T-80 and T-85 MBTs of Pakistan along with Al Khalid and Al Zarrar

[Armstrong]

Hey @Keshav Murali & @alimobin memon what would say to the proposition that the Pakistan Army explores the option of converting our huge stock of T-54/55s (Type 59s) into Armored Personnel Carriers or even Combat Recovery Vehicles like the Israelis did first with their Centurions & now Merkava chassis based Namer ?

Surely a few dozen of these would serve Pakistan quite handsomely in the Tribal Areas where we've suffered quite a few casualties due to IEDs & even RPG attacks on customized Toyotas that usually carry our boys.

Or as Alimobin pointed out even as Infantry Fighting Vehicles ? Can it be done ? Would it be worth it ?

Hmmn @DESERT FIGHTER @jhungary @F.O.X @Last Hope @Hyperion @Dillinger - Can you guys pitch in as well ?

 

[alimobin memon]

Hey @Keshav Murali & @alimobin memon to the proposition that the Pakistan Army explores the option of converting our huge stock of T-54/55s (Type 59s) into Armored Personnel Carriers or even Combat Recovery Vehicles like the Israelis did with the Centurions to all the now Merkava chassis based Namer ?

Surely a few dozen of these would serve Pakistan quite handsomely in the Tribal Areas where we've suffered quite a few casualties due to IEDs & even RPG attacks on customized Toyotas that usually carry our boys.

Exactly Thats what they are going to do afterall they willl always be better than 20mm armour of normal carriers. Will provide an excellent Protection. However I also prefer Making some of these tanks as IFV adding the 20-30mm auto cannon and some ATGMS. Plus Self propelled Howitzers.

 

[Super Falcon]

please post any pics of T 85 which is superior T 85 or T 80 UD or Al khalid

 

[F.O.X]

Hey @Keshav Murali & @alimobin memon what would say to the proposition that the Pakistan Army explores the option of converting our huge stock of T-54/55s (Type 59s) into Armored Personnel Carriers or even Combat Recovery Vehicles like the Israelis did first with their Centurions & now Merkava chassis based Namer ?

Surely a few dozen of these would serve Pakistan quite handsomely in the Tribal Areas where we've suffered quite a few casualties due to IEDs & even RPG attacks on customized Toyotas that usually carry our boys.

Or as Alimobin pointed out even as Infantry Fighting Vehicles ? Can it be done ? Would it be worth it ?

Hmmn @DESERT FIGHTER @jhungary @F.O.X @Last Hope @Hyperion @Dillinger - Can you guys pitch in as well ?

Any Track base vehicle is pretty much of no use in the Tribal areas , that is why you also dont see the current APC's there .

that's all i know , however Armour is not my area of expertise , so may be someone else can explain better.

 

[alimobin memon]

please post any pics of T 85 which is superior T 85 or T 80 UD or Al khalid

1st al khalid, 2nd T80 UD then Type 85 Note that T is russian tank series Chinese is not T its type !

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Hey @Keshav Murali & @alimobin memon what would say to the proposition that the Pakistan Army explores the option of converting our huge stock of T-54/55s (Type 59s) into Armored Personnel Carriers or even Combat Recovery Vehicles like the Israelis did first with their Centurions & now Merkava chassis based Namer ?

Surely a few dozen of these would serve Pakistan quite handsomely in the Tribal Areas where we've suffered quite a few casualties due to IEDs & even RPG attacks on customized Toyotas that usually carry our boys.

Or as Alimobin pointed out even as Infantry Fighting Vehicles ? Can it be done ? Would it be worth it ?

Hmmn @DESERT FIGHTER @jhungary @F.O.X @Last Hope @Hyperion @Dillinger - Can you guys pitch in as well ?

IFVs in fata ? not really a good idea... but yes they can be converted... into self propelled howitzers(which is a good idea).... but except for mine clearing vehicles.. we have yet to see any other major conversion..

 

[Last Hope]

Hey @Keshav Murali & @alimobin memon what would say to the proposition that the Pakistan Army explores the option of converting our huge stock of T-54/55s (Type 59s) into Armored Personnel Carriers or even Combat Recovery Vehicles like the Israelis did first with their Centurions & now Merkava chassis based Namer ?

