Rumors killer -- Spreading lies is bad, mmkay?

[Rechoice]

 

[Andrei]

Thank you for using this reference I gave you earlier to prove that the so-called "rat-tail" didn't exist.

you are disgusting , always lying.

Another famous rumor which is often publicized Han chauvinist, Japanese right wings, Tibetan government in exile and other anti-China forces --

"Yuan dynasty and Qing dynasty are not China";
"China was Mongolia's colony";
"Manchurian rulers claimed that they are not Chinese..."

These people really know nothing about the history of those 2 periods of China
:

"The Proclamation of the Founding of Yuan Dynasty" (建國號詔):

誕膺景命，奄四海以宅尊﹔必有美名，紹百王而紀統。肇從隆古，匪獨我家。且唐之為言蕩也， 堯以之而著稱﹔虞之為言樂也，舜因之而作號。馴至禹興而湯造，互名夏大以殷中，世降以還，事殊非古。雖乘時而有國，不以利而制稱。為秦為漢者，著從初起之 地名﹔曰隋曰唐者，因即所封之爵邑。且皆徇百姓見聞之偶習，要一時經制之權宜，概以至公，不無少貶。我太祖聖武皇帝，握乾符而起朔土，以神武而膺帝圖，四 震天聲，大恢土宇，輿圖之廣，歷古所無。頃者耆宿詣庭，奏草申請，謂既成於大業，宜早定於鴻名。在古制以當然，於朕心乎何有！可建國號曰大元，蓋取《易 經》乾元之義，茲大冶流形於庶品，孰名資始之功。予一人底寧於萬邦，尤切體仁之要，事從因革，道協天人。於戲！稱義而名，固非為之溢美﹔孚休惟永，尚不負 於投艱。嘉與敷天，共隆大號！

The Emperor of Yuan clearly claimed the succession of former Chinese dynasties from the Three Sovereigns and Five Emperors to Tang dynasty.
Have you ever seen a suzerain amazingly claim the inheritance rights of its' colony?
Have you ever heard that the UK claimed that the UK is a successor of India?

Not to mention, during Yuan dynasty, Mongolian themselves also called their country "China":

鐵木兒塔識曰：「刺探在敵國固有之，今六合一家，何以刺探為？設果有之，正可令睹中國之盛，歸告其主，使知向化。」
--元史

鐵木兒塔識 (son of Toqto'a): "Such action of spying on your enemy state is no double expected, but since the world is now a united family, why would they even do such thing? Even if they are really spying on us, let them be. For they will see how great China 中國 (Zhongguo) is and report it to their king and make him obey (us)." --History of Yuan


As for Qing dynasty:

［Nerchinsk Treaty］
「...將流入黑龍江之額爾古納河為界。河之南岸、屬於中國(Zhongguo)。河之北岸、屬於鄂羅斯。」
"Argun river will be set as the border (between the two countries). The land from the south of the river belongs to China; the land from the north of the river belongs to Russia."

I'm not even telling you where is Argun river located.

Not Chinese you say:

「在逆賊等之意，徒謂本朝以滿洲之君，入為中國之主，妄生此疆彼界之私，遂故為訕謗詆譏之說耳... (逆賊)不知本朝之為滿洲，猶中國(Zhongguo)之有籍貫。」
"...(traitors) are so foolish that they don't even understand that Manchu is a part of China."
--Yongzheng, emperor of Qing Dynasty.

you lie again. no source again , i have given you lots sources, but you ignored all the time. so disgusting

Emperor of Qing: "Air rifle is one of the most important kind of weapons in the army."

［火绳一项, 甘肃省用纸张制造, 殊属非是。鸟枪最为军营利器, 而临时施放, 尤籍火绳点放, 朕常火枪中鹿, 从不知用纸为绳, 即向来京师健锐火器各营无用纸火绳效枪者, 盖缘纸张质地脆薄, 易于破损, 若用以为绳, 药多则过火迅速, 药少则又难点引, 且不耐雨水潮湿, 是以总用麻绳燃造,从无以纸为火绳之法⋯⋯嗣后各省营伍所用火绳, 俱著照定制以麻绳要制, 毋许偷换纸张, 以利军队而昭实用。］－－《清朝续文献通考》

火繩槍是清朝之前發明的，不是清朝的，沒有人說清朝沒有使用這些明朝的東西。但是清朝在很多戰爭 中使用冷兵器是不爭的事實，還有你個二逼，在外國人面前互掐很好玩？傻逼。

 

[Andrei]

Another famous rumor which is often publicized Han chauvinist, Japanese right wings, Tibetan government in exile and other anti-China forces --

"Yuan dynasty and Qing dynasty are not China";
"China was Mongolia's colony";
"Manchurian rulers claimed that they are not Chinese..."

These people really know nothing about the history of those 2 periods of China
:

"The Proclamation of the Founding of Yuan Dynasty" (建國號詔):

誕膺景命，奄四海以宅尊﹔必有美名，紹百王而紀統。肇從隆古，匪獨我家。且唐之為言蕩也， 堯以之而著稱﹔虞之為言樂也，舜因之而作號。馴至禹興而湯造，互名夏大以殷中，世降以還，事殊非古。雖乘時而有國，不以利而制稱。為秦為漢者，著從初起之 地名﹔曰隋曰唐者，因即所封之爵邑。且皆徇百姓見聞之偶習，要一時經制之權宜，概以至公，不無少貶。我太祖聖武皇帝，握乾符而起朔土，以神武而膺帝圖，四 震天聲，大恢土宇，輿圖之廣，歷古所無。頃者耆宿詣庭，奏草申請，謂既成於大業，宜早定於鴻名。在古制以當然，於朕心乎何有！可建國號曰大元，蓋取《易 經》乾元之義，茲大冶流形於庶品，孰名資始之功。予一人底寧於萬邦，尤切體仁之要，事從因革，道協天人。於戲！稱義而名，固非為之溢美﹔孚休惟永，尚不負 於投艱。嘉與敷天，共隆大號！

The Emperor of Yuan clearly claimed the succession of former Chinese dynasties from the Three Sovereigns and Five Emperors to Tang dynasty.
Have you ever seen a suzerain amazingly claim the inheritance rights of its' colony?
Have you ever heard that the UK claimed that the UK is a successor of India?

