Question about Ottoman rule in Eastern Europe

[Indus Pakistan]

There is no need

If I post something he does not agree with he will make some disparaging comment about my ethnicity or my lack of knowledge. Both don't fly. Just because we do not have oil, means nothing. My people are proud and never give ground to anybody. And when the Americans came after some Arabs the only place on earth that had the gumption to give them refuge was my people. Where was the Arab world then? Something that this guy does not understand. The oil will go one day. Then it will be back to sand.

And just for the record I think I know you know that I have held you in high regard. But then you don't look down on my ethnic group or Pakistan. Trust me the last people who can look down on my people is people from KSA. I leave this thread in respect of your wishes.

 

[haviZsultan]

No need to fight guys. I agree with @EgyptianAmerican here. We are all one people and cousins in our belief of our own superiority and that can cause conflicts sometimes. We all love our countries and need to work hard to better them. And not fall into the trap of hatred between each other.

@EgyptianAmerican I was recently reading up on languages in Egypt. It seems the ancient Egyptian language was wiped out during the Arab invasion of Egypt starting from Amr bin Al Aas's invasion under Rashiduns. I guess a lot of indigenous cultures disappeared in the world and not just the Egyptian language or at the hands of the Arabs. There were countless other languages even in Europe that disappeared. It would be interesting to know how north africa would be if it had not been arabicized. And how Persia and Pakistan escaped this arabicization even though they were under their rule for some time, persia for almost 500+ years. Strange and fascinating how every country today culture, language and demography has evolved and changed over time.

 

[EgyptianAmerican]

This all sounds great and everything but trust me, I tried being civil with that individual, to no avail, and I am not longer going to tolerate his little obsessions or pathetic insults that ironically only showcase his lack of knowledge more than anything else. I will reply in kind. I used to deal with Iranians successfully single-handedly so dealing with him won't be a problem at all. The only disadvantage is that I am on foreign ground as are you and every other Arab user. I have a no-nonense approach in "real life" as well. We are Arabs and we don't take shit from anyone. Least of all some Pashtun in the UK of all people with due respect. It's a joke.

You can have him bro.

Ah that famous Arab temper, you remind me far too much of my cousinHe goes bezerk if you insult his heritage or "Arabness", I guess it's a normal Arab trait that I myself have tamed within myself.

 

[Sargon of Akkad]

If I post something he does not agree with he will make some disparaging comment about my ethnicity or my lack of knowledge. Both don't fly. Just because we do not have oil, means nothing. My people are proud and never give ground to anybody. And when the Americans came after some Arabs the only place on earth that had the gumption to give them refuge was my people. Where was the Arab world then? Something that this guy does not understand. The oil will go one day. Then it will be back to sand.

And just for the record I think I know you know that I have held you in high regard. But then you don't look down on my ethnic group or Pakistan. Trust me the last people who can look down on my people is people from KSA. I leave this thread in respect of your wishes.

Everyone and his dog knows that the history, achievements and legacy of Arabs compared to those of Pashtuns is like comparing the achievements of the Romans with those of Lithuanians. It is an unfair and utterly comical comparison hence you being true to yourself by providing high-quality comedy once again in the form of your post.

Your people have a literary history that is barely 500 years old. Your very scripture derives from Arabic. Today you excel at stoning women in broad daylight in Kabul of all places. What goes on in the isolated mountain villages nobody knows or wants to know. In the GCC you people excel as taxi drivers and laborers. So excuse me for not taking anything that you wrote seriously. Once you reach our knees in terms of achievements, influence and legacy we can attempt an discussion. Until then, know your place.

While you are at it you should read what the Arabs (that came from Arabia) after conquering your ancestral lands had to say about them. Even to this very day Yemen alone is in another universe in terms of heritage sites and heritage in general. Compare a Yemeni mountain village or major cities and its architecture with your ancestral Eastern Afghanistan. Dubai vs Congo it is.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Pakistan escaped

Only Sindh in what is now Pakistan was taken by the Arabs and even that was for a very short period. And Persia was not held by Arabs for 500 years.

