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Pakistan's Battlefield Nuclear Policy A Risky Solution to an Exaggerated Threat

And what's the world going to do about it with regards to China? In May/June 1998 indians were saying that the whole world will isolate/destroy and condemn China for helping Pakistan becoming a nuclear weapons state. Yet here in 2016 China is only 1 of 2 nations on earth that is a superpower on track to becoming a global hyper power. China and america are 2 nations that the whole world cannot do NOTHING about. If your above post was true then the indian military would have attacked Pakistan after mumbai 26/11/2008.

No body is going to do anything to China, its the China which will do something like it did during the Kargil war aka gave the recorded conversation of the Gen Musharraf, when he was in Beijing (Gone to China for asking Help) to India.

After Mumbai and Parliament attack, there was the pressure from the people of the India on the govt. to take strict action against the so called terrorist who were getting training in the training camps in Pakistan, who attacked India in coward and proxy way. There was no intention of India to Invade Pakistan ever, the mobilization was done to secure the border to prevent any Pakistani Army action, and strike the training camps in the P0K in Pakistani held kashmir. But at that time, our strike core based on the Jabalpur which is at the heart of the India, thousands of KM away from the border took so much time with its all heavy Gears and equipments, that the surprise factor was not there. Therefore, you can see various training for the fast and quick mobilization, transport aircraft deal M777 guns deal, and combat helicopters, which created a hype called cold start doctrine but in reality it was the demand of the present requirement and you are not going to wage the war like the World War.

Does India need TNWs?

