Pakistan calls for Morsi’s release !

[Armstrong]

Dude, you never understood Ata-Turk, did you? His eventual aim wasn't 100% secularization of Turkey, rather give an alternative to wahabism. We need to tailor some opiate for our fools as well, you can't just take them off one drug, without having another one ready.

Ata-Turk was too deep, for it you need to travel the length and breadth of Turkey, talk to old people who are still alive.... they will tell you what he was.... forget the books.

Oh I understood Ataturk just fine - A great man, a great patriot & truly the father of the Turks !

But I've seen the ideals of Jinnah & Iqbal too deeply to ever settle for the Secularization of Pakistan....I know what I want & I've argued for its sake a dozen times...I'm not in the mood of repeating the entire conversation all over again !

 

[Hyperion]

Everyone out of gas? Now, let's get back to being apathetic Pakistani's and Indians.... humara kia ho ga kaaliya? We don't plan, organize nor take action. We criticize like mohallay-wali-aurat and then bye bye....

 

[Dillinger]

Oh I understood Ataturk just fine - A great man, a great patriot & truly the father of the Turks !

But I've seen the ideals of Jinnah & Iqbal too deeply to ever settle for the Secularization of Pakistan....I know what I want & I've argued for its sake a dozen times...I'm not in the mood of repeating the entire conversation all over again !

No disrespect but look at what @Hyperion is saying in context of performance, who got it right (in relative terms- who's system produces a better result irrespective of what was intended and whether the original path set by the respective founders was followed or not?). Jinnah or Kemal? Turkey never invested in any strategic weapon, keeps its fingers within the middle east and Europe without sacrificing its needs, pushes even the US of A when it feels that its interests shall be harmed (and mind you we are not talking of- oh we'll harbor terrorists who poke and prod you as a sign of our displeasure but really just go and outright refuse American demands to their face with the accompanying proverbial finger). Where do you see Turkey and Pakistan by 2020 respectively? Is glory won by shooting a few Israeli jets down? Is it won by procuring nukes?

 

[Armstrong]

No disrespect but look at what @Hyperion is saying in context of performance, who got it right (in relative terms- who's system produces a better result irrespective of what was intended and whether the original path set by the respective founders was followed or not?). Jinnah or Kemal? Turkey never invested in any strategic weapon, keeps its fingers within the middle east and Europe without sacrificing its needs, pushes even the US of A when it feels that its interests shall be harmed (and mind you we are not talking of- oh we'll harbor terrorists who poke and prod you as a sign of our displeasure but really just go and outright refuse American demands to their face with the accompanying proverbial finger). Where do you see Turkey and Pakistan by 2020 respectively? Is glory won by shooting a few Israeli jets down? Is it won by procuring nukes?

Its complicated & cannot be explained away without me sacrificing the better part of the evening on it as I've done countless times before you joined PDF !

At any rate, even in relative terms, Turkey was nearly in as much sh*t as we were only but a decade ago !

 

[Hyperion]

Dude, we don't agree here... Our formula and that of Quaid was brilliant. The strategic weapons are part of that package, Islam no Islam, India no India, that is one thing we have done right, including Pakistan.

Ata-Turk has similar plans about some weapons, however, some generals within his ranks stabbed him in the back (we reckon poisoned).....

Now the thing is we lost our way the day we started thinking that we were Arabs, and that happened in the 80's.

No disrespect but look at what @Hyperion is saying in context of performance, who got it right (in relative terms- who's system produces a better result irrespective of what was intended and whether the original path set by the respective founders was followed or not?). Jinnah or Kemal? Turkey never invested in any strategic weapon, keeps its fingers within the middle east and Europe without sacrificing its needs, pushes even the US of A when it feels that its interests shall be harmed (and mind you we are not talking of- oh we'll harbor terrorists who poke and prod you as a sign of our displeasure but really just go and outright refuse American demands to their face with the accompanying proverbial finger). Where do you see Turkey and Pakistan by 2020 respectively? Is glory won by shooting a few Israeli jets down? Is it won by procuring nukes?

@Armstrong @Dillinger @Secur, we digress. Let's stay on topic. Let's discuss what we need to do.

 

[Dillinger]

Dude, we don't agree here... Our formula and that of Quaid was brilliant. The strategic weapons are part of that package, Islam no Islam, India no India, that is one thing we have done right, including Pakistan.

Ata-Turk has similar plans about some weapons, however, some generals within his ranks stabbed him in the back (we reckon poisoned).....

Now the thing is we lost our way the day we started thinking that we were Arabs, and that happened in the 80's.

A plan or a scheme is only as good as the safeguards and contingencies its followed by. For example- we have as many fundoos as you do yet do you see them wield the kind of power yours do, in relative terms? Can they high-jack a whole nation's destiny, no? Why because we have inbuilt checks and balances- which came from those who founded our republic- they don't even need to work all the time nor perfectly, no shield has ever been unbreakable but we have a shield- where is your shield? Which plan has ever survived first contact? I am not criticizing Pakistan's choice to procure nukes, I am asking one simple question- Turkey (which has access to nukes through NATO) but is not a nuclear power and Pakistan which is- between them which has the greater capability to secure its interests?

