Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[Tank131]

So a couple of points i want to make. Regarding deep strike, we are fixating on RA'AD and for good reason, but frankly RA'AD is a long range weapon that PAF could theoretically mount to any number of platforms beyond JF-17. I mean like getting more ATR or cn-235 type aircraft and mounting 4 RA'AD on them (similar to P-3C carrying harpoon). But you could also just try and modify landing gears to give you more ground clearance as well.

Beyond this there are other weapons systems you can seek like Raptor 3 which has ranges of almost 300km. PAF has already integrated H2/Raptor (60km), H-4/Raptor II (120km), LS-6 (60KM), and REKS/Takbir (60-100km), MAR-1 (ARM) which gives a great arsenal for standoff range strike. Most of these weapons could be fired from inside Pakistan and hit positions in India so adding Raptor III would give you the necessary range you need even if Ra'ad was not able to be placed on JF-17, in order to give you a strong A2G capabilities. JF-17 has a strong potential for A2G and can carry more weapons than the Mirage so if necessary it is more than able to fill that role.

Beyond the weapons, If there is going to be no further pursuit of F-16 (or upgrades to the fleet), then the entire JF-17 fleet should be upgraded with the air cooled version of whichever radar goes into the Blk-3 be it KLJ-7A (which has both liquid and air cooled versions), Grifo-E, or the LKF601E which is the radar which is apparently favored by AVIC per Allen Warnes. That will go a long way towards improving the quality level of the overall fleet. The entire fleet should be equipped PL-15 and Pl-10 along with HMD/cueing system.

 

[MastanKhan]

So a couple of points i want to make. Regarding deep strike, we are fixating on RA'AD and for good reason, but frankly RA'AD is a long range weapon that PAF could theoretically mount to any number of platforms beyond JF-17. I mean like getting more ATR or cn-235 type aircraft and mounting 4 RA'AD on them (similar to P-3C carrying harpoon). But you could also just try and modify landing gears to give you more ground clearance as well.

Beyond this there are other weapons systems you can seek like Raptor 3 which has ranges of almost 300km. PAF has already integrated H2/Raptor (60km), H-4/Raptor II (120km), LS-6 (60KM), and REKS/Takbir (60-100km), MAR-1 (ARM) which gives a great arsenal for standoff range strike. Most of these weapons could be fired from inside Pakistan and hit positions in India so adding Raptor III would give you the necessary range you need even if Ra'ad was not able to be placed on JF-17, in order to give you a strong A2G capabilities. JF-17 has a strong potential for A2G and can carry more weapons than the Mirage so if necessary it is more than able to fill that role.

Beyond the weapons, If there is going to be no further pursuit of F-16 (or upgrades to the fleet), then the entire JF-17 fleet should be upgraded with the air cooled version of whichever radar goes into the Blk-3 be it KLJ-7A (which has both liquid and air cooled versions), Grifo-E, or the LKF601E which is the radar which is apparently favored by AVIC per Allen Warnes. That will go a long way towards improving the quality level of the overall fleet. The entire fleet should be equipped PL-15 and Pl-10 along with HMD/cueing system.

Hi,

For ground strike---mirage 3 / 5. Isn't the reason to acquire all able bodied mirage 3 /5 for that purpose---.

An upgraded mirage 3/5 is an excellent excellent investment for a smart weapons delivery system---extremely inexpensive delivery system other than a very expensive pilot---.

 

[Tank131]

Hi,

For ground strike---mirage 3 / 5. Isn't the reason to acquire all able bodied mirage 3 /5 for that purpose---.

An upgraded mirage 3/5 is an excellent excellent investment for a smart weapons delivery system---extremely inexpensive delivery system other than a very expensive pilot---.

The pilot is very expensive, and highly at risk for equipment failure given the age of the mirage. Beyond that, the JF-17 carries a larger payload further ans can defend itself with SD-10/PL-15. Id rather have a JH-7A but i wont rehash that here.

 

[MastanKhan]

The pilot is very expensive, and highly at risk for equipment failure given the age of the mirage. Beyond that, the JF-17 carries a larger payload further ans can defend itself with SD-10/PL-15. Id rather have a JH-7A but i wont rehash that here.

Hi,

That is understood---we are on the same page---but as the Paf has procured more Mirage 3 / 5's---they don't have any other purpose other than the strike role---.

 

[Armchair]

Remanufactured Mirages. @denel says this is doable and jigs are sitting in SA among other places.

 

[Tank131]

Hi,

That is understood---we are on the same page---but as the Paf has procured more Mirage 3 / 5's---they don't have any other purpose other than the strike role---.

Doesn't make it smart or dumb... Its a neglible cost to maintain the status quo. I dont think most will add to the numbers serving but be used to retire older airframes and others will be cannibalized for spares.

 

[MastanKhan]

Doesn't make it smart or dumb... Its a neglible cost to maintain the status quo. I dont think most will add to the numbers serving but be used to retire older airframes and others will be cannibalized for spares.

Hi,

Well look at it this way---. When you upgrade an older aircraft with a modern EW package---you are basically increasing the potential of its fire power thru accuracy by utilizing smart precision strike weapons---.

But you are right---it is retiring older frames and utilizing not so older frames---.

 

[Dazzler]

Guarding the skies

 

[mshan44]

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Hi,

For ground strike---mirage 3 / 5. Isn't the reason to acquire all able bodied mirage 3 /5 for that purpose---.

An upgraded mirage 3/5 is an excellent excellent investment for a smart weapons delivery system---extremely inexpensive delivery system other than a very expensive pilot---.

I think it'd be:

• for deep strike/SOW deployment, use the Mirages
• for close air support, use JF-17 Block-1s upgraded with AESA radars and Brimstone and SDB-like weapons
• for anti-ship warfare and maritime support, use JF-17 Block-2s & Block-3s
• for air-to-air use JF-17 Block-3s & F-16s

 

[nomi007]

View attachment 574602

can these tri-rail pylon use for Aim-120?

 

[MIRauf]

So why we will spend money on more weapons.

World oldest profession --> Prostitution
Second oldest ? weapons, Arms Merchants.

As long as there is mankind, there be war and you will need weapons.

 

[MastanKhan]

A very wise solution( to use what we have in our inventory), there is no war, as per expectation, USA and Saudia are in contact with both countries, and both countries govts has achieved their "targets" to fool common people with war slogans and created hype to divert attention from daily economic issues.
So why we will spend money on more weapons.

Hi,

Weapons are not like eggs that your mom might send you to get for breakfast in the morning that your dad forgot to bring last night---.

 

[Flight of falcon]

A very wise solution( to use what we have in our inventory), there is no war, as per expectation, USA and Saudia are in contact with both countries, and both countries govts has achieved their "targets" to fool common people with war slogans and created hype to divert attention from daily economic issues.
So why we will spend money on more weapons.

You should be tied to a pole on LOC and left for few hours .

 

[Dazzler]

can these tri-rail pylon use for Aim-120?

Nope.