@AmirPatriot @Arminkh

 

[EgyptianAmerican]

@EgyptianAmerican I was recently reading up on languages in Egypt. It seems the ancient Egyptian language was wiped out during the Arab invasion of Egypt starting from Amr bin Al Aas's invasion under Rashiduns. I guess a lot of indigenous cultures disappeared in the world and not just the Egyptian language or at the hands of the Arabs. There were countless other languages even in Europe that disappeared. It would be interesting to know how north africa would be if it had not been arabicized. And how Persia and Pakistan escaped this arabicization even though they were under their rule for some time, persia for almost 500+ years. Strange and fascinating how every country today culture, language and demography has evolved and changed over time.

The Ancient Egyptian language died out after the greeks and Romans took over. When Caesar burned down the library of Alexander he destroyed thousands and possibly millions of books about Ancient Egypt.

The language you are talking about is Coptic, it's basically a modified and more Egyptian version of Greek and it didn't die when the Arabs took over, it took quite a while before it did.


Egyptians have always had Arab blood and have had Arab culture practices, our nearness with the Nabateans and other Arabs tribes as well as the Bedouins led to inter-mixing far long before the Arab invasions. Ever since and during Ancient Egypt we have been Arabs just not called Arabs, I suggest you avoid Coptic Egyptian sources and their bull, claiming that they are the true children of Pharaohs(which is false).


Coptic's have a superiority complex so ignore them.

Nabatean trade routes

As you can see Arabs had a long and honored inter-mingling pretty much everywhere in the Middle east.

 

[Sargon of Akkad]

Only Sindh in what is now Pakistan was taken by the Arabs and even that was for a very short period. And Persia was not held by Arabs for 500 years.

@AmirPatriot @Arminkh

Of course.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_conquest_of_Afghanistan

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghan_Arabs

That is why you can find venerated tombs and graves of Arabs all over Afghanistan that date back to the Arab Islamic conquest of it and TONS of Pashtun tribes claiming Arab ancestry when they are not claiming Israelite ancestry. Yes, 300 years + is a short period of time. Subject venerating the conqueror. Don't worry you are not the first or last ones.

In any case there was nothing to see or do there anyway so of course other areas were many times more important.

When Yemen looks like a Dubai and you look like Congo it cannot be any differently.

 

[Awan68]

I can simplify this for you, the islam that conquered syria, egypt, iraq and most of africa was the real thing, islam in its pure form and the people who spread it truly believed themselves to be cradels of liberty and one true word, the muslim powers that conquered spain and eastern europe were imperialistic powers long corrupted by lust of power, the were muslims yet thier conquests were more for dominance rather than spreading the pure form of islam , the ottomans that ruled over eastern europe were sultans who had a thousand kept women and divulged in wordly pleasures and riches, they were the opposite of the caliphs who used to impose poverty on themselves and lived just for Allah n humanity hence the message that got to europe n spain was an imperialistic one, a message of occupation n tyrany still much better than western imperialistic powers who were barbarous but a message of submission n tyrany nonetheless so less people were driven to islam in europe cause the ottomans made them feel like they were bieng occupied, they didnt take them into the fold like abubakr(ra) and umar(ra) took the people of jordan, syria, iraq, iran, africa into thier arms...

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Everyone

Look I am backing off because of respect to @EgyptianAmerican but I will say this before I go. Your kind do take the shit up the backside. The only thing you can do is push around poor workers in your country. Other than that you freakin go crying like baby to your "big daddy" USA. Without US Army you would be tasting Saddam's rod or the Iranian rod. Take your pick. Every hunted Arab post 9/11 ran to our lands to get refuge from the American's. What does that tell you? We don;t go running to hide in KSA from Americans. Your people do. So you can see who does not take any crap. From Americans or from the Russians.

 

[Sargon of Akkad]

Ah that famous Arab temper, you remind me far too much of my cousinHe goes bezerk if you insult his heritage or "Arabness", I guess it's a normal Arab trait that I myself have tamed within myself.

We are extremely proud people and I do admit that most of us have a hot temper but that's not the problem here. The "problem" or rather the comedy is some Pashtun (of all people and moreover a racist despite looking like a Gypsy) migrant in his 50's based in the UK, who by his silly unmotivated insults and false superiority, honestly believes or thinks (I doubt that he really does that because if he does he is more messed up than I thought) that the legacy of his people, accomplishments, achievements etc. are anywhere remotely comparable to that of Arabs.

