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Now, IAF wants new canopy for LCA

Trainers are necessary in the long run for the reasons explained. It has no relevance right now. So they are taking the extra time to fit in plumbing for mid-air refuelling. Right now, only the single seat versions have mid-air refuelling.

That's not my point. Why you lot taking were taking dig at JF17 not having dual seat version? That has been a historical line toed by Indian trolls. You been here long enough to know!
 
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Wasn't the the new canopy requirements known for LCA mk1a all along? They want this on mk1 now.So Hurr hurr.. hinddoo teja flop..muh thunder rokz..

Is this a defence forum or troll forum now?
 
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That's not my point. Why you lot taking were taking dig at JF17 not having dual seat version? That has been a historical line toed by Indian trolls. You been here long enough to know!

Actually, no, I have never personally come across anything mentioned of the sort.

But combat coded trainers are excellent for battlespace management, recce, electronics warfare and strike missions. The capability of a 4th gen jet increases quite a bit when you have two heads for such missions. It's the lack of foresight that resulted in the JF-17 missing out on a trainer version. Even the naval Rafale boys lamented missing out on the trainer version for the marine variant, but also for a whole host of different reasons, including 16-hour missions.

So, yes, the JF-17 is quite a bit less capable for not having a two seat variant.

The trainer delay for LCA is only 1 year. Instead of taking deliveries of 4 aircraft this year, the IAF has decided to take 8 aircraft starting from the next financial year, once delivery of all 32 single seat jets are complete. So it's not a significant delay.
 
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Actually, no, I have never personally come across anything mentioned of the sort.

But combat coded trainers are excellent for battlespace management, recce, electronics warfare and strike missions. The capability of a 4th gen jet increases quite a bit when you have two heads for such missions. It's the lack of foresight that resulted in the JF-17 missing out on a trainer version. Even the naval Rafale boys lamented missing out on the trainer version for the marine variant, but also for a whole host of different reasons, including 16-hour missions.

So, yes, the JF-17 is quite a bit less capable for not having a two seat variant.

The trainer delay for LCA is only 1 year. Instead of taking deliveries of 4 aircraft this year, the IAF has decided to take 8 aircraft starting from the next financial year, once delivery of all 32 single seat jets are complete. So it's not a significant delay.


You must be living under the rock all these years I suppose!

You see the funny thing is, all the reasons you mentioned for Tejas not needing a dual seat trainer, have been the reasons explained to Indian trolls for no need to have dual seat Jf17 trainer version. Like simulator , easy to fly for pilots converting from other platforms.
 
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You must be living under the rock all these years I suppose!

You see the funny thing is, all the reasons you mentioned for Tejas not needing a dual seat trainer, have been the reasons explained to Indian trolls for no need to have dual seat Jf17 trainer version. Like simulator , easy to fly for pilots converting from other platforms.

Those are two different things.

To operate a 4th gen jet, you don't really need a two seat version if you have a decent advanced trainer like the Hawk. But a two seat version is a force multiplier in certain scenarios. We have used the two seat M-2000 to great effect in Kargil.
 
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Oh boy. Your riposte is the result of years of having a confirmation bias about issues relating to the Tejas, i.e. you end up having a very myopic & binary view of the issue.
Oh well excuse me, i did read somewhere that your Tejas was supposed to have been inducted in the 90s.
We Indians understand that the Tejas has had its fair share of problems and that it will continue to have its ups and down throughout its upgradation phase as it is impossible to have a clean, no failure R&D route, as Tejas is after all a fighter aircraft; but what we also do understand is that it is completely normal, i.e. all its achievements and hiccups.
True, except you Indians can't comprehend some facts like after some 20 years most aircraft are close to end of their service cycle while you are still undecided on yours outlook.
What you pakistanis don't understand is that when a hiccup does surface and articles are written about the said hiccups, that does not automatically translate to the Tejas program shutting down, regardless of how much you wish for it to be so.
Actually, we wish to see most if not all of the IAF equipped with this futuristic masterpiece.
And see, you pakistanis would have understood this too, if pakistan had actually gone through the trouble of actually developing a fighter jet.
Ah, now that the Indian has crawled out of skin and showing his true nature, suffice to say, if you Bhartis had a brain, you would be dangerous, I mean only a loser or a brain dead person would conclude that, JF-17 has no input from Pakistan but somehow it requires Pakistani Pilots and staff to market and display the aircraft.
You Bhartis often say that you also manufacture the SU-30....well try to sell even a bulb from it to a third party and see where you stand.
 
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@waz

Can you please close this thread or merge the OP to the existing Texas thread? Posts are just trolling each other.
 
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This is the problem with IAF, every-time they change their requirements and force, the R&D to achieve that without financial support and cry that its delayed.