Pakistan’s introduction of TNWs in South Asia
raises the question whether India should develop
the same to counter Pakistan’s TNWs. Strategic
thinkers and experts across India have strictly
believed that India should refrain from developing
such weapon systems. There are several reasons
for this belief. Firstly, there is the complexity of
distinguishing between strategic and tactical
nuclear weapons. In fact, India’s foremost
strategic thinker Late Air Commodore Jasjit Singh
never drew any distinction between tactical and
strategic nuclear weapons. According to him, “any
nuclear weapon, of any quality, mode of delivery
or yield, used against any type of target, will result
in a strategic impact to which the logical response
would be the use of nuclear weapons, more often
than not, on an overwhelming scale.”17
He further states that these weapon systems
“evolved” from Cold War theologies and that
the “artificial division of nuclear weapons into
tactical and strategic is not only irrelevant for us
[India], but carries with a danger that a belief
system could grow in a way that might justify
the use and utlity of such weapons for actual
war-fighting.”18 Professor P.R. Chari, another
nuclear veteran also seconds the Air
Commodore’s opinion that “the real danger
from TNWs arises from the psychology it
engenders that nuclear war is possible.”19 Lt.
General V.R. Raghavan also of the view that “the
Indian position (if TNWs are used in conflict) may
well be that a nuke is a nuke and the use of even a
tactical one is a strategic strike.”20 He further
states, “[t]he Indian decision makers may not
attach importance to either the yield of the
weapon used, or the territory on which it is
detonated. The response could well be strategic
on the lines indicated in the India doctrine.”21
Therefore, the response to Pakistan’s first-use of
nuclear weapons on Indian territory irrespective of
whether the weapon used is tactical or strategic
should be ‘massive retaliation’ as mentioned in
our doctrine. This philosophy is more so crucial
since the distinction between TNWs and strategic
nuclear weapons is only in technical terms and not
in material terms given the short flight times of
delivery systems and geographical contiguity of
India and Pakistan.
Secondly, India’s nuclear doctrine, strategy and
nuclear posturing also leave minimal scope for the
introduction of TNWs in its nuclear strategy.
India’s nuclear strategy of Mutual Assured
Destruction (MAD), premised on counter-value
targeting, does not allow any scope for the development of TNWs of MAD. TNWs are
usually confined to counter-force roles and
therefore, defy India’s nuclear deterrence strategy
of MAD. India’s nuclear posture is premised on
the principle of ‘credible minimum deterrence
posture’, which does not concentrate on the
number game, but on developing minimum
survivable nuclear weapons. If TNWs were to
strengthen nuclear deterrence, India would need a
great number of them to be deployed in the
battlefield, which would defy its ‘credible
minimum deterrence’ posture.
Also, if TNWs in India could restrict adversary
from using their TNWs,22 this strategy holds no
significance for India. This is because a state can
only avert its adversary from using TNWs first, if
the state has a ‘first-use’ doctrine. With India’s
‘no-first use’ doctrine, the TNWs would pose no
advantage to India’s military strategy. Moreover,
TNWs attach with them, the dilemma of ‘use them
or lose them’. India’s ‘no-first use’ doctrine on the
other hand, reduces any scope for this sort of
dilemma to arise. Thus, the possession of TNWs
would only weaken India’s stand on ‘no-first use’
doctrine. New Delhi’s ‘no-first use’ doctrine and
explicit mention of ‘massive retaliation’ in its
nuclear doctrine also put lesser burden on the
command and control and on the armed forces,
especially the Indian Army. This is because once
nuclear weapons are used by the adversary on
Indian Territory, the response is as stated in the
doctrine. Introduction of TNWs would pose an
added burden on the command and control.
Thirdly, is the issue of India’s threat perceptions,
which are not only confined to Pakistan but also
China. In fact, it was the presence of the Chinese
nuclear threat right from 1964 that became the
crucial factor behind India’s nuclear program
following the 1962 Indo-China war. Jaswant
Singh writes, “the nuclear age entered India's
neighborhood when China became a nuclear
power in October 1964. From then on, no
responsible Indian leader could rule out the option
of following suit.”23 The Chinese nuclear threat
continues to loom and is a major factor that affects
India’s nuclear thinking and planning.
Introduction of TNWs by India would not only
lower the nuclear threshold vis-à-vis Pakistan, but
also against China. In fact, India should take the
lead to discuss nuclear arms control measures with
China and never encourage such destablizing
weapons that would only instigate nuclear arms
race. Since Beijing refuses to recognize India as a
nuclear weapon state (NWS), the scope for any
nuclear arms control measures or nuclear
confidence building measures (NCBMs) between
India and China has been restricted. India and
China have a lot in common in their nuclear
weapons policies, in that both practice ‘no-first
use’ doctrine and both have resorted to de-mated
and de- alerted nuclear weapons. Both have
vouched strong for the implementation of a global
‘no-first use’ treaty and hence, there is a scope for
cooperation in these aspects. There could also be a
scope for a bilateral agreement de-targeting each
other’s assets in the future and these scopes of
future cooperation could get jeopardized should
India develop TNWs.
Fourthly, for Pakistan, nuclear weapons serve as a
tool to promote proxy wars against India. From
India’s side, introducing TNWs in its strategy
would mean confining nuclear conflict to a
localized or battlefield level. This would only
increase the frequency of Pakistan’s proxy wars
against Indian Territory should Pakistan become
aware that a limited conflict leading to the use of
nuclear weapons, would be confined to battlefield
level. Brigadier Gurmeet Kanwal, a veteran on
nuclear issues, argues the same that limiting
India’s response to TNWs would “play straight
into Pakistan's hands and give that country the
freedom to continue to interfere in India's internal
affairs through its 'proxy war' in J&K, including
the launching of Kargil-type misadventures.”24
Fifthly, is the issue of lowering the nuclear
threshold and also inviting catastrophe for Indian
troops with TNWs. India’s nuclear deterrence is
strengthened in its ability to be able to survive an
enemy first-strike and be able to retaliate causing
‘unacceptable damage’. As long as New Delhi is successful in developing survivable nuclear
forces, there is little need to respond to TNWs
with TNWs. Strategic nuclear delivery systems
are farther from border regions and therefore,
more survivable. A 700kms range Agni-I can be
fired from deep within the territory than a 60kms
range missile and therefore, the Agni-I is less
susceptible to being destroyed by enemy attacks.
Also, such strategic nuclear delivery system in
India’s nuclear arsenal could be tactically
employed, that is, tactical employment of strategic
weapons. This means that the strategic weapon
systems are not restricted to serve strategic
purposes but can be used against counter-force
targets. This would strengthen India’s ‘credible
minimum deterrence’ posture, and at the same
time keep the nuclear threshold high, thereby
strengthening stability in the region even as
Islamabad continues to lower the same.
Moreover, the Indian Army’s doctrinal shift from
attrition-based warfare to maneuver warfare,
evident from its Cold Start Doctrine, requires
rapid movement of the Integrated Battle Groups
(IBGs) to save their deployment time in crisis
situation. The aim is to launch “offensive
operations to a shallow depth” without crossing
Pakistan’s nuclear red lines. Possessing TNWs
complicate the rapid deployment of forces by
attaching with them the hassle to deploy the
TNWs too close to the borders. As India refrains
from crossing Pakistan’s nuclear red lines, an
introduction of TNWs in its strategy could
jeopardize this attempt of not crossing the nuclear
threshold. In addition, should India deploy TNWs
in its territory, any effort on Islamabad’s side to
destroy TNWs deployed on forward positions,
even with conventional weapons could lead to a
nuclear catastrophe on the Indian territory and
therefore, catastrophic for the Indian troops also.
Moreover, capturing of an Indian missile battery
by enemy could be detrimental since the same
nuclear tipped missiles could be used against
Indian troops.
Sixthly, India’s superiority in its conventional
military might vis-à-vis Pakistan allows it to
refrain from venturing into TNWs. India must
continue to affirm Pakistan that her conventional
superiority is sufficient to deter Pakistan’s
conventional forces. In fact, New Delhi should
concentrate on modernizing her conventional
forces, especially, conventional firepower
capability, artillery in particular, whose
modernization process continues to be a
desideratum. Modernization of conventional
forces by India would result in Pakistan not only
having to increase the number of TNWs in its
arsenal, but put an added burden on Pakistan’s
conventional military development to keep pace
with India’s conventional military superiority.
 