Even on Stormfront or some White supremacist webpages, where both peoples are hated (those that even know what a Pashtun is as most people in the world have no clue - you go ask Egyptians and 95% of them would never have heard about such a people), they would laugh at such an suggestion. Anywhere for that matter. Even on some Pashtun forum they would admit it.

Ask any people regardless of ethnicity or nationality and they would obviously agree with what I have written. This is the objective truth that is undeniable.

At least if I was discussing with equal opponents (Italians, Persians, Turks, French, Brits etc.) and other imperial people who have had great legacies and shaped the world on numerous fronts at certain time periods and in ancient times as Arabs did etc., I would have taken it more seriously. But his likes? Nah, that's an insult to me and you. Especially if racist, despite looking like a Gypsy himself, and with obsessions and false beliefs of superiority. I know that any neutral reading this discussion would agree with my views. It is even comical for me to discuss this. And believe me I have nothing against his people or even give them a thought (positive nor negative) but notice that I did not begin the insults but I am for sure not going to tolerate some Pashtun of all people to insult our great and undeniable legacy on numerous fronts.

In short big words from a person belonging to a people that my people conquered and influenced heavily. Changes that are still felt almost 1400 years later. Imagine a Nigerian being racist and having a superiority complex against a Brit? Everyone should get the drift by now.

 

[Tiger Genie]

what's new. another thread anxious to re-write history of conversion by sword.

 

[Kambojaric]

The same reason why Norman Sicily if not majority had a significant Muslim minority. The state saw no real benefit in eradicating previous inhabiting communities due to their aversion to conversion, because this would result in loss of precious revenue via taxes. Entities like the Ottomans were Empires, maintained and expanded by their military. Supplying this grand army required funds and food, which farmers and tradesman throughout the Empire provided.

Certainly there must have been discrimination against members of religious minorities but nowhere in Ottoman history does anything like the Spanish inquisition come in the play. Nor does the same happen in Serb ruled Yugoslavia, although significant communities of Muslims were uprooted and massacred throughout the Balkans as a consequence of the Ottoman Empires collapse.

As far as the Bosniaks and Albanians are concerned, the former had a long history of religious independence, going back to the days of the Bogomolists. The latter's elite as far as I know converted in large numbers to Islam post the Ottoman conquest, and the masses tend to follow the elite after some generations. The Albanians benefited immensely from Ottoman rule, and de facto partially ruled the Ottoman Empire during certain periods (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Köprülü_era).

 

[haviZsultan]

Of course.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_conquest_of_Afghanistan

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghan_Arabs

That is why you can find venerated tombs and graves of Arabs all over Afghanistan that date back to the Arab Islamic conquest of it and TONS of Pashtun tribes claiming Arab ancestry when they are not claiming Israelite ancestry. Yes, 300 years + is a short period of time. Subject venerating the conqueror. Don't worry you are not the first or last ones.

In any case there was nothing to see or do there anyway so of course other areas were many times more important.

When Yemen looks like a Dubai and you look like Congo it cannot be any differently.

Sargon I am nominally and by unproven sources partly a pashtun though more of a muhajir because we can't prove our pashtun links nor a lot of people know about them even in our family. So you aren't only insulting one person but a lot of people. At the end of the day all people are working to better themselves. I have noticed a feeling of superiority among Saudi arabs and this is an impediment towards peace between us. Don't get emotionally carried away. Criticism is good sometimes but our societies paint it as an evil.

I have noted that in societies with less freedoms of expression and other freedoms people tend to be more sensitive towards any form of criticism. Thats how I feel you are behaving. You can always ignore a person you don't like-but better it is to debate with them without losing your cool

 

[الأعرابي]

Every hunted Arab post 9/11 ran to our lands to get refuge from the American's. What does that tell you?

Your land is terrorist havens? Without them Arabs defending you you'd still be under communist control.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Your land is terrorist havens? Without them Arabs defending you you'd still be under communist control.

Go free the Palestinians who are getting busted by the Jews everyday - tough guy.