Not to mention, during Yuan dynasty, Mongolian themselves also called their country "China":

鐵木兒塔識曰：「刺探在敵國固有之，今六合一家，何以刺探為？設果有之，正可令睹中國之盛，歸告其主，使知向化。」
--元史

鐵木兒塔識 (son of Toqto'a): "Such action of spying on your enemy state is no double expected, but since the world is now a united family, why would they even do such thing? Even if they are really spying on us, let them be. For they will see how great China 中國 (Zhongguo) is and report it to their king and make him obey (us)." --History of Yuan


As for Qing dynasty:

［Nerchinsk Treaty］
「...將流入黑龍江之額爾古納河為界。河之南岸、屬於中國(Zhongguo)。河之北岸、屬於鄂羅斯。」
"Argun river will be set as the border (between the two countries). The land from the south of the river belongs to China; the land from the north of the river belongs to Russia."

I'm not even telling you where is Argun river located.

Not Chinese you say:

「在逆賊等之意，徒謂本朝以滿洲之君，入為中國之主，妄生此疆彼界之私，遂故為訕謗詆譏之說耳... (逆賊)不知本朝之為滿洲，猶中國(Zhongguo)之有籍貫。」
"...(traitors) are so foolish that they don't even understand that Manchu is a part of China."
--Yongzheng, emperor of Qing Dynasty.

跟吃了屎一樣上躥下跳，誰否認滿清不是中國了？是中國亡國時期而已。

Another famous rumor which is often publicized Han chauvinist, Japanese right wings, Tibetan government in exile and other anti-China forces --

"Yuan dynasty and Qing dynasty are not China";
"China was Mongolia's colony";
"Manchurian rulers claimed that they are not Chinese..."

These people really know nothing about the history of those 2 periods of China
:

"The Proclamation of the Founding of Yuan Dynasty" (建國號詔):

誕膺景命，奄四海以宅尊﹔必有美名，紹百王而紀統。肇從隆古，匪獨我家。且唐之為言蕩也， 堯以之而著稱﹔虞之為言樂也，舜因之而作號。馴至禹興而湯造，互名夏大以殷中，世降以還，事殊非古。雖乘時而有國，不以利而制稱。為秦為漢者，著從初起之 地名﹔曰隋曰唐者，因即所封之爵邑。且皆徇百姓見聞之偶習，要一時經制之權宜，概以至公，不無少貶。我太祖聖武皇帝，握乾符而起朔土，以神武而膺帝圖，四 震天聲，大恢土宇，輿圖之廣，歷古所無。頃者耆宿詣庭，奏草申請，謂既成於大業，宜早定於鴻名。在古制以當然，於朕心乎何有！可建國號曰大元，蓋取《易 經》乾元之義，茲大冶流形於庶品，孰名資始之功。予一人底寧於萬邦，尤切體仁之要，事從因革，道協天人。於戲！稱義而名，固非為之溢美﹔孚休惟永，尚不負 於投艱。嘉與敷天，共隆大號！

The Emperor of Yuan clearly claimed the succession of former Chinese dynasties from the Three Sovereigns and Five Emperors to Tang dynasty.
Have you ever seen a suzerain amazingly claim the inheritance rights of its' colony?
Have you ever heard that the UK claimed that the UK is a successor of India?

Not to mention, during Yuan dynasty, Mongolian themselves also called their country "China":

鐵木兒塔識曰：「刺探在敵國固有之，今六合一家，何以刺探為？設果有之，正可令睹中國之盛，歸告其主，使知向化。」
--元史

鐵木兒塔識 (son of Toqto'a): "Such action of spying on your enemy state is no double expected, but since the world is now a united family, why would they even do such thing? Even if they are really spying on us, let them be. For they will see how great China 中國 (Zhongguo) is and report it to their king and make him obey (us)." --History of Yuan


As for Qing dynasty:

［Nerchinsk Treaty］
「...將流入黑龍江之額爾古納河為界。河之南岸、屬於中國(Zhongguo)。河之北岸、屬於鄂羅斯。」
"Argun river will be set as the border (between the two countries). The land from the south of the river belongs to China; the land from the north of the river belongs to Russia."

I'm not even telling you where is Argun river located.

Not Chinese you say:

「在逆賊等之意，徒謂本朝以滿洲之君，入為中國之主，妄生此疆彼界之私，遂故為訕謗詆譏之說耳... (逆賊)不知本朝之為滿洲，猶中國(Zhongguo)之有籍貫。」
"...(traitors) are so foolish that they don't even understand that Manchu is a part of China."
--Yongzheng, emperor of Qing Dynasty.

as manchu what they said . Qing is not China,but a Mongolian Dynasty - History Forum ~ All Empires

 

[Snomannen]

you are disgusting , always lying.


you lie again. no source again , i have given you lots sources, but you ignored all the time. so disgusting


火繩槍是清朝之前發明的，不是清朝的，沒有人說清朝沒有使用這些明朝的東西。但是清朝在很多戰爭 中使用冷兵器是不爭的事實，還有你個二逼，在外國人面前互掐很好玩？傻逼。

Yeah sure Macartney was a big liar. Only nonsense come from your mouth are true.

