAF service.
Best of luck!!

can you tell me when we will get first f35,if we order it now.
 
The BJP’s stormy petrel Subramanian Swamy has for long been publicly opposed to the $22 billion Rafale deal, to the point of even suggesting that there was more to the UPA government’s choice than met the eye. In February 2012, The Sunday Times of London quoted Swamy as saying he had initially been told the Eurofighter had won the deal to supply 126 fighter jets but that it all changed after the entry of a veteran French consultant, Bernard Baiocco, an ex-employee of the defence firm Thales, which contributes radar and electronic systems to Rafale. “Baiocco was here (in Delhi) and he went around, and everything changed after that,” Swamy had said, explaining the UPA’s sudden change of heart. With the Modi government poised to indicate its choice, Swamy spoke to Pranay Sharma. Excerpts:

What do you think of the Rafale deal?

It stinks right through. The deal should be frozen or scrapped and negotiations for the MMRCA should begin afresh.

Why do you say this?

There are a number of reasons but foremost Rafale was finalised not through commercial negotiation; it was done by private conversations between Sonia Gandhi, her sisters and Carla Bruni, wife of then French president Nicolas Sarkozy.

Your other objections...

No country outside France has so far bought the Rafale. Some countries had shortlisted it, but rejected it later. We must find out why they did so. We must also know why it is so much more expensive than the other competitors. With the kind of money India has pledged to buy the planes, it can actually buy over the entire company that makes them. Moreover, there are also reports that it is trying to win the contract by giving a subcontract to an influential Indian industrialist. In addition, its performance in terms of fuel consumption etc was much higher and unimpressive during the recent Libyan campaign.

So what should be done about the Rafale deal?

I had written to the UPA defence minister A.K. Antony citing reports and the information on the Sonia Gandhi family’s link with Carla Bruni. Being an honorable man sensitive about his image and reputation, Antony had frozen negotiations with Rafale. I am not sure why Arun Jaitley decided to defreeze it.

The BJP’s in power. Will you ask for Rafale deal to be scrapped?

We have a party meeting coming up in a few days. I will raise the issue not only with defence minister Jaitley but also with PM Narendra Modi. I’ll definitely bring it to their notice.
The moment Rafale was selected it was clear something is seriously wrong
 
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