Obama Cancels Summit With Putin

[vostok]

Yeah, same story here about Ceausescu, especially the old people..most tend to forget the lack of electricity or the cold nights in new, free apartments, without heat, and remember only the good things.
There were some good things, can't deny that - best thing was all the free time everyone got for themselves and the stress free life (compared to now)

But in the end, the down sides were to many, it simply got to a point were life was to hard and the liberties to few- and Ceausescu got shoot for his stupidity and mistakes (rightfully so)

Now nobody want's to go back to that, and I think a system like France has is the best compromise between socialism/capitalism (or even better, the Nordic countries, but it;s almost impossible to implement that in Europe)

And we are so very off-topic

And now they have heat and electricity in those mounteen villages? I don't think so.
I do not want to hurt you, but that Romanians lived under socialism worse than the Poles and the Czechs or Russians and so does now. It is independent from the system.
The best compromise - was in the Soviet Union under Stalin, when the service sector and small factories were in private hands, and large - in the hands of the state. The economy grew by 30% per year. In the 52 th year of Stalin introduced the gold ruble - so every spring prices dropped by a few percent, and salaries have grown contrary to a few percent.

 

[Declein]

And now they have heat and electricity in those mounteen villages? I don't think so..

That happened in Bucharest, in the 80's

I do not want to hurt you, but that Romanians lived under socialism worse than the Poles and the Czechs or Russians and so does now. It is independent from the system.

No hurt involved, it's pretty true.We lived in socialism better than some (Bulgarians for example) and worst than the many, for the vast majority of time
Ceausescu & his system are to blame for that (system that we inherited now, unfortunately)

Edit: Btw, Ceausecu tried something like that in the beginning of the 70's: small, private business, run by citizens.It worked great, for a while. After that, he went to N Korea and got influenced by the morons there, to start his own personality cult.
He cancelled everything a few years later..

The best compromise - was in the Soviet Union under Stalin, when the service sector and small factories were in private hands, and large - in the hands of the state. The economy grew by 30% per year. In the 52 th year of Stalin introduced the gold ruble - so every spring prices dropped by a few percent, and salaries have grown contrary to a few percent.

Can't agree there - while Stalin might have made some good moves internal (I'll take your word for it, I really don't know), he was still responsible for the death of millions .
Hitler also brought many improvements to Germany and he raised the standard of living, but in the end, he was still a mass murderer - and lets just leave it at that

 

[vostok]

That happened in Bucharest, in the 80's

In 80's all was ruining - Gorbachev worked about destroing socialism. Untill his appearning we have full markets under him - shortages and ruins.

Can't agree there - while Stalin might have made some good moves internal (I'll take your word for it, I really don't know), he was still responsible for the death of millions .
Hitler also brought many improvements to Germany and he raised the standard of living, but in the end, he was still a mass murderer - and lets just leave it at that

Stalin is too big topic for discussion, it's true.
I do hope that after years or decades Eastern Bloc will be restored. We all saw that Western capitalists wants none of us neither good nor prosperity. They need us as slaves or prostitutes - nothing more.
We must build a new socialism - it's the only hope. Otherwise, progress will slow down and begin degradation - is now in sight.

 

[vostok]

 

[Desert Fox]

Theorists have developed a new model of socialism - it is based on the new information technologies. By the 2018-2020 year will be to create a global computer
program of economic development - the model of the economy will be 4-5 times more efficient than a capitalist.

I'm not sure about this new "Socialism", i'm a little skeptical. Is there a name for it? There is already a proven form of Socialism that was in fact very successful. It was such a big threat to Capitalism that it had to be destroyed at all cost. Its not Communism/Marxism though.


Check these posts from another thread:

Post #203

Post #205

Post #211

 

[Desert Fox]

Now many people, especially the common people, wistfully remember the USSR - free apartments, free education, free medical care, old people received such pensions that could always help their children and grandchildren.
And all these stories about what the KGB monitored for some people - so in America they spying for everybody and consider it correct.
I still believe in people and in what socialism - correct, without errors of the Soviet Union but with all it's achievements - it is sure will come.

This 'spying' has been expanded under the Obama administration. Obama is a Marxist.

 

[vostok]

I'm not sure about this new "Socialism", i'm a little skeptical. Is there a name for it? There is already a proven form of Socialism that was in fact very successful. It was such a big threat to Capitalism that it had to be destroyed at all cost. Its not Communism/Marxism though.


Check these posts from another thread:

Post #203

Post #205

Post #211

Nazi was measured skulls and determined on this basis - a full value
person or not. You seem to be heavily addicted by the Nazi party, but decided to disregard the first word - "national."
Socialism can not be nationalism as a new society involves the friendship of nations and their equality.
What is the basis socialism economy? In planning. In the past, it was not possible to create a plan that takes into account all aspects. Because of this, there were distortions in industry that caused huge losses to the state.
But by 2018-2020 years due to the development of computer technology will create a program of economic planning that takes into account absolutely all of the criteria.

This 'spying' has been expanded under the Obama administration. Obama is a Marxist.

This spuying was opened under Obama, but it was always. The Americans - master splurge.
If he was Marxist he would start the Socialisct revolution. But he is true liberal and nothing more.

 

[Prechko]

These are my sources:

Dyadkin, I.G. (Demograficheskaya statistika neyestestvennoy smertnosti v SSSR 1918-1956 ): 56 to 62 million "unnatural deaths" for the USSR overall, with 34 to 49 million under Stalin.

Davies, Norman (Europe A History, 1998): c. 50 million killed 1924-53, excluding WW2 war losses. This would divide (more or less) into 33M pre-war and 17M after 1939.