Seriously you very need a good doctor to check your head, your lack of logical sense and shamelessness very annoyed people here.
No souses? Tell me what the heck are these then:

"The Proclamation of the Founding of Yuan Dynasty" (建國號詔)
"History of Yuan (元史)"
"Nerchinsk Treaty" (尼布楚條約)
"Records of great righteousness resolving confusion" (大義覺迷錄)

"The Proclamation of the Founding of Yuan Dynasty" (建國號詔):

誕膺景命，奄四海以宅尊﹔必有美名，紹百王而紀統。肇從隆古，匪獨我家。且唐之為言蕩也， 堯以之而著稱﹔虞之為言樂也，舜因之而作號。馴至禹興而湯造，互名夏大以殷中，世降以還，事殊非古。雖乘時而有國，不以利而制稱。為秦為漢者，著從初起之 地名﹔曰隋曰唐者， 因即所封之爵邑。且皆徇百姓見聞之偶習，要一時經制之權宜，概以至公，不無少貶。我太祖聖武皇帝，握乾符而起朔土，以神武而膺帝圖，四 震天聲，大恢土宇，輿圖之廣，歷古所無。頃者耆宿詣庭，奏草申請，謂既成於大業，宜早定於鴻名。在古制以當然，於朕心乎何有！可建國號曰大元，蓋取《易 經》乾元之義，茲大冶流形於庶品，孰名資始之功。予一人底寧於萬邦，尤切體仁之要，事從因革，道協天人。於戲！稱義而名，固非為之溢美﹔孚休惟永，尚不負 於投艱。嘉與敷天，共隆大號！

The Emperor of Yuan clearly claimed the succession of former Chinese dynasties from the Three Sovereigns and Five Emperors to Tang dynasty.
Have you ever seen a suzerain amazingly claim the inheritance rights of its' colony?
Have you ever heard that the UK claimed that the UK is a successor of India?

Not to mention, during Yuan dynasty, Mongolian themselves also called their country "China":

鐵木兒塔識曰：「刺探在敵國固有之，今六合一家，何以刺探為？設果有之，正可令睹中國之盛，歸告其主，使知向化。」
--元史

鐵 木兒塔識 (son of Toqto'a): "Such action of spying on your enemy state is no double expected, but since the world is now a united family, why would they even do such thing? Even if they are really spying on us, let them be. For they will see how great China 中國 (Zhongguo) is and report it to their king and make him obey (us)." --History of Yuan


As for Qing dynasty:

［Nerchinsk Treaty］
「...將流入黑龍江之額爾古納河為界。河之南岸、屬於中國(Zhongguo)。河之北岸、屬於鄂羅斯。」
"Argun river will be set as the border (between the two countries). The land from the south of the river belongs to China; the land from the north of the river belongs to Russia."

I'm not even telling you where is Argun river located.

Not Chinese you say:

「在逆賊等之意，徒謂本朝以滿洲之君，入為中國之主，妄生此疆彼界之私，遂故為訕謗詆譏之說耳... (逆賊)不知本朝之為滿洲，猶中國(Zhongguo)之有籍貫。」
"...(traitors) are so foolish that they don't even understand that Manchu is a part of China."
--Yongzheng, emperor of Qing Dynasty.

Not only your head got problem, but your blind eyes too.
Oh, or maybe, based on your logic, everything aside from your own nonsenses are real, am I right. Of course I am, since you are acting exactly as what I describe.

You keep yelling at me because "I ignore you".
Why don't you ask it yourself and tell me that what the freak were these posts, for Allah's sake was I really writing to an illiteracy or something:

I already told you that "the long list you have posted has a lot of books yet none of the words on the list is really from any of the books. You know what that means? That means you didn't even open a single page of those books."

This is how you make references:

「在 歷史上身居權力頂點的人物，一旦走上了錯誤的道路是很難迷途知返的，他們往往在謬 誤的斜坡上越滑越遠，張獻忠的悲劇正在於此。他甚至發出了“除城盡剿”的命令，分遣軍隊到所屬州縣搜殺百姓。連西京成都也發兵“剿洗”。 《聖教入川記》中，載錄了外國傳教士目睹的情況：張獻忠下令除大西政權官員家屬以外，成都“城內居民一律殺絕。”第二天，“各軍人皆奉命認真嚴剿，毫不容 情。……各軍分隊把守城門，餘軍驅百姓到南門就刑。”“被拘百姓無數集於南門外沙壩橋邊。一見獻忠到來，眾皆跪伏地下，齊聲悲哭求赦雲：大王萬歲！大王是 我等之王，我等是你百姓，我等未犯國法，何故殺無辜百姓？何故畏懼百姓？我等無軍器，亦不是兵，亦不是敵，乃是守法良民。乞大王救命，赦我眾無辜小民，云 云”。張獻忠聽了，“不獨無哀憐之意，反而厲聲痛罵百姓私通敵人。隨即縱馬躍入人中，任馬亂跳亂蹄，並高聲狂吼：該殺該死之反叛！隨令軍士急速動刑。冤乎 痛哉，無罪百姓齊遭慘殺。……錦繡蓉城頓成曠野，無人居住，一片荒涼慘象，非筆舌所能形容。”“獻忠剿洗成都後，旋即傳令曉諭各鄉場鎮村莊之民，均可移居 成都城內為京都居民。”張獻忠的過火行為，最後弄得自己越來越孤立，乾脆一把火燒掉成都，打算丟掉四川，另謀出路。」－《明末農民戰爭史》
「獻忠之在蜀也，殺掠尤慘，城邑村野，至數百里無人跡。民逃入深山，不得食而死者委填岸谷；或採草木葉食之，得生者久乃化為野人，裸處林棲，體生白毛，遇人則搏殺之而吮其血。」－《永曆實錄》