 

[darkinsky]

when the state organisation holds 40% of the egyptian economy it will be a very tough transformation

egyptians have no choice but to live under their military rule

 

[Hyperion]

Dude, they are scared shitless... during my time @ mandatory military service, that was one topic we discussed EVERY DAY... during my time @ ODTU (my university), again, that was the only thing we were tasked with. My department had A,B,C,D,E,F,G,H wings, and guess what? How do I know so much about all this stuff?

A plan or a scheme is only as good as the safeguards and contingencies its followed by. Which plan has ever survived first contact. I am not criticizing Pakistan's choice to procure nukes, I am asking one simple question- Turkey (which has access to nukes through NATO) but is not a nuclear power and Pakistan which is- between them which has grater capability to secure its interests?

 

[Dillinger]

Dude, they are scared shitless... during my time @ mandatory military service, that was one topic we discussed EVERY DAY... during my time @ ODTU (my university), again, that was the only thing we were tasked with. My department had A,B,C,D,E,F,G,H wings, and guess what? How do I know so much about all this stuff?

Yaara sorry I didn't exactly catch that, who is scared and of what? Also brother I edited my post- the one you're replying to so re-read it if its not too much of a bother.

 

[Hashshāshīn]

haha what a joke this country has become.

 

[Hyperion]

Yara, obviously, you have never met an enraged Wahabi zealot (TTP)! No cage in this world can contain him. Regarding someone hijacking the destiny of Pakistan (if you are referring to the nukes), they are 100% secure. Not even one zealot, even the marginal ones @ lower ranks in armed forces ever know of their existence. Even our PM's (if we see them as a security Islamic threat) get a briefing about their location or their numbers.

We are very safe in that regard. Tell me something, could anyone handle a person as brain washed as Kassab? Now multiply that by 100, and you get LeJ/TTP and other assorted dogs that we have to deal with.

Yaara sorry I didn't exactly catch that, who is scared and of what? Also brother I edited my post- the one you're replying to so re-read it if its not too much of a bother.

P.S. Turkey always wanted nukes, badly. The ones under NATO umbrella are completely useless. We know it.

 

[Dillinger]

Yara, obviously, you have never met an enraged Wahabi zealot (TTP)! No cage in this world can contain him. Regarding someone hijacking the destiny of Pakistan (if you are referring to the nukes), they are 100% secure. Not even one zealot, even the marginal ones @ lower ranks in armed forces ever know of their existence. Even our PM's (if we see them as a security Islamic threat) get a briefing about their location or their numbers.

We are very safe in that regard. Tell me something, could anyone handle a person as brain washed as Kassab? Now multiply that by 100, and you get LeJ/TTP and other assorted dogs that we have to deal with.



P.S. Turkey always wanted nukes, badly. The ones under NATO umbrella are completely useless. We know it.

Hype!!! @Armstrong why is Hype tying it all up with some insinuation from my side that it was wrong for Pakistan to go nuclear (which I clarified that I didn't- I only brought them up to point out one of the current difference between Turkey and Pakistan) or that its warheads may not be safe (the latter toh I didn't even allude to at all)? Hype I expected you to get that, what do you think I mean by high jacking the destiny of a nation, nukes aren't any nation's "destiny"- come on yaara.

 

[Hyperion]

Yara, I'm not. Just pulling your leg...

What about the second part? Do you think any nation has the capacity to contain 300,000+ zealots???

Hype!!! @Armstrong why is Hype tying it all up with some insinuation from my side that it was wrong for Pakistan to go nuclear or that its warheads may not be safe (the latter toh I didn't even allude to at all)? Hype I expected you to get that, what do you think I mean by high jacking the destiny of a nation, nukes aren't any nation's "destiny"- come on yaara.

 

[Dillinger]

Yara, I'm not. Just pulling your leg...

What about the second part? Do you think any nation has the capacity to contain 300,000+ zealots???

You think that our zealots are any less into zealotry- its just that we don't allow our state orgs. to arm them or use them as assets- nor we do we allow them to build a network of zealots to further our aims to the point that the said network then sets the standards for the birth of other orgs. of zealots who then act on purposes completely contrary to a nation's prosperity and security. Have you ever heard our fundoos like Togadia, do you think that a white supremacist harbors any less hatred within his being than a TTP grunt? The only difference my friend is that they do not have access to a network comprising of gun runners to politicians who have made it acceptable for such orgs. to not only exist BUT also wage a sophisticated campaign against the people and the state. So yes zealots can be handled, the point is not to create an atmosphere which is conducive to zealots and furthermore not letting the atmosphere exist for 3 damn long decades. Otherwise human nature is the same all over, only the ability of those in power and those who set the standards and the institutional habits really matter. Once in a blue moon when one of them gets mil-spec tools and training we catch the twerp/twerps and let them rot- to the point that the singular instance where a well trained group (Abhinav Bharat- our parallel to your religious fundoos) - not penny pushing rioters- emerged we bagged them all the minute we caught em' after the Samjhauta bombings- to the point that one of their particularly popular members is suffering from cancer and she still gets to rot in the same uncomfortable cell as a common murderer no matter how much the fundoos squeal.

 

[TopCat]

Okay I wasn't on the top of the world when Morsi was kicked out of the office & then whisked away but why the foOk does it matter to us whether Egypt's PM is Morsi or Mussolini ?

Its none of our business !

Not correct...