Twentieth Century Atlas - Death Tolls

The sources that put it lower than 60-50 million didn't/don't have access to declassified Soviet records. The 60,000,000 is a slight exaggeration but due to the number of mass graves discovered and those that are yet to be discovered as well as previous records the number has been either 50 or 60 million total deaths in the Soviet Union.

As i said , people often say that 10 million people died in GULAG , while archival research does not support it , and put max. number around 1.6 million people (between 1929-1953) (book Red Holocaust , Steven Rosefielde). We will agree that difference between 10 million and 1.6 million is quite a huge one....

Those Red Army POW's died as a result of Stalin's policy of branding anyone who surrendered to the Germans as a "traitor". That was Stalin's grim Order No. 270 of August 16, 1941.

Hitler proposed to the Soviets a fair deal; if the Soviets treat captured Axis troops in accordance with Geneva convention (of which the Soviet Union was not a signatory to) he would would give the same rights to Red Army POW's in German camps. Stalin declined this proposal stating that "the Soviet Union has now POW's, only traitors".

Hitler and Geneva convention? Look , the fact is vast majority of German POWs returned home alive while vast majority of Soviet POWs returned in coffins. There is no comparison. Geneva convention or not , we all know how POW should be treated. There is no excuse for these crimes in figure of Stalin.

 

[vostok]

People! Enough to repeat those tales about Stalin!
Documented known that have been 640,000 people executed from 1923 to 1953.
But was built 8000 giant industrial enterprises. Was created the world's best defense industry, the most advanced system of free education system and free medical care.
USSR became a science leader in the world, overtaking not only England or the United States, but the rest of the world combined.
Thousands of achievements, it is impossible to simply list them. But all of you like wound toys repeated about some "tens or hundreds of millions brutally tortured personally by Stalin".
Fear the God.
Stalin is the best and most successful politician in Russia since the time of Catherine the Great.

 

[Tshering22]

Who asked you?

Just as no one asked you to tell anyone blindly as Indian without knowing who they are.

Don't tell me that some guy from Romania argues exactly like an Indian on all the topics I've seen on this forum.

Tell me one Indian that has advocated a stand against Russians here.


Really, what's wrong with you, man?

Not that it has anything to do with you.

There are many false flaggers here but he's not one of them.

The European members here can vouch for it.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Really, what's wrong with you, man?

Again, who the Hell asked you? If you don't like my post then don't read it.

 

[Tshering22]

Again, who the Hell asked you? If you don't like my post then don't read it.

It comes out as surprising considering you're one of the more rational ones among your countrymen here.

No one asks anyone here.

This is a forum. Not Red Guard's playground.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

It comes out as surprising considering you're one of the more rational ones among your countrymen here.

No one asks anyone here.

This is a forum. Not Red Guard's playground.

I am friendly to those who are not hostile to myself and to my country.

Unfortunately most of the time, Indians fall in the latter category.

And if they don't like what they get in return, that's not my problem.

If you don't like it, then the only thing you can do is avoid reading it, or report it.

 

[Desert Fox]

As i said , people often say that 10 million people died in GULAG , while archival research does not support it , and put max. number around 1.6 million people (between 1929-1953) (book Red Holocaust , Steven Rosefielde). We will agree that difference between 10 million and 1.6 million is quite a huge one....

Soviet sources state otherwise:

Olga Shatunovskaya, a member of the Soviet Commission of Party Control, and head of a special commission during the 1960s appointed by premier Khrushchev, has similarly concluded: "From January 1, 1935 to June 22, 1941, 19,840,000 enemies of the people were arrested. Of these, seven million were shot in prison, and a majority of the others died in camp."

The Jewish Role in the Bolshevik Revolution and Russia's Early Soviet Regime

So that means that out of 19,840,000, 12,840,000 died in the labor camps. This is Soviet source stating this.

And even if we exclude the Gulags victims, Stalin was still butchering his own people in peace time, let alone war time.

Hitler and Geneva convention? Look , the fact is vast majority of German POWs returned home alive while vast majority of Soviet POWs returned in coffins. There is no comparison. Geneva convention or not , we all know how POW should be treated. There is no excuse for these crimes in figure of Stalin.

Vast majority???? Do you have a source?

Of the 3 million German troops in Soviet captivity, less then 1 million returned to Germany. And this was only the German troops, not including other Axis troops in Soviet captivity from Rumania, Hungary, and Italy.

Secondly, as the sources i posted state, Soviet POW casualties were as a direct result of Stalin's policy.

 

[Desert Fox]

Nazi was measured skulls and determined on this basis - a full value
person or not. You seem to be heavily addicted by the Nazi party, but decided to disregard the first word - "national."
Socialism can not be nationalism as a new society involves the friendship of nations and their equality.
What is the basis socialism economy? In planning. In the past, it was not possible to create a plan that takes into account all aspects. Because of this, there were distortions in industry that caused huge losses to the state.
But by 2018-2020 years due to the development of computer technology will create a program of economic planning that takes into account absolutely all of the criteria.

You can be a Nationalist and a Socialist. Anyone who wants to preserve the distinct identity of his people and work for the benefit of his own country and kinsmen/countrymen is a Nationalist and a Socialist. To be a Nationalist doesn't mean that one should hate others and not form friendly relations with other nations.

I'm not addicted to the "Nazi" party, rather i am interested and inspired by their successes, of which one cannot find a comparison even to this day.

This spuying was opened under Obama, but it was always. The Americans - master splurge.
If he was Marxist he would start the Socialisct revolution. But he is true liberal and nothing more.

Obama doesn't openly declare his intentions as that would make it obvious.