「明 代末年，朝政腐敗，宦官專權，百姓生活舉步維艱。崇禎九年（1637年），臨武、藍山礦工在劉新宇、郭子奴領導下發動起義。崇禎十年礦工起義發 展到4萬餘人，順湘江而下，明軍結巨筏於耒水口（今衡陽市北）堵截，義軍以巨斧砍筏纜，筏散，官兵無力作戰。義軍遂由衡州水陸齊下，四月，湘鄉縣城被攻 陷，義軍據湘鄉縣城5日。攻湘潭，縣城有防，知縣黃文經集兵守衛，縣民推馬惟元為將，王應龍輔佐，在錦灣斬義軍數百，城未下，義軍遂散入鄉間，眾多農民響 應。在明軍邀擊下，礦工義軍退卻。五月，湘鄉天王寺（今婁底境）江長子、李大用、曉和尚起義，與臨武、藍山礦工起義相呼應，聚眾數千。崇禎十年冬十一月， 馬惟元病重，劉新宇會合湘鄉天王寺起義軍從寧鄉攻湘潭；馬惟元抱病出戰，死。王應龍單騎對壘，達十日之久；礦工以火藥炸城，城破。王應龍投奔何騰蛟。兩支 義軍會合後，攻長沙。同時又攻克瀏陽、醴陵，進入江西袁州境。江西、湖南調兵夾擊。湖南明軍在尹先明、羅安邦率領下進入湘鄉；義軍敗走龍山，龍山在今漣 源、雙峰、新邵、邵東四縣交界處。 《湘鄉縣志》載：“龍山為湘邑山水之宗。湘之山，以龍山為最大，而漣水即發源於其下。”明軍誣指“紳民”附和義軍，濫殺天王寺附近無辜百姓，暴屍於野；僧 人普濟收屍數百，葬於茶亭子，遂稱“千人塚”。崇禎三年，陝西發生農民起義。 《明史•張獻忠傳》載：“獻忠以米脂三十六寨應之，自稱'八大王'。”崇禎十六年八月，張獻忠起義軍進入湖南，江長子、李大用率部分義軍加入張獻忠的大西 軍，從湘鄉龍山攻邵陽、寧鄉，並掠瀏陽，張獻忠軍遂逼近岳州。 《明史•張獻忠傳》載：“沅撫（即湖南巡撫）李乾德，總兵孔希貴等城陵磯拒戰，三戰三克，殲其前部。獻忠怒，百道並進，乾德等不支，皆走，岳州陷。獻忠欲 渡洞庭湖，卜於神，不吉，投珓（占卜用的卦）而詬。將渡，風大作，獻忠怒，連巨舟千艘，載婦女焚之，火光夜如晝。騎而逼近長沙。”獻忠軍在長沙北郊殲明孔 希貴軍。巡按劉熙祚護衛吉王、惠王走衡州，圍城後，推官蔡道憲據城而守，以強弩置於城頭射擊。三天后，總兵尹先民降，長沙入獻忠軍手中。蔡道憲“盛服就 執”與凌姓衙役一同被義軍處死。而有一名叫馮一第的舉人卻往湘鄉招兵抗擊義軍，結果被張獻忠部下殺死。長沙城破，九月，張獻忠揮軍向衡州，據汪煇所作《湘 上痴脫難雜錄》載：獻忠軍過湘潭，見湘潭城已“為明（軍）殘破，遂未紮營，而四鄉業已受苦不堪，以馮典史為湘潭偽令”。這位馮典史任張獻忠的縣令後，留守 湘潭，縣境秩序井然。張獻忠入潭後繼續進軍，破衡州。 《明史•張獻忠傳》載：“吉王、惠王、桂王俱走永州。乃斥（拆）桂（王）府材，載至長沙，而自追三王於永。熙祚命中軍護一王入廣西，身入永（州）死守，城 陷見殺。”張獻忠連克東安、道州、郴州、桂陽後，攻武岡不下，又回兵直抵衡州。 《湘上痴脫難雜錄》說：張獻忠軍“自衡山至下攝司止，遍地搜山”，尋覓殘存官軍和地方豪強。而百姓“沿門設香花牌位，辦豬羊酒食、龍鳳旗傘迎接”義軍。張 獻忠軍對一切有功名的人、豪強之家，採取了極端措施，“不問老少、男婦俱斫去一手，間或斫去兩手”，“凡舉監生員以及鄉紳約保，有職役者皆剮”。光緒刊 《湘潭縣志•李常庚傳》則稱其“明季居南嶽，有道行。張獻忠至衡州，聞其名，求得之。常庚勸以勿殺。獻忠至殘忍，其在衡湘未嘗屠戮，常庚力也”。可見張獻 忠殘忍嗜殺，並不對一般百姓。張獻忠入潭後，“未嘗屠戮”應是事實，後來獻忠主力由湘潭經益陽往常德，不久又轉長沙，下岳州，而留部將簡甲屯兵湘潭。湘鄉 地方豪強勢力推李參將為首，同彭大廳率民兵與簡甲作戰，簡甲兵敗退走。 “李兵在湘，借捉賊之家為名，捉一人牽連十餘人，抄一家騙害十餘家，民不聊生。”凡支持義軍的百姓又遭一次大殺戮。崇禎十六年（1643年），張獻忠率兵 從湘鄉進攻寶慶，土弁王祥、彭東四自立為都督，殺擁張之縣民無數。崇禎十七年正月，有兵從淥口而來，李參將帶兵阻擊，被其殺敗，退入城中。既而船兵大至， 登岸殺人放火，李參將逃走，接著又有左良玉副將、馬士秀率大隊人馬“從醴陵、瀏陽抵長沙，並間河東州縣，俱逼焚殺不堪，小馬（馬士秀）兵在湘殺掠半月有 餘，方下武昌”。湘潭百姓又遭明軍左良玉部士兵一次屠戮。二月，湘潭城居民從山林中躲兵歸來，“米價高昂，南北不通，百里之內，音信杳然”，縣內十分荒 涼、蕭條，以至“市無貿，田無農，衙無胥吏”。清順治元年（1644年）春，張獻忠率部撤出湘潭，馮典史任兩年縣令後也隨軍而撤走，義軍出湖南由荊州入四 川。張獻忠在四川稱大西王。在張獻忠的大西軍猛烈掃蕩後，明諸王、官兵和地方武裝，趁張獻忠大西軍撤出，又瘋狂報復，肆意掠奪，濫殺無辜，正如《明季北 略》所說：“人之居者、行者，俱不得安保其身命。”人民無法生活，只得逃往偏僻的深山之中。」－《湘潭歷史考述 》