@Windjammer , I didn't expected you to open new thread on LCA news, considering many of members object/complain about creating unnecessary LCA/Tejas threads without any substance. It would be great helpful if you could merge all LCA/Tejas related news with already existing HAL Tejas | Updates, News & Discussions thread in Indian Defense Forum section instead of creating fresh thread for every petty information's. Let it be a norm so that Forum will be clean & neat.

This is my sincere & humble request and don't take it as offence.
The problem is not with Indian talent, the problem is your political establishment. It is trying to f with you. Too much vested interest, they don't want to see indigenous products, they want to go for holidays in the West and get a new beemer while shagging some Russian ladies. India will never be self sufficient if this goes on. Your military is corrupt as hell. Trust me, they will buy some token LCAs, in 10-20 years time it will be obsolete, then they will propose importing again, a new cycle. =)
 
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Oh well excuse me, i did read somewhere that your Tejas was supposed to have been inducted in the 90s.

True, Tejas was to fly by 95-96, even though the project technically started only in the late 80s.
That itself should tell anyone knowledgeable about fighter aircraft timelines that it is simply not possible.

Our timelines serve more as a challenge to us than to prove to other people of our capabilities.

You should look at when the Tejas' 1st prototype flew and when it was inducted to see if whether Tejas followed a normal fighter's timeline.
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And considering how relatively inexperienced DRDO and HAL were, Tejas is quite an achievement.

True, except you Indians can't comprehend some facts like after some 20 years most aircraft are close to end of their service cycle while you are still undecided on yours outlook.

Incorrect, you are conflating the R&D period with the timeline post induction(service cycle) of the said aircraft and it has only been 2 years since Tejas has been inducted.

Also, we are quite decided on the Tejas, which is why it is inducted and more and different variants are to come, a 3rd and new production facility is being constructed, etc.

Actually, we wish to see most if not all of the IAF equipped with this futuristic masterpiece.

No wonder there's always an odd pakistani poster in a Tejas thread saying something along the lines of "this small thing happened, so now Tejas is doomed". Definitely not a Freudian slip at all.

Ah, now that the Indian has crawled out of skin and showing his true nature, suffice to say, if you Bhartis had a brain, you would be dangerous, I mean only a loser or a brain dead person would conclude that, JF-17 has no input from Pakistan but somehow it requires Pakistani Pilots and staff to market and display the aircraft.

Please don't insult everyone's intelligence here.
It is really disingenuous of you to pretend like somehow the near negligible "work done" by pakistan in the JF-17 somehow comes even remotely close to the work we did in the Tejas, hence my comment about pakistanis not knowing about what it means to develop a fighter aircraft.

In what capacity is pakistan even capable of doing any R&D on fighters?

What fighter grade wind tunnel facilitates are there in pakistan? How many new aircrafts have been tested in these facilities?
You got any rcs test facilities? Any IR test facilities for the same?
Have your aircraft design facilities ever designed a whole new fighter aircraft from the ground up?
What indigenous CAD softwares was pakistan able to develop?
What CFD tech were you lot able to make because of the JF-17?
Was pakistan able to develop quadruplex fly by wire after so many years post the induction of the JF-17?
What kind of composite research is going on in pakistan for the JF-17?
Any fighter grade turbine research organization in pak?
Any radar R&D organization in pak that can develop AESA radars?

To think that pakistan can do any meaningful work in any 4th gen aircraft without having the above is just ridiculous.

You Bhartis often say that you also manufacture the SU-30....well try to sell even a bulb from it to a third party and see where you stand.

Strawman argument.

Why does it matter if we can sell the Su-30MKIs or no?
The point we usually try to make is that we can manufacture a majority of the subsystems of a foreign fighter, while pakistan can't even do the same for something you lot call a "Joint-Venture".

And likewise, we have also developed and employed successfully, a handful of indigenous subsytems in the Su-30MKI whereas we can't say the same for pakistan and JF-17.

You are resting on the laurels of the chinese.
 
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Dear india
Just give up and buy a bunch of f16s with manufacturing rights, stop wasting toilet making money
 
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Errr......The IAF is now posting only qualified flight instructors and fight combat leaders to Tejas squadron because we cannot risk young pilots flying the fighters.
You want a teenage guy to fly an aircraft?
 
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Dear india
Just give up and buy a bunch of f16s with manufacturing rights, stop wasting toilet making money
If I am India, I would do the same. Seriously stop wasting time with LCA, reverse the damn F-16 and build up the supply chain. Even if I am Chinese, I feel tired and angry looking at the way the military fcking with them. It's a win win for India if you choose F-16, annual training and conference trips to the states for the pilots and commanders, pocket money from the Indian/Lockheed joint venture.
 
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