Surely a few dozen of these would serve Pakistan quite handsomely in the Tribal Areas where we've suffered quite a few casualties due to IEDs & even RPG attacks on customized Toyotas that usually carry our boys.

Or as Alimobin pointed out even as Infantry Fighting Vehicles ? Can it be done ? Would it be worth it ?

Hmmn @DESERT FIGHTER @jhungary @F.O.X @Last Hope @Hyperion @Dillinger - Can you guys pitch in as well ?

It can be done, but is it feasible is the question. Do we need it? We have plenty of APCs in service and on-order. Armour recovery would be a better option.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

It can be done, but is it feasible is the question. Do we need it? We have plenty of APCs in service and on-order. Armour recovery would be a better option.

Not just ARVs but SP mortars aswell...

 

[Undertaker]

of them only t-80ud and al khalid are 3rd generation.

though i dont undertstand why they upgraded t-55 to al khalid standard with all the modern equipments,era and new engines but ignored the type 85III..when in true sense the type 85III upgraded with catherine thermal imagers,Aorak mk2 era and a better gun.

would had been alot better than upgrading the t-55

i heard that T-85IIMP had many Problems with the engine and chain drive. its true ?

 

[Armstrong]

IFVs in fata ? not really a good idea... but yes they can be converted... into self propelled howitzers(which is a good idea).... but except for mine clearing vehicles.. we have yet to see any other major conversion..

It can be done, but is it feasible is the question. Do we need it? We have plenty of APCs in service and on-order. Armour recovery would be a better option.

More than anything I was referring to Israel & how they managed to utilize those platforms to fairly good use. Perhaps we can look towards making them IFVs in somewhat a watered down version of the Bradleys or perhaps we arm them with ATGMs or even look into the possibility of using them as Anti-Air Platforms like the Indians did with their T-72s fitted with those SAMs or perhaps even have a trio of Type 59s in an Orelikon Anti-Air Guns, a Radar wielding one & a Type 59 that serves as a command post !

Numerous possibilities are out there ! Shouldn't we explore them & utilize our huge reserve of these platforms instead of scrapping them when the times come ? Even as APCs they'd provide exponentially more protection than the M113s even with the bolt up armor that we use.

 

[Last Hope]

Everything you said is possible, but it depends if it is practically feasible and required?

 

[alimobin memon]

i heard that T-85IIMP had many Problems with the engine and chain drive. its true ?

It was later resolved and Pak army have now III standard They have Thermal imagery but of range no more than 1 km effective and max Engagement range ~2400m for any round.

And Yes Self propelled artillery is much better option for old tanks.

 

[alimobin memon]

One More thing. Al Zarrar was updated Rather than 85 was so that type 59 is too obsolete and Couldnt stand against any tank today. It deserved more. The Type 85 III has almost same Firepower as Al zarrar standard. Having Al khalid level Upgrade Doesn't mean it is Al Khalid In Firepower and Survival techniques. Type 85 is more on par with T 72 later variants. Type 85 has thermal imagery.

 

[surya kiran]

More than anything I was referring to Israel & how they managed to utilize those platforms to fairly good use. Perhaps we can look towards making them IFVs in somewhat a watered down version of the Bradleys or perhaps we arm them with ATGMs or even look into the possibility of using them as Anti-Air Platforms like the Indians did with their T-72s fitted with those SAMs or perhaps even have a trio of Type 59s in an Orelikon Anti-Air Guns, a Radar wielding one & a Type 59 that serves as a command post !

Numerous possibilities are out there ! Shouldn't we explore them & utilize our huge reserve of these platforms instead of scrapping them when the times come ? Even as APCs they'd provide exponentially more protection than the M113s even with the bolt up armor that we use.

Also, remember if you have tracked vehicles you need to transport them. Typically, I assume, you would need rail heads. From there you move them in trucks or they move on their own. In this scenario, tyred vehicles have an advantage, because of their easier integration with the existing logistical network.

 

[Donatello]

I think the thread title is misleady.......we Have the Ukrainian T-80s and Chinese Type 85. NOT T-85