Oh and speaking of 魯迅, guess who said this: 「至於周的武王，則以征伐之名入中國，加以和殷似乎連民族也不同，用現代的話來說，那可是侵略者。」

The primary source (written in classical Chinese) has recorded that people were killed because of denying changing their hairstyle, yet NONE of them were killed for the reason of "wearing Ming dynasty clothing".

Thank you again for proving yourself wrong.

Moreover this is also a primary source that recorded Han people were still wearing Ming's style clothing under Qing's rule, especially that Qing Han general who had committed a lot of massacres to Han people themselves and was very active to shave every single Han people's hair:

［金珠衣飾，書籍器皿，遍列通衢，其價甚賤。有錢買歸者，後獲大利。新太守張（按：張銚，偃 師人）住進士陳子龍宅。華亭縣陳鑑、海防楊之易，即忠臣楊漣長子，時雖剃髮，猶漢人衣冠，烏紗大帶，不改舊服也。餘以丁艱，不與科試，兼欲告閒，而同袍之 告退者不一人。學師欲索重價，餘以力綿中止。九月十三日，督鎮李成棟點驗各兵，餘與曹馳尹儒冠往觀之。李尚烏紗玉帶，用八座大轎，抬於門首，馬步卒皆疾趨 而過，軍威嚴肅，莫可名狀。］

－－《乙酉筆記》

Come on, keep lying in front of facts.


Who said that matchlock was invented during Qing dynasty you silly-head~ Your friend clearly said that Qing army ONLY used cold steel to fight with westerners, which is obviously a big LIE I have already disclosed.
Also, why don't you tell me that what's wrong with using cold steel at wars during those days.

What did I just tell you:

You just posted these pictures showing the invaders of China were using both firearms & using cold steels (such combination was extremely normal back in those days) yet you complain about Qing army has been using cold steels (with firearms ) to fight with the invaders.

Do you even know what you are doing or thinking.
Seriously you should go get your head check by a good doctor, at once.

Base on your logic, using firearms = not using cold steels, or using cold steels = not using firearms, am I right. Of course I am, once again you have proved that you have such a simple mind which can only distinguish "white & black" like a 3 years old.

And I even wonder if you can even understand the word "only (long knife)".

Why don't you open your tiny lil' eyes and see what kind of weapons those Japanese were using, hrrrr? Really enjoy being slapped by yourself don't you? How is that being slapped by your own source, TWICE? I wonder who is the real disguising "傻逼" here.

Oh and you are the one who has been messing around here all the time; I'm just a guy who has been reasoning with a sick dude with facts and truths from the very beginning.

 

[Snomannen]

跟吃了屎一樣上躥下跳，誰否認滿清不是中國了？是中國亡國時期而已。


as manchu what they said . Qing is not China,but a Mongolian Dynasty - History Forum ~ All Empires

Yeah sure because cursing around without any good reason is really a good idea to tell everyone in the whole world that you are freaking awesome~

Also as I have said, your logical sense... gee, I wonder if you even have any. How could China was in its period of subjugation --yet Qing dynasty itself IS China. Not to mention its was Qing dynasty which "upgraded" the word "China" from the meaning of a geographical concept (middle land)" to the "meaning of modern sovereign state (including Tibet, Xinjiang, North-East of China, etc.)":

"進入清代以後，雖然清朝直轄的18個省依然以「中國」稱之，而「天下」也保持著泛化的指稱政令實施範圍的含義。但「中國」卻有了指稱清朝疆域的用法， 「天下」與「中國」出現了重合的傾向。一個明顯的例證即是中俄《尼布楚條約》的簽訂。康熙二十八年，為了解決沙俄向東擴張而引發的邊界爭端，清朝和沙俄簽 訂了具有現代國際法水準的邊界條約----- 《尼布楚條約》。清朝依據《尼布楚條約》所立界碑全文為：「大清國遣大臣與鄂羅斯國議定邊界之碑：一，將由北流入黑龍江之綽爾納，即烏倫穆河，相近格爾必 齊河為界。循此河上流不毛之地，有石大興安以至於海。凡山南一帶，流入黑龍江之溪河，盡屬中國。山北一帶之溪河，盡屬鄂羅斯。一，將流入黑龍江之額爾古納 河為界，河之南岸屬於中國，河之北岸屬於鄂羅斯.......中國所有鄂羅斯之人，鄂羅斯所有中國之人，仍留不必遣還... ....」 很顯然，在條約中「清朝」和「中國」是可以互稱的，「中國」已經具有了一個近現代主權國家的含義。該條約的滿文、俄文、拉丁文本也都是如此。也就是說，最 遲到康熙時期，「中國」已經成為一個多民族統一國家的稱呼，中華各民族也由此開始以一個主權國家----- 中國的身份活動於世界舞台。"－－《「中國」與「天下」的重合》

Another relevant article:

"清朝不是中國嗎﹖
范普拉赫和達賴喇嘛等無法否認清朝對西藏的主權﹐於是又重彈“清朝不是中國”的老調。《以事實證明西藏的真相》說﹕“滿清和西藏的交往與蒙古和西藏的交往一樣﹐其中與中國並無半點關係。”那麼清朝的繼承國又是誰﹖他們能從世界地圖上指出來嗎﹖

