The Murder of Osama Bin Laden. U S Pakistan Partners in Crime Seymour Hersh

[nik22]

There is another thread on this. I posted below about possible sequence of events:

1. US find out through ISI officer about presence of OBL in Pak. US confirms on the ground through Dr Afridi or any other asset
2. US debate whether or not to inform Pak. US thinks it may be too risky and detrimental to their interests by doing this Operation on their own ( what If ISI get to know of possible operation and change the location of OBL? What if Pak forces attack US forces during operation or shoot down their chopper?)
4. US confronts Pak Army and ISI chief with undeniable evidences of OBL in Pak. There is no other option with Pak army, ISI chief but to go with US.
5. Pak Army and ISI chief still debate privately how best to handle this matter. Capture or killing of OBL is certain but what is the best way?
Option 1: Pak capture/kill OBL but says CIA gave the tip.
PRO: Pak save the face in front of world. Probably get some appreciation as well.
CON: More Terrorist organization open war against Pak Army.
Option 2: Actual operation or original operation that was told
PRO: Pak can deny involvement.
CON: Huge embarrassment
6. Either way Pak goes, it is a coup for US. Option 2 will just make President Obama and team hero of the nation. They want to go that way.
7. US and Pak planners prepare the script to immaculate level. It includes pics of Obama and team looking nervous in the room.
8. Things go per script with some minor hiccups.

After 4 years, People have forget about it. Popularity of President Obama is at peak. Economy is doing good, employment is at high. He is humorous. Most people like him.

Things are picking up on Presidential Election 2016 side. Someone in the race (inspired by House of Cards) decides it is not good to have a too strong President. It will make the endorsement of President very important. Not a bad idea to spill some beans. After almost 4 year, 1 week, report of actual Operation is published.

So President Obama and team were not honest with Nation? Truth would not be out soon or never. But a doubt has been sown in mind of American People and world. (Real 'House of Cards' continues)

 

[Armstrong]

Its an investigative article based on the testimony of a secret high level source that had access to the absolute top rungs of power in Washington and Islamabad at the same time. Take it with a kilo of salt.

Oh come on; at least it made me feel good that we weren't caught with our pants, boxers and everything else one can think of, down during the OBL raid !

Now you're telling me that it may well be true that we really did commit the biggest intelligence oversight in our history by failing to recognize that OBL was there in Abbottabad !

 

[A1Kaid]

By wheels in motion, I categorically remember telling you that I was talking about the stage where they were still ascertaining if it was indeed OBL within the compound. I see 3 years has still not helped you digest my argument.



Aafia Siddique is a US Citizen.

I don't think so, her family said she is a Pakistani citizen, she was born in Pakistan and there is no evidence she ever changed her citizenship or held US citizenship. She came to US on education Visa.

 

[3.14159]

Aafia Siddique is a US Citizen.

1. According to official court documents, she is Pakistan citizen.

 

[Icarus]

Oh come on; at least it made me feel good that we weren't caught with our pants, boxers and everything else one can think of, down during the OBL raid !

Now you're telling me that it may well be true that we really did commit the biggest intelligence oversight in our history by failing to recognize that OBL was there in Abbottabad !

Actually when this entire issue erupted, I had created a thread where I explicitly mentioned that it had been Pakistan that had red flagged the Kuwaitis as OBL couriers but US had lead us to believe that it wasn't the case while they pursued the lead themselves.

I don't think so, her family said she is a Pakistani citizen, she was born in Pakistan and there is no evidence she ever changed her citizenship or held US citizenship. She came to US on education Visa.

1. According to official court documents, she is Pakistan citizen.

She resided in America for over a decade, married a nationality holder and had children there. She was a green card holder herself though I agree that whether or not she was a full citizen is still subject to debate.

 

[The Great One]

By wheels in motion, I categorically remember telling you that I was talking about the stage where they were still ascertaining if it was indeed OBL within the compound. I see 3 years has still not helped you digest my argument.

I guess the phrase has different meaning depending upon which side of the wagah border you are on.
But now look again. You make yet another partial retreat.

'Obama was unaware of the OBL raid until all the data had been collected, identities verified and the strategy chalked out.'

I don't even need to remember, its straight from my profile page.

 

[Armstrong]

Actually when this entire issue erupted, I had created a thread where I explicitly mentioned that it had been Pakistan that had red flagged the Kuwaitis as OBL couriers but US had lead us to believe that it wasn't the case while they pursued the lead themselves.

