Pentagon campaign to recruit Vietnam as military ally against China exposed delusions of US war strategy

[Mrc]

US wants other countries like vietnam and india to fight their war against china..... but not them selves

 

[cochine]

That is a fact. Many Viet girls learned Chinese and English to meet more Chinese and foreigner.

This girl is Hua ethnic in Vietnam, may be. so she could speak Futonghua fluenly. we could deport them back to China such traitor ethnic: Hua Chinese, like what we did in 1979.

 

[Jobless Jack]

This is what happens when you keep indians as company for too long.

the delusion rubs on to you

 

[the_messenger]

Why on earth some Vietnamese mentioned mass deportation based on ethic ? deport our OWN citizen ?
That's not VN policy, never was, never will be. That's against what Vietnamese military stand for, against our own value.

 

[shi12jun]

That is a fact. Many Viet girls learned Chinese and English to meet more Chinese and foreigner.

This Vietnamese bride is from southern Vietnam, and her father is a Vietnam police officer

 

[KAL-EL]

Among East Asian countries, China has least problem with Vietnam and North Korea. And Japan is a big dynamite.

South Korea is a gangster and once North Korea is gone, it will turn aggressive. It now spread propaganda that Manchuria belongs to Korea. It never recognize the demarcation between North Korea and China,

It is also a NATO state, and allow USA to install modern surveillance radar.

CPV is very wary about USA color revolution.

Vietnam wont even allow a USA radar station on her soil.

South Korea is a gangster?

 

[Beast]

You should thank heavens we Viet people have a warm heart for chinese despite all conflicts. Other enemies can’t expect little mercy from us. Look at the Pol Pot army, the Siamese, or the Champ with the latter where we made all men to eunuch after they surrendered.

Yes yes, China show mercy to Vietnam in 1988 spratly island battle. You havent thank us when we returned the POW after your ship sunk.

Its not delusion. In longterm, its good idea.

Vietnam communist party will never trust US as long as they still continue support South Vietnam leftover regime staying in US. One of the criteria for Vietnam to support US against China is to eliminate South Vietnam regime and banned the south Vietnam flag in US. But US is too stupid of against its pride and accept Vietnam request.

Pro China faction in Vietnam on power, and I would expect them to on power for a long time. No way for an Asian NATO with Vietnam onboard.

Not only Nguyen Phu Trong, is pro China, next boss on waiting list Pham Minh Chinh is even more pro China.

That is right. Those American continue to advocate support of South VIetnam leftover in US and ask for topple of communist Vietnam. Other hand , they expect Vietnam communist to support them fight China.

These American politicians are the most brainless people plotting foreign policy for ASEAN.

 

[Song Hong]

Next leader of Vietnam Pham Minh Chinh was party boss of Quang Ninh, the northern border province with China.

When he was there, he pushed the implementation of SEZ, trying to get China investment in.

Then he proposal was shot down by anti China faction, accusing the SEZ of selling Vietnam to China.

Now CPV anointed this man as next boss, China Vietnam can expect to have a nice relationship.

 

[cochine]

Vietnam communist party will never trust US as long as they still continue support South Vietnam leftover regime staying in US. One of the criteria for Vietnam to support US against China is to eliminate South Vietnam regime and banned the south Vietnam flag in US. But US is too stupid of against its pride and accept Vietnam request.

The time is changed. China is kneed before USA in cold war, from 1972 at Peking when Nixon dropped there. But nowaday, China would like to dominate here in Asia, China is again betrayed your master USA.

Today USA is partner of Vietnam. Development of relation with Vietnam in is interest of USA.

 

[Beast]

The time is changed. China is kneed before USA in cold war, from 1972 at Peking when Nixon dropped there. But nowaday, China would like to dominate here in Asia, China is again betrayed your master USA.

Today USA is partner of Vietnam. Development of relation with Vietnam in is interest of USA.

View attachment 735466

VCP is no stupid. The american are equally cunning. American need to left go south vietnam regime support in US, can they?

Why would VCP support a imperialism try to destroy VCP? VCP rather lose a few island to China than exterminate by US color revolution. The choice for vietnam is cleared.

 

[cochine]

VCP is no stupid. The american are equally cunning. American need to left go south vietnam regime support in US, can they?

Why would VCP support a imperialism try to destroy VCP? VCP rather lose a few island to China than exterminate by US color revolution. The choice for vietnam is cleared.

VCP is smarter than CPC in politic !

US navy fight with PLAN in East Sea of Vietnam for rules of international law, Its OK for us, why not ?

Check the photos I posted above and here, no idiot Chinese can understand what does the photos has presented. Color revolution is in hand of President of United States, its red flag with golden star .

 

[Beast]

VCP is smarter than CPC in politic !

US navy fight with PLAN in East Sea of Vietnam for rules of international law, Its OK for us, why not ?