事 實上﹐清朝皇帝也自稱中國人。雍正皇帝親書《大義覺迷錄》說﹕“本朝之為滿洲﹐猶中國之有籍貫。舜為東夷之人﹐文王為西夷之人﹐曾何損於聖德乎﹗……自古 中國一統之世﹐幅員不能廣遠﹐其中有不向化者﹐則斥之為夷狄。如三代以上之有苗﹑荊楚﹑獫狁﹐即今湖南﹑湖北﹑山西之地也。在今日而目為夷狄可乎﹖至於漢 ﹑唐﹑宋全盛之時﹐北狄西戎世為邊患﹐從未能臣服而有其地﹐是以有此疆彼界之分。自我朝入主中土﹐君臨天下﹐並蒙古極邊諸部落俱歸版圖﹐是中國之疆土開拓 廣遠﹐乃中國臣民之大幸﹐何得尚有華夷中外之分論哉﹗（50）”

清朝雖然不以中國為國號﹐卻在許多條約裡自稱中國。如1689年《中俄尼布楚條約》﹑1842年《中英南京條約》﹑1844年《中美五口貿易章程》（即《中美望廈條約》）﹑1858年《中俄天津條約》﹑1858年《中英天津條約》﹑1858年《中法天津條約》﹑1860年《中英北京條約》﹑1860年《中法北京條約》﹑1860年《中俄北京條約》﹑1890年《中英會議藏印條約》等等等等﹐無一不是以“中”為國名。《中俄尼布楚條約》一開頭就稱康熙為“中國大聖皇帝”﹐條約中多次使用“中國”字樣﹐如“將流入黑龍江之額爾古納河為界﹐南岸屬中國﹐北岸屬俄”。其中未見“清國”或“滿洲帝國”字樣（51）。有時把“中國”和“大清”並用﹐作為同義詞。《中英南京條約》第八條稱﹕“凡係大英國人﹐無論本國﹑屬國軍民等﹐今在中國所管轄各地方被禁者﹐大清皇帝准即釋放。（52）”1906年《中英續訂藏印條約》說﹕“案查光緒十六年二月二十七日及十九年十月十八日﹐中國與英國所定兩次藏印條約﹐其所載各款﹐西藏並未認為確實﹐亦未允切實遵辦……玆大清國大皇帝﹑大英國全境大皇帝兼五印度大皇帝……（53）”今日地球上根本不存在一個滿清國或滿洲國﹐滿洲的土地和人民都在中國境內﹐而且滿族都說漢語﹐都認為自己是中國人。所謂清朝不是中國論﹐無異於癡人說夢話。" -- 徐明旭

See, while some pro-China oversea Chinese are trying their best to protect their fatherland from lies and rumors, some "pig allies" just wanna see all of their works burnt by supporting Tibet exile government, Falong Gong, some Westerners' claim: Yuan and Qing are not China". And yet these "pig allies" dare to call the others "anti-China", how ridiculously funny.


That link oh my freaking God, *sigh*, let me tell you something you silly head. Last time a member with a Vietnamese flag (names "EastSea") here yelling that "Southerners of China" such as Cantonese and people of Shanghai should gain their independence because we are not "true Han" and we are "slaves of Han Chinese". He also posted a link of another forum, which leads to a thread with a bunch of "Claim-to-be Southerners" yelling that "Southerners of China" should be "freed" and independent from "evil China".
You know what I did to that Vietnamese guy? I "greeted" his whole family for countless posts. But don't you worry, I wouldn't do the same thing to you. Instead I'm going to give you sth else -a deep, freaking sympathy. My friend, you are in the same level of an ignorant, uneducated scum, I really feel sorry for you, and your whole family as well.

 

[Snomannen]

The Truth about Uyghur demographics and Han immigration in Xinjiang

by @Wholegrain (Thanks to her/ His great works)

Just a backup and reviewing:

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The same accusation that Han people are demographically swamping Uyghurs has been repeated around over 1,000 times already and is widespread in the western and other media hostile to China (India etc.)

Xinjiang is made out of two distinct regions which were not culturally or politically linked until China put them together in one province. They are Dzungharia (mostly Ili) and the Tarim Basin. Dzungharia is steppe and was traditionally home to nomads and nomadic empires. The Tarim Basin is made out of Oases and home to sedentary people.

Han Chinese have almost entirely migrated to Dzungharia and not the Tarim Basin. Nearly the entire Han population in Xinjiang lives in Dzungharia. The Uyghurs are not natives to Dzungharia but immigrants from the Tarim so both Han and Uyghurs in Dzungharia are immigrants.

The Uyghurs are native to the Tarim Basin, which is in southern Xinjiang only. It is the former territory of the Chagatai Khanate. The Uyghurs were sedentary Turkic speaking farmers in the Oaseses of the Tarim. Before the Soviets gave them the name "Uyghur" in 1921 they were not known as Uyghurs but as Turkis in the west. They called themselves Sart, which meant a sedentary Turkic speaking Muslim, or by the Oases they came from. If they came from Turpan they would be Turpanlk. Their language was called Eastern Turki or Chagatai. The Tarim Basin was also known as Moghulistan (Mongol land) since the Chagatais were descendants of Genghis Khan.

Dzungharia is in northern Xinjiang. It was home to the Dzunghar Oirat Mongols who were a nomadic, Lamaist Buddhist people. Their state was the Zunghar Khanate. The name of Xinjiang's capital Urumqi is from the Dzunghar, not the Uyghur language.