I know I read an article in the Guardian or some other UK based paper mentioning that the Pakistanis tipped the Americans about Kuwaiti. It is funny though that this isn't mentioned that often because it would once and for all, for any rational and unbiased person, end the matter of 'Pakistan harboring OBL' completely; 'cause as strange as it may sound like to someone who'd want to imagine Pakistan as the guilty party (come what may) : You just don't give information about how to get to the guy you're hiding to the people who are searching for him !

Waiseee Sethi Sahib; womanizing aaap nahin karteiii.....saving the world scenario mein aap nahin participate karteiii.....BMWs aaap nahin chalateiii.....phir Pakistan keh James Bond kaisee aaap nei apneiii aap ko banaa liyaa ?

Aur yahan Sethi Sahib mein aaap ko James Bond seh bhiii higher level par bethaa kar apnaa successor aur next James Butt bananeiii ka soooch rahaa thaaa !

 

[duhastmish]

It makes sense. I doubt Pakistan had no idea about Osama and us can reach so deep and move out without Pakistani guessing.

This is closer to what most people will agree. The earlier story made us the superman and Pakistan a plankton.

Let's see the response that might tell a more about its reliability.

 

[rockstar08]

That Guy Osama is dead ..
The guy Obama is still President ..
That Guy Pasha , i have no idea about him ..
Kiyani sahab is still relaxing in some 2-3 acre farm house ..
some Journalist investigate and write an article ..
and here we are , digging the old graves ..

 

[MastanKhan]

1. Even after ignoring your blatantly racist rant, it remains clear that the words "Every single time---it is someone else's fault----it is some one else that needs to be blamed---" is more applicable to the Pakistani mindset than anybody else.

2. In fact, it is Pakistani national disease to blame everybody and their uncle around the world just to avoid taking responsibility for their own affairs.

Sir,

It is the American national disease to blame everyone---. You had your chance to take him out multiple times---. The cowards that were wearing your uniform could not pull the trigger---.

I stand behind my rascist rant----. Get your head out of your lilly white arse---you let him escape sudan---you let him escape Somalia---you let him escape 4 times in Afghanistan----you openly stated on the world television that you care less if Osama is alive or dead----you clearly stated we are not seeking him----he is immaterial to us---.

This's teamcreated a drama for him to win the elections---and I voted for that arsehole.

If the U S is so righteous then why is it crawling back to Pakistan for help in Afghanistan---in yemen---against iran---.

 

[Icarus]

I guess the phrase has different meaning depending upon which side of the wagah border you are on.
But now look again. You make yet another partial retreat.

'Obama was unaware of the OBL raid until all the data had been collected, identities verified and the strategy chalked out.'

I don't even need to remember, its straight from my profile page.

I'm not reading and posting these off a printed source, so you will have to excuse the fact that I am unable to repeat a 3 year old post word for word.

 

[MastanKhan]

That Guy Osama is dead ..
The guy Obama is still President ..
That Guy Pasha , i have no idea about him ..
Kiyani sahab is still relaxing in some 2-3 acre farm house ..
some Journalist investigate and write an article ..
and here we are , digging the old graves ..

Hi,

Now that it has started---these graves will be dug much much deeper and wider. The U S fckued up so bad at that time---.

The thing is---Obama claiming to be so clever and sharp---by blaming Pakistan--what was he thinking of doing to Pakistan----.

The blame part does not make any sense----it only seems that it was done to please the crowds---. A thoughtless move---the consequences of which were not comprehended---or it was due to a Pakistan HATER in the cabinet who was in a position to push his agenda.

U S gained nothing out of it---Obama has egg on his face---U S administration is looking like an idiot.

The ony advantage that the U S had was at that time---was that Pakistan had a coward of a commander in chief----. Any brave general wth some tact would have gone on the media and fought the campaign in front of the tv screen to tell the americans how fcuked up their generals were in afghanistan---.

The fcuk ups of the American generals should have been displayed one after the other on the screen with a narrative---. How the were so bad that the U S was paying money to the TAIBAN for safe passage of goods-----.

Wouldn't paying the enemy at time of war be tantamount to treason for the U S military!

 

[MastanKhan]

Sir,

It is the American national disease to blame everyone---. You had your chance to take him out multiple times---. The cowards that were wearing your uniform could not pull the trigger---.

I stand behind my rascist rant----. Get your head out of your lilly white arse---you let him escape sudan---you let him escape Somalia---you let him escape 4 times in Afghanistan----you openly stated on the world television that you care less if Osama is alive or dead----you clearly stated we are not seeking him----he is immaterial to us---.