Check the photos I posted above and here, no idiot Chinese can understand what does the photos has presented. Color revolution is in hand of President of United States, its red flag with golden star .

View attachment 735508

View attachment 735510

You can continue deluded yourself. Vietnam has so far not jump the US camp with Japan. They know US still has hostility against communist including Vietnam. US contempt for VCP with supporting south vietnam regime in US has irked vietnam until now. VCP is not stupid enough to stay in front of bullets fired by CPC against US.

Those minor treaty signed which u show are nothing significant so far. They are for local consumption for people like you who think VCP will go against China for US.

Tell next why vietnam didn't continue go spratly island and drill oil now given that oil price has gone up?

 

[Surya 1]

thegrayzone.com
Pentagon campaign to recruit Vietnam as military ally against China exposed delusions of US war strategy | The Grayzone
Gareth Porter·April 8, 2021
10-12 minutes

After convincing itself Vietnam would grant it access for missile bases against China, the Pentagon got a hard dose of reality.

When the Pentagon began gearing up for a future war with China in 2018, Defense Department officials quickly realized that they needed access to Vietnamese territory for troops armed with missiles to hit Chinese ships in a US-China conflict. So they initiated an aggressive campaign to lobby the Vietnamese government, and even Communist Party officials, in the hope that they would eventually support an agreement to provide them the permission.

But a Grayzone investigation of the Pentagon’s lobbying push in Vietnam shows what a delusional exercise it was from its inception. In a fit of self-deception that highlighted the desperation behind the bid, the US military ignored abundant evidence that Vietnam had no intention of giving up its longstanding, firmly grounded policy of equidistance between the United States and China.

Vietnam as a key base in US war strategy

Between 2010 and 2017, China developed intermediate-range missiles capable of hitting American bases in Japan and South Korea. To counter that threat, the Pentagon and military services began working on a new strategy in which US Marines, accompanied by an array of missiles, would spread out over a network of small, rudimentary bases and move continuously from one base to another.

Vietnam was the logical choice for such sites. Australia and the Philippines publicly ruled out hosting US missiles capable of hitting China, and South Korea was considered unlikely to agree. Indonesia and Singapore were too economically dependent on China to be interested.

But as Chris Dougherty, the former senior advisor to the deputy assistant secretary of defense for strategy and force development, who had written large parts of the 2018 National Defense Strategy, told the Military Times last September, “Vietnam has some wonderful geography. You can have good external lines against the Chinese.” Pentagon strategists also knew that Vietnam had soundly defeated a poorly conceived Chinese invasion in 1979 designed to punish the Vietnamese for their ties with the Soviet Union.

The Pentagon’s focus on Vietnam began when then-Defense Secretary James Mattis visited Vietnam in both 2017 and 2018, meeting several times with Defense Minister General Ngo Xuan Lich, who had previously visited him in Washington. During his January 2018 visit, Mattis waxed enthusiastically about the future of US-Vietnam cooperation, calling the two countries “like-minded partners.”

In April 2019, the commander of the US Indo-Pacific Command, Adm. Philip S. Davidson, visited Hanoi and Ho Chi Minh City during a four-day trip. Mattis’s successor, Mark Esper, went even further in a November 2019 trip, meeting not only with the defense minister, Lich, but with executive secretary of the Communist Party, Tran Quoc Vuong, as well.
Officials were pleased with what they believed was a breakthrough for the Pentagon, despite the Vietnamese Defense Ministry’s abrupt cancellation of 15 previously planned “defense engagements” with the United States without public explanation the previous month.

In the Defense Department’s pursuit of Vietnam’s active involvement in its new war strategy, however, US military brass were ignoring the fundamental fact that the Communist Party of Vietnam and military leadership were not going to budge from the strategic policy to which it had been publicly committed for two decades.

The policy was summed up in three fundamental principles: no military alliances, no aligning with one country against another, and no foreign military bases on Vietnamese soil. The Vietnamese commitment to those “three noes”, first made public in a national defense white paper published in 1998, was repeated in successive white papers in 2004 and 2009.
Those principles clearly ruled out the kind of military cooperation that the Pentagon sought from Vietnam. But there was apparently too much at stake for top Pentagon officials to let that reality stand in the way of their enthusiasm.
The Defense Department’s main corporate research arm, the RAND Corporation, which was heavily invested in the idea of a viable new military strategy for war with China, was equally unwilling to acknowledge the truth. In January 2019, Derek Grossman, RAND’s specialist on Vietnamese defense policy, publicly reassured the policymakers that Hanoi was not really bound by any of those three “three noes.”

On the principle of “no military alliances,” Grossman claimed that Vietnam had “essentially created a major loophole in its own rule” by defining alliance as a military agreement requiring another country to defend Vietnam if it were attacked. He came up with equally creative explanations for why the other “noes” were also loosely defined in practice.