In the Chagatai Khanate, the Chagataid Khan and princes were the secular rulers. The religious leaders were the Sayyid Naqshbandi Khojas. There were two factions of Khojas, the Qarataghliks and Aqtaghliks. The Qarataghliks and the Chagatai Khan expelled the Aqtaghliks from power. The Aqtaghliks sought aid from the Buddhist Zunghar Khanate, which then attacked the Chagatai Khanate, installed the Aqtaghliks as puppets and forced the turkic population into submission and paying tribute.

The Chagataid Turks and Qarataghlik Khojas then turned to China for aid. China and the Turkic muslims (Uyghur ancestors) launched a massive campaign the Dzunghars in 1758-1759 and nearly exterminated the entire Zunghar population. Only tens of thousands are still left in Xinjiang.

The Zunghar Khanate was then absorbed into China, and the Chagatai prince, the Qarataghlik Khojas and the Turkic Khans and Begs then submitted to Chinese rule and the Tarim Basin also became part of China. The Aqtaghlik Khojas were bitter about their loss and tried to forment rebellion but were defeated.

China then settled in the place of the decimated Dzunghar population, thousands of Han, Hui, Manchus, Xibo, and Turkic Muslims from the Tarim Basin (uyghurs ancestors). Those turkic muslims became known as the Taranchi and the Uyghurs in modern Dzungharia are their descendants. Very few Han migrated into the Uyghurs native Tarim basin.

Urumqi was originally a Han and Hui (Tungan) city with few Uyghurs. Its the Uyghurs who are the immigrants.

Beyond the Pass: Economy, Ethnicity, and Empire in Qing Central Asia, 1759-1864 - James A. Millward - Google Books

Beyond the Pass: Economy, Ethnicity, and Empire in Qing Central Asia, 1759-1864 - James A. Millward - Google Books

Foreign tourists in Urumchi today sometimes complain that the city is "too Chinese" in comparison with the Central Asian atmosphere of southern Xinjiang; many believe Urumchi's East Turkestani culture has been erased by Han immigration and architecture. In fact, the Uyghur population and culture in the city today is a relatively recent feature, for Urumchi in its first decades in most respects resembled a north Chinese town, populated primarily by Tungans from Gansu and Shaanxi and Han from many Chinese provinces, in addition to the bannermen.
The Qing administed the Dzungharia and the Tarim basin as separate regions. The north (dzungharia) used to be called 天山北路 tianshan beilu and the south (Tarim Basin) was 天山南路 tianshan nanlu.

Those two distinct areas, Dzungharia (tianshan beilu) and Tarim Basin (tianshan nanlu) were combined to form Xinjiang province in 1884 by the Chinese government. Ever since then its been regarded as a single province,

This is an old book from 200 years ago. Soungaria is Dzungharia and Turkestan refers to the Tarim Basin only

China ; Political, Commercial, and Social: In an Official Report to Her ... - Robert Montgomery Martin - Google Books

The government of Soungaria and Turkestan is of three kinds: —1st. In the easternmost districts of Soungaria, Barkoul, and Orountchi, it is much the same as China, and these districts have been incorporated with the province of Kansuh; 2nd. In the western districts around Ele, where the Chinese convicts are sent, it is strictly military, being occupied by Mantchou troops, who are considered as inhabitants of the soil; they are commanded by a general and subordinate officers, whose authority extends to the eastern districts, and to Turkestan; in Turkestan, the government is left in the hands of the native nobles, who are Begs of different degrees of rank, under the control of Chinese residents at the principal cities.
More...

The book of the world - Richard Swainson Fisher - Google Books

That part of the empire called Hi is a vast region, lying on each side of the Tien-shan, or Celestial Mountains, and including a tract nearly as large as Mongolia, and not much more susceptible of cultivation. The limits extend from 36° to 49° N , and from longitude 71° to 96° E. It is divided by the Tien-shan into two parts called " lu," or circuits, viz.: Tien-shanpeh-lu and Tien-shan-nan-lu, or north and south of the Celestial Mountains. The former is commonly denominated Songaria, from the Songares its former rulers, and the latter is known as Little Bokara, or Eastern Turkestan. Hi, taken as a whole, may be regarded as an inland isthmus, extending south-west from the south of Siberia, off between the Gobi and Caspian deserts, till it reaches the Hindoo-Kush, leading down to the valley of the Indus. The former of these deserts encloses it on the east and south, and the other on the west and north-west, separated from each other by the Belur-tag and the Muz-tag ranges, which join with the Celestial Mountains that divide the isthmus itself into two parts. These deserts united are equal to the extent of Sahara, but are not as arid and tenantless. Little is known of the topography, productions, or civilization of the tribes, but the efforts of the Chinese have been systematically directed to developing the agricultural resources of the country, by stationing troops in every part, who cultivate the soil, and by banishing criminals thereto, who are obliged to work for, and assist the soldiers. The productions are numerous. Wheat, barley, rice, and millet are the chief grains; tobacco, cotton, and fruits are grown; herds of horses, camels, cattle and sheep, afford means of locomotion and food for the people, while the mountains and lakes supply game and fish. The inhabitants are composed mostly of Eleuths, Mongols, Manchus, Chinese, and several native tribes. The government is under the control of the Manchu military officers residing at Hi.

Tien-shan-peh-lu is divided into three commandaries. Hi on the west, Tarbagatai on the north, and Kur-kara-usu on the east, between Hi and Oroumtsi, in Kansuh. The districts of Tarbagatai and Kur-kara-usu are small compared with Hi.