This nigger's teamcreated a drama for him to win the elections---and I voted for that arsehole.

If the U S is so righteous then why is it crawling back to Pakistan for help in Afghanistan---in yemen---against iran---.

Hi,

It is easy to blame the weak----did the CNN FOXNEWS MSNBC ---did any one of these media outlets ever make a statement and blamed the U S military of its failures in Afghanistan----.

Do you lilly white americans really believe in the bravery of your soldiers in Afghanistan---these cwards had the backing of gunship heicopters---C130 gunships---A 10 warthogs---F16's---F18's---missile strikes---heavy gun support---drone strikes----.50 caliber siper rifles---and what are they fighting against----.

Fighting against those equipped with AK47's and RPG's---with no body armor---no protection---no medevac----. What a fcuking drama the U S military created in Afghanistan----GOT AN ACADEMY AWARD while coming out the worst in this drama.

Medals of honor are being distributed like candies for fighting the most ill equipped fighters in the world---and the American soldiers are proud too own them---what a third rate military----. How the standards of a great warring nation has gone down---.

They used to dive deep in strong oceans and come out with pearls to show their bravery----now they dive in a shit pool and come out with shiny quartz and claim their valor---.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

would be interesting to know who in the US govt. betrayed Seal Team 6

"dead men tell no tales"

I did. I think he'd still like to be in Washington DC rather than a Pakistani prison.

you'd have to be an idiot to have $25 mil and opt to move to DC when you could live in San Diego or Miami

First, there is no evidence that any of this is true. All we have right now is Hersh's anonymous source (who miraculously, seems to have all the answers). Second, according to the article, Pakistan was in possession of and saving Bin Ladin for a rainy day. That rainy day came when an unknown ISI officer walked into the CIA and told them where you were hiding Bin Ladin. You could've killed him or turned him in back in 2006. Assuming all this is true, you could've asked for it to be a joint operation. However, your generals were worried about the backlash and choose to ask that it looked like a U.S. operation. Why? Could it be because there was a lot of support for religious extremism in Pakistan?

Here's something to think about. If the truth had come out that you were hiding Bin Ladin, do you know what the people here would have wanted the U.S. President to do to Pakistan? You live here, I'm sure you understand the sentiments. So before you went off on this racist rant, maybe you should've thought what would have happened to your country if it was announced that you'd been holding on to Bin Ladin while we were paying you to help find him. All in all, even if every bit of Hersh's story was true and everything the president said was false, you still walked away in the best possible shape you could have. So thank you lucky stars and move on along.

thank YOUR lucky start that Pakistan is facilitating your dignified exit from Afghanistan, that's all i can say

and please dont ignore history either - OBL was your blue-eyed angel once upon a time

the issue is what mindset is ruling the white house and what is the mindset of the advisers are there. despite there we have no issue with the Americans in general.

Americans are incredibly innocent and naiive people by and large. Smart, but incredibly naiive - easily moved by what mainstream media throws at them. Then again we arent always too different either.

 

[rockstar08]

Hi,

Now that it has started---these graves will be dug much much deeper and wider. The U S fckued up so bad at that time---.

The thing is---Obama claiming to be so clever and sharp---by blaming Pakistan--what was he thinking of doing to Pakistan----.

The blame part does not make any sense----it only seems that it was done to please the crowds---. A thoughtless move---the consequences of which were not comprehended---or it was due to a Pakistan HATER in the cabinet who was in a position to push his agenda.

U S gained nothing out of it---Obama has egg on his face---U S administration is looking like an idiot.

The ony advantage that the U S had was at that time---was that Pakistan had a coward of a commander in chief----. Any brave general wth some tact would have gone on the media and fought the campaign in front of the tv screen to tell the americans how fcuked up their generals were in afghanistan---.

The fcuk ups of the American generals should have been displayed one after the other on the screen with a narrative---. How the were so bad that the U S was paying money to the TAIBAN for safe passage of goods-----.

Wouldn't paying the enemy at time of war be tantamount to treason for the U S military!

Bhai , no matter how much we dig the old graves , we wont find nothing but some dust coated bones ..
the world has learned the word " Conspiracy theory " and anything that create confusion is a Conspiracy theory ,
no one will believe us , nor will stand with us ...

US has lie in Past , but still no one dare to stand against them .. and above all, our own people are ready to be sold for "Sharab , Shahbab and Paisa " so there is no point in blaming others ..