When Vietnam’s long-awaited new National Defense White Paper was published in late November 2019, Grossman discovered new reasons for pressing ahead with the Pentagon’s bid for Vietnam’s cooperation with the US military against China.
Grossman suggested that the Vietnamese had planted “subtle messages of opportunity for Washington” in the document, including its readiness to participate in “security and defense mechanisms in the Indo-Pacific region.” And he pointed to a new supplement to what had now become Vietnam’s “four noes.”

“[D]epending on the circumstances and specific conditions,” the principle said, “Vietnam will consider developing necessary, appropriate defense and military relations with other countries.” In practice, that merely meant that if Vietnam were seriously threatened by a Chinese attack, it could abandon its commitment to those “four noes.”

But the addendum was hardly a signal of Vietnamese readiness to participate in a US “Indo-Pacific Strategy”. Rather, the “four noes and one depend” in the defense white paper were part of a larger strategy of maintaining equidistance between China and the United States, as first adopted by the Party Central Committee in 2003 as “Resolution 8”.

The Pentagon’s Vietnam bubble bursts

Washington’s optimism about a new era of US-Vietnam defense cooperation against China was based on little more than wishful thinking.

By late 2020, it was apparent that the bubble of Pentagon hopes for a breakthrough with Vietnam had burst: there would be no Vietnamese involvement in a US anti-China military strategy in the region. Nor would there be high-level Pentagon or military visits during the year. More importantly, no further US-Vietnam military activities were announced.

The RAND Corporation’s Derek Grossman finally acknowledged in August 2020 that Vietnam had not been poised to begin deeper military collaboration against China after all. He now admitted the reality that Hanoi was taking a “conservative approach” to the “four noes and one depend” that he had marketed only months before as an open door to more US cooperation.

Grossman conceded that Vietnam had carried out a “delicate balancing act,” avoiding any move likely to antagonize China. The country’s careful approach, he wrote, is “disappointing for Washington and should temper American assessments of the extent to which Hanoi might be willing to play a role in the US Indo-Pacific strategy,” clearly implying that the Trump administration’s “high hopes” for a “like-minded partner” strategy in Vietnam were misplaced.

Nguyen The Phuong, a research associate at the Centre for International Studies at Vietnam National University, Ho Chi Minh City, confirmed in an interview with The Grayzone that the basic Vietnamese policy of maintaining equidistance between China and the United States is not questioned by anyone within the Vietnamese government.

Nguyen observed that both civilian and military officials believe the US Navy had no effective strategy for curbing Chinese operations in the maritime zone that Vietnam claims.

The only difference of opinion which had arisen within that consensus, he said, was that many Vietnamese diplomats with whom he has talked believe that the US Coast Guard, which is not under the control of Defense Department — but which the US nevertheless considers a military service — would be more effective tool in countering China’s tactics in the contested maritime zone in the South China Sea than the US Navy has been.

They also believed that giving the Coast Guard access to Vietnam’s deep-water port at Cam Ranh Bay would not be provocative to China. The military leadership, however, has rejected that idea, according to Nguyen.

But what the Pentagon desired from Vietnam primarily was access to bases for American ground troops with missiles.
In September 2020, after the Defense Department reached an agreement with Palau on bases in the Pacific island, Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense for East Asia Heino Klinck revealed in an interview with the Wall Street Journal that what the Defense Department truly sought was “access to places instead of permanent bases.”

As the article explained, “US security policy in Asia calls for a heavier presence of American forces, but on a rotational basis, whereby troops switch in and out for training and exercises.”

The Marines that the Pentagon would like to have positioned in Vietnam would otherwise have been sitting ducks for Chinese missiles. But Nguyen The Phuong does not believe that any Vietnamese official, whether civilian or military, would even consider allowing such access. “If the US tried that approach on Vietnam, it would certainly fail,” he said.

The story of the Pentagon’s pursuit of Vietnam as a potential military partner against China reveals an extraordinary degree of self-deception surrounding the entire endeavor. And it adds further detail to the already well-established picture of a muddled and desperate bureaucracy seizing on any vehicle possible to enable it to claim that US power in the Pacific can still prevail in a war with China.

Trump was a loud mouth guy who just spoke bluntly. Bidden is a man of action. He will act. After Laddakh stand off, whole world knows that China is a paper Dragon with no teeth. Bidden will take full advantage of that.

 

[Beast]

Trump was a loud mouth guy who just spoke bluntly. Bidden is a man of action. He will act. After Laddakh stand off, whole world knows that China is a paper Dragon with no teeth. Bidden will take full advantage of that.

The only paper tiger is india. Al Indian can do is to be paper warrior , write self fantasy victory article to make themselves feel good.

But in real life got whacked and has 20 men beaten to death or freeze in river.

 

[Surya 1]

The only paper tiger is india. Al Indian can do is to be paper warrior , write self fantasy victory article to make themselves feel good.

But in real life got whacked and has 20 men beaten to death or freeze in river.

And that self victory article make china withdraw like a shameless looser.