Tien-shan-nan-lu, or southern circuit of Hi, also named Sin-kiang or new frontier, has been called Little Bokhara and Chinese or Eastern Turkestan, by foreigners. It is less fertile than the Northern Circuit, the greatest part of iis area being rugged mountains and barren wastes. The Tarim flows through it from west to east, from the Belur-tag to Lop-nor, a lake lying on the edge ot the desert. No other river basins of any size are found within the circuit. The climate is exceedingly dry, and its barrenness is owing more to the want of moisture than to the nature of the soil. The productions of the valley of Tarim comprise most of the grains and fruits of Southern Europe. The mountains and marshes contains jackals, tigers, bears, wolves, &c. Gold, copper, and iron, are brought from this region ; but as articles of trade they are less important than the sal-ammoniac, saltpetre, sulphur, and asbestos, obtained in the volcanic region on the east of the Celestial mountains. The present divisions of this circuit are regulated by the position of the "eight Mahomedan cities," viz: Harashar, Kuche, Ushi, (including Sairim and Bai,) Oksu, Khoten, Yarkand, Cashgar, and Yingeshar. The superior officers reside at Yarkand, but the southern circuit is divided into four minor governments at Harashar, Ushi, Yarkand, and Khoten.

The government of Hi differs in some respects from that of Mongolia, where religion is partly called in to aid the state. In the northern circuit the authority is strictly military. The supreme command of the whole of Hi is entrusted by the colonial office to a Manchu, "tsiang-kiun," or military governor-general, resident at Kuldsha, who has under him two councillors to take cognizance of civil cases, and 31 residents scattered about in both circuits. The governor also commands the troops of Kansuh, but has nothing to do with the civil jurisdiction. The revenue is derived from a capitation tax and tithes on produce. There are no transit duties as in China, but custom-houses are established at the frontier trading ports. The character of the inhabitants north of the Tien-shan is rendered unlike that of those dwelling in the southern circuit by the diversity in their language and nomadic habits, more than by the sway religious rites and allegiance have over them. The language generally used in the south is the Jaghatai Turki of the Kalmucks. The Usbecks constitute the majority of the people, but Eleuths and Kalmucks are everywhere intermixed. The Tibetans have settled in Khoten, or more probably remnants still exist there of the former inhabitants.
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Here are souces on how the Qing dynasty colonized Dzungharia with BOTH Han and Taranchis (Uyghur ancestors) from Tarim oases like Aksu and other peoples like Manchus, Xibe and others. Both Han and Uyghurs are not native and are immigrants.

Beyond the Pass: Economy, Ethnicity, and Empire in Qing Central Asia, 1759-1864 - James A. Millward - Google Books

China Marches West: The Qing Conquest of Central Eurasia - Peter C Perdue - Google Books

State Capitalism, Contentious Politics and Large-Scale Social Change - Google Books

Now in modern times since 1950, China has directed most Han immigration into Dzungharia (and alot of development as well). The majority of Han in Xinjiang a NOT on Uyghur native land and both Han and Uyghurs in Dzungharia are immigrants. The Dzunghars are the natives and they are almost extinct. The Uyghurs are the majority in their native tarim basin.

Xinjiang - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

At the start of the 19th century, 40 years after the Qing reconquest, there were around 155,000 Han and Hui Chinese in northern Xinjiang and somewhat more than twice that number of Uyghurs in southern Xinjiang.[79] A census of the time tabulated ethnic shares of the population as 60% Turkic and 30% Han.[80] Before 1831 only a few hundred Chinese merchants lived in southern Xinjiang oases (Tarim Basin), and only a few Uyghurs lived in northern Xinjiang (Dzungaria).[81] After 1831 the Qing permitted and encouraged Han Chinese migration into the Tarim basin in southern Xinjiang, although with very little success, and stationed permanent troops on the land there as well.[82] Political killings and expulsions of non Uyghur populations in the uprisings of the 1860s[82] and 1930s saw them experience a sharp decline as a percentage of the total population[83] though they rose once again in the periods of stability following 1880 (which saw Xinjiang increase its population from 1.2 million)[84][85] and 1949. From a low of 7% in 1953, the Han began to return to Xinjiang between then and 1964, where they comprised 33% of the population (54% Uyghur), similarly to Qing times. A decade later, at the beginning of the Chinese economic reform in 1978, the demographic balance was 46% Uyghur and 40% Han;[80] this has not changed drastically until the last census in 2000, with the Uyghur population reduced to 42%.[86] Military personnel are not counted and national minorities are undercounted in the Chinese census, as in most censuses.[87] While some of the shift has be attributed to an increased Han presence,[88] Uyghurs have also emigrated to other parts of China, where their numbers have increased steadily. Uyghur independence activists express concern over the Han population changing the Uyghur character of the region, though the Han and Hui Chinese mostly live in northern Xinjiang Dzungaria, and are separated from areas of historical Uyghur dominance south of the Tian Shan mountains (southwestern Xinjiang), where Uyghurs account for about 90% of the population.[89]

In general, Uyghurs are the majority in southwestern Xinjiang, including the prefectures of Kashgar, Khotan, Kizilsu, and Aksu (about 80% of Xinjiang's Uyghurs live in those four prefectures), as well as Turpan prefecture in eastern Xinjiang. Han are the majority in eastern and northern Xinjiang (Dzungaria), including the cities of Urumqi, Karamay, Shihezi and the prefectures of Changjyi, Bortala, Bayin'gholin, Ili (especially the cities of Kuitun), and Kumul. Kazakhs are mostly concentrated in Ili prefecture in northern Xinjiang. Kazakhs are the majority in the northernmost part of Xinjiang.
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Red is Dzungharia and Blue is the Tarim Basin.

Dzungar Khanate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Dzungaria - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Tarim Basin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Dzungar people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Chagatai Khanate

Here are maps on qing Xinjiang which was divided into Tianshan beilu (dzungharia) and tianshan nanlu (tarim basin, also called eastern turkestan)

Before the Qing dynasty conquered the Ming dynasty, Dzungharia was part of the Zunghar Oirat Khanate and Tarim was part of the Chagatai Khanate

 

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