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1. LOLZ What here is hapening is any question which you fail to answer is only reported and deleted for trolling, and if the Indian person ask for the facts, then he is banned. Really do you want a fare discussion or just the chest thumping by your country men members yourself.
We do not advertise our inductions
If something appears in a parade in military colours it is inducted. That seems too hard for you with your press conferences to parade every buy and every media event...
you can leave any time you want. no one forces you to stay or leave. All we say is understand the military ways of Pakistan before harassing people with constant questions
2. Check, some of your members saying that Indians are paranoid for the NASR, and only the name NASR means the cold start docterine is failed, but in reality its you who are paranoid of the Guided Weishu Rocket System aka M-20 aka NASR.
you participate in every thread with the same sorry facts, and your media is obsessed with the concept and evil. Our forum, our discussions, stay away if you do not like it.
3. I know I most probably be banned, but a noobe question, the Ballastic Missile needs the GPS guidance to reach its target, and when the condition between India and Pakistan will become tense, the first thing what the international community will do is they will stop the GPS service like GPS, GLOSNOV, Baideau etc. Now you will say why would China will stop its service, and before I am being banned I answer this question, because in the event of the Nuclear explosion by the Pakistan, all the evidence could be collected from the ground Zero, which will point toward the China.
no it does not, it is a noob question.. If you came to learn and not to troll, there are many threads which one should read before annoying others with questions that are already answered
It is akin to you being in economic university and someone interrupting lectures to ask what does deficit mean.. That is how basic this concept is.
Read old threads, most of the queries have been discussed and it seems annoying that every new indian member challenges these things in every thread we open for our own discussions.
5. There are Moderator specially @HRK (let me call him myself, before the Pakistani Members call him for the resecue) who will delete this post, and likely to see this post as the trolling but care to explain, you have inducted NASR with couple of test, but Pakistani Army is ready with the tactical nuclear weapon without preparing to fight under NBC environment, and without NBC gears. Care to post the equipments, tools which Pakistani Army have procured to fight in the environment which it is going to create in the battle field other wise no one is going to digest such things except Pakistani people.
No need to prove to you what or what we do not have. Purchases are not always made openly, much of what we have we get through back channels and make ourselves. Read on our latest tanks, troop carriers and see if they have any measures against radioactive, chemical and biological warfare....
Reply after you have gained basic knowledge, know the answers to the questions you posted yourself from old threads. We can not retype for every person who asks the same questions, go to the database and start reading from there and move on to sticky threads and then to old discussions by old members.
 
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We do not advertise our inductions
If something appears in a parade in military colours it is inducted. That seems too hard for you with your press conferences to parade every buy and every media event...
you can leave any time you want. no one forces you to stay or leave. All we say is understand the military ways of Pakistan before harassing people with constant questions

you participate in every thread with the same sorry facts, and your media is obsessed with the concept and evil. Our forum, our discussions, stay away if you do not like it.

no it does not, it is a noob question.. If you came to learn and not to troll, there are many threads which one should read before annoying others with questions that are already answered
It is akin to you being in economic university and someone interrupting lectures to ask what does deficit mean.. That is how basic this concept is.
Read old threads, most of the queries have been discussed and it seems annoying that every new indian member challenges these things in every thread we open for our own discussions.

