Shaheen Scramble

[Windjammer]

Airforces around the globe carryout inter squadron manoeuvres and participate in multinational oversea exercises to hone their skills and polish their tactics. Amongst other practices the main focus is also given to scramble time of air assets. The goal involves, in any emergency to have sufficient number of aircraft in air in minimum time to meet any challenge.
Ironically, USAF and RAF were both dismayed at the tactics adopted by the Indian Airforce while scrambling it's SU-30s during Red Flag and Indra Danush series of exercises. The IAF has adopted the policy of launching as far as SU-30s are concerned, individually with a gap of 60 Seconds while other participants would often carry out formation take-offs and landings.
I was inclined to check how the PAF carries out it's scrambles and discovered the same procedure as NATO or Western air arms. It not only carries out formation scrambles and landings but also practices with four ship abreast formation take-off.

 

[StormBreaker]

Airforces around the globe carryout inter squadron manoeuvres and participate in multinational oversea exercises to hone their skills and polish their tactics. Amongst other practices the main focus is also given to scramble time of air assets. The goal involves, in any emergency to have sufficient number of aircraft in air in minimum time to meet any challenge.
Ironically, USAF and RAF were both dismayed at the tactics adopted by the Indian Airforce while scrambling it's SU-30s during Red Flag and Indra Danush series of exercises. The IAF has adopted the policy of launching as far as SU-30s are concerned, individually with a gap of 60 Seconds while other participants would often carry out formation take-offs and landings.
I was inclined to check how the PAF carries out it's scrambles and discovered the same procedure as NATO or Western air arms. It not only carries out formation scrambles and landings but also practices with four ship abreast formation take-off.

View attachment 655874

Any video of four breast formation ?

 

[Armchair]

If they can do 4 abreast for F-16, same runway may be able to do 5 abreast for F-7PGs...

 

[I S I]

Nobody in his right mind in PAF would do this. Possible yes? Risk, too much.

 

[Windjammer]

Nobody in his right mind in PAF would do this. Possible yes? Risk, too much.

Formation landing is even more challenging but they still do it including PAF.

 

[Ivan]

Airforces around the globe carryout inter squadron manoeuvres and participate in multinational oversea exercises to hone their skills and polish their tactics. Amongst other practices the main focus is also given to scramble time of air assets. The goal involves, in any emergency to have sufficient number of aircraft in air in minimum time to meet any challenge.
Ironically, USAF and RAF were both dismayed at the tactics adopted by the Indian Airforce while scrambling it's SU-30s during Red Flag and Indra Danush series of exercises. The IAF has adopted the policy of launching as far as SU-30s are concerned, individually with a gap of 60 Seconds while other participants would often carry out formation take-offs and landings.
I was inclined to check how the PAF carries out it's scrambles and discovered the same procedure as NATO or Western air arms. It not only carries out formation scrambles and landings but also practices with four ship abreast formation take-off.

View attachment 655874

Bhai I just recalled you had told me about this. One of the Indian SU-30 had to embarrassingly break the formation.

 

[Windjammer]

JF-17 Tunders in Tandem Landing.

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[Raider 21]

Airforces around the globe carryout inter squadron manoeuvres and participate in multinational oversea exercises to hone their skills and polish their tactics. Amongst other practices the main focus is also given to scramble time of air assets. The goal involves, in any emergency to have sufficient number of aircraft in air in minimum time to meet any challenge.
Ironically, USAF and RAF were both dismayed at the tactics adopted by the Indian Airforce while scrambling it's SU-30s during Red Flag and Indra Danush series of exercises. The IAF has adopted the policy of launching as far as SU-30s are concerned, individually with a gap of 60 Seconds while other participants would often carry out formation take-offs and landings.
I was inclined to check how the PAF carries out it's scrambles and discovered the same procedure as NATO or Western air arms. It not only carries out formation scrambles and landings but also practices with four ship abreast formation take-off.

View attachment 655874

Their ADA scramble procedures are often involving 1 aircraft taking off in full burner. I have never seen nor heard of 2 aircraft taking off in full burner during ADA or QRA. 4 ship abreast formation take-off is impossible with F-16s when fully loaded, 2 at max.

 

[litman]

never seen any video of 4 PAF f-16s taking off togethor. generally they all line up and then take off one after the other. the first one starts to pull up and the next one starts rolling down the runway.

 

[Lincoln]

4 F-16s with what type of weapons config?

 

[Imran Khan]

If they can do 4 abreast for F-16, same runway may be able to do 5 abreast for F-7PGs...

and what they will do in sky ? even all of then takeoff together

 

[Windjammer]

never seen any video of 4 PAF f-16s taking off togethor. generally they all line up and then take off one after the other. the first one starts to pull up and the next one starts rolling down the runway.

You often disagree my friend.....just because you have no seen it that doesn't means it never happens.
I understand the second light on nose wheel comes on at the point of break release.

 

[litman]

yes you are right. if i havent seen such a formation take off of PAF F-16s it doesnt mean they dont do such kind of things but you know seeing is believing. have seen a video of two PAF F-16s rolling down the runway though but not 4 yet. it would be great to watch. there are videos of 3-4 T37s and K 8s of sherdil formation taking off.
as far as indian su 30 are concerned some indian member uploaded a video of su 30s taking off for some night training mission and all 4 of them were not even lined up on the main runway strip. when one took off the other one then taxied to the main runway and then kicked off. as compare to NATO or PAF they took lot of time.

 

[Thorough Pro]

That IAF practice for SU30MKI is/was engine-related as the engines on the planes are very sensitive to ingesting exhaust/smoke of the lead plane. I don't think they use the same 60-second gap for the launch of other aircraft like Mirage

Airforces around the globe carryout inter squadron manoeuvres and participate in multinational oversea exercises to hone their skills and polish their tactics. Amongst other practices the main focus is also given to scramble time of air assets. The goal involves, in any emergency to have sufficient number of aircraft in air in minimum time to meet any challenge.
Ironically, USAF and RAF were both dismayed at the tactics adopted by the Indian Airforce while scrambling it's SU-30s during Red Flag and Indra Danush series of exercises. The IAF has adopted the policy of launching as far as SU-30s are concerned, individually with a gap of 60 Seconds while other participants would often carry out formation take-offs and landings.
I was inclined to check how the PAF carries out it's scrambles and discovered the same procedure as NATO or Western air arms. It not only carries out formation scrambles and landings but also practices with four ship abreast formation take-off.

View attachment 655874

 

[litman]

the pic is from the operation swift retort vid

at 34:07
two F-16 Bs can be seen taking off togethor at the very end at 37 :19

not an aviation expert so thats why i have a question regarding such a formation take off of 4 F-16s. what will be the advantage of doing such a take off other then reducing the time for launching 4 jets by only 10- 12 seconds but on the other hand the risks are more. there are more chances of FOD as F-16 inlets are more closer to the ground as compare to other jets in our inventory. the risks of jets smashing into each other are also high. there is a video of PAF F-7 crashing immediatley after take off. in a formation take off there are more chances of losing multiple jets if one develops some mechanical fault or gets a bird hit. so risking a plane for 10- 12 seconds advantage doesnt seem to be a good deal. so i think its better to stick to traditional ways.

you can see that the second air craft had sufficient time to turn away when the lead air craft lost power.