No need to prove to you what or what we do not have. Purchases are not always made openly, much of what we have we get through back channels and make ourselves. Read on our latest tanks, troop carriers and see if they have any measures against radioactive, chemical and biological warfare....
Reply after you have gained basic knowledge, know the answers to the questions you posted yourself from old threads. We can not retype for every person who asks the same questions, go to the database and start reading from there and move on to sticky threads and then to old discussions by old members.

Why waisted so much energy Simple say Good bye, I don't have anything to add, check PDF old threads and search for you answer. LOL BYE for all SIR
 
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I think our Indian friends here are ignoring the fact that there is another layer of guided projectile munitions (missiles/rockets) which Indian IBGs will have to deal with before they will face Nasr and TNWs. Since 2010, we know that PA is in possession of A-100E MRL and conventional ballistic missiles like Abdali. Nasr is an option for the last resort.

Induction of A-100Es added an extra layer in defense shield against Indian Army's IBGs. So, it is evident that Pakistan is working on improving the conventional capabilities to deter Indian aggression as well. Nasr's fast paced development served more of a physiological goal and this is exactly what nuclear weapons and their delivery systems are meant to. Here is what GlobalSecurity has to say about A-100E.

The long rumored sale of the A-100 300mm MRL system to Pakistan was confirmed during the 2010 Azm-e-Nau-3 exercise. According to UPI Asia Online on 25 September 2008 reported that Pakistan purchased from the China A-100 long-range rockets. Pakistani military industry sources, Pakistan last year with China Precision Machinery Import and Export Corporation signed purchase. This was the first time that China sold to other countries A-100 long-range rockets. Sources said that Pakistan bought the first A-100 long-range rockets to equip a battalion for the first functional testing. Later, Pakistan seemed likely to continue to increase the purchase of the weapon.

South Asian military analysts believe that Pakistan move may be in response to India purchased from Russia 9K58 Smerch rocket systems. Russia 9K58 Smerch and the China A-100 long-range rockets are 300mm multiple rocket launch system. In 2001, India and Russia signed a $ 450 million worth of 9K58 Smerch rocket system purchase contract. In 2008, the first arrival of 9K58 Smerch rocket system participated in the National Day military parade in India. From the Chinese military industry sources said 9K58 Smerch launch rocket systems, the maximum range is 90 km, while China's A-100 launch farthest distance of 120 kilometers. Improved during the recent launching devices, A-100 attack accuracy is greatly improved.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/a100.htm

But I think, PAA and PAF must also work on another conventional deterrence in form of CAS platform to deter this threat. I am a strong believer of Air power in defensive fire support role. PA needs something like A-10. The fact that US has not been able to retire this bird despite many announcements, speaks volumes about the value they added in the fire power on ground against enemy ground troops.
 
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We do not advertise our inductions
If something appears in a parade in military colours it is inducted. That seems too hard for you with your press conferences to parade every buy and every media event...
you can leave any time you want. no one forces you to stay or leave. All we say is understand the military ways of Pakistan before harassing people with constant questions

you participate in every thread with the same sorry facts, and your media is obsessed with the concept and evil. Our forum, our discussions, stay away if you do not like it.

no it does not, it is a noob question.. If you came to learn and not to troll, there are many threads which one should read before annoying others with questions that are already answered
It is akin to you being in economic university and someone interrupting lectures to ask what does deficit mean.. That is how basic this concept is.
Read old threads, most of the queries have been discussed and it seems annoying that every new indian member challenges these things in every thread we open for our own discussions.

No need to prove to you what or what we do not have. Purchases are not always made openly, much of what we have we get through back channels and make ourselves. Read on our latest tanks, troop carriers and see if they have any measures against radioactive, chemical and biological warfare....
Reply after you have gained basic knowledge, know the answers to the questions you posted yourself from old threads. We can not retype for every person who asks the same questions, go to the database and start reading from there and move on to sticky threads and then to old discussions by old members.
This is a coversation forum. It would have been better if you point him to the forums with reference. Get over your high horse and start acting like what your title says and not goofy
 
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What makes you think that those figures are even nearly accurate?.
I don't know, the study has to answer that. It's a recreation of the 1965 battles that assumes nuclear weapons are employed instead of conventional munitions. That means the deployments and attacks remain unchanged, right? I suppose that if the tanks were widely separated (say, 150 meters apart) then perhaps a tactical nuke might only destroy a dozen or so of the Indian tanks, while the Pakistani civilian area around them would be utterly annihilated. Thus only one-quarter of an attacking armored battalion would be destroyed, while three-quarters of it would be at leisure to advance and control an area cleared of civilians and cover by the defender's own military.

Presumably in a future conflict the attack and defense plans won't be the same. But this sort of study does illustrate that developing a weapon just because you can isn't necessarily a wise policy. Indeed, it might be much better to limit these instead, as the U.S. and Soviet Union did of their own accord and by treaty.
 
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I don't know, the study has to answer that. It's a recreation of the 1965 battles that assumes nuclear weapons are employed instead of conventional munitions. That means the deployments and attacks remain unchanged, right? I suppose that if the tanks were widely separated (say, 150 meters apart) then perhaps a tactical nuke might only destroy a dozen or so of the Indian tanks, while the Pakistani civilian area around them would be utterly annihilated. Thus only one-quarter of an attacking armored battalion would be destroyed, while three-quarters of it would be at leisure to advance and control an area cleared of civilians and cover by the defender's own military.
Don't spread mathematical trolls.
Those who developed NASR, are working on NASR and developing the strategy of its use age are much wiser.
And get out of these impressions.

1: Pakistan will use TNW in civilian areas.
2: Each NASR strike with destroy Dozen tanks only.
 
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But you are making claims that its gonna destroy half dozen tanks and this and that -
I'm not "making claims" but highlighting what the report says: that a tacnuke would only destroy 13 MBTs in the reenactment while creating hundreds of thousands of casualties.
 
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creating hundreds of thousands of casualties.
NASR is not first line of defense,
and its not Cold Start specific weapon.
Consider it like a ''loop'' in strategy and demoralizing factor.
NASR is deadly, even if it not used. Its deterrent.
No matter how many scary claims Pakistan will make to threat India, it will use NASR only as weapon of last solution.

I'm not "making claims" but highlighting what the report says: that a tacnuke would only destroy 13 MBTs

These reports are bit old.
Pakistan did some specific modifications in this weapon, consider it an advance form of Salted bomb.......
Minimum collateral damage, but maximum damage to organic life.
And if you really want ''mathematical calculations''
then it is ''believed'' that Each lancher (four missiles) is meant to cover an area of 12 km square.
Which makes 3 km square per missile............. now how many Tanks or Armored vehicles will be in 3 km square area, that depends upon their way of deployment, terrain and goals in region............ be it 12, be it 120............. it doesn't make much difference.
 
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NASR is not first line of defense,
and its not Cold Start specific weapon.
It's not a Cold Start study but a reenactment of 1965 w/tacnukes. What you say may be true yet militaries are notorious for planning future battles - especially those of defense - based on previous ones.
 
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I'm not "making claims" but highlighting what the report says: that a tacnuke would only destroy 13 MBTs in the reenactment while creating hundreds of thousands of casualties.
I believe Nasr's true effectiveness is in its capability to nullify any goals achieved by CSD, after the territory is occupied. In order to hold the occupied chunk of Pakistani territory, IA will have to deploy a command and control mechanism with a concentration of troops and vehicles, and that stronghold can be a far easier target for a volley of 4x Nasr missiles, thus deterring CSD. Since that supposed area will be devoid of PA elements, and civilians to a higher extent too, the friendly casuality factor will double down.

Possible deployment of Nasr in such a scenario can be far more fruitful than against invading columns.
 
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2015-11-10-bunkovo-090-900.jpg

That trooper looks as if hes contaminating radioactive sausages ! :undecided:
 
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It only shows that your immature attempt to mass occupy Pakistan through conventional means has been laid to permanent rest. Remember, this capability has been developed to put the Indian cold doctrine in its deathbed. Your emotional response confirms our success. This capability now ensures that India will have to think a million times before even attempting any misadventure.

Now, interestingly you talk about genocide. Didn't your coward country think about this before introducing nuclear weapons in the subcontinent? What happened to your false national pride mantra there? Let me guess, you are one of those hypocrites that likes to deal in double standards.

This is Indian logic. Be the first to produce nuclear weapons and threaten a neighbor by its use. Yet, shed crocodile tears when the neighbor opts to have them for its security. Don't make us laugh.

Good points !